Call to abolish perks for judges, generals, legislators

[Ali_Baba]

“Ye fauj sab se bara disease hai qaum ka, deemak hain… mein iss ka hissa tha mujhe bhi band karo… aur ab iss mulk aur qaum ko tootne do”

@SQ8 In english please?

 

[SQ8]

You talk about retired, I know serving ones (including those in hasaas idaray) who echo the same sentiments.

Leave the season officers aside, aaj kal Laftain aur Kaptaanon nay anon twitter account banaye huay hain and they vent on them regarding the military.

I have no clue where we are heading, but it is precarious.

Nations come and go - that’s all I can say.
Pakistan may end up being a case study

@SQ8 In english please?

Compared Pakistan Army to a termite infestation in Pakistan’s “structure”

 

[SQ8]

Let it be clear - this doesn’t mean go start spitting on the first uniformed person you see. There are more honest, dutiful and focused officers than there are the three star kind which keep a dangerous wild animal as a pet and then lie on the FIR. Many of them are dissenting within the confines of the system and doing their best to maintain discipline - others are disillusioned as well and are either looking for avenues of retirement. However, if one is looking for analogy to the current situation within the Pakistani military think of it as a combination of Enron employees finding out what their executives were really doing and those of Theranos - these are still people with lives and families who are also thinking of other families. Core values are being attacked left and right while others are trying to maintain their illusion of “everything will be alright”.

The issue isn’t the military or otherwise - it is the stark realization by many that most of their countrymen are too shell shocked to change the situation and most will just try to escape.

 

[Signalian]

i can list a plethora of public dept who've been paying taxes since 47 so what's the point? Ehsaan krty hain ?

Go on, list them. They should be taking care of themselves too as they take care of Pakistan. Military does.

 

[Erieye]

Go on, list them. They should be taking care of themselves too as they take care of Pakistan. Military does.

in what way does military take care of itself? are you implying the military run businesses?

that is somewhat fair on 3 conditions:

-you allow fair competition in the market (dont enforce a monopoly)

-pay the appropriate taxes timely

-doesn't disturb you from doing your primary task. (should be fine since retired offciers supposedly run the businesses and some civillians)

 

[Signalian]

in what way does military take care of itself? are you implying the military run businesses?

that is somewhat fair on 3 conditions:

-you allow fair competition in the market (dont enforce a monopoly)

-pay the appropriate taxes timely

-doesn't disturb you from doing your primary task. (should be fine since retired offciers supposedly run the businesses and some civillians)

Military also takes care of its own after retirement.

A retired officer can get a job (even in military structure) for 3 years which can be further extended. Then there is monthly pension like a salary, even if he doesn't work. Lt Col and above at least get a house and plot. Medical checkups remains free after retirement, for self, family and parents.

 

[Olympus81]

The myth of military superiority and “getting everything right” has been perpetuated for the longest time - while the military does pay tax and unlike civilians cannot dodge it through institutional governance (until they retire) - it isn’t exactly a game changing amount.

Ironically, when the military does pay taxes it is in effect paying itself in a way but that is a longer debate.

Today I spoke to a former retired officer who was possibly one of the cleanest and most accomplished two star I knew and his utterances left me speechless
“Ye fauj sab se bara disease hai qaum ka, deemak hain… mein iss ka hissa tha mujhe bhi band karo… aur ab iss mulk aur qaum ko tootne do”

That tells you exactly where Pakistan is

I understand the pessimism but even if situation goes really bad, how will Pakistan break?

Pakistan with its 4 provinces is still pretty much united or am I missing something here.

 

[Mentee]

Go on, list them. They should be taking care of themselves too as they take care of Pakistan. Military does.

Plz don't ask for defense budget from this nation next time around as the army is pretty sovereign and self sufficient without the the need of any assistance from the state of Pakistan. We too could care less and invest our finances into education and health sector.

Lt Col and above at least get a house and plot. M

Why them ? Why not professors, cops teachers, engineers, accountants, doctors, public prosecutors etc working in the same pay scale? What makes them so special?

 

[Signalian]

Plz don't ask for defense budget from this nation next time around as the army is pretty sovereign and self sufficient without the the need of any assistance from the state of Pakistan. We too could care less and invest our finances into education and health sector.

They will still get the budget even if they don’t ask for it. There will be a share and it will be allotted to buy armament, ammunition and other weaponry that military needs.

Why them ? Why not professors, cops teachers, engineers, accountants, doctors, public prosecutors etc working in the same pay scale? What makes them so special?

I think CSS officers get the perks too, federal govt handled that.

Army officers don’t get free house or plot in any case. The DSOP fund gets cut from salary throughout their career for the house and then a lump sum payment has to be given for the house at the end. In case of plots, it’s usually a 6 monthly instalment that again has to be paid. The good thing is that the rates are subsidised.

The careers you mentioned do get their perks which could be minimal but I have already mentioned that military looks after it’s own and that’s what makes it special.

Now that you have information, what can you really do about it apart from sulking and burning your blood. You have been arguing and going in circles but you will never get satisfied coz your mind is made up on this. Either take some action or give it a rest.

for everyone

Pakistan air force police car is BMW as we are oil rich arab country

while Indian air force chief use suzuki

Now with the advent of bullet proof vehicles, then jammers as well as security entourage, the piece of the Pie just got bigger.

GOP also uses beemer X1.

 

[SoulSpokesman]

@Jango @SQ8

Jango/Oscar sahiban,

It is encouraging to hear that there are now many serving as well as retired officers who see the folly of their institution which is basically the ruling class of Pak. Eventually some of them will rise to the top or groom similarly minded people. It is through such organic realisation on part of large sections of the ruling class that all great nations have risen to higher levels.

Regards

 

[Enigma SIG]

State within a state cant continue.

All businesses of army need to be liquidated.

 

[Signalian]

Question isn’t if someone is riding helicopter or bicycle. Question should be ask who evaluated the requirement and authorized the purchase and use of the ride. When you start holding people accountable, such things will automatically start getting fixed.

Over here in US, investigation always comes up with one answer, who is responsible here. It could be multiple people at different stage or could be one at the top. Once people start losing job and going to jail. Heera phari will stop.

In Pakistan, the position of SHO upto MNA is bought and then money is made to recover that, it’s a business of power in its own, no investigation will end that. This would mean that all PSs in Pakistan having 3-4 SHOs each will have to undergo this process. Then going up the ladder up to MPAs and MNAs.

 

[Signalian]

Leave the season officers aside, aaj kal Laftain aur Kaptaanon nay anon twitter account banaye huay hain and they vent on them regarding the military.

I’m not sure if you are aware but we have had MI, AI and NI visiting this forum and some mods were requested to delete some posts which caught the eyes of the agencies as they revealed some info on weapon systems that was not to be spread over the internet.

Having said that, if intel can visit PDF for such posts, it won’t be difficult to imagine that they have noted down posts on Twitter and other social media that you are mentioning.

I know of an officer whose FB chats were downloaded as transcripts by agency after he came under observation and the matter got to court martial, so open posts on social media won’t go unnoticed.

 

[salarsikander]

it’s a business of power in its own, no investigation will end that.

That is nothing like Mil Inc of Khakis, Using Taxpayer funded Military equipment to power Askartvi Avaiotion and charging tourist some tens of thousands of dollars to take them to mountains, and the repair bill of course be charged to Taxpayers where as the profits will go to mess bill, Maintaining of Gold courses perks etc.
The budget that Army receives is just like How a local Masjifd Receives donations and the treasury then goes on himself to bill the donation his Salary and perks with no oversight whatsoever, The cheap mentality of Brown sahib is deeply ingrained in the rotting institutions.
Can you please point out where it does say in the constitution says that the Military can have its own commercial Set ups? Please dont Mimick the Goras Masters of the Pentagon because what Pentagon does bring about true change to American security and the way how they conduct business unlike here, where Chahcah aur mama of General or Col get contracts in military to supply or make ROads in Askari housing societies that too using cheapest of cheapest labor and quality

GOP also uses beemer X1.

So Khakis suffer from an Inferiority complex then? no much of a difference between their and Wadera mentality?

They will still get the budget even if they don’t ask for it.

But why be bgehahart and take it when you said they take care of their own by plundering states' resources on wholesome scale ?

 

[salarsikander]

hen there is monthly pension like a salary, even if he doesn't work. Lt Col and above at least get a house and plot. Medical checkups remains free after retirement, for self, family and parents.

No wonder the dead weight is ballooning to point where literally nothing is left to buy new equipment but to support the dead weight