Chengdu J-20 5th Generation Aircraft News & Discussions

[ChineseTiger1986]

Agree
Classified info is classified for a reason. So we call all speculate here,no one,but time is entitled to give verdict.
By law of physics, I know those two J-20 jets in the debut demo flight at the Zhuhai air show must not be powered by any AL-31F.

The AL-31FM2 is already out, since it hasn't passed any flight test, so let alone being installed on the J-20.

Now the real contest is between the WS-10X and the WS-15.

 

[Tiqiu]

That's right. For J-20 with a weight of 19t plus fuel to make that kind of vertical climb maneuver without afterburner, those mysterious engines have to have a lot higher thrust than the Russian ones.

If graphic analysis is the only means for our outsiders to speculate, then at least people need to analyze the color characteristic of the exhaust nozzles of various engines in question here in addition to their shapes, structures etc, as the petals and flops are made of different materials and different materials have different properties, thus they will show different color under light. I heard the nozzle of FWS10B uses ceramic-based composite materials and FWS15 uses carbon-based nanomaterials to tolerant high temperature, so i think we should pay some attention to this aspect when viewing and comparing those engines.

F-35 's nozzle uses ceramic matrix composites

 

[cirr]

11 LRIPs，of which 6 have been painted with "tactical numbers".

 

[Deino]

11 LRIPs，of which 6 have been painted with "tactical numbers".

IMAGES PLEASE ... oh man, where are my chill-pills !??

 

[52051]

IMAGES PLEASE ... oh man, where are my chill-pills !??

Well, in his weibo, the mod of fyjs (one of the two most popular China military BBS) claimed there are 11 J-20 production version in CAC factory, and 6 of the 11 has printed numbers.

Note the many of first bunch of J-20's pictures we saw in 2010/2011 were taken by this exact mod, he also post the first few J-10B/C pictures.

He sure has some credit here.

There are many threads in mulitple Chinese defence related BBS discuss this, for example:
http://lt.cjdby.net/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=2325242&extra=page=1

 

[Deino]

Thanks a lot ... did he mention any numbers ? Are they already a 5-digit serial or similar to the first FTTC-unit the J-10A were allocated to, only 2-digit numbers ?

Thanks again,
Deino

 

[帅的一匹]

Well, in his weibo, the mod of fyjs (one of the two most popular China military BBS) claimed there are 11 J-20 production version in CAC factory, and 6 of the 11 has printed numbers.

Note the many of first bunch of J-20's pictures we saw in 2010/2011 were taken by this exact mod, he also post the first few J-10B/C pictures.

He sure has some credit here.

There are many threads in mulitple Chinese defence related BBS discuss this, for example:
http://lt.cjdby.net/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=2325242&extra=page=1

For this, the national security will invite him for tea.

 

[Beast]

For this, the national security will invite him for tea.

Some are intentional leak with blessing from PLAAF. I am sure this is a response after JMSDF bragging about being the first foreigner countries to takeover F-35A.

It might not long before we can even know more about what type of engines used on J-20.

 

[samsara]

Some are intentional leak with blessing from PLAAF. I am sure this is a response after JMSDF bragging about being the first foreigner countries to takeover F-35A.

It might not long before we can even know more about what type of engines used on J-20.

Talking about "JMSDF bragging about being the first foreigner countries to takeover F-35A" in a nice photo show (credit to the National Interest publication), CCTV 4 in its Focus Today just moment ago (02 Dec, evening program) just aired that segment and showed the nice photo along with Japan's new anti-ship ground missile, arguably to defend the Diaoyu (Senkaku) Island. It's said that Japan pays around JPY750 bn (or about USD6.6 bn) a year for protection fee to USFJ.

 

[Deino]

Some are intentional leak with blessing from PLAAF. I am sure this is a response after JMSDF bragging about being the first foreigner countries to takeover F-35A.

It might not long before we can even know more about what type of engines used on J-20.

Indeed an argument ... by the way: Do You remember once ???

 

[52051]

Thanks a lot ... did he mention any numbers ? Are they already a 5-digit serial or similar to the first FTTC-unit the J-10A were allocated to, only 2-digit numbers ?

Thanks again,
Deino

He didnt, all he claimed are: 11 J-20 IOC version so far, and 6 have number printed, and he claimed that there will be 700+ J-20 planned.

 

[Deino]

He didnt, all he claimed are: 11 J-20 IOC version so far, and 6 have number printed, and he claimed that there will be 700+ J-20 planned.

Ok ... then I must have misinterpret the first part (even if 11 LRIP birds was already assumed by late October), the 6 with the numbers however are new.

Concerning the 700+ I think that's more a bit of an overestimation ... just think about how many Flankers China has so far.

Deino

 

[52051]

Ok ... then I must have misinterpret the first part (even if 11 LRIP birds was already assumed by late October), the 6 with the numbers however are new.

Concerning the 700+ I think that's more a bit of an overestimation ... just think about how many Flankers China has so far.

Deino

Well, with all respect, like I explained before, the past experience is not a very good indication of future when it come to military production in China now, like if we use past production of 052C to forecast, then we may reach a conclusion, that China will order no more than 4-6 052d DDG, yet we get 13 052d DDG now and new orders are still coming.

The production of China's military hardware is on an accerlating phase now, I explained the reasons before.

 

[Asoka]

Ok ... then I must have misinterpret the first part (even if 11 LRIP birds was already assumed by late October), the 6 with the numbers however are new.

Concerning the 700+ I think that's more a bit of an overestimation ... just think about how many Flankers China has so far.

Deino

J-20 is going to be a force multiplier. Other than being a long range striker to take out the oil tankers, AWACS and EW planes, it could act as a commander to drones and 3rd and 4th generation fighters. When you see a cloud of j-10 J-11 and J-15, and J-16 in the sky on your radar screen coming at you, you know you are not going to defeat them with just your F-16, F-35, F-15, knowing lurking in them could be many J-20. Without enough F-22s to escort your other fighters, your battle plan is out of the window.

And if you just going to send F-22 to meet them, the J-1X fighters could act as a swarm of weapon platforms for the J-20, which provide them with targeting information. The J-20 will enable the J-1X fight better, so China might need less of them.

So in my opinion, 500 J-20 is minimum and even 800 of them is not too many. Remember, the USAF's original plan was to have 800 F-22s.

I might even say 1200, even 2000 J-20's is possible. I hear you doubters laughing and rolling on the floor and saying "NO, ITS IMPOSSIBLE! WHERE IS THE EVIDENCE? WHERE IS THE PROOF?"

But who is planning to build 2400 F-35 at a cost of $230 millions per plane, and has accumulated $20 Trillions national debt ($4 Trillions By George W. Bush, and $10 Trillions by Barry O'Bomber) and owes China $1.3 Trillion dollars.

And you think it is possible for China to build 1200-2000, or even just 500, J-20 at $120 millions per plane?

 

[samsara]

Lockheed Martin should feel great gratitude to Japan for its huge contribution to the funding of this masterpiece.

非常に多くの日本をありがとうございます Hijō ni ōku no Nihon o arigatōgozaimasu Thank you very much, Japan!

~~~~~~~~

Japan Finally Acquires First Beleaguered F-35 Joint Strike Fighter - Sputniknews (2016-12-03)

The Japan Air Self-Defence Force received the first of its Lockheed Martin F-35s this week at Luke Air Force Base in Arizona according to IHS Jane’s.

Since 2006, the F-35 has been plagued by a series of issues involving logistics systems, avionics processors, landing gear, and fuel tank design. In October, a Marine Corps F-35B fighter jet caught on fire during a training simulation.

"Every time they test it they find another failure," Pierre Sprey, one of the designers of the F-16, told Sputnik Radio. "Another failure means an expensive fix that has to be put into the production line," Sprey added.

One of the chief features of the F-35s, its stealth capability, "was an advertising hook when it was first developed as a multibillion dollar program in the early 80s," he said. "Stealth itself dated all the way back to World War II, but was a relatively cheap and low-level operation," he noted. And while stealth may have been an effective marketing tactic, "every Battle of Britain radar would be able to see every stealth airplane today, loud and clear," he said.

Still, the F-35s are a significant upgrade from Japan’s 1970s-era Mitsubishi-McDonnell Douglas F-4J Kai aircraft. "This is such an important time in our wing’s history" Colonel Kurt Gallegos, the 944th Fighter Wing commander, said of the deal, according to Update Philippines.

The entire deal, including initial purchase, future maintenance and repairs, is worth an estimated $14 billion, IHS Jane’s notes. Japan has agreed to procure 28 of the F-35s over the next five years, the security intelligence news agency adds.