Are TURKEY and PAKISTAN really ALLIES?

[Pan-Islamic-Pakistan]

This brotherhood is not nonsense. You talk about Allah but then you go against the word of Muhammad(S.A.W) that believers are but brothers.

All your hate against Turkey is because they do not support the dictatorship of Assad. Your love for Khameini is too great for everyone to see. Your butthurt was quite visible when Turks were slaughtering Hizbis and Assadists.

Let me tell you one thing Iran can never replace Turkey even in the next 100 years. You need to live with this fact.

Another topic, but I just want to say this in passing.

Iran is a historical enemy of Afghanistan and Pakistan.

Turkey is a historical ally.

 

[Malik Alpha]

Another topic, but I just want to say this in passing.

Iran is a historical enemy of Afghanistan and Pakistan.

Turkey is a historical ally.

Indeed. I remember how Iran shamelessly supported Northern alliance during the invasion of Afghanistan and then the same happened in Iraq. Zionist and Majoosis are two sides of the same coin they successfully fooled the entire world in believing that they are enemies to eachother.

 

[Iltutmish]

If Turkey finds a better deal somewhere else, they will go for that. If Pakistan finds a better deal somewhere else, they will go for that.

Turks and Pakistanis get along very well on a person to person level due several reasons. But please don’t confuse that with hard realpolitik.

As Muslims we should have Good Relations with other Muslims, but this hype ist just childish. One poster here even demanded to ban people who are against Pakistans „allies“. Stop that please!

 

[Yankee-stani]

If Turkey finds a better deal somewhere else, they will go for that. If Pakistan finds a better deal somewhere else, they will go for that.

Turks and Pakistanis get along very well on a person to person level due several reasons. But please don’t confuse that with hard realpolitik.

As Muslims we should have Good Relations with other Muslims, but this hype ist just childish. One poster here even demanded to ban people who are against Pakistans „allies“. Stop that please!

The problem is most Pakistanis tend to over hype relations with foreign countries which comes up like cringe I blame the media for simplifying the understanding of geo politics and international relations also does not help its presented from a Pakistan centric position yes our interests should be heard but to call one country a traitor or another country a brother is just plain childish

Another topic, but I just want to say this in passing.

Iran is a historical enemy of Afghanistan and Pakistan.

Turkey is a historical ally.

But the same Turkey supported the Northern Alliance and still kinda does in Afghanistan which is against the Taliban and Pasthuns

 

[Turan09]

If Turkey finds a better deal somewhere else, they will go for that. If Pakistan finds a better deal somewhere else, they will go for that.

Turks and Pakistanis get along very well on a person to person level due several reasons. But please don’t confuse that with hard realpolitik.

As Muslims we should have Good Relations with other Muslims, but this hype ist just childish. One poster here even demanded to ban people who are against Pakistans „allies“. Stop that please!

Well with this logic, we would have just support india rather than Pakistan. After all they have more money, much more money don't they? And they were really okay to pay some of it to gain our support, but you know, we don't see it that way... Perhaps you should change your perspective too.

 

[Yankee-stani]

Well with this logic, we would have just support india rather than Pakistan. After all they have more money, much more money don't they? And they were really okay to pay some of it to gain our support, but you know, we don't see it that way... Perhaps you should change your perspective too.

India has other main sellers,I think push to shove even Erdogan Sahib would not mind that

 

[Iltutmish]

I think this is a general problem in the Islamic world. Every person saying something remotely positive about a Muslim or Islam becomes a hero for them. Here in Germany there are some leftist comedians who say positive things about Muslim immigrants. After that you will see a lots of Facebook post saying that the comedian just Converted to Islam and his new name is „Abu Bilal Ibn Peter“. It’s ridiculous. We are Muslims, we don’t need the praise of this toxic people who are mostly promoting values that are totally against our Religion and culture!

 

[Yankee-stani]

I think this is a general problem in the Islamic world. Every person saying something remotely positive about a Muslim or Islam becomes a hero for them. Here in Germany there are some leftist comedians who say positive things about Muslim immigrants. After that you will see a lots of Facebook post saying that the comedian just Converted to Islam and his new name is „Abu Bilal Ibn Peter“. It’s ridiculous. We are Muslims, we don’t need the praise of this toxic people who are mostly promoting values that are totally against our Religion and culture!

They are not leftist tho they are just neo liberal shrills who are usually centrists posing as so called "humanitarians" but I get the gist of what you are saying so when Erdogan Sahib says something positive about Pakistan on Kashmir you have folks thinking he might send TAF to LOC what ridiculous notion is that man Pakistanis are just childish when it comes to stuff like that

 

[Iltutmish]

Well with this logic, we would have just support india rather than Pakistan. After all they have more money, much more money don't they? And they were really okay to pay some of it to gain our support, but you know, we don't see it that way... Perhaps you should change your perspective too.

Pakistan has good relations with turkey, nobody doubts that. But at the end we are two different national entities with our own problems and tasks. History teaches us that an ally of yesterday can be an enemy of tomorrow (not implying that this will happen to the relationship between Pakistan and Turkey! I am thankful for our great relationship).

 

[Turan09]

India has other main sellers,I think push to shove even Erdogan Sahib would not mind that

I will be honest there, india is rich. Economically there is no comparison between you and them. They are as a state god damn rich. And best part is, they don't have a national defence industry, it is appetizing, much more than Pakistan ever will be... They were ready to pay 2.3 billion dollars only for support ships... 2.3 billions only for the support ships!
Now, this was all about the gaining the support of the Turkish State. A simple trick, now imagine the guys who wanna pay 2.3 billion dollars only for the support ships... how much they would pay for other products? They don't buy from us because we are supporting you, otherwise, we would just got our piece from the cake. And this cake is big and looks delicious.
But there is a law, ''Turkish Defence Companies can't sell ''lethal'' weapons to india'' This is our law. Is it logical? According to your opinion, no. According to you we would have go for it.
And my friend, this is perhaps a difference between your logic and mine. We don't sell our friends for money.

Pakistan has good relations with turkey, nobody doubts that. But at the end we are two different national entities with our own problems and tasks. History teaches us that an ally of yesterday can be an enemy of tomorrow (not implying that this will happen to the relationship between Pakistan and Turkey! I am thankful for our great relationship).

I am not against this, infact, I agree. Today's friend might be the tomorrows enemy. The problem is that people who express Turkey would sell Pakistan if there is a better option. And they are using this false theory to justify their hypocritical ideas. My problem is with it. There was a better option for us. Much better than Pakistan much richer than Pakistan, but unlike your saudi brothers for example, we didn't sell you.
Now people can avoid our sacrifices if they so choose, but that doesn't mean I am not gonna tell to their faces that they are all hypocritical, ignorant fools.
I was clear I hope.

 

[Gorgin Khan]

I will be honest there, india is rich. Economically there is no comparison between you and them. They are as a state god damn rich. And best part is, they don't have a national defence industry, it is appetizing, much more than Pakistan ever will be... They were ready to pay 2.3 billion dollars only for support ships... 2.3 billions only for the support ships!
Now, this was all about the gaining the support of the Turkish State. A simple trick, now imagine the guys who wanna pay 2.3 billion dollars only for the support ships... how much they would pay for other products? They don't buy from us because we are supporting you, otherwise, we would just got our piece from the cake. And this cake is big and looks delicious.
But there is a law, ''Turkish Defence Companies can't sell ''lethal'' weapons to india'' This is our law. Is it logical? According to your opinion, no. According to you we would have go for it.
And my friend, this is perhaps a difference between your logic and mine. We don't sell our friends for money.


I am not against this, infact, I agree. Today's friend might be the tomorrows enemy. The problem is that people who express Turkey would sell Pakistan if there is a better option. And they are using this false theory to justify their hypocritical ideas. My problem is with it. There was a better option for us. Much better than Pakistan much richer than Pakistan, but unlike your saudi brothers for example, we didn't sell you.
Now people can avoid our sacrifices if they so choose, but that doesn't mean I am not gonna tell to their faces that they are all hypocritical, ignorant fools.
I was clear I hope.

My Friends you are just observing one side of the coin, But thats upto everyone to decide for themselves but kindly dont sell us the idea that one is rich the other is poor, because we are not getting anything for free first. And if you see the past ten years you have milked us almost as much as others. F16s upgrade, Augusta, TAI 129, MILGEM, You name it. If your Imagination tells you India will buy all of your stuff, then why not you guys go for a try at the expense of us ?
If we go by your logic of selling to rich nations , How many rich nations buy your weapons and how many need to do so ? What technologies turkey offer that others dont ? Do you sell to Germany , France , USA , China , Russia , Saudi Arabia ? How many other countries offer a bigger lucrative markets for your high end products than us ? You have the choice to sell to India we also have the choice to buy better products from other sources. It is all about you scratch my back i scratch yours and the problem is the back of both countries need scratching its not only ours.

 

[dBSPL]

We are not at the level of alliance. But if Pakistan and TR should not make an alliance, theoretically, no other two country should be able to form an alliance beteen theirself. So this shows our common potential.

 

[Turan09]

My Friends you are just seeing one side of the coin, But thats upto everyone to decide for themselves but kindly dont sell us the idea that one is rich the other is poor, because we are not getting anything for free first. And if you see the past ten years you have milked us almost as much as others. F16s upgrade, Augusta, TAI 129, MILGEM, You name it. If your Imagination tells you India will buy all of your stuff, then why not you guys go for a try at the expense of us ?
If we go by your logic of selling to rich nations , How many rich nations buy your weapons and how many need to do so ? What technologies turkey offer that others dont ? Do you sell to Germany , France , USA , China , Russia , Saudi Arabia ? How many other countries offer a bigger lucrative markets for your high end products than us ? You have the choice to sell to India we also have the choice to buy better products from other sources. It is all about you scratch my back i scratch yours and the problem is the back of both countries need scratching its not only ours.

Just wanna ask you a simple question, why all world, Russia, US, Israel, Iran, Saudi Arabia, Jordan supports India over you? Is it because indians are nice people? Is it because their country is great? No. Because they have 450 billion dollars forex reserves. Every fucking one of them, Saudis, Israelis loves them because of this. Now I know calling them rich might sound like an insult for you but I am not trying to make you feel bad. But for the sake of the math, all Pakistani Economy isn't 450 billion dollars let alone the forex reserves. Don't see it as an insult. Even if you crush them in battlefield, they have more money. Infact they have more cash than all of your economy.
Now, to answer your questions, State banned to sell any lethal weapons to india. They wanted to buy support ships, UCAV's. And let's be honest there, they would throw some billions just for the support. Or why you think they buy from every country? Iranian oil, israeli, american, russian and french weapons,... I would say it works, pay some money and everyone will shut up.
Now, For your other question, we mostly sell our weapons to US, Germany, Oman and Qatar after that it is Holland, India and Azerbaijan. You can look at to list. So yes we do sell weapons to Germany and US.
PS, Right now, you are number 22. So there is actually 21 countries who buys more from us. Hope I answered your question.
https://www.haberturk.com/iste-turk...n-cok-ihracat-yaptigi-ulkeler-2282368-ekonomi

Now let me repeat myself, you can buy, you can sell I don't care. But we didn't sell you for money unlike Saudis and others which let's be honest it would be logical to do so. Thats why before talking about ''Turkey would sell us if they had a chance'' look at to world you live in. Look at to mirror, and you will see perhaps our way of thinking is not the same.
You can blame me, I don't care about that neither. This was hardcore truths for you. Even if you didn't like it.

 

[Pan-Islamic-Pakistan]

I will be honest there, india is rich. Economically there is no comparison between you and them. They are as a state god damn rich. And best part is, they don't have a national defence industry, it is appetizing, much more than Pakistan ever will be... They were ready to pay 2.3 billion dollars only for support ships... 2.3 billions only for the support ships!
Now, this was all about the gaining the support of the Turkish State. A simple trick, now imagine the guys who wanna pay 2.3 billion dollars only for the support ships... how much they would pay for other products? They don't buy from us because we are supporting you, otherwise, we would just got our piece from the cake. And this cake is big and looks delicious.
But there is a law, ''Turkish Defence Companies can't sell ''lethal'' weapons to india'' This is our law. Is it logical? According to your opinion, no. According to you we would have go for it.
And my friend, this is perhaps a difference between your logic and mine. We don't sell our friends for money.


I am not against this, infact, I agree. Today's friend might be the tomorrows enemy. The problem is that people who express Turkey would sell Pakistan if there is a better option. And they are using this false theory to justify their hypocritical ideas. My problem is with it. There was a better option for us. Much better than Pakistan much richer than Pakistan, but unlike your saudi brothers for example, we didn't sell you.
Now people can avoid our sacrifices if they so choose, but that doesn't mean I am not gonna tell to their faces that they are all hypocritical, ignorant fools.
I was clear I hope.

We know very well of Turkey's genuine sacrifices for Pakistan and Kashmir. This is why the whole of Pakistan loves Turkey, it is pretty much unanimous.

We Pakistanis also are ready to help Turkey in any way possible. Many European countries, US, Arabs, now China, have asked us to step aside from supporting Turkey, but our heart can never do such a thing.

We feel that la'nat of Allah swt will fall upon anyone who does not support brother believers of Turkey, descendants of Khalifat and Ghazis. And I feel the same thing, Pakistan survived miraculous alliances of foes which incessantly attacked us, such as USSR-India-BD alliance of '71, USSR in Afghanistan and Soviet agents in Pakistan, and recently US-Israeli-Indian-Iranian alliance and terrorism in Afghanistan.

 

[Yankee-stani]

We know very well of Turkey's genuine sacrifices for Pakistan and Kashmir. This is why the whole of Pakistan loves Turkey, it is pretty much unanimous.

We Pakistanis also are ready to help Turkey in any way possible. Many European countries, US, Arabs, now China, have asked us to step aside from supporting Turkey, but our heart can never do such a thing.

We feel that la'nat of Allah swt will fall upon anyone who does not support brother believers of Turkey, descendants of Khalifat and Ghazis. And I feel the same thing, Pakistan survived miraculous alliances of foes which incessantly attacked us, such as USSR-India-BD alliance of '71, USSR in Afghanistan and Soviet agents in Pakistan, and recently US-Israeli-Indian-Iranian alliance and terrorism in Afghanistan.

How is China stopping Pakistan from having no relations with Turkey, did the MFA In Beijing made statements regarding Turkish-Pakistani relations and saying CPEC should be stopped you are just upset cause some Chinese members had some differing views towards Turkey