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Unfortunately, Pahlavis tried to falsify history of Iran. That's why @Serpentine thinks that this map is making any sense, while even in that century, Iran(Qajar empire) has not control, nor claims on most parts of the shown map. :disagree:

how have you been rmi5?

super busy as usual?
 
how have you been rmi5?

super busy as usual?
I am fine buddy. ;) I will be a bit more relieved this week, but, I will be super busy again, very soon. :lol:
What about you?
are u happy with Argentina-Germany final game? :D
 
I am fine buddy. ;) I will be a bit more relieved this week, but, I will be super busy again, very soon. :lol:
What about you?
are u happy with Argentina-Germany final game? :D

to me, fro the second half, it looked like going to the penalties.

But Romero you legend! This world cup has made stars out of the goal keepers.
 
Why are you insisting in saying lies? Wars started when Russia invaded Qajar empire, which resulted in Golestan treaty. The funny point is that you hate qajar turks so much that you are even appologyzing for Russian empire. BTW, it was the peter the great who started the mess by his famous wills letter. For pete's sake, go read some basic history man, ...


BTW, I am saying that what you are saying is just bunch of non-sense which is generated by Pahlavi propaganda, and you are refrencing your words to uneducated people's words which is being imposed to these propaganda, and has zero scientific value.

Another face palm is needed:



About your map, it is a funny BS map. Hopefully, we are in a pakistani forum, and you can ask history educated Pakistanis to teach you whether Punjab, Afghanistan, Sind, Northwestern frontier, and Balouchistan have been part of Qajar empire or not.
@FaujHistorian Can you elaborate it whether Punjab was part of Iran or sikh empire was ruling during those times? Please elaborate about Balouchistan, and how local rulers(we call them Khan) were ruling baluchistan.
@Serpentine dude, as I told you before, your mind is infested with Pahlavi non-sense propaganda. FYI, we did not even have control on Sistan, let alone on Punjab ;) We later traded part of Sistan instead of a strip border region with Afghanistan which was Pashthun region.

In Farsi:
"Hattaa ma rouye balouchestan ham control nadaashtim, va dar vaaghe' az gharaardaad e goldesmit be ba'd boud ke ingilis balouchestan ra ba ma taghsim kard. ghabl az oun, dolat amalan faghat ta kerman ra dar ekhtiyaar dasht, va manaateghi mesle Iranshahr, ... jozve manaategh e taht e hakemiyat e iran naboud. ta inke Qajar dynasty va ingilis in mantagheh ra taghsim va ba'dan tasarrof kardand"

Seriously, learn some history dude. :disagree:

@Serpentine
BTW, In official maps of Qajar era, they usually did't use terms like Persia. During Qajar era, Iran was officially named "Mamaalek e Mahrouseh ye Qajar ya Mamalek e Mahrouseh ye Iran". So, Iran was either referred by these names or the translation of these terms. Using the term Persia is vague here. Even if the map is not fake, like other fake documents made by Pahlavis, it may refer to something else.


As a bigger military power, it was natural that Russia was harassing its neighbor, which was Iran and no one denies that. But Qajar king, Fath Ali Shah entered an already doomed war and and was trying also to rely on French and British to win the war. If he had slightest military IQ, just like Shah Abbas's policy towards Ottomans, he would leave the Georgia (which was recently annexed by Russia) temporarily to the Russians, then organize a modern army in years and attack them and take the territories back, but not only it ended in disaster, but also it led to another disaster 15 years later with treaty of Turkemanchay by the very same mistake. We should also note that Russia was fighting on other fronts at the same time and yet this happened.

About the map, I accept that it may not be accurate and I'm not the one who made it, but you should also accept that Iran lost one of the most strategic areas which was Caucasus and also some parts of Turkmenistan and Afghanistan.

in farsi:

nemidunam chera inghadr talash dari az qajar ha ghahreman besazi va ya vanemud koni ke man daram az pahlavi tarafdari mikonam, agar man az turk haie qajar motenafer budam serfan be khatere ghomiat, nemiumadam az mosadegh be onvane ye rahbare khob yad konam va agar ba turk ha moshkel dashtam, nemiumadam esmi az nader shah bebaram be onvane ye padeshahe moghtader. be har hal nemidunam chera paziroftane eshtebahate qajarha inghadr sakhte, khodet ham didi ke man che rahat paziroftam ke reza pahlavi ki bude va che karde, vali to dari serfan be khatere turk budan qajar ha ino be ye mas'aleie ghomiati tabdil mikoni. asan ki ahamiat mide qajar ha az che ghomi budan? on moghe ke asan be ghole khodet in masaele turk va fars matrah nabude, pas vaghti man enteghad mikonam, dalili bar in nist ke moshkeli ba ghomiateshun daram va khodetam khub miduni ke intor nist.

Now I will answer a possible reply to this post in the chill thread since I don't want to ruin this thread with an exclusive discussion.
 
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As a bigger military power, it was natural that Russia was harassing its neighbor, which was Iran and no one denies that.
So, you are giving them the right to do so? kinda funny. It seems that I should repeat what I wrote for Armstrong, for you as well.
But Qajar king, Fath Ali Shah entered an already doomed war and and was trying also to rely on French and British to win the war. If he had slightest military IQ, just like Shah Abbas's policy towards Ottomans, he would leave the Georgia (which was recently annexed by Russia) temporarily to the Russians, then organize a modern army in years and attack them and take the territories back, but not only it ended in disaster, but also it led to another disaster 15 years later with treaty of Turkemanchay by the very same mistake. We should also note that Russia was fighting on other fronts at the same time and yet this happened.
Learn some history man. I don't know from where you bring these BS stuff. So, basically, if a stronger neighbor asks for your home, or your money or your wife, would you simply give them to him? Where is the dignity then? BTW, what Russians wanted, was not Georgia. Most of Gerogia was not even in control of Qajars. What Russians wanted was reaching to India from Qajar empire. Have you ever heard about "The Big Game"? Have you ever heard about Peter the Great's wills letter? Do you know what was mentioned there? They wanted the whole Qajar empire, but they could not achieve it.
FYI, as long as Russia was busy in the war front with Ottomans, Qajars had the upperhand in Caucasus and take back cities in Caucasus. When the Russians war with Ottomans finished, they sent paskevich with the soldier of the other front and then Qajars lost the war. Go learn some history dude. :disagree:
About the map, I accept that it may not be accurate and I'm not the one who made it, but you should also accept that Iran lost one of the most strategic areas which was Caucasus and also some parts of Turkmenistan and Afghanistan.
What do you mean by being inaccurate? That map is totally falsified. It is like saying 5000 instead of 1000 and saying that your guess has been just inaccurate. Again, As I told you before, only Herat and 17 cities in Caucasus were lost, while we gained Khoramshahr from Ottomans, and gained areas in Baluchistan after the goldsmith treaty. The border with ottomans got fixed and secured as well. Sistan also gained by trading it with bunch of desert areas in eastern border strip as well. That's the real picture, not what you just mentioned which was a hilarious fake map.
in farsi:

nemidunam chera inghadr talash dari az qajar ha ghahreman besazi va ya vanemud koni ke man daram az pahlavi tarafdari mikonam,
Dude, I am not apologizing anyone, you should not do so either. instead of taking everything personally and try to apologize for everything, try not to be dogmatic and clean your mind from BS propaganda that is being told to you.
agar man az turk haie qajar motenafer budam serfan be khatere ghomiat, nemiumadam az mosadegh be onvane ye rahbare khob yad konam va agar ba turk ha moshkel dashtam,
You did not know that Mosaddegh was a Qajar ;)
nemiumadam esmi az nader shah bebaram be onvane ye padeshahe moghtader.
Pa na pa, mikhaasti dige Nader shah ra ham demonize va belittle koni? :lol:
be har hal nemidunam chera paziroftane eshtebahate qajarha inghadr sakhte, khodet ham didi ke man che rahat paziroftam ke reza pahlavi ki bude va che karde, vali to dari serfan be khatere turk budan qajar ha ino be ye mas'aleie ghomiati tabdil mikoni. asan ki ahamiat mide qajar ha az che ghomi budan? on moghe ke asan be ghole khodet in masaele turk va fars matrah nabude, pas vaghti man enteghad mikonam, dalili bar in nist ke moshkeli ba ghomiateshun daram va khodetam khub miduni ke intor nist.
Dude, again, you should not take everything personally. The point is that I expect you, as a Sharif Univ alumni, have a much more broad viewpoints and not to fall easily for every BS propaganda that is told to you. If we don't even know our pretty recent history, or have no correct ideas about subjects like religion, our neighbors history, ... we will be really screwed and be fooled easily in the future. It is a very serious issue, if you have not noticed it yet, and it is not just about Qajars ;)
Now I will answer a possible reply to this post in the chill thread since I don't want to ruin this thread with an exclusive discussion.
OK :-)
 
@Kaan - Kardes tell me about Said Nursi, I've heard his name mentioned once or twice in a couple of books I was reading - I know that he was a Religious Scholar...tell me about him - whats the Turkish take on him ?
 
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