Bajrang Dal terrorists attack Churches

[Flintlock]

Yes but Christianity made its mark on the world by slaughtering idol worshippers . So it's safe to say they won't call themselves Hindu.

The only conversion you can ban is if someone puts a gun to a hindu's head and forces them to convert. If MONEY converts Hindus to Christianity, they weren't much Hindus to begin with. Plus what's your issue whatever religion an individual calls himself? It's none of your business!

The reason why Muslims don't convert to another religion easily is because there is a stigma against it, including death for converts and becoming social outcasts in the least. Also the exclusive nature of Islamic belief discourages people from following any other religion. Islam is built to retain believers and spread, and so is Christianity.

In Hinduism, there are no such mechanisms to retain believers because Hindus did not come in contact with abrahmic faiths for a long time. Only after centuries of contact with Islam and Christianity, Hindu leaders have decided to copy these faiths in order to compete against them.

 

[Spring Onion]

The reason why Muslims don't convert to another religion easily is because there is a stigma against it, including death for converts and becoming social outcasts in the least. Also the exclusive nature of Islamic belief discourages people from following any other religion. Islam is built to retain believers and spread, and so is Christianity.

In Hinduism, there are no such mechanisms to retain believers because Hindus did not come in contact with abrahmic faiths for a long time. Only after centuries of contact with Islam and Christianity, Hindu leaders have decided to copy these faiths in order to compete against them.

in Hinduism, there are no such mechanisms to retain believers.?????


The brutal killing of Dalits who have converted to Christianity tells all about Hindutva mentality.


And would you reply me why Hinduism has to copy Christianity and Islam in order to compete with them ???

When you compete something or someone it means your ideas and working have shortcomings.

Secondly why Hindus did not or do not try to spread Hindusim ????

 

[Always Neutral]

The reason why Muslims don't convert to another religion easily is because there is a stigma against it, including death for converts and becoming social outcasts in the least. Also the exclusive nature of Islamic belief discourages people from following any other religion. Islam is built to retain believers and spread, and so is Christianity.

In Hinduism, there are no such mechanisms to retain believers because Hindus did not come in contact with abrahmic faiths for a long time. Only after centuries of contact with Islam and Christianity, Hindu leaders have decided to copy these faiths in order to compete against them.

Why can't hinduism abolish untouchability ? No one converts unless it financially, socially or morally benefits him. Time for Hindoo society to introspect.

Regards

 

[Spring Onion]

Why can't hinduism abolish untouchability ? No one converts unless it financially, socially or morally benefits him. Time for Hindoo society to introspect.

Regards

Dear qudrati that is what i am saying. Ban on conversion is the solution.

Do away with untouchabilty and you wont see much conversions.

Blaming other faiths for preaching to Hindus and terming this root-cause of problem wont help much nor it will stop conversions.

 

[Flintlock]

Why can't hinduism abolish untouchability ? No one converts unless it financially, socially or morally benefits him. Time for Hindoo society to introspect.

Regards

Untouchability has been abolished in Hinduism - speak to any priest in any temple and he will tell you the same thing. However, it is true that caste discrimination is a reality in India.

The question is, does conversion to Islam or Christianity really help those who suffer discrimination? To some extent, perhaps. However, Islam has its own "caste system", and Christians simply become a new caste among the many.

The right way to abolish caste discrimination is not conversion to Christianity or Islam, which instead of solving the pre-existing problem, simply add new ones.

The answer is a secular education, and a better standard of living which can free people from the bonds of religion.

 

[Spring Onion]

Untouchability has been abolished in Hinduism - speak to any priest in any temple and he will tell you the same thing. However, it is true that caste discrimination is a reality in India.

The question is, does conversion to Islam or Christianity really help those who suffer discrimination? To some extent, perhaps. However, Islam has its own "caste system", and Christians simply become a new caste among the many.

The right way to abolish caste discrimination is not conversion to Christianity or Islam, which instead of solving the pre-existing problem, simply add new ones.

The answer is a secular education, and a better standard of living which can free people from the bonds of religion.

Stop your lies for justifying Hindu cast system.
there is no cast system in Islam.

stoping people from practicing according to their free will in a country that calls herself a secular country is unethical as well as against the spirit of secularism.

and as far as secular education, well would you care to explain what secular education means in India ???

And you said go and ask any priest first of all they are pundits and not preists secondly, in India there are separate templs for low cast Hindus and upper cast hindus how can the priests be called fair and unbias in such a situation.

 

[ngold]

Stop your lies for justifying Hindu cast system.
there is no cast system in Islam.

Jana in Indian Muslim society there is also a cast system.. There are backwards in Indian Muslim society..

stoping people from practicing according to their free will in a country that calls herself a secular country is unethical as well as against the spirit of secularism.

NOT AGAIN..

and as far as secular education, well would you care to explain what secular education means in India ???

Secular education is already there in place except Madarsas...I think he is talking about missionary/madarasa..
[/QUOTE]

And you said go and ask any priest first of all they are pundits and not preists secondly, in India there are separate templs for low cast Hindus and upper cast hindus how can the priests be called fair and unbias in such a situation.

Now tell me who told you about this.. and please don't say that you have visited India and have seen so many such temples..

 

[Spring Onion]

Jana in Indian Muslim society there is also a cast system.. There are backwards in Indian Muslim society.. ..

Its not the Muslim society its the new Indian law under which they had put billions of Muslims as Dalits or backward as they are part of billllioooooooons of poor of India.

There is big difference between backwardness and cast system.

There is no Cast system in Islam. No matter Muslims live anywhere in the world we do not have cast system unlike Hindusim where casts determine the social, religious status of human.

Secular education is already there in place except Madarsas...I think he is talking about missionary/madarasa..

If so why this secular education failed to eleminate untouchability from Hindusim despite a long time.

Now tell me who told you about this.. and please don't say that you have visited India and have seen so many such temples..

well i dont need to prove that i visited India. Those Indians whom i met there know very well that i visited India just few months back.

And for your information as recnt as 2006 the Jagannath temple in Kerada-Garh in Kendrapara district has never allowed a Dalit to enter.

 

[Awesome]

Actually, no, you aren't. There are Hindu sects also which believe exactly the same thing.

The problem isn't with the belief that you are stating, its with the other implications of converting to Islam, for example, greater alllegiance to Islam than your own country, political Islam that constantly seeks to create a Sharia state, repressive beliefs like burkha and other legal principles, and a general contempt towards all other religions.

Contempt breeds contempt - so the Hindu right is simply a reaction to the attitude of Muslims towards non-muslims.

Why do you think Shaivites have no problems with Vaishnavites, Jains have no issues with Buddhists, and Hare-Krishnas have no issues with Swaminarayans? Because there is an understanding that all beliefs lead to the same god "One god Many Paths".
However, in Islam, you have "There is only one god and his name is Allah". That's when the problem arises.

See their level of allegiance is something you cannot rightfully question!

It's their private matter! Islam is nothing but what a Muslim makes it to be!

From what you're saying is "Every religion is hinduism". You shouldn't have a problem then. Just in your hearts believe that all Muslims are infact Hindus and all Christians are Hindus and you can satisfy your ego. Why the problem then?

 

[Awesome]

Well said..
I am just talking about the double satndards.. I was not aware about your feelings for......

Not a billion people.. Minorities (Muslim/ X-tians)are around 30 Crores. So correct you figure...

You're forgetting the fact that most Hindus aren't very 'Hindu' to begin with? .

Of course Flint tells me he considers everyone that breathes a Hindu so I guess I'm wrong then.

 

[Awesome]

I"m describing Hindutva, not Secularism.

In any case, secularism means separation of church and state, and I am definitely not arguing against that.
The policies of the government are definitely not going to be decided by Hindu priests and astrologers.

Then hang them Bajrang Dal Terrorists and stop defending people who kill INDIANS!

Christian... INDIANS!

 

[Awesome]

The reason why Muslims don't convert to another religion easily is because there is a stigma against it, including death for converts and becoming social outcasts in the least. Also the exclusive nature of Islamic belief discourages people from following any other religion. Islam is built to retain believers and spread, and so is Christianity.

Actually my religion rocks, thats why no one converts from it (although in this day n age, some still do, but the numbers are negligible).

1. We believe in ONE god. Just like Hindus also believe in one big boss God. But we make it VERY clear, that he's one and do not leave it up for interpretation.

2. We believe all the cool people that taught us religion are prophets and not Gods. God has no son. God and mating with a human woman is kind of ridiculous to us.

3. We are very pragmatic. We believe in invitro fertilization, we challenge natural selection with molecular science, we have a controlled mechanism for change in our religion too...

4. The Quran has never been edited.

In Hinduism, there are no such mechanisms to retain believers because Hindus did not come in contact with abrahmic faiths for a long time. Only after centuries of contact with Islam and Christianity, Hindu leaders have decided to copy these faiths in order to compete against them.

Yeah you're only burning and mutilating people you can't retain

Hindu Fundos are nutjobs, please admit it already.

 

[ngold]

Its not the Muslim society its the new Indian law under which they had put billions of Muslims as Dalits or backward as they are part of billllioooooooons of poor of India.

Sorry Jana you are wrong.. Only some specific Muslims are going to be benefitted by this reservation...It will create same Social problem with-in Indian muslim society... Look how secularism is trying to harm ur so called equality in Islam...

There is big difference between backwardness and cast system.

There is no Cast system in Islam. No matter Muslims live anywhere in the world we do not have cast system unlike Hindusim where casts determine the social, religious status of human.

Jana this time I did googling to prove myself.. and found following thing..
"Among the Muslims of India there has developed a two-tier hierarchy. The upper class, called Sharif Jat, includes Muslims who belonged to the higher levels in caste hierarchy and also Muslims who arrived to India from foreign countries. The lower class, called Ajlaf Jat, includes Muslim converts from lower castes. As in the world, the upper classes do not have close social relations with lower classes, the same way the Sharif Jat do not normally have close social relations with Ajlaf Jat"...

I will ask from my Muslims friends about this...

If so why this secular education failed to eleminate untouchability from Hindusim despite a long time.

I agree that there is an issue but this has been reduced to some extent.. You can argue on that but truely speaking this is totally dependent on illiteracy.. as indian aawaam will get well educated, this will vanish.. Now a days its only remained in rural areas..

And for your information as recnt as 2006 the Jagannath temple in Kerada-Garh in Kendrapara district has never allowed a Dalit to enter.

Strange.. how can they identify any Dalit among so many people..

 

[Spring Onion]

Sorry Jana you are wrong.. Only some specific Muslims are going to be benefitted by this reservation...It will create same Social problem with-in Indian muslim society... Look how secularism is trying to harm ur so called equality in Islam...:

i am not wrong.

Its your law that had brought poor Muslims calling them as Dalits.
Tell your governement that it is not good. I did not make that law dear.

Above all Islam is not something that will be changed by Indian reservations.
Secularism can never harm equality in Islam as equlity in Islam is not based on birth unlike Hinduism where you can are classified in lower casts and upper casts on the basis of your birth in a family.

Jana this time I did googling to prove myself.. and found following thing..
"Among the Muslims of India there has developed a two-tier hierarchy. The upper class, called Sharif Jat, includes Muslims who belonged to the higher levels in caste hierarchy and also Muslims who arrived to India from foreign countries. The lower class, called Ajlaf Jat, includes Muslim converts from lower castes. As in the world, the upper classes do not have close social relations with lower classes, the same way the Sharif Jat do not normally have close social relations with Ajlaf Jat"...:

that may be due to their Hindu past but in Islam there no such thing called upper class or lower class.

Even if these jats do not interact socialy (now this social interaction may be based on wealth standard such as everyone wants to be married in a rich family) but still all of them pray at the same mosque there is no bar on entry of any Muslim.

Still they eat togather in a gathering.
There is no concept of untouchability in Islam.Unlike Hindusim where upper cast Hindus do not eat togather with low casts. Where if a low cast enter a temple of high cast hindu. The temple is considred made dirty by the entry of the dalit and hence it is purfied all over again.

I agree that there is an issue but this has been reduced to some extent.. You can argue on that but truely speaking this is totally dependent on illiteracy.. as indian aawaam will get well educated, this will vanish.. Now a days its only remained in rural areas.. :

No dear i do not think that education is the soultion as i had seen higly educated people in India practicing untouchability.
Awarness is the key.

Bring pundits from upper cast onboard. If there is respect for views of pundits indeed they can help change the views of upper cast hindus about the lower casts.

Strange.. how can they identify any Dalit among so many people..

my dear do not find excuses if you take the pain for googling to find anything against Islam to be used as argument then also do google for the truth about ban on Dalits into entry in that tempel.

 

[ngold]

You're forgetting the fact that most Hindus aren't very 'Hindu' to begin with? .

That's called foolse paradise.... .. The real problem that you have is why so supressed these Hindus are not getting converted to other religion most favourably Islam... Now think about this why do they still live as Hindu..if they have better options available.. Why not so called Dalit or Lower cast is not converting to Islam.. Why???

Of course Flint tells me he considers everyone that breathes a Hindu so I guess I'm wrong then

Flint has his own ideology i have mine.. He is also right that every native living here is Migrants of Hindu religion..In short technical meaning Hinduism is the superset.....