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Can Japan show the West how to live peacefully with Islam?

Saudis studying in Japan to get scholarships


Crown Prince Salman, deputy premier and minister of defense, has instructed authorities to include all Saudis who are pursuing their higher studies in Japan at their own expense to be brought under the King Abdullah Foreign Scholarship Program if they fulfill necessary conditions.

Disclosing this, Essam Amanullah Bukhari, cultural attaché at the Saudi Embassy in Japan, said a number of Saudi students studying in Japanese universities will benefit from the crown prince’s directive and will specialize in subjects approved under the scholarship scheme.

Saudi Ambassador to Japan, Abdul Aziz Turkistani, thanked Prince Salman on behalf of Saudi students for his gesture and emphasized that Saudi students in Japanese universities and institutes work hard to rise up to the expectations of their country’s leadership.

Prince Salman was in Japan on an official visit as part of his four-nation Asian tour and met with Saudi students. Watching an invention by Saudi student Muqrin Al-Atawi, he asked him about Shalyouh Al-Atawi, a well-known poet from his tribe by reciting a few couplets from his poem.
The crown prince urged students to uphold Saudi Arabia’s reputation of being the cradle of Islam and the Custodian of the Two Holy Mosques.

Saudis studying in Japan to get scholarships | Arab News — Saudi Arabia News, Middle East News, Opinion, Economy and more.



Like any fanatical sect in any religion , there will be those who use religion for political gain. While there were many injuries committed by Muslims and Christians to each other and to other peoples who practiced a different faith, the true nature of Christianity and Islam is peace, in my personal learned point of view. While i don't consider myself a scholar of Islam, I did study it in college as well as participated in inter-faith dialogue with Muslims, Buddhists, Hindus, and Christians. This experience allows me to understand that there are large segments of practitioners of different faith modalities who do have genuine love, understanding for people who do not belong to their faith community.

PS. It is incorrect also to blame others for some of the mistakes of their ancestors. The injuries may be great, but it is unfair to blame and pass on the blame through the generations.

@amitkriit , if I am not mistaken, one of the six cardinal virtues in Hinduism is Forgiveness, which is reiterated in the works of Lakshmi and Vishnu.

To quote a verse from the Mahabharata,
"Righteousness is the one highest good, forgiveness is the one supreme peace, knowledge is one supreme contentment, and benevolence, one sole happiness."

Instead of posting random news headlines to help your view point, can you post some government facts about :

1) the actual number of foreign middle eastern students studying in Japan

An article here and there is not too convincing.
 
What are you? Official speaker for Shiv Sena? Sins for Muslims? Coming out of a Hindu women's post where women, as of TODAY in many parts of India have to be burnt / die when their husband's pass away. This is Minus 20 century stuff. A country where minorities are killed in broad day light and at night sleeping in their homes, thousands are burned in entire villages by the Hindu terrorists from Shiv Sena, BJP, RSS and the likes????? The WORSE human rights treatment anywhere in the world along with some African countries, happens in India. Women are raped and killed, for a US Quarter ( 25 cents) you can find someone to sell their body.......and here you guys are acting all holly and telling the world how their sh*it stinks and yours smells like Christian Dior.....???? Your religion is the ONLY religion that divides its own followers into 3 or 4 categories, each of the higher category has the "God Given" right to act Godly......and that's allowed? I have a friend here from India, who's a surgeon. He, till date still calls out others in front of me by their cast name and a cuss... (mind you that his kids in college now turning 23 years old) .....so there you have it, bright and shinny, the practices of your great religion where you are allowed to discriminate between your own. Let alone Christians and Muslims, etc, etc.
Forget about hundreds of thousands of Men, Children killed in Kashmir because your mighty Indian army thought ONE day they'll become a threat to them???? Literally, hundreds of thousands women and girls raped for the sheer fact that they belonged to Muslim majority in Kashmir and your army's men were trying to show them Hindu manhood by raping innocent girls, young women and elderly women alike?????
I am not pointing fingers or bashing your religion, everyone should believe in what they want to. The issue is, smell your own shi*t before you tell others about how bad theirs smell. In fact, if yours smells ten times worse, you might want to get your issues fixed before pointing to anyone else.
I can go ON and ON and write a book.

Give me the sources for the last woman burnt on pyre of her dead husband in India or shut up. Likewise for your other rants about minorities being killed in broad daylight. If anything the story goes other way round, with Muslims burning Hindu villages and killing Hindus in broad daylight.

Even for case of rapes, murders, prostitution, India ranks very very low on per capita basis.

Now I do not have to talk sh*t about Muslims, they themselves do a good job of it. Last I saw, no one is worried on how Hindus are terrorizing the world. So no issues there to fix really.
 
Does a women has to die with her husband dead? Do you have to be looked down upon and someone else be derogatory to you because they are a higher cast? Or does a Pandit in a place of worship gets to pick out who he wants to have se*x with and call that girl a gift to Gods??? Or do your minorities have to be burnt to death when they are sleeping in their homes at night and the entire village is burnt by Terrorists from Shiv Sena, RSS and the likes........RIGHT, Instead of addressing these serious issues, you think "I" live in a bubble.

Does a Apostate need to die? Does a Kafir deserve to be beheaded? Does every public place which is visited by Kafirs deserves to be suicide Bombed? Does a community deserve to suffer cultural genocide? Do History Museums deserve to be ransacked? Does a minor girl deserve to get married off to her first cousin? Does a man have the right to keep multiple wives? Do we need to follow 14th century archaic laws in 21st century? Does a person who draws somebody's cartoon deserve to go into hiding for his life? Do women deserve to be stoned for extra-marital sex? Do rape victims deserve to be caned for compromising their modesty? Do Muslims have the right to keep sex slaves? Does Blasphemy warrant Death?

I won't stretch it any further because I won't like to have a Fatwa dangling over my head.
 
fyi
How Hindutva nationalists created their own make believe version of history of Muslim rule in South Asia to fit their political agenda of marginalizing Muslims:
iViews.com - Safronisation of Indian History Elicits Deafening Silence
NCERT controversy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
User:Dbachmann/Wikipedia and nationalism/Hindutva and pseudoscience - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

And for a realist history of South Asia and Bengal and how an unbiased historian judged the Muslim rule of South Asia as mostly benevolent, please read this e-book, when you have free time:
The Rise of Islam and the Bengal Frontier, 1204–1760[/quote
Most hindutavadis are not concerned with bangladesh
 
Nice thread. Yes they should learn something from Japan. But at first, they should stop attacking Muslims and raging wars especially in the Middle East.
 
Nice thread. Yes they should learn something from Japan. But at first, they should stop attacking Muslims and raging wars especially in the Middle East.

I agree, non-Muslims have dressed up as Muslims grown beard and doing all the nasty stuff just to show Muslims in bad light. This is a CIA+RAW+MOSSAD conspiracy, bigger than 9/11.
 
I already refuted your statement in post 15. This justification does not hold water, and should not be entertained. There is no justification for terrorism.
You're kidding me right? We've been handing issues of illegal immigration , my friend, and the number has exceeded in the tens of thousands. Given, we are not dealing with millions of illegal immigration as the United States is with Latinos crossing the porous border -- per annum.



I suggest you look into social cleavage theory as an explanation to link economics and terrorism.
@LeveragedBuyout and @Nihonjin1051, @MarkusS , @Peter C
What nihonjin is failing to understand is that here a theory of critical mass is applicable.
Muslim group behaviour changes when it reaches a certain level of percentage of the population. And till that critical mass is reached, they remain unobtrusive and cause no issues. Its only after that level is crossed you start seeing issues.

And as such Nihonjin, Japan really can not give a model of 'peace with Muslims' to the West or the world, unless its an example of 'how/why to keep Muslims as a percentage of population really low'. Because that is the absolute truth of it.

Yes you have a small number of Muslims in Japan, and as I have mentioned above, unless they reach a certain level of population percentage you would not have to face the problems that the West or India is already facing. And similarly, when the Muslim population in Europe/West was as low as is currently in Japan, they had zero issues with Muslims then, just as Japan has now.

So you are not qualified enough by virtue of having an almost insignificant number of Muslims on a percentage basis to be able to give an example.

Here is a link for both of you to peruse. I understand that its a blog post, but that does not take away from the content of the message. Go through it in full before you comment on it.

Muslim behavior/terrorism correlated with population size | Heaven Awaits
 
Lmaoo at the blog post ^^. Anyway @Nihonjin1051 perhaps the fact that Japan has more native Muslims than immigrants will help things remain as good as it is as the locals can help immigrants adjust more properly.
 
Lmaoo at the blog post ^^. Anyway @Nihonjin1051 perhaps the fact that Japan has more native Muslims than immigrants will help things remain as good as it is as the locals can help immigrants adjust more properly.

Truth doesn't need to be bitter, it can be funny as well. Muslims are less than 1% of Japan's population, hence options for them are quite limited.
 
Truth doesn't need to be bitter, it can be funny as well. Muslims are less than 1% of Japan's population, hence options for them are quite limited.

That blog is devoid of historical realities and also has percentage of Muslims wrong for some countries so I will leave it at that. As for Japanese Muslims as long as they became productive parts of Japanese society they will be fine. European countries mostly allow Muslims from countries they conquered to come settle and they tend to be poor and it becomes harder for them to adjust.
 
That blog is devoid of historical realities and also has percentage of Muslims wrong for some countries so I will leave it at that. As for Japanese Muslims as long as they became productive parts of Japanese society they will be fine. European countries mostly allow Muslims from countries they conquered to come settle and they tend to be poor and it becomes harder for them to adjust.

You know what? Shias in India never got themselves mobilized when Mumbai was attacked, they didn't mobilize when 40 Indians (non-Muslims) were taken hostage in Iraq, they did not mobilize when country was fighting war, but now they are ready to go to Iraq to fight. That is the present reality.

Native vs Settled argument doesn't hold.
 
You’re basically jumping on the same narrative bandwagon I’ve criticized and in the process ignore historical facts. I don’t blame you as an Indian, for the Geopolitical trajectory over the past decade has facilitated your National Interest, just as it has done so for Afghanistan, in light of a shared enemy. However, keep in mind that I and my countrymen remain predominantly Muslim, just as you’ve a huge Muslim population of your own to contend with. It helps neither of us to submit ourselves to reckless narratives that Americans with their small Muslim population or the innately exclusivist Europeans on their part can afford to throw around and leave us to deal with. So try and understand me, rather than submit yourself to a dismissive tone in alignment to the National Interest of others.


Unlike Christianity, the Mosque had never enjoyed religious institutional privileges and control by way of the Church to the Vatican, where those Reformation leaders had the one target to take their complaints to, resulting in the Protestant movements and the myriad of discourse within Christianity, leading the way for the Enlightenment. Until recent years, the Mosques were largely independent from any centre or authority inasmuch as they were from each other. It’s only with the latest rise of political Islam (Islamism/IslamoFascism) over the last couple of centuries and their organized penetration into Mosques, that a more homogenous narrative around shared grievances and perceived enemies have been formed. Some of these are ideologically driven, whereas others are extensions of state or intelligence agencies, as you well know. Added to this are widely accepted religious norms that in actual fact run contrary to the teachings of the Quran, but deeply entrenched through centuries of habituation. Whoever assumes that mankind consistently acts logically and reasonably at all times is a fool to be dismissed.


Given this, it would be silly to assume that a movement can be launched from within a Mosque or Islamic institution, when facing off such a well-funded and determined enemy, aided by historically institutionalised and entrenched schools of thought. Moreover, this also requires Liberal minded Muslims like me to do away with our tendency to leave religion to the realm of the private, opting instead for a politically religious confrontation of our own. What I propose is nothing less that a massive revolution against traditional Islam (Salafi, Sunni and Shia alike) that is arguably already under way, albeit in bits and drabs and with no sense of cohesion. It’ll remain that way unless united under a political platform that crosses all borders. The solution to a multi-national political enemy is by way of a multi-national political confrontation. This requires the development of a clear Manifesto, aided by funding, planning and execution, at least initially independent of all Muslim Governments that have their heads buried in the sand.





All I’m asking is that they place meaningful action where their mouth is, given an entrenched American belief in the spread of liberties the world over.


You’re obviously not in tune with the developments of Muslim counter-narratives already under way. My own anonymous discourse on the internet alone launched an Afghan American Muslim on his way to enjoy his own thousands of followers, after he asked me if he could take some of my ideas to the public. The problem I have with him is that he’s now reduced the narrative to petty Afghan politics, hence the problem with disjointed and spontaneous movements. For this reason, I’ve become hesitant to anonymously present my case in full, when idiots and enemies alike can run it to the ground for ulterior motives. I’m looking for allies right now.





Are we to hold the American Civil war responsible for the prevalence of institutionalised racism across the United States until the Civil Rights Movements? Are we to hold the Declaration of Independence responsible for the prevalence of institutionalised slavery until the Civil war? Are we to hold Christianity responsible for intra-Christian wars, Church tyrannies and failures to deny Colonialism, State sponsored racism, two world wars, and the rise of Communism from within Christendom? Are we going to hold Hinduism to account for centuries of servitude, facilitated by the prevalence of internal racism that held men of lighter shades of skin to higher esteem?


Off course not.


Because mankind on the whole are fallible, illogical, and devoid of consistency in the employment of sound reasoning. It would be stupid to claim otherwise, when the United States itself is not a Democracy, but a Constitutional Republic. Had this not been the case and Democratic polls and the tyranny of Majority rule were the order of the day, then there wouldn’t be anything in place to control the favourite idiot of the day being voted into office, as had happened in Ancient Greece, Mussolini’s Italy and Hitler’s Germany.


Any reasonable student of history would inform you that nations, ideas, and religious beliefs are never the same from one generation to another, as they’re all subject to evolutionary reviews and reinterpretation, mostly necessitated by collective NEEDS. Right now, the state of national failures across the Muslim world has fostered the realization for the NEED to review our dilemmas and reflect upon our scriptures to understand where we’ve went wrong. Your disingenuous mockery of Muslims for our inability to “decipher the correct Islam…over the last 1400 years”, is an anti-intellectual rebuttal that neglects any honest intent at arriving to a solution. We know that “power corrupts and absolute power, absolutely corrupts”, so given that the fall of Muslim power from any international relevance has only been two centuries in the making, the NEED for a review and change has simply not availed itself as it has in recent years. It’s a sad reflection of humanity – rather than Islam - that when the going’s good and others have to suffer our own sins, then the motivation isn’t really there to cleanse ourselves from those sins. This is why most Pakistanis herein are far less inclined to criticise their state policies towards Afghanistan, while most of them still remain sheltered from the same savagery that inflicted my nation. Afghans on the other hand are far more exposed to ideas towards our salvation, for we’ve been to hell and back.


Any logical student of the Quran would tell you that our predicament has been earned and that calling oneself a “Muslim” does not protect us from the wrath of God’s natural order. I recall reading a devout Hindu once lamenting years ago that we Afghans have earned what’s coming to us, correctly predicting that our state of affairs would get much worse. The “Karma” he was alluding to however, is very much a shared scriptural warning inherent in both our religions. All mankind who spread wars and mischief across the world will earn what’s coming to them. Given this, we’re all best advised to help rather than to hinder other people’s intentions to fight the good fight. It’s up to you and the American I’ve addressed here to make the right choice. I’ve already made up my mind and know in my heart that come tomorrow or a hundred years from now, what I propose will absolutely succeed. When it does so, we’ll liberate ourselves completely from anyone else’s perceived interests. When we do, our children will look back and remember those who helped and those who hindered….guaranteed. Islam will not go away, but it will transform, either with you or without you.



That "gratuitous ad hominem" might have misfired, but it was a deliberate intent to give you a friendly nudge. I can get much uglier if I wanted to, but that kind of motivation just isn't there. And no, "the west" as a whole does not qualify....there are "westerners", and then there are the stated exceptions.
You have earned my respect friend. And I shall look forward to reading your posts in the future. I disagree with some of your views, nonetheless this is not the place for me to raise them.

What I find particularly interesting is your ability to present your views in a very logical manner. I hope it rubs off on many others.
 
You know what? Shias in India never got themselves mobilized when Mumbai was attacked, they didn't mobilize when 40 Indians (non-Muslims) were taken hostage in Iraq, they did not mobilize when country was fighting war, but now they are ready to go to Iraq to fight. That is the present reality.
Native vs Settled argument doesn't hold.

Why do you care what they want to do!? Isn't India a secular country!? That means they are free to do whatever they want! And did Hindu majority people in India even cared about Iraq during the war? Or do you all even care what is happening in Palestine, Syria, Afghanistan? So what's wrong, if they are affected by what is happening to fellow Muslims around the world. It's all natural, just like how you got distressed when 40 Hindus were taken hostage in Iraq but you wouldn't give a damn if they were Muslims. And your post speaks volumes about your hatred towards Indian Muslims and yet you call Muslims intolerant? Such hypocrisy... It's people like you who are intolerant and always complaining; no wonder why they would protest because of racist people like you, who are always trying to suppress them.
 
@LeveragedBuyout and @Nihonjin1051, @MarkusS , @Peter C
What nihonjin is failing to understand is that here a theory of critical mass is applicable.
Muslim group behaviour changes when it reaches a certain level of percentage of the population. And till that critical mass is reached, they remain unobtrusive and cause no issues. Its only after that level is crossed you start seeing issues.

And as such Nihonjin, Japan really can not give a model of 'peace with Muslims' to the West or the world, unless its an example of 'how/why to keep Muslims as a percentage of population really low'. Because that is the absolute truth of it.

Yes you have a small number of Muslims in Japan, and as I have mentioned above, unless they reach a certain level of population percentage you would not have to face the problems that the West or India is already facing. And similarly, when the Muslim population in Europe/West was as low as is currently in Japan, they had zero issues with Muslims then, just as Japan has now.

So you are not qualified enough by virtue of having an almost insignificant number of Muslims on a percentage basis to be able to give an example.

Here is a link for both of you to peruse. I understand that its a blog post, but that does not take away from the content of the message. Go through it in full before you comment on it.

Muslim behavior/terrorism correlated with population size | Heaven Awaits

Thank you for highlighting my point. While certain users took my comments the wrong way, in short, it is this: Japan does not have experience dealing with large minorities of any group, let alone a large minority Muslim population. It is far too early to draw conclusions and project lessons from its new and nearly non-existent Muslim population on countries that have had large Muslim populations for decades. We will be happy to compare notes when Japan does have such experience.

Why do you care what they want to do!? Isn't India a secular country!? That means they are free to do whatever they want! And did Hindu majority people in India even cared about Iraq during the war? Or do you all even care what is happening in Palestine, Syria, Afghanistan? So what's wrong, if they are affected by what is happening to fellow Muslims around the world. It's all natural, just like how you got distressed when 40 Hindus were taken hostage in Iraq but you wouldn't give a damn if they were Muslims. And your post speaks volumes about your hatred towards Indian Muslims and yet you call Muslims intolerant? Such hypocrisy... It's people like you who are intolerant and always complaining; no wonder why they would protest because of racist people like you, who are always trying to suppress them.

I can't speak for India, but the US has learned that it's damned if we do, damned if we don't. Ignore problems in the Muslim world, and we are the evil empire that doesn't value Muslim lives. Intervene in the Muslim world, and we are the evil empire, trying to colonize and corrupt Dar es Salaam. Americans are increasingly inured to the problems of the Muslim world, which is why we increasingly ignore the chaos in Africa and the Middle East. We help those who want to help themselves, because we only can help those who want to help themselves.
 
Nice thread. Yes they should learn something from Japan. But at first, they should stop attacking Muslims and raging wars especially in the Middle East.
lol...its u Muslim killing each other...not anyone else...
btw u should join them in iraq...they may need u..
 

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