Australian French angle to India’s Quest for Nuclear Attack Submarines ?

[PARIKRAMA]

Australian French angle to India’s Quest for Nuclear Attack Submarines ?

Published August 11, 2016 SOURCE: Anand SG / FOR MY TAKE / IDRW.ORG

India might be lead subcontractor for the supply of components to the submarine project involving Australia and France said a recent media reports . In parallel India and France have started initial conversations in partnership for construction of Six new indigenously developed attack Nuclear submarines for Indian Navy .

Shortfin Barracuda Block 1A which Australia has selected is conventionally powered diesel electric derivative of Barracuda class submarines that are nuclear attack subs (SSN) of French Navy and for long DCNS has been in talks with India to offer this derivative to India under India navies Project75I program under which Indian navy plans to acquire Six new next generation Conventional submarines .

Both Australia and India are been persuaded by France with one eye on SSN option for which they are open to provide assistance. While traditionally Russia has been India traditional partner when it comes to Nuclear assistance , Winner of Project75I might hold answers to who will collaborate on India’s Six SSN project next .

India Navy already operates Single Russian supplied AkulaII Class Nuclear attack submarine under its fleet and is keen on acquiring one more attack nuclear submarine from Russia on a longterm lease for which Indian and Russian officials had talks .

India is keen on leasing Russia’s latest Project 885 Yasenclass nuclear powered attack submarine which is improved up variant of AkulaII submarines and India is also keen on developing new line of indigenous nuclear attack submarine in collaboration with Russia based on Yasen class submarines , but French too are eyeing this lucrative deal with India and have been offering collaboration on SSN in lieu of orders for Shortfin Barracuda Block 1A under Project75I .

Barracuda SSN is state of the art submarine built for French navy to deal with an evergrowing array of challenges . The first submarine of this class SSN Suffren is scheduled to enter service with French Navy in 2017. Six Barracudas will be acquired by 2027 by French Navy .

Source: http://idrw.org/australian-french-angle-to-indias-quest-for-nuclear-attack-submarines/

Comment:

Even though source is idrw, please take this news as a hint of what NSA Ajit Doval has been negotiating over a 18 months period.

Anybody who has followed Rafale Sticky knows that i have said beyond Rafale there is a string of other projects where we will get French cooperation. The SSN design will be Indian and technology will be from French and Russian side. Especially Barracuda technology will be a substantial percentage.

I had hinted here clearly that DCNS will get a key role going forward and will be involved in Scorpenes, SSNs and IAC2 project as well.

I said also the route will be via either L&T Areva for the reactor or P75I SMX being selected to get this deal officially done or a combination.

The interest in Project 885 as part of goodies is also there in the sticky when Goodies on Table offered by Russia to stop Rafale deal and divert the investments into Russian arms were discussed.

All this was revealed almost 6-8 months ago in the sticky and now slowly info in public domain is out.

Expect more goodies will be formally leaked out as we draw towards the CCS approval for Rafale expected in coming days.

 

[Major d1]

German and French teams (the French company SCNS group .).. Australia doesn't have the facilities to accommodate nuclear submarines. . The Indian and Pacific Oceans are big areas to patrol, particularly for a typical mission might require a sub to disappear for 55 days for War & Conflict.

 

[Stephen Cohen]

Australian French angle to India’s Quest for Nuclear Attack Submarines ?

Published August 11, 2016 SOURCE: Anand SG / FOR MY TAKE / IDRW.ORG

India might be lead subcontractor for the supply of components to the submarine project involving Australia and France said a recent media reports . In parallel India and France have started initial conversations in partnership for construction of Six new indigenously developed attack Nuclear submarines for Indian Navy .

Shortfin Barracuda Block 1A which Australia has selected is conventionally powered diesel electric derivative of Barracuda class submarines that are nuclear attack subs (SSN) of French Navy and for long DCNS has been in talks with India to offer this derivative to India under India navies Project75I program under which Indian navy plans to acquire Six new next generation Conventional submarines .

Both Australia and India are been persuaded by France with one eye on SSN option for which they are open to provide assistance. While traditionally Russia has been India traditional partner when it comes to Nuclear assistance , Winner of Project75I might hold answers to who will collaborate on India’s Six SSN project next .

India Navy already operates Single Russian supplied AkulaII Class Nuclear attack submarine under its fleet and is keen on acquiring one more attack nuclear submarine from Russia on a longterm lease for which Indian and Russian officials had talks .

India is keen on leasing Russia’s latest Project 885 Yasenclass nuclear powered attack submarine which is improved up variant of AkulaII submarines and India is also keen on developing new line of indigenous nuclear attack submarine in collaboration with Russia based on Yasen class submarines , but French too are eyeing this lucrative deal with India and have been offering collaboration on SSN in lieu of orders for Shortfin Barracuda Block 1A under Project75I .

Barracuda SSN is state of the art submarine built for French navy to deal with an evergrowing array of challenges . The first submarine of this class SSN Suffren is scheduled to enter service with French Navy in 2017. Six Barracudas will be acquired by 2027 by French Navy .

Source: http://idrw.org/australian-french-angle-to-indias-quest-for-nuclear-attack-submarines/

Comment:

Even though source is idrw, please take this news as a hint of what NSA Ajit Doval has been negotiating over a 18 months period.

Anybody who has followed Rafale Sticky knows that i have said beyond Rafale there is a string of other projects where we will get French cooperation. The SSN design will be Indian and technology will be from French and Russian side. Especially Barracuda technology will be a substantial percentage.

I had hinted here clearly that DCNS will get a key role going forward and will be involved in Scorpenes, SSNs and IAC2 project as well.

I said also the route will be via either L&T Areva for the reactor or P75I SMX being selected to get this deal officially done or a combination.

The interest in Project 885 as part of goodies is also there in the sticky when Goodies on Table offered by Russia to stop Rafale deal and divert the investments into Russian arms were discussed.

All this was revealed almost 6-8 months ago in the sticky and now slowly info in public domain is out.

Expect more goodies will be formally leaked out as we draw towards the CCS approval for Rafale expected in coming days.

Unless the Rafale deal is signed all these off set plans and goals will remain just dreams

 

[Perpendicular]

Am confused, looks like we are trying to pull out a SU30 in navy too. Getting Russian platforms putting in Indian, french inputs.
An extreme view but not impossible is to give french submarine work and pull out on Rafale.

 

[Stephen Cohen]

An extreme view but not impossible is to give french submarine work and pull out on Rafale.

Rafale deal is the MOTHER deal

Everything else flows and originates from there

 

[anant_s]

L&T Areva

Could be interesting.
L&T has already formed a JV with AREVA for large sized forgings for N plants.

I don't want to speculate, but this looks extremely doable and possible scenario.
I'll also add to @PARIKRAMA reference to Dassault angle. Apart from Military aviation, France is also negotiating EPR 2 deal (surprise surprise Areva again) and here one shouldn't be surprised if that co-operation in civil nuclear field, extends to military projects as well. & here i mean powerplant for ACs as well.

 

[PARIKRAMA]

Could be interesting.
L&T has already formed a JV with AREVA for large sized forgings for N plants.
View attachment 324947
I don't want to speculate, but this looks extremely doable and possible scenario.
I'll also add to @PARIKRAMA reference to Dassault angle. Apart from Military aviation, France is also negotiating EPR 2 deal (surprise surprise Areva again) and here one shouldn't be surprised if that co-operation in civil nuclear field, extends to military projects as well. & here i mean powerplant for ACs as well.

Let me add to that with an example of another company via which small but significant tech is transferred.

There is a company called Flash Forge (FF). It does work for Indian Sub programs and presently working for both Scorpenes and Arihant Class SSBNs.
This is its exhibition pics from Def expos of last years

Scorpene work denoted by FFL

This is the company's JVs and manufacturing achievements

The two JVs which are of high importance to both scorpenes and Arihant program

 

[surya kiran]

@PARIKRAMA went through their website. They are not listed, right?

 

[PARIKRAMA]

@PARIKRAMA went through their website. They are not listed, right?

Yes unlisted company..

Forgot to tag

@Abingdonboy @Vergennes @BON PLAN @Taygibay @MilSpec @SpArK @AUSTERLITZ @Picdelamirand-oil
Pls refer post #1 and post #6, #7..

Again repeating IDRW is not the very good source.. but its hinting onto what deal contours of Rafale is and has been discussed in PDF before

 

[Taygibay]

Australia and India are been

That's a verb tense I don't recall encountering!?
-Are been persuaded in that article, in fact!

But being French speaking, I have a decent grasp of the ways to play with father Time.

So are been because, of the pair, one has been and the other should/could have gone through,
either already or potentially so in a limbo where both are persuaded but one is yet to act on it?

How very Indian time mechanics!

As for the strategic component, it is much more central than almost all value it to be.
Without an understanding of how mil industry affects and is affected by geo-politics,
you very normally miss ties knotted over decades for reasons inherent to the Nation's nature.

That 3rd red box in the FFCoyard infographic shows a solid metallic parts maker.

And good day all, Tay.

 

[BON PLAN]

German and French teams (the French company SCNS group .).. Australia doesn't have the facilities to accommodate nuclear submarines. . The Indian and Pacific Oceans are big areas to patrol, particularly for a typical mission might require a sub to disappear for 55 days for War & Conflict.

It is DCNS, and it is a 100% french company.

Australia don't have YET facilities for nuclear SSN, but it is a rich country, and faces a lot of threats from china. All is possible. The main obstacle is USA. Uncle Sam may accept another country to sell SSK to Austalia (because USA don't produce SSK for decades. But the weapon system will be a US one...) but SSN is another thing.

 

[Taygibay]

Guys, check it out but according to official word and more so public opinion,
Oz doesn't WANT nuclear vessels, period.

But due to its size and location, it must have the best submarines available.

Hence the need to have a complex program re-engineering top class SSN
technology with a precise mission equipment sourcing thrown in.

India's needs are very different.

Good day all, Tay.

 

[Crixus]

Sir please tag me also when ever you post something interesting

Yes unlisted company..

Forgot to tag

@Abingdonboy @Vergennes @BON PLAN @Taygibay @MilSpec @SpArK @AUSTERLITZ @Picdelamirand-oil
Pls refer post #1 and post #6, #7..

Again repeating IDRW is not the very good source.. but its hinting onto what deal contours of Rafale is and has been discussed in PDF before

 

[Rajaraja Chola]

I sincerely believe for Nuclear Subs we must rely on Russian help. Their Yasen Class are good too. The French are trustworthy. But Russians are too trustworthy for long. And the kind of help even the French can provide, but only at a higher price.

 

[BON PLAN]

I sincerely believe for Nuclear Subs we must rely on Russian help. Their Yasen Class are good too. The French are trustworthy. But Russians are too trustworthy for long. And the kind of help even the French can provide, but only at a higher price.

Just have a look to the number of russian nuclear subs sunk..... Last one was Koursk. It's a little bit worrying isn't it?

Just have a look to Yasen sub : very big (more than a Lafayette SSBN class !), probably very costly, very late on shedule (built from 1990...).

See the last russian sub : Lada SSK = A failure . I'm afraid they have lost some of their previous skill with end of cold war. You need a stronger partner.


Okay, okay.... I'm french..... so I 'm a little bit biased