Chengdu J-20 5th Generation Aircraft News & Discussions

[Audio]

hmmm, that means F-35 pwned

You sure?

Designed for a “HUD-less” cockpit, the heads up display travels with the pilot’s head, yielding pictures like this to the occupant:

 

[SuperFieryDragon]

waiting about five to eight years J20 will enter china pla I only know so much

whats the top speed on this plane?

maybe has 2.0 to 2.35Mach

 

[homing28]

 

[SBD-3]

Janes Defence Weekly on J-20

 

[oct605032048]

J-20 is not designed to fight against India. There is no reason for them to worried about it at all.

 

[Diivil]

wonderful~~

 

[Martian2]

JSF (Joint Strike Fighter) is inferior to J-20 Mighty Dragon

1. JSF does not have supercruise capability.

2. JSF is not an all-aspect stealth fighter. It has less-stealthy LOAN (low observable asymmetric nozzle) nozzles. The flat nozzles on the F-22 are the best design for radar and infrared stealth.

The J-20 is likely to install flat nozzles when the powerful WS-15 engine is ready, because it is the only feature where it is clearly inferior to the F-22.

3. JSF has bumps along its entire bottom. There is also a large protrusion above the left airduct for the cannon on the F-35A, which makes it less stealthy.

4. JSF uses cheaper materials, which compromise stealth.

5. The combat radius is only half of the J-20.

6. JSF lacks internal side weapon bays.

7. The JSF is significantly smaller in physical size and can only carry a much smaller radar with less T/R (transmit/receive) modules. Since it has only one engine, the available power to the radar is also significantly less.

The JSF radar is clearly inferior to the F-22 and a J-20 equipped with AESA radar.

8. The J-20 will be able to look down and shoot missiles (with better kinematics or more kinetic energy) at the lower flying F-35. The service ceiling of the J-20 is 65,617 ft. It is only 60,000 ft. for the F-35.

In conclusion, the JSF is no match for the J-20. The battle plan is for the F-22 to engage the J-20. However, there are only 187 F-22s. The military balance may shift if China produces 300 or more J-20s in the future (circa 2018).

Sensor fusion doesn't mean much when the J-20 has a larger radar and greater detection range than the F-35. Furthermore, the J-20 has a cleaner design and is stealthier than the F-35. Sending a F-35 against the J-20 is unwise.

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Latest J-20 "2002" Mighty Dragon photographs

Notice the gold transparent RAM on the J-20 cockpit canopy. Only China and the U.S. have this advanced material science technology.

The prominent DSI (diverterless supersonic inlet) strake was probably extensively modeled with Chinese supercomputers.

When the WS-15 engine is ready in a few years, China can replace the J-20 LOAN nozzles with flat nozzles. The J-20 will be good to go against the F-22.

[Note: Thank you to Greyboy2 for the pictures.]

 

[gambit]

JSF is inferior to J-20 Mighty Dragon

1. JSF does not have supercruise capability.

2. JSF is not an all-aspect stealth fighter. It has less-stealthy LOAN (low observable asymmetric nozzle) nozzles. The flat nozzles on the F-22 are the best design for radar and infrared stealth.

The J-20 is likely to install flat nozzles when the powerful WS-15 engine is ready, because it is the only feature where it is clearly inferior to the F-22.

3. JSF has bumps along its entire bottom. There is also a large protrusion above the left airduct for the cannon on the F-35A, which makes it less stealthy.

4. JSF uses cheaper materials, which compromise stealth.

5. The combat radius is only half of the J-20.

6. JSF lacks internal side weapon bays.

7. The JSF is significantly smaller in physical size and can only carry a much smaller radar with less T/R (transmit/receive) modules. Since it has only one engine, the available power to the radar is also significantly less.

The JSF radar is clearly inferior to the F-22 and a J-20 equipped with AESA radar.

8. The J-20 will be able to look down and shoot missiles (with better kinematics or more kinetic energy) at the lower flying F-35. The service ceiling of the J-20 is 65,617 ft. It is only 60,000 ft. for the F-35.

In conclusion, the JSF is no match for the J-20. The battle plan is for the F-22 to engage the J-20. However, there are only 187 F-22s. The military balance may shift if China produces 300 or more J-20s in the future (circa 2018).

Sensor fusion doesn't mean much when the J-20 has a larger radar and greater detection range than the F-35. Furthermore, the J-20 has a cleaner design and is stealthier than the F-35. Sending a F-35 against the J-20 is unwise.

Latest J-20 "2002" Mighty Dragon photographs[/B][/COLOR]

Notice the gold transparent RAM on the J-20 cockpit canopy. Only China and the U.S. have this technology.

The prominent DSI (diverterless supersonic inlet) strake was probably extensively modeled with Chinese supercomputers.

When the WS-15 engine is ready in a few years, China can replace the J-20 LOAN nozzles with flat nozzles. The J-20 will be good to go against the F-22.

[Note: Thank you to Greyboy2 for the pictures.]

Must be a slow news day on the J-20 front.

 

[Pfpilot]

That just sounds insane. How can one compare the combat radius of the f-35 with an aircraft that is yet to have any official figures regarding the performance of the engine or fuel capacity released. Generally everything negative about the f-35 plagues the j-20 as well. It is a bit rich to assume China's first attempt at a stealth aircraft can match US stealth developments that have taken place over the last three decades.

On the other hand, sensor fusion is of crucial importance; when that massive j-20 radar is turned on, the f-35 sensors will be able to detect it and pinpoint it's location to the pilot, long before the j-20 detects any f-35s. It is a little far fetched to assume that the Chinese can match the USA in radar technology in the first place; a smaller American radar is probably superior to far larger radars produced by other nations. The Americans have various operational AESA radars in their fighters and have had the opportunity to test and improve them over the last decade and a half. The Chinese may well get to there someday, but at this point the American hegemony over sensors and avionics cannot be challenged.

The Chinese are very capable, but you are not giving them their due and underestimating the challenge they face in trying to catch up to American technology.

 

[gambit]

That just sounds insane. How can one compare the combat radius of the f-35 with an aircraft that is yet to have any official figures regarding the performance of the engine or fuel capacity released. Generally everything negative about the f-35 plagues the j-20 as well. It is a bit rich to assume China's first attempt at a stealth aircraft can match US stealth developments that have taken place over the last three decades.

On the other hand, sensor fusion is of crucial importance; when that massive j-20 radar is turned on, the f-35 sensors will be able to detect it and pinpoint it's location to the pilot, long before the j-20 detects any f-35s. It is a little far fetched to assume that the Chinese can match the USA in radar technology in the first place; a smaller American radar is probably superior to far larger radars produced by other nations. The Americans have various operational AESA radars in their fighters and have had the opportunity to test and improve them over the last decade and a half. The Chinese may well get to there someday, but at this point the American hegemony over sensors and avionics cannot be challenged.

The Chinese are very capable, but you are not giving them their due and underestimating the challenge they face in trying to catch up to American technology.

Like I said -- slow news day. The J-20 discussion have been stagnant for a long time. The Chinese playgrounds are intellectually dead on the technical issues because none of them have relevant experience to talk in any sensible manner, hence the ridiculous exaggerations on the J-20's side and the gross misunderstanding on tactics.

That is what the F-22's Communication/Navigation/Identification (CNI) configuration. The F-35's CNI is even better and the plan is to transition the F-35's CNI over to the F-22 in the future.

 

[Esc8781]

Yes there is a news that the f-35 can jam the f-22's radar!

It said, Airborne detection of stealth aircraft may already be an operational capability. In a series of tests at Edwards AFB, Calif., in 2009, Lockheed Martin?s CATbird avionics testbed—a Boeing 737 that carries the F-35 Joint Strike Fighter?s entire avionics system—engaged a mixed force of F-22s and Boeing F-15s and was able to locate and jam F-22 radars, according to researchers.

Source: aviation week. Gambit, what unit controls the Band 2 antenna arrays?

 

[eachus]

Yes there is a news that the f-35 can jam the f-22's radar!

Source: aviation week. Gambit, what unit controls the Band 2 antenna arrays?

F-35 does not know what type of radar J20 is going to use, J20 knows what F35 is using and will export. how do you and how can you jam something you dont know?



let me translate the comparison in my own words. F-22 is air superior fighter, it has great stealthy features and also powerful engine. since it was introduced too early, it rivals were 3G fighters and electronic only 10 years outdated. the F35 is new one but its pocket is full of knifes, none of its knife is shape.

J20 was develop/introduced 20 later, it has clear rivals --- F22 and F35(possible T50, but T50 is only 3.9G, not true stealthy). J20 has more advance/newer electronic. and J20 focus on air-superior, its top priority is to reduce its front RCS. make it extremely stealthy from front. its has large nose, new radar, new electronics, large weapon bay can carry larger longer range missiles.

J20 is the only one to be "first find, first kill" killing machine.

 

[gambit]

F-35 does not know what type of radar J20 is going to use, J20 knows what F35 is using and will export. how do you and how can you jam something you dont know?



let me translate the comparison in my own words. F-22 is air superior fighter, it has great stealthy features and also powerful engine. since it was introduced too early, it rivals were 3G fighters and electronic only 10 years outdated. the F35 is new one but its pocket is full of knifes, none of its knife is shape.

J20 was develop/introduced 20 later, it has clear rivals --- F22 and F35(possible T50, but T50 is only 3.9G, not true stealthy). J20 has more advance/newer electronic. and J20 focus on air-superior, its top priority is to reduce its front RCS. make it extremely stealthy from front. its has large nose, new radar, new electronics, large weapon bay can carry larger longer range missiles.

J20 is the only one to be "first find, first kill" killing machine.

Another fine example of 'Chinese physics'.

A transmission at X freq is going to be the same X freq no matter who receive it. Detailed knowledge of pulse characteristics mean a more tailored response, meaning the jamming signals will have reduced effects on peripheral receivers in the area, such as friendly aircrafts that may be transmitting at the same freq but not with the same pulse characteristics.

You are wrong.

 

[Esc8781]

F-35 does not know what type of radar J20 is going to use, J20 knows what F35 is using and will export. how do you and how can you jam something you dont know?



let me translate the comparison in my own words. F-22 is air superior fighter, it has great stealthy features and also powerful engine. since it was introduced too early, it rivals were 3G fighters and electronic only 10 years outdated. the F35 is new one but its pocket is full of knifes, none of its knife is shape.

J20 was develop/introduced 20 later, it has clear rivals --- F22 and F35(possible T50, but T50 is only 3.9G, not true stealthy). J20 has more advance/newer electronic. and J20 focus on air-superior, its top priority is to reduce its front RCS. make it extremely stealthy from front. its has large nose, new radar, new electronics, large weapon bay can carry larger longer range missiles.

J20 is the only one to be "first find, first kill" killing machine.

The f-22 can be upgraded with its avionics that one of the reasons it was chosen over the YF-23, it was more upgradable, like Gambit says "A transmission at X freq is going to be the same X freq no matter who receive it", I love it when they underestimate the f-35's capability. Anyways I think the real rival to the f-35 is the su-35. If the j-20 and f-35 meets the it will most likely be the F-35C.

 

[eachus]

Another fine example of 'Chinese physics'.

A transmission at X freq is going to be the same X freq no matter who receive it. Detailed knowledge of pulse characteristics mean a more tailored response, meaning the jamming signals will have reduced effects on peripheral receivers in the area, such as friendly aircrafts that may be transmitting at the same freq but not with the same pulse characteristics.

You are wrong.

I see the other way around, J20 will jam F35 since J20 is more powerful than F35. if F35 tries to jam J20, j20 will fire missile and take it down since F20 will see further and can kill longer distance.

The f-22 can be upgraded with its avionics that one of the reasons it was chosen over the YF-23, it was more upgradable, like Gambit says "A transmission at X freq is going to be the same X freq no matter who receive it", I love it when they underestimate the f-35's capability. Anyways I think the real rival to the f-35 is the su-35. If the j-20 and f-35 meets the it will most likely be the F-35C.

F22 has its legs too short, 500KM is nothing and if you fight against China you can not refuel around 500km radius. China is not Iraq. for F35, it is not air-superior fighter, J20 is specified on air-superior and focus on pointing only 2 objects, f35 and f22. none of f35 nor f22 is specified to fight J20 since J20 is newer version.