China to have 4 aircraft carriers, 18 Type 055 destroyers, and 300 J-20 by 2025

[Viet]

So you lick our azz for another 1000 years...

You are funny!
No we never lick the emperor’s azz.

 

[antonius123]

Ok let’ see. It’s You that posted the first link of an article. In this article a chinese military expert claims China meter wave radars can detect F35 and the radars can guide missiles to destroy it. So he is talking of wave length of 1 meter and more, I assume.

The second article you posted claims L band radars can detect F35 by resonance.
L band radars operate with wave length of 15-30cm.

how do you explain the difference?

1 meter wave length and 30cm wave length is not much different. Basically it is the shorter wave length that make the stealth object work effectively.

About resonance: can do you explain how this resonance comes from? And how can a radar detect it?

F35 total program costs are about $1.5 trilion. You mean the PLA can neutralize the plane by assembling a cheap radar it can build it a garage?

It is talking about regions applicable to computing the radar cross-section of a sphere.

The radar cross-section equation breaks down primarily due to creeping waves in the area where 2π · r. The largest positive perturbation of the radar cross-section (point A) would be 4 times higher than the radar cross-section computed using the optical region formula. Just slightly a minimum occurs (point B) and the actual radar cross-section would be 0.26 times the value calculated by using the optical region formula. This area is known as the „Mie” or „resonance region”.

 

[j20blackdragon]

when 120 strategic bombers of China with each having 6 supersonic missiles under protection of aerial refuelling capable J20s, F35, J10, J15 and J16s come to the air then I would really like to see how UKs tiny fleet will defend against 720 incoming missiles just from the strategic bombers alone.

Bravo, you are the first person in this thread so far to mention the FULL NUMBER of H-6K China currently has available.

For those that are curious...

There are 5 confirmed regiments/brigades of H-6K/H-6N.

At least 26 aircraft per regiment/brigade.

6 KD-20/KD-20A (range ~1,500km) long-range cruise missiles per H-6K.

H-6K combat radius: ~3,500km.

 

[antonius123]

I keep having to repeat myself lol

Submarines - China will only be sending your latest fast nuclear subs(3 Type-093SSNs) as the rest are either too noisy or too slow to keep up with the aircraft carriers and escorts.
China's military leaders are not that simple minded.

Too noisy is according to you, or your father.

In October 2009, a Song-class (Type 039) diesel-electric attack submarine unexpectedly surfaced within torpedo range of the American aircraft carrier USS Kitty Hawk.
https://thediplomat.com/2015/12/chi...cruise-missile-attack-on-us-aircraft-carrier/

This 093 is even better than Song or Yuan class that stalk USS Kitty Hawk and USS Ronald Reagan.

As for the Type-056s, yes they can technically sail in open ocean, but the logistics of supporting an extra 60 Type-056s 1000s of kms away from China's coasts would be crippling - simply you do not have enough refuelling and resupply capacity as you never planned for it.

Again ... Britt can send navy to Indian Ocean while PLAN can't and will be crippled due to logistic nightmare? another pathetic joke of a stupid fanboy

No F-35Bs will not be using Harpoons as you rightly say they will lose their stealth.
The main use of the F-35Bs will be to wipe all your J-15Bs from the sky on the first day of battle and to use their powerful LPI radar to give accurate real time tracking of your fleet. Yes the F-35B will be scanning in and out(switch on radar > scan Chinese fleet > switch off radar > move position > switch on radar again > scan Chinese fleet > cycle.

Again ... if your F-35B are lucky enough to be able to take off from carriers before sunk to the bottom of the sea by YJ-100 or DF-26, and if the lucky F-35B will have another second luck by surviving HHQ-9 which is guided by anti stealth radar

And the next question for your super lucky F-35B is => how you will destroy PLAN ships? if F-35 function is just to wipe J-15 which doesnt fly off from Liaoning because HHQ-9 is enough to play the role intercepting F-35B?
Or if J-15 still fly off but guided by anti stealth radar, it could become a real threat to F-35B because it brings PL-15 mach4 with range 300km.

Nope! the power and LPI or radar cannot give real time accuracy at all. It is "distance" and AI that can give real time accuracy for a radar. Learn physics in order to be a little bit smarter please.

LOL. Switchin on and off is no use. PLAN passive radar YLC-20 can catch any any radio signal emitted from F-35 (radio communication, datalink com), and will always catch F-35B radar wave everytime it switch on their radar.


OK, F-35 can scan PLAN ship ... and then what? with what F-35 will destroy PLAN ship? as you say they dont bring Harpoon, LRASM to destroy ship or maybe bring 2 short range AShM to shoot ships and 4 AAM to shoot fighter, then that means you can only destroy 24 ships at best (assuming that it is true there are dozen F-35B operational in UK carrier now :lol ).

It will be very very very lucky for F-35B to launch short range AShM (normally is less than 60km range), because within that range F-35B will be even visible for most of PLAN normal radar and destroyed by HHQ-9.

UK is currently testing the 140km Spear 3 anti-radar missile and so I am sure a few dozen will be sent to get some real-live practice on your fleet. Each F-35B can carry 8 internally while also carrying 2 AMRAAMs
btw - On one hand you say that the Harpoons will make the F-35B lose it's stealth and the other you say that your anti-stealth radar makes stealth irrelevant? You are contradicting yourself there.

Any missile carried externally will make any stealth aircraft exposed to radar. So all missile that F-35B can carry internally are the short range ones. Different with J-20 because J-20's internal bay is much longer can acommodate longer missile like PL-15 with 300km range.

So now your anti-stealth radar will be able to "guide" J-15s to the rough position of the F-35Bs. I thought you said it will know exactly and direct a HHQ-9 missile from 1-200kms to shoot it down?

Let me tell you another thing for free - The J-15 would have have to be within 20-30kms of an F-35B to get a firing solution, whereas an F-35B would "see" the J-15 from 200kms away using it's LPI radar.
F-35B would know that Chinese radars were scanning it and so would switch to DAS to locate any J-15s within many 10s of kms away from it and then use their AMRAAMs to destroy it - no radar lock would even be required. So all that China would have would be a general idea that the F-35B was in the area but no precise location would ever be available unless the J-15 went to within 20-30kms and switched on it's radar but the F-35B would have used DAS and AMRAAM to have splashed the J-15 way before then.
I hope that Chinese military leaders are not that stupid to try this tactic you suggest!

LOL you are not smart he means: with help of anti stealth radar J-15 can lock F-35 from far away (say 300km) and then launch PL15 toward it.

And yes, the same anti stealth radar will guide HHQ9 from distance 300km away from F-35.

That means either J-15 or PLAN DDG will first shoot F-35.
Uhm btw you cant jammed passive radar, both DAS and RWR cannot detect it since it doesnt emit signal

Are you really an accountant as your handle seems to suggest?

Do you have any idea what the logistic issues would be of refuelling a J-20 2-3000kms away from the Chinese mainland.
To get an idea of what this may mean please study the below:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Black_Buck

Chinese strategic bombers are the 120 H-6s.
Yes they have the range and the weaponry but how would they know where to launch their missiles at as China would either need sub tracking or air tracking of the UK fleet? The UK would control both the air and under the surface and so not possible. Satellites are not enough by themselves as they cannot give realtime information since they pass by in orbit.

This one is the most ridiculous in your post.



"Do you really think that UK has any chance of even defending its mainland in one on one against China ?"

Even the USN would take 1 year to defeat the UK and that is with USAF help - US mainland is only 5000kms from UK but China is more than 10000km away and it is not a straight line over ocean like from USA to UK.

How will China even hope to fuel and resupply it's fleet from so far away?
There are a few choke points where the Chinese supply convoy would have to pass through - UK SSNs would be waiting to hunt them down at these locations.

Also how would the PLAN airforce of just 30-40 J-15s cope with 150 Euro-fighters armed with the deadly Meteor missile and guided by the full-size AWACs that UK has on the mainland?

I remind you again ... since you are to ignorant and never learn: OTH and Yaogan Satellite can detect enemy ship on sea.

 

[The Accountant]

The chinese’ vulnerability is the sea. We need to cut them off from oil, foods, energy supplies. Best way to do is imposing a total sea blockade by submarines.

First thing, Vietnam knacks the Pla’s military code, so we know their plans of attacks in advance.

Vietnam launching preemptive strike, with the first aircraft carrier the Laoning as target. Japan, Korea and India submarines join in to sink chinese merchant vessels.
Chinese economy coming to a standstill. The PLA launching series of attacks on Japan and Vietnam at sea and land.

Vietnam land based Yakhont targeting and disabling chinese destroyers, second missile attack sink the chinese invasion fleet in the battle.

Vietnam’s ultimate goal, drawing the US into the war with nuclear exchanges. At the end everyone is dead.

you can read the scenario in the novel:

Shattered Trident (Jerry Mitchell Series Book 4)

China vs multiple countries has some chance ... Malaka strait was the key vulnerability of China.

However forming such an alliance really difficult as all the cpuntries has different interests. And China is picking its fight wisely. They r not aggressive on any front except for south china sea hence right now japan and india will not likely to come out in open like vitenam.

Furthermore CPEC and OBOR are answere to this vulnerability. If a powerful froup tries to threaten naval blockade specially through Malaka strait then China still can get supplies from CPEC and OBOR by which they r getting connectivity through land routes.

 

[KAL-EL]

Just waste my time...

Despite saying that, you keep replying to him tho

 

[Viet]

1 meter wave length and 30cm wave length is not much different. Basically it is the shorter wave length that make the stealth object work effectively.



It is talking about regions applicable to computing the radar cross-section of a sphere.

View attachment 597573

The radar cross-section equation breaks down primarily due to creeping waves in the area where 2π · r. The largest positive perturbation of the radar cross-section (point A) would be 4 times higher than the radar cross-section computed using the optical region formula. Just slightly a minimum occurs (point B) and the actual radar cross-section would be 0.26 times the value calculated by using the optical region formula. This area is known as the „Mie” or „resonance region”.

Meter is meter, centimeter is centimeter. You can’t say a centimeter L band Radar is a meter radar too. It’s rediculous.

There are articles circulating JY-27A chinese meter Radar can detect F35 however those articles offer no explanation how it does it accept general bla bla.

Ok that picture you posted I find interesting. Question: which parts of F35 emits resonance? Is it the entire plane? Or is the wing? the tail? Or what?

China vs multiple countries has some chance ... Malaka strait was the key vulnerability of China.

However forming such an alliance really difficult as all the cpuntries has different interests. And China is picking its fight wisely. They r not aggressive on any front except for south china sea hence right now japan and india will not likely to come out in open like vitenam.

Furthermore CPEC and OBOR are answere to this vulnerability. If a powerful froup tries to threaten naval blockade specially through Malaka strait then China still can get supplies from CPEC and OBOR by which they r getting connectivity through land routes.

Ok that will change the scenario entirely because the chinese can get resupply by land routes via Cpec and Obor. That is if a major confrontation we need to drag in the US, while keeping Russia neutrality.

I am waiting for someone that write novels to the scenario.

 

[antonius123]

Meter is meter, centimeter is centimeter. You can’t say a centimeter L band Radar is a meter radar too. It’s rediculous.

L Band is not cm-wave as it is around 15cm means 15x cm-wave.
Maybe "terminology" of metre-wave is not accurate as well, but the point is meter wave is not in optical region too.

There are articles circulating JY-27A chinese meter Radar can detect F35 however those articles offer no explanation how it does it accept general bla bla.

It is meter-radar. The explanation of meter radar has been given above.

Ok that picture you posted I find interesting. Question: which parts of F35 emits resonance? Is it the entire plane? Or is the wing? the tail? Or what?

Should be entire.

 

[Viet]

L Band is not cm-wave as it is around 15cm means 15x cm-wave.
Maybe "terminology" of metre-wave is not accurate as well, but the point is meter wave is not in optical region too.



It is meter-radar. The explanation of meter radar has been given above.



Should be entire.

The entire plane?
Ok hopefully the US military reads your comment and realize F35 is scrap, they must scrap the plane immediately, $1.5 trillion could be saved.

What you mean with terminology “meter radar” is inaccurate? X band is centimeter radar, you call it meter radar or what? You are funny.

 

[UKBengali]

China vs multiple countries has some chance ... Malaka strait was the key vulnerability of China.

However forming such an alliance really difficult as all the cpuntries has different interests. And China is picking its fight wisely. They r not aggressive on any front except for south china sea hence right now japan and india will not likely to come out in open like vitenam.

Furthermore CPEC and OBOR are answere to this vulnerability. If a powerful froup tries to threaten naval blockade specially through Malaka strait then China still can get supplies from CPEC and OBOR by which they r getting connectivity through land routes.

CPEC route can be blocked unless PLAN deploys a CBG to Gwadar - even then China will be outmatched by USN.
OBOR is the answer to China’s weakness in the oceans.

Despite saying that, you keep replying to him tho

I have stopped now as he just keeps repeating the same old stuff about ASBMs, J-20s on carriers( ) SSKs in open ocean battles etc.
Think I have made my point about how far China needs to go before it has the quality of a top tier Navy like the UK. Now the US has the same quality but x10 more powerful. PLAN is improving rapidly but they will need till at least 2050 to match this.
As the PLAN gets more powerful then we will see an even closer alliance between US/Japan/Australia/Canada and the UK.
JN could become extremely powerful(2x UK) when they feel they have the need to and so this needs to be also taken into it account.
PLAN is just not going to build carriers and others do not respond.

 

[Kai Liu]

CPEC route can be blocked unless PLAN deploys a CBG to Gwadar - even then China will be outmatched by USN.
OBOR is the answer to China’s weakness in the oceans.



I have stopped now as he just keeps repeating the same old stuff about ASBMs, J-20s on carriers( ) SSKs in open ocean battles etc.
Think I have made my point about how far China needs to go before it has the quality of a top tier Navy like the UK. Now the US has the same quality but x10 more powerful. PLAN is improving rapidly but they will need till at least 2050 to match this.
As the PLAN gets more powerful then we will see an even closer alliance between US/Japan/Australia/Canada and the UK.
JN could become extremely powerful(2x UK) when they feel they have the need to and so this needs to be also taken into it account.
PLAN is just not going to build carriers and others do not respond.

Bengali bumpkin boy, do not speak like a Saint... It is you who keep repeating your same B.S. again and again like your pathetic 3 little subs to beat our 100s ships, a dozen F35s to rule the universe, and your joke 25 km range SAMs to shoot down all of our numerous hyper sonic missiles.... And you know what? You are a pathetic lair:
You stopped because I have exposed your lies and you have no answer to them:
#1 you have ZERO F35 in maritime combat operation,
#2 you have ZERO 'SPEAR 3' in operation,
#3 you have few little F23s with Sea Ceptor as oppose to your B.S. claim...
#4 your carriers are slow azz only go 25 knot... instead of your B.S. claim...
And there are more...

Despite saying that, you keep replying to him tho

Because I have tons of time to waste just watching and play with this Bengali joke bumpkin boy...lol...

 

[The Accountant]

CPEC route can be blocked unless PLAN deploys a CBG to Gwadar - even then China will be outmatched by USN.
OBOR is the answer to China’s weakness in the oceans.

Everything can be blocked my dear however the blocking country has to be aware of consequences.

China dont not CBG for unblocking the CPEC ... a small fleet of of Chinese strategic bomber are enough to tackle the supposed blockade.

The trade routes u r suggesting to block r within striking range of china whereas US can strike them only with the help of its limited 11 CBGs out of which only half can be away from USA mainland and even thise 6 cant be deployed against China alone as US has adversary all around the world ... dont u understand the advantage of home ground soecially when there is no empire and no resttiction on no of players ?

 

[UKBengali]

Everything can be blocked my dear however the blocking country has to be aware of consequences.

China dont not CBG for unblocking the CPEC ... a small fleet of of Chinese strategic bomber are enough to tackle the supposed blockade.

The trade routes u r suggesting to block r within striking range of china whereas US can strike them only with the help of its limited 11 CBGs out of which only half can be away from USA mainland and even thise 6 cant be deployed against China alone as US has adversary all around the world ... dont u understand the advantage of home ground soecially when there is no empire and no resttiction on no of players ?

US can deploy 6 CBGs( leaving 2 for other theatres) against China - remember UK and JN are also likely to join with the US in case of conflict with China.
I would expect at least 1 US + 1 UK CBG to deploy against Gwadar - Chinese strategic bombers will have little impact on such a powerful force protected by maybe a dozen escorts DDGs and FFGs.

 

[opruh]

Ignore @Viet and @UKBengali, they have no job so they are present in pdf 24/7 to spew craps and post their fantasies involving their us daddies.

 

[The Accountant]

US can deploy 6 CBGs( leaving 2 for other theatres) against China - remember UK and JN are also likely to join with the US in case of conflict with China.
I would expect at least 1 US + 1 UK CBG to deploy against Gwadar - Chinese strategic bombers will have little impact on such a powerful force protected by maybe a dozen escorts DDGs and FFGs.

Why would UK go against China ? Last time i checked Europe supported China against wishes of US. Europe hasbissues with Russia not China.

Secondly in a whole woeld against China offcourse China is to win bit it is so embaracing for USA that they need to call in others to even threat china ..

China's 120 long range bombers having 6 supersonic antiship misiles are useless as they r fucking paper missiles ... what these 720 missiles can do ... they r for tv shows only