Arjun Mark II : An Israeli View [ Must Read ]

[IND151]

good vid Pandora

watch his vid at 3:12

 

[Dazzler]

The Arjun is a very good tank.Most of the problems associated with it have been rectified.But one fundamental problem remains , and that is it's width.The Arjun is wider than the standard tank carrier platforms of the Indian railways.As a result the tanks cannot be stationed in other parts of the country but only in the Rajasthan and other border areas.

So basically you are saying they have sorted out most technical obstacles but they are finding it hard to tweek the original German Leo 2 design? Funny!

 

[Dazzler]

good vid Pandora

watch his vid at 3:12

I did, still a shot by heli, not from ground so one can hardly judge the speed, sprint.

 

[Night_Raven]

So basically you are saying they have sorted out most technical obstacles but they are finding it hard to tweek the original German Leo 2 design? Funny!

Leo2 ... you sure are funny !

Now I wonder why Al-Khalid surfaced without ANY problems reported whatsoever ... copies of PLA Type 90-IIM don't need any testing !

 

[Jon Snow]

Friend, Arjun has had serious mobility, engine, transmission issues till 2 years ago. Are they all rectified? Can you give me a source that Indian Army is finally happy with Arjun's overall performance and DRDO? Seems to me that Arjun is forced on Indian Army by a powerful DRDO/ political lobby because if Arjun is as good as pretended, why go for the T-90m Vladimir in the first place?? I just want to know that's all.

the answer is simple.... When the t 90m was ordered the arjun was facing some issues, but the drdo managed to remove all these kinks and a comparative trial was held with the t 90 and it was found that the arjun is much better than the t 90- hence all these further orders bringing the total number of arjuns in the army to 500..... The t 90 contract cannot be cancelled because
a)it was already signed
b)the arjun is more expensive
c)the hvf avadi had already created all the infrastructure and started production of the t 90 bhishma
d)the t 90 is a very good tank too.... Among all the tanks in the subcontinent in recent times it is the only tank which is battle tested

 

[SupermanKaPapa]

and what was so special about Arjun move in desert apart of flying dust? It was pretty slow to be honest. Compare it with AK racing in the desert.

AK needs to be faster than Arjun...........otherwise, how it can save its life from the greatest warrior on the earth in Indian mythology.

 

[rockstarIN]

Friend, Arjun has had serious mobility, engine, transmission issues till 2 years ago. Are they all rectified? Can you give me a source that Indian Army is finally happy with Arjun's overall performance and DRDO? Seems to me that Arjun is forced on Indian Army by a powerful DRDO/ political lobby because if Arjun is as good as pretended, why go for the T-90m Vladimir in the first place?? I just want to know that's all.

it is the doctrine and the support systems, our strike corps needed less weighted tanks as stated by Kigndurgaking as their suport systems is configured like the same. And if you think it is as pretended, how come it did well in trails as well as foreigners are praising it?

 

[Dazzler]

 

[Jon Snow]

business-standard.com/india/news/arjun-tank-outruns-outguns-russian-t-90/389650/

thats the link for the comparative trials- as you can see it happened in 2010, long after all the contracts for the t 90 had been signed

 

[Night_Raven]

This is an Arjun MBT discussion ... dont derail the thread with AK videos ...if you need , create a separate thread for that...

 

[SupermanKaPapa]

You can name it whatever you want it does not matter. Will it become McLaren F1 if you say so?

And you can say whatever you want. It also does not matter.

What matter is, this:

 

[Areesh]

This is an Arjun MBT discussion ... dont derail the thread with AK videos ...if you need , create a separate thread for that...

If it is a Arjun MBT discussion than why the hell you were bringing in AK in previous posts on this thread. Confused much new troll???

 

[Ganga]

The problem with Arjun is that there was so much negative media while it was under development that people are having a hard time believing that all the problems have been rectified and that the final product is very good. The Israelis are considered tank experts and when they say something about tanks it deserves attention.There is a saying about Tejas

"Those who criticized her never flew her , those who flew her never criticized her"

The same thing is happening here too.

 

[GORKHALI]

Friend, Arjun has had serious mobility, engine, transmission issues till 2 years ago. Are they all rectified? Can you give me a source that Indian Army is finally happy with Arjun's overall performance and DRDO? Seems to me that Arjun is forced on Indian Army by a powerful DRDO/ political lobby because if Arjun is as good as pretended, why go for the T-90m Vladimir in the first place?? I just want to know that's all.

I don't know where you get this hypothesis that DRDO forced political system to accept its equipment ???Do you have any link to it ??
In any country Armed force is one of the most powerful entity ,asked your army they knows this better .No body had ever forced Indian army to buy its thing , if its satisfy its AFR then it happily accept it.Arjun MBT satisfied its required performance and now going to another level as MK2 ,you just keep yourself updated kid and watchout ,how many Arjun tank will be in IA by2015 and how many Ak will be in PA....

 

[SupermanKaPapa]

What are the armour specifications of the Arjun?

The Kanchan Armor
By P. Chacko Joseph | September 24th, 2007

Kanchan armor is a composite armor also called sandwich armor. During the initial days, India had approached the British to co-develop a composite armor. British armor research was based in British tank research centre on Chobham Common, the reason the generic name Chobham armor for all such type of composite armor. The British were not favorable to the Indian proposal.

Development of a composite armor was earnestly taken up at Armour Design & Development Division at the Defence Metallurgical Research Laboratory (DMRL), Kanchan Bagh, Hyderabad. Like the British name Chobham, Kanchan Armor got its name from Kanchan Bagh.

Kanchan Armor uses the same principle as the Chobham armor, but the composition is different. It has Rolled Homogenous Armor (RHA) and composites. RHA is a type of steel sheet used as protection for the armored vehicles since World War II. Kanchan Armor has a composite panel sandwiched between RHA. The number of layers is decided based on the user requirement.

When a projectile is fired, the armor stops it via compression and de-compression method. As the projectile hits the armor, it faces compression because of the RHA, and then it faces decompression because of the composite. When the projectile passes through several such sandwiched layers, it breaks up the APFDS or HEAT shot. A HESH shot is ineffective against a spaced armor. It definitely will not go through a layered armor.

In 1980’s the Kanchan composite had a composition of ceramic, alumina, fiber glass and some other such materials mixed. The RHA tried out had two thicknesses, i.e. a 350 mm plate and a 315 m plate. However these two plates had the same weight as a 120mm RHA. Hence it is said that Kanchan armor is more volume at same weight. The anti-tank munitions have problems in penetrating denser mass.

This is the time when the Russian Tank T-72 imported by Indian Army could not penetrate the Kanchan Armor protected Arjun Tank , with APFDS at point blank range. Subsequently, the debate took place if the Russians had supplied us with training rounds rather than the actual ammunition. As a side note, in January 2000 at Proof & Experimental Establishment (PXE), Balasore, Arjun tank armor defeated all available HESH and FSAPDS rounds including Israeli FSAPDS rounds.

Back to 1980’s, after the T-72 incident, a 106 mm RCL gun was tried on the Arjun Tank. 106 RCL’s were effective anti-tank weapons those days. It played havoc on enemy tanks in 1971 war. The Kanchan armor defeated that too.

Kanchan armor composition has undergone massive changes since 1980’s. The volume of the RHA has been reduced to lesser mass because of better metallurgy. The composite has evolved too and it does not use the 1980’s technology anymore.


http://www.indian-military.org/army/armour/main-battle-tanks/247-mbt-arjun.html

Also what APFDS rounds are used and what is their penetration capabilities?

Heard the Al Khalid can't take in the Long Rod penetrators is that true?The longest Chinese APFDS round is 560mm (Quoted from Zraver http://www.defence.pk/forums/land-f...-number-tanks-pakistan-army-6.html#post442074) long being used on their tanks so is it the same for the Al Khalids as well?

Arjun Ammunition System

Two types of ammunition, namely, Fin Stabilised Armour Piercing Discarding Sabot (FSAPDS) and High Explosive Squash Head (HESH) have been fully developed and productionised for MBT Arjun.

The complete round of Arjun ammunition system consists of a semi-combustible cartridge case with steel obturating cup, semi-combustible primer, propellant, additive liner for wear reduction of gun and FSAPDS shot/HESH shell. The semi-combustible cartridge case (SCCC) ammunition has the advantage of reduction of round and chamber length, weight of the round, ease of handling, higher muzzle velocity, higher rate of fire, longer barrel life, and logistics.


I know most of this is well known.........but for those who want to clarify their facts. Also please let me know, if anything is wrong. Thx in advance.