Can Pakistan produce/acquire these kinds of subs?

[JonAsad]

Totally agreed. A better alternative for Pakistan Navy would be using SLCMs on board AIP-equipped conventional submarines. Multiple assets will ensure maximum survivability, instead of one or two SSBNs, which could be cornered and hunted down relatively easily (considering that Pakistan wouldn't be able to make ultra-quiet SSBNs for the first time).

After indian nuclear tests we were offered F-16's and aid and what not-
I am happy the real Pakistani think tanks think ahead and are not that much submissive-

Then there was just one Ghazi who kept the mighty indian aircraft carrier and their navy at bay-
We could have bought few frigates destroyers instead what use they brought in 65 and 71 after Ghazi sank-
Those multiple assets sank like buckets-

 

[Yogi]

Totally agreed. A better alternative for Pakistan Navy would be using SLCMs on board AIP-equipped conventional submarines. Multiple assets will ensure maximum survivability, instead of one or two SSBNs, which could be cornered and hunted down relatively easily (considering that Pakistan wouldn't be able to make ultra-quiet SSBNs for the first time).

Agreed bcoz SSBNs are of not much use for Pak bcoz there prime use is 2nd stike in nuke stand off n power projection n can't be used to confront attack subs n will rather require a attack subs to defend itself n top of it, it'll just drain out whatever resouce r left with PN.....

A better option will always be Diesel electric subs with AIP along with capability to launch long range CMs or if Pak is hell bent to produce a nuke sub then better go for a SSGN than a SSBN...

 

[JonAsad]

Agreed bcoz SSBNs are of not much use for Pak bcoz there prime use is 2nd stike in nuke stand off n power projection n can't be used to confront attack subs n will rather require a attack subs to defend itself as it will just drain out whatever resouce r left with PN.....

Really indian- you think we havent considered taking advantage of that prime use?-
Or you think we dont need second strike capabilities to defend Pakistan?-

There is no need for bombers if they need fighter escorts- made sense right?-

 

[The Deterrent]

I am happy the real Pakistani think tanks think ahead and are not that much submissive-

Excuse me?

Then there was just one Ghazi who kept the mighty indian aircraft carrier and their navy at bay-
We could have bought few frigates destroyers instead what use they brought in 65 and 71 after Ghazi sank-
Those multiple assets sank like buckets-

Because India didn't have good submarines at that time. Have you looked at their shopping list now?
The frigates didn't have AShCM SAM protection, simple.

My point was, that a relatively larger number of AIP-equipped submarines would not only be difficult to counter, but the SLCMs onboard them would also provide a dispersed and survivable nuclear deterrent for second-strike options.
Moreover, they would be more economical and technologically favorable for Pakistan.

 

[Yogi]

Really indian- you think we havent considered taking advantage of that prime use?-
Or you think we dont need second strike capabilities to defend Pakistan?-

There is no need for bombers if they need fighter escorts- made sense right?-

I just suggested that bcoz i think currently Pak needs focuss more on its economy than power projection in neighbourhood besides had u read my post a bit calmly u would have realised that i suggested that bcoz it would just act as a burden on PN then serving any real purpose in near future ofcourse in future when the economy recovers Pak can focuss on that front but currently it'll just act at a wastage of resources....

But i know no matter how hard i'll try to prove it logically u'll remain hell bent on ur stand bcoz of shear hatred towards India n Indians...

 

[farhan_9909]

Pakistan nuclear submarine based reactor research started soon after manufacturing of first khushab reactor in 1997,

beside as far as i know the third agosta90b was manufacture from scratch in KSEW,and under a 109millions USD deal france upgraded KSEW infra to manufacture sub at home


though we are good with qing class submarine.those are some huge sub in the range of indian arihant class submarine in displacement.


Qing class submarine=Russian Golf class submarine
also known as SSB nt SSK

Conventional submarine capable of launching SLBM's

 

[JonAsad]

Excuse me? Real?



Because India didn't have good submarines at that time. Have you looked at their shopping list now?
The frigates didn't have AShCM SAM protection, simple.

My point was, that a relatively larger number of AIP-equipped submarines would not only be difficult to counter, but the SLCMs onboard them would also provide a dispersed and survivable nuclear deterrent for second-strike options.
Moreover, they would be more economical and technologically favorable for Pakistan.

What you have proposed is a timely solution while other countries plan for unforseen future unforseen circumstances-
F22 has no equal still amrika developed it- they are ready-
And we will have two at start like we had only 1 in 65- that made the difference- now we have many subs-
And so we will start with two and have many nuclear subs later- unlike your proposition which will end us looking for a 2nd strike capability maybe too late-

World is becoming hostile by every second- its not just india we should plan for-
Our history is full of such short sighted wisdom- they were well prepared to defend themselves from their neighbours- but couldnt do a sh!t when britishers came- they were using pistols and guns for Gods sake- while we sharpened the swords-

 

[JonAsad]

Excuse me?

Oo yaar i was talking about the real world strategic thinkers-

 

[The Deterrent]

What you have proposed is a timely solution while other countries plan for unforseen future unforseen circumstances-
F22 has no equal still amrika developed it- they are ready-
And we will have two at start like we had only 1 in 65- that made the difference- now we have many subs-
And so we will start with two and have many nuclear subs later- unlike your proposition which will end us looking for a 2nd strike capability maybe too late-

World is becoming hostile by every second- its not just india we should plan for-
Our history is full of such short sighted wisdom- they were well prepared to defend themselves from their neighbours- but couldnt do a sh!t when britishers came- they were using pistols and guns for Gods sake-

Sir, everything aside...how is Pakistan going to finance such a project? We aren't Amrika, are we?

Oo yaar i was talking about the real world strategic thinkers-

Oh sure, no offense taken. Of course we are just keyboard TTs
Rest assured Pakistan's military will do the best in the favor of the nation.

 

[Safriz]

Actually in many ways it is. Sir, this guy is an independant expert, if he says it is long way away for Pakistan and near impossible for them on their own then he is not lieing.

the technical know how is there in Pakistan..funding isnt...

 

[JonAsad]

I just suggested that bcoz i think currently Pak needs focuss more on its economy than power projection in neighbourhood besides had u read my post a bit calmly u would have realised that i suggested that bcoz it would just act as a burden on PN then serving any real purpose in near future ofcourse in future when the economy recovers Pak can focuss on that front but currently it'll just act at a wastage of resources....

But i know no matter how hard i'll try to prove it logically u'll remain hell bent on ur stand bcoz of shear hatred towards India n Indians...

Sorry if i offended you was not my intention-
And economy will grow as soon as we have safeguarded ourselves against every possible hostility-

 

[Yogi]

Pakistan nuclear submarine based reactor research started soon after manufacturing of first khushab reactor in 1997,

beside as far as i know the third agosta90b was manufacture from scratch in KSEW,and under a 109millions USD deal france upgraded KSEW infra to manufacture sub at home


though we are good with qing class submarine.those are some huge sub in the range of indian arihant class submarine in displacement.


Qing class submarine=Russian Golf class submarine
also known as SSB nt SSK

Conventional submarine capable of launching SLBM's

AFAIK no Augusta was ever made from sratch in Pak, France always provided important components, however if u have some source to back ur claim then i'll definitely appriciate...

That said Qing Class aka Type095 is a SSGN n it does not carry BMs so again source of ur claim will be appriciated...

 

[manofwar]

Definitely Pakistan can!!There is no question about that...............
But there are a lot of if's and but's involved........
it will have to
-Improve R & D Infrastructure
-Churn out more scientist and engineers who can enroll in defence agencies
-Improve it's repo amongst the great powers, to protect itself from a sanctions at worse or bad relations at best fallout
-Increase R&D share in defence budget
And most of all, Invest more in economy so that money for all these is made available. At the end it all comes down to the kind of economy a country has............In a present day conventional war scenario, Pakistan wouldn't be able to give battle to India for more than 3-5 weeks at max.
Also it needs to have a solid plan in place for sub construction, with will to continue..........

 

[Bratva]

Sir, everything aside...how is Pakistan going to finance such a project? We aren't Amrika, are we?



Oh sure, no offense taken. Of course we are just keyboard TTs
Rest assured Pakistan's military will do the best in the favor of the nation.

first news about nuke sub surfaced in 2006 when it was said NDC was successful in making a experimental minitaurized nuke reactor. Now it's 2012 and Pakistan developed a 5 year plan to develop nuke sub... So 200-300 million every for five years combined with previous years research. So 1-1.5 billion minimum is sufficent for a nuke sub development.

 

[JonAsad]

Sir, everything aside...how is Pakistan going to finance such a project? We aren't Amrika, are we?

Yaar history proves we are resilient under worst possible conditions-
becoming Nuclear the example- we will find way- Tawakul alallah-

Oh sure, no offense taken. Of course we are just keyboard TTs
Rest assured Pakistan's military will do the best in the favor of the nation.

Ameen to that-