China's defense budget to grow 7.5% in 2010: spokesman

[below_freezing]

well said
i dont support big spending in military. Bear in mind one fighter less we may have one school more. i'd rather see competition in economy or even sport field than in military field.

in 1840, the qing dynasty was 1/3 of the world's GDP. britain took it all away.

in 1890 the qing dynasty was still 9 times larger than Japan in GDP. japan took it all away again.

it's better to eat grass and stay alive than eat beef 1 day and die the next.

 

[topjumper]

The manchurians were only interested in enriching themselves not building a stronger china, same as when the mongols took over china. Those are the unfortunate chapters in the chinese history.

I don't think any chinese is against building a stronger defence capability, but sometimes military fans are quite impatient, they envy the military might of the US and wish we could somehow spend our way to catch up, but the truth is a country's military capability goes hand in hand with its overall industrial/technological capabilities, even if China now spends all of its money on military we will still be behind the US because buying other people's stuff can never lead you to the VERY top.

We have to focus on improving our education, industries, innovations and economy and our military will improve along with it, if you look at China 30 years ago and now it is very obvious that we didn't get to where we are today by focusing on developing our military but by developing our economy. China as the world's 2nd largest economy still lacks world leading universities, research scientists and industries, this MUST change, the government's decision to focus on education reform and push towards a more industrialized economy from a labour-intensive one should be welcomed. We are not stupid people who can only follow the steps of others, in fact a disproportionate percentage of the best PhD students in the western world's best universities are Chinese, we need to create an environment where China can attract and keep its best, only then we can truly stand on equal footing with the United States, the road is long but the direction is clear, we should welcome our government on these initiatives.

Also on the current military budget, china has the world's 2nd largest military budget! The money we had last year and years before that was enough to fund the research of aircraft carriers and J-XX, what make you think that after this increase that somehow we won't be able to afford it anymore?? The truth is we are going to have our aircraft carriers and our J-XX, in fact both of them are going to come out this year, there's no need to be impatient, the day that we have the Chinese equivalent of companies like Boeing, General Electric and IBM, the Chinese equivalent of MIT, CalTech and Cambridge, the day that we'll truly be the leading civilization of this world once again, we are heading the right direction, so be proud and be patient!

 

[no_name]

Patience is a virtue, and one that Chinese has grasped better than anyone else IMO. China is hardly on headlines like it is now just a decades ago except when Beijing starts shooting missiles or row over arm sales to Taiwan.

It is not easy for those at the top who have to plan for the welfare of their countrymen and at the same time bear with their sometimes undeserved criticisms. Having farsight is very important.

Alot of things they still need to do:

-education/ talent hunting
-western development
-green energy
-service/high tech economy
-Health care and elderly care
-current hight speed rail transport

Their primary focus is not even on defense yet. Once they start improving arm forces like shanghai in 90s is when to watch. What you're looking at now is not china's military transformation, that I think will start when J-xx enters production a few years from now and when there is a couple of carriers in the waters.

The truth is we are going to have our aircraft carriers and our J-XX, in fact both of them are going to come out this year

Do you have reliable source about the aircraft carrier? Is it the Varyag because I don't think the homemade ones are ready that fast. If true hopefully they will place workable J-15 and J-10C on deck.

 

[Communist]

Do you have reliable source about the aircraft carrier? Is it the Varyag because I don't think the homemade ones are ready that fast. If true hopefully they will place workable J-15 and J-10C on deck.

This year.... this year... I can't be patient

But is Varyag ready for that? I know aircrafts will be there, just need to know whether the carrier is ready or not...

 

[below_freezing]

The manchurians were only interested in enriching themselves not building a stronger china, same as when the mongols took over china. Those are the unfortunate chapters in the chinese history.

I don't think any chinese is against building a stronger defence capability, but sometimes military fans are quite impatient, they envy the military might of the US and wish we could somehow spend our way to catch up, but the truth is a country's military capability goes hand in hand with its overall industrial/technological capabilities, even if China now spends all of its money on military we will still be behind the US because buying other people's stuff can never lead you to the VERY top.

We have to focus on improving our education, industries, innovations and economy and our military will improve along with it, if you look at China 30 years ago and now it is very obvious that we didn't get to where we are today by focusing on developing our military but by developing our economy. China as the world's 2nd largest economy still lacks world leading universities, research scientists and industries, this MUST change, the government's decision to focus on education reform and push towards a more industrialized economy from a labour-intensive one should be welcomed. We are not stupid people who can only follow the steps of others, in fact a disproportionate percentage of the best PhD students in the western world's best universities are Chinese, we need to create an environment where China can attract and keep its best, only then we can truly stand on equal footing with the United States, the road is long but the direction is clear, we should welcome our government on these initiatives.

Also on the current military budget, china has the world's 2nd largest military budget! The money we had last year and years before that was enough to fund the research of aircraft carriers and J-XX, what make you think that after this increase that somehow we won't be able to afford it anymore?? The truth is we are going to have our aircraft carriers and our J-XX, in fact both of them are going to come out this year, there's no need to be impatient, the day that we have the Chinese equivalent of companies like Boeing, General Electric and IBM, the Chinese equivalent of MIT, CalTech and Cambridge, the day that we'll truly be the leading civilization of this world once again, we are heading the right direction, so be proud and be patient!

agreed, our goal is a fully industrialized economy. we are on the fast track to it right now, still a long way off though. but we should not learn from the US. their model of development is wasteful, and we do not have the capability to mimick them. they had a whole continent's resources to exploit and enough slave labor provided by blacks and immigrants to build their agricultural and then industrial base.

our model should be germany, japan, france, and britain until the 1950's. these are countries with conditions like ours: crowded, exhausted resources, high populations. and now they have achieved what they had (what britain had when the british empire existed before it became a US attack dog) through a focus on heavy industry while not neglecting light industry. like we are right now, they produced everything. britain not only was the textile capital of the world (low end) but also produced the strongest navy for 100 years and invented tanks and railroads (high end).

 

[no_name]

they produced everything.

Yes, the ability to do this is very important. And I don't see why not. With 1300 million people it could have been a world within a world. I just hope once they have the best in everything they are not going to close off again like in Qing dynasty.

I see the bigger picture of a revitalised China pulling the Middle east back to former glory times when the silk route runs. But this means our military muscle needs to have bulk first as competition with west will cause frictions

 

[Communist]

agreed, our goal is a fully industrialized economy. we are on the fast track to it right now, still a long way off though. but we should not learn from the US. their model of development is wasteful, and we do not have the capability to mimick them. they had a whole continent's resources to exploit and enough slave labor provided by blacks and immigrants to build their agricultural and then industrial base.

our model should be germany, japan, france, and britain until the 1950's. these are countries with conditions like ours: crowded, exhausted resources, high populations. and now they have achieved what they had (what britain had when the british empire existed before it became a US attack dog) through a focus on heavy industry while not neglecting light industry. like we are right now, they produced everything. britain not only was the textile capital of the world (low end) but also produced the strongest navy for 100 years and invented tanks and railroads (high end).

Another excellent post.

But China needs to imitate US in some cases.

An arms manufacturing military industry like the US. This industry is just so profitable and can create jobs domestically as well as it serves national security needs. Apart from that, civilian sectors should be merged with defense sectors except agriculture.

 

[Communist]

Yes, the ability to do this is very important. And I don't see why not. With 1300 million people it could have been a world within a world. I just hope once they have the best in everything they are not going to close off again like in Qing dynasty.

I see the bigger picture of a revitalised China pulling the Middle east back to former glory times when the silk route runs. But this means our military muscle needs to have bulk first as competition with west will cause frictions

Along with that, China should flex the cultural muscle which China is doing already.

Also, a good intelligence network worldwide must be developed.

 

[below_freezing]

Yes, the ability to do this is very important. And I don't see why not. With 1300 million people it could have been a world within a world. I just hope once they have the best in everything they are not going to close off again like in Qing dynasty.

I see the bigger picture of a revitalised China pulling the Middle east back to former times when the silk route runs. But this means our military muscle needs to have bulk first

rest assured we are far too weak to close off for at least 100 years.

we probably have the relative power of Germany in 1900 right now. That is, boxed off and surrounded by the prevailing international naval power, Britain for them and US for us. The difference between us and Germany back then is: Britain and France were the only ones blocking germany to the West. We are being blocked by:

Japan, USA, Australia, Philippines, South Korea, India, Afghanistan (USA).

 

[no_name]

An arms manufacturing military industry like the US. This industry is just so profitable and can create jobs domestically as well as it serves national security needs. Apart from that, civilian sectors should be merged with defense sectors except agriculture.

Not too sure about that. I think some problem includes need a constant market or war, also lobbying by interest groups, and budget overruns due to decreased efficiency in designing new weapons.

The 300+ million price tag even for a F-22 is crazy in my opinion.

 

[no_name]

rest assured we are far too weak to close off for at least 100 years.

we probably have the relative power of Germany in 1900 right now. That is, boxed off and surrounded by the prevailing international naval power, Britain for them and US for us. The difference between us and Germany back then is: Britain and France were the only ones blocking germany to the West. We are being blocked by:

Japan, USA, Australia, Philippines, South Korea, India, Afghanistan (USA).

But you see it is still easier now to go west than east right now.
The key is US, once it cannot support oversea base it's allies like Japan and S/korea will fall back under China's umbrella as they share more common things.

 

[Communist]

Not too sure about that. I think some problem includes need a constant market or war, also lobbying by interest groups, and budget overruns due to decreased efficiency in designing new weapons.

The 300+ million price tag even for a F-22 is crazy in my opinion.

Somehow, anyhow, China needs to create favorable conditions for that industry. Since, its in the initial stage, China should focus on small arms industry along with a few big ones with cheaper rates, so that poor countries can at least buy some, that they can't buy from Western high priced ones.

In this century, nothing is so profitable except arms selling. The key to the success of US has been arms industry.

 

[Communist]

rest assured we are far too weak to close off for at least 100 years.

we probably have the relative power of Germany in 1900 right now. That is, boxed off and surrounded by the prevailing international naval power, Britain for them and US for us. The difference between us and Germany back then is: Britain and France were the only ones blocking germany to the West. We are being blocked by:

Japan, USA, Australia, Philippines, South Korea, India, Afghanistan (USA).

China is now in a more complex situation than before. Something needs be done through diplomacy.

 

[below_freezing]

Somehow, anyhow, China needs to create favorable conditions for that industry. Since, its in the initial stage, China should focus on small arms industry along with a few big ones with cheaper rates, so that poor countries can at least buy some, that they can't buy from Western high priced ones.

In this century, nothing is so profitable except arms selling. The key to the success of US has been arms industry.

the arms industry has been successful for the US because it manufactures not only weapons of war, but war itself. how many wars in the past 60 years have not been US influenced? the US makes wars that 1.) need the fighters to buy equipment from the US, but also 2.) the war itself regardless of who wins, will benefit the US even if it doesn't sell any weapons.

think about afghanistan vs. soviets and how CIA sells stingers to afghans. it doesnt matter if afghans or soviets win, US wins anyways since if soviets win the US scores a political victory, has an excuse to arm other nations in the core of Russian influence, created a market in pakistan for even more US goods, etc. while if soviets lose then US obviously also wins.

same thing in iran-iraq war. US won, both iran and iraq lost. even korean war, the US lost on the battlefield but won in the corporate boardroom. the only war where the US did not make a huge profit is Vietnam.

 

[no_name]

rest assured we are far too weak to close off for at least 100 years.

we probably have the relative power of Germany in 1900 right now. That is, boxed off and surrounded by the prevailing international naval power, Britain for them and US for us. The difference between us and Germany back then is: Britain and France were the only ones blocking germany to the West. We are being blocked by:

Japan, USA, Australia, Philippines, South Korea, India, Afghanistan (USA).

The answer is in space.