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China says Sukhoi-35 last Imported fighter, while India carries on importing more Fighters

what fact? just because you say so?

'creating infrastructure isnt a problem'

this tickled me hard- so why do India have to send it's own tejas to Russia for testing if it can build 1 back at home?

Like i said, jsut the same old self-deceiving excuses.

Do some research about Indian private sector and find out how they have created world class infra for non military objects.

If it wasn't for the govt building a test facility is not a big deal for private sector.
 
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Do some research about Indian private sector and find out how they have created world class infra for non military objects.

If it wasn't for the govt building a test facility is not a big deal for private sector.

do what research? since u have this deflection anecdote(when we were talking about infrastructure related to arms) that Indian private sector created 'world class infra for non military objects', why dont u lists them out? How i do 'research' if i dont even know what world class infra u r talking about?

giphy.gif


'no issue'
'no big deal'
'not a problem'
'we will do it if we want to'

yayayayayayayayaya
 
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do what research? since u have this deflection anecdote(when we were talking about infrastructure related to arms) that Indian private sector created 'world class infra for non military objects', why dont u lists them out?

Reliance industries refinery Essar refinery, ISRO TATA power. There are many. We can go on and argue over it.

The fact remains the same. Indian government didn't allow private sector unlike China and US to participate in defence projects. And it was govts lack of support that worked against the defence industry. For example if they could have continued the fruits of research and manufacturing from DRDOs HF Marut project designed by Kirk tank then we could have had a fighters manufacture base now.
 
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Reliance industries refinery Essar refinery, ISRO TATA power. There are many. We can go on and argue over it.

The fact remains the same. Indian government didn't allow private sector unlike China and US to participate in defence projects. And it was govts lack of support that worked against the defence industry. For example if they could have continued the fruits of research and manufacturing from DRDOs HF Marut project designed by Kirk tank then we could have had a fighters manufacture base now.

Those are jsut oil refineries, almost any1 can build them- including even dirt poor sub saharan nations and state enterprises can also build them:

  • Fushun Petrochemical Refinery (CNPC), 160,000 bbl/d (25,000 m3/d)
  • SINOPEC Anqing Company Refinery110000 bbl/day
  • SINOPEC Beijing Yanshan Company Refinery 165000 bbl/day
  • CNCP (PetroChina) Lanzhou Refiner 112000 bbl/day
  • SINOPEC CPCC Guangzhou Branch Refinery 150000 bbl/day
  • SINOPEC Maoming Company Refinery 265000 bbl/day
  • SINOPEC Beihai Company Refinery 12000 bbl/day
  • SINOPEC Cangzhou Company Refinery 70000 bbl/day
  • CNCP (PetroChina) Daqing Petrochemical Refinery 122000 bbl/day
  • SINOPEC Luoyang Company 100000 bbl/day
  • SINOPEC Jingmen Company 100000 bbl/day
  • SINOPEC Wuhan Company Refinery 80000 bbl/day
  • SINOPEC CPCC Changling Company Refinery100000 bbl/day
  • SINOPEC Jinling Company Refinery265000 bbl/day
  • SINOPEC Jiujiang Company Refinery 98000 bbl/day
  • CNCP (PetroChina) Jilin Chemical Refinery 115000 bbbl/day
  • CNCP (PetroChina) Dalian Petrochemical Refinery144000 bbl/day
  • CNCP (PetroChina) Fushun Petrochemical Refinery 186000 bbl/day
  • CNCP (PetroChina) Jinxi Refinery 112000 bbl/day
  • CNCP (PetroChina) Jinzhou Petrochemical Refinery112000 bbl/day
  • WEPEC Dalain Refinery 200000 bbl/day
  • SINOPEC Jinan Company 21000 bbl/day
  • SINOPEC Qilu Company Refinery 195000 bbl/day
  • SINOPEC Shanghai Gaoqiao Oil Refinery 220000 bbl/day
  • SINOPEC Tianjin Company Refinery 100000 bbl/day
  • CNCP (PetroChina) Dushanzi Refinery 120000 bbl/day
  • CNCP (PetroChina) Ürümqi Petrochemical 101000 bbl/day
  • SINOPEC Zhenhai Refinery 345000 bbl/day
Algeria

Nigeria
Sudan

even a psuedo-primitive nation who have a large portion of its people living as tribal people in jungles like papua New guinea can also build one:


Papua New Guinea







you are just like saying "indian private sector can build a decent house' when everyone can build decent houses
 
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Those are jsut oil refineries, almost any1 can build them- including even dirt poor sub saharan nations and state enterprises can also build them:

  • Fushun Petrochemical Refinery (CNPC), 160,000 bbl/d (25,000 m3/d)
  • SINOPEC Anqing Company Refinery110000 bbl/day
  • SINOPEC Beijing Yanshan Company Refinery 165000 bbl/day
  • CNCP (PetroChina) Lanzhou Refiner 112000 bbl/day
  • SINOPEC CPCC Guangzhou Branch Refinery 150000 bbl/day
  • SINOPEC Maoming Company Refinery 265000 bbl/day
  • SINOPEC Beihai Company Refinery 12000 bbl/day
  • SINOPEC Cangzhou Company Refinery 70000 bbl/day
  • CNCP (PetroChina) Daqing Petrochemical Refinery 122000 bbl/day
  • SINOPEC Luoyang Company 100000 bbl/day
  • SINOPEC Jingmen Company 100000 bbl/day
  • SINOPEC Wuhan Company Refinery 80000 bbl/day
  • SINOPEC CPCC Changling Company Refinery100000 bbl/day
  • SINOPEC Jinling Company Refinery265000 bbl/day
  • SINOPEC Jiujiang Company Refinery 98000 bbl/day
  • CNCP (PetroChina) Jilin Chemical Refinery 115000 bbbl/day
  • CNCP (PetroChina) Dalian Petrochemical Refinery144000 bbl/day
  • CNCP (PetroChina) Fushun Petrochemical Refinery 186000 bbl/day
  • CNCP (PetroChina) Jinxi Refinery 112000 bbl/day
  • CNCP (PetroChina) Jinzhou Petrochemical Refinery112000 bbl/day
  • WEPEC Dalain Refinery 200000 bbl/day
  • SINOPEC Jinan Company 21000 bbl/day
  • SINOPEC Qilu Company Refinery 195000 bbl/day
  • SINOPEC Shanghai Gaoqiao Oil Refinery 220000 bbl/day
  • SINOPEC Tianjin Company Refinery 100000 bbl/day
  • CNCP (PetroChina) Dushanzi Refinery 120000 bbl/day
  • CNCP (PetroChina) Ürümqi Petrochemical 101000 bbl/day
  • SINOPEC Zhenhai Refinery 345000 bbl/day
Algeria

Nigeria
Sudan

you are like saying "indian private sector can build a decent house' when everyone can build decent houses

Excellent comparison! ISRO is not a refinery they do good job and have world class infrastructure for rocketry and space program. The same oil refinery company was given contracts for making Rafale in India by Dassult corp. ask those sub Saharan companies for a similar contract from Dassult or DCNS. And good luck with that.

We don't make airbus here in India but TATA sed makes Boeing fuselage and Apache guns and doors. The private and the non defence sector has the money and cash for R&D and production it's the govt will that stops them coz unless there is a guarantee of confirm orders no one will invest.

However things are changing now and in 20 years you can see some serious work in aviation defence.
 
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The "rumor" of the Su-35 purchase has been circulating the internet for a good part of 9 years. The rationale behind the purchase of merely 24 Su-35s in the advent of the J-11D, J-16, and other Flanker derivatives (which are more advanced than the Su-35s in numerous aspects) is also up to interpretation. By that measure, I'd say that any skepticism is well-justified.

Well,we only know about it for 4 years now.And for Chinese members,the "Skepticism" has a touch of hyper nationalistic attitudes as well.

By the way,your claim again has brought us to the same point,if China is making "Flanker Derivatives" which is better than Russian one,why they bothered to by SU-35 in the first place??There is no doubt though we'll see a Chinese version of SU-35 in near future even with all the Russian safeguards in place.
 
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Why can't we accept the fact, China is too big an opponent for us at present with their state of the art manufacturing facilities. India need very rapid as well as heavy investment on R&D in all sectors if we want to at-least compete with them. Alas, our decision making mechanism and good for nothing bureaucracy is to be blamed. :-(
We know they are powerful no denying that unlike our friends from the west who are some martial superior race.... atleast in their minds
 
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Well,we only know about it for 4 years now.And for Chinese members,the "Skepticism" has a touch of hyper nationalistic attitudes as well.

By the way,your claim again has brought us to the same point,if China is making "Flanker Derivatives" which is better than Russian one,why they bothered to by SU-35 in the first place??There is no doubt though we'll see a Chinese version of SU-35 in near future even with all the Russian safeguards in place.

My perspective has always been this: if the Su-35s were truly meant to supplant or even complement an existing Flanker (secondary to a technical deficit or whatnot), the Chinese would have purchased far higher numbers of the aircraft than merely 24. Additionally, we would see much slower production & development of domestic Flanker variants, which has not been true (the J-11D, J-15, J-16 are in full production or development).

From a technical basis, the J-11D and J-16 (and also J-15A to some extent) has numerous enhancements such as AESA radars, application of CFRP composites & RAM, additional hardpoints, ECM/EW upgrades, etc., many of which are simply not found on the Su-35.

There are a few theories on why the Su-35s were purchased, based on their camouflage and the general parameters of the deal:
1. Stop-gap until more advanced aircraft (J-11D, J-20, etc.) come into service
2. Salvage of its 117S TVC engines (unlikely given the development of a similar-performing WS-10IPE)
3. DACT or OPFOR (very likely given its camouflage, which reflects that of existing PLAAF "Blue Force" simulator aircraft)
4. Supplement inadequate J-11B/J-16/J-11D production (possible but it will cause logistic issues)

The Su-35 purchase of 2016 is very different to the Su-30MKK/MK2 purchase back in 2000s (which involved 100+ aircraft); it's very unlikely a technological gap was the main reason for the purchase, especially with the appearance of advanced Flanker derivatives as stated above.
 
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China claims its developed 5 gen tech and still imports su-35 and they have been negotiating this for ages...
Advice to Pakistanies,even if it costs more go for euro fighter instead of going for J-31.

China claims its developed 5 gen tech and still imports su-35 and they have been negotiating this for ages...
Advice to Pakistanies,even if it costs more go for euro fighter instead of going for J-31.

You don't know anything about Chinese product but we do and it is full fill our requirements and we know the future plans of China and we are partners to achieve those goals for us as well. JF17 give us manufacturing experience and now over 75% plane is made in Pakistan. We achieve early 90's and late 90's technology combo and JF block 3 will touch late 90's and early 2000's tech. Where India is stand in finishing product?. China is 10 to 15 year behind compare to US in every field and in engine they are 30 to 40 years behind US, but in next 10 years they will cover the gap in good pace and in engine they will beat Russia very soon. They have there first finish engine product WS10 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shenyang_WS-10 and soon we hear news about few more finish product. They just start engine manufacturing in 2010 and in next 10 years they will be master in this field like US, Russia and France. Now they are focusing on improvements in engine not in make new product from scratch.
 
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