ARABIC language to be POPULARIZED in Pakistan

[Foinikas]

My arabic handwritting

 

[_NOBODY_]

I am Pro Ertagul/Turkish that is the Islamic culture I believe was closer to what Islam really was
> Focused on Education
> Focused on Arts
> Focused on Humanities (Social Work, Local Societies)

I believe the version of Islam introduced in 17-18th Century was distinctly selected by British and selected specifically in Arabia

Today in Saudia we do see a Drive to reverse whatever was implemented in Arabia

Don't forget the women empowerment that was shown in Diriliş: Ertuğrul. The entire economy of the various tribes was sustained by women. Clothes, rugs, sheets and cutlery were all manufactured by women and we still have men in our so-called Islamic republic who don't let their wives work. I am a man but I was greatly inspired by the women in Diriliş: Ertuğrul.

 

[Corruptistan]

Don't forget the women empowerment that was shown in Diriliş: Ertuğrul. The entire economy of the various tribes was sustained by women. Clothes, rugs, sheets and cutlery were all manufactured by women and we still have men in our so-called Islamic republic who don't let their wives work. I am a man but I was greatly inspired by the women in Diriliş: Ertuğrul.

Why should we even look towards a largely fictional TV series when we can just take a look at early Islamic history where Arab women were founders of univeristies

University of al-Qarawiyyin - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Fatima al-Fihriya - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

warriors, doctors on the battlefield, merchants, poets, scientists.

Extraordinary Women from the Golden Age of Muslim ...​

Extraordinary Women from the Golden Age of Muslim Civilisation - 1001 Inventions

Extraordinary women from different faiths and backgrounds worked alongside men in Muslim Civilisation to advance their societies. Those talented women are shining examples and role models of women who excelled in fields of poetry, literature, medicine, philosophy and mathematics. We pay tribute...

www.1001inventions.com

The problem is that people have mixed local cultural practices into Islam. A good example of this is Afghanistan where unfortunately Pashtuns among the tribal/Taliban elites have mixed Pashtunwali principals with Islam and folded it to their liking. The idea that education should be banned for women is not derived from Islam but conservative cultural practices.

Female circumcision is another mostly cultural practice that is widespread in areas of Muslim Africa, for instance Somalia.

 

[Foinikas]

Hey bro, are you a crypto Muslim? No Greek or Christian would want to learn Arabic except for academic purposes.

No,I just like languages and I was going through a phase where I was listening to arabic pop,reading books about the history of the Arabs,watching every documentary I could find on TV etc.

But I like the arabic language because it's very calligraphic and beautiful.

 

[_NOBODY_]

My arabic handwritting

View attachment 856704

Masah'Allah, that is absolutely incredible.

No, I quoted your post in support of your comments about the post you had replied to.

Besides, clearly Pakistan needs more Arabization, and promoting the language can only help.

But I already stated that it is too late to adopt Persian now especially since it doesn't offer any practical benefits, unlike Arabic and Mandarin so where's the disagreement? I must say I never expected you of all people to advocate for the Arabization of Pakistan. Considering how the gulf countries are progressing, I too advocate for more Arabization of Pakistan. I would also like our government to create cultural exchange programs with the Gulf countries.

 

[Edevelop]

And contrary to popular belief, most foreign-originated vocabulary in Urdu and Hindi derives from Arabic. Many of the words that we regard as being Persian in origin are actually Arabic-derived Persian words. The problem is that many of those words have got a new meaning in Urdu/Hindi compared to the original Arabic versions.

اثراللغۃالعربیةفیاللغۃالأزدیۃ(مصطلحاتالقانونالباکستانینموذجا)
Influences of Arabic Language upon Urdu Language:

http://journals.uop.edu.pk/papers/Influences%20of%20Arabic.pdf

All of those people are Semitic people originally and Afro-Asiatic speaking peoples. Neighbors as well. DNA tests today also confirm that they cluster very closely. The idea of "true Arabs" does not exist. Yemenis for instance were Arabized not long before Islam. As for looks, they have similar facial features and characteristics and are all mostly olive skinned/brown people with great diversity in every Arab country from outright pale to Afro-Arabs (particularly in North Africa).

Kebab is a Semitic word so it implies an local origin. Arabic cuisine also shares great similarities from Morocco to Oman. Arabs have their own shared language, culture, history, DNA/genetics, geography, phenotypes etc. They have far more in common than what separates them.

And there is a lot of diversity/dialects/regional cultures within every single Arab country. A Moroccan from Tangier is not the same as a Moroccan from Marrakech. A Saudi Arabian from Najran is different from a Saudi Arabian from Tabuk. An Egyptian from Sinai is different from an Egyptian from Luxor etc. A Han Chinese from Guangzhou is not the same as one from Beijing. We can do that with every country in the world and peoples.

If we use your logic, we can separate people in every single country. An Iranian from Tabriz is not the same as an Iranian from Shiraz or Kerman. A Turk from Istanbul is different from a Turk in Adana. A Brit from Cornwall is not the same as a Brit from Newcastle. A Spaniard from Barcelona is not the same as a Spaniard from Sevilla. An Italian from Turin is not similar to an Italian from Sicily.

And where do we even start with ourselves (Pakistanis)?

Pakistanis are very unique. If we have to consider DNA in Pakistan, the ethnic races such as Punjabis, Pashtuns, Kashmiris, Balochis and Sindhis are of same or similar makeup yet if we have to consider cultural practices we are all distinct. For example in the north, Pashtuns have a tribal culture but Baltistanis / dardics don't and women have greater rights. If there is something to be said about Pakistan in essence it is a true multi-cultural state found very rare in the world and I believe that's our strength. Generally I'm not in favour of any national languages and would prefer a Switzerland type model in which they have 4 official languages due to 4 different cultural groups. However, if someone were to ask me if I had to chose between Farsi and Arabic, I would rather have Farsi because our history and cultures came from that part of the world and Islam in Pakistani territories came via sufis.

 

[Foinikas]

Persian is far more sophisticated, much polite.
Popular ARabic these days is Egyptian or Lavent dialects.
The standard Arabic, or Najdi Arabic are not very popular or don't have the same reach.

I don't know if they are more sophisticated or polite,they sound harsher to me.
Standard Arabic is the standard in every Arab country. They can understand each other like this. What exactly do you mean "they don't have the same reach"? It's the official language.

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

Yes what was apparent in the Ertagul Series was they emphasized the role of Women and their focus to be backbone of their trade

I watched the series more with interest as it showcased some historical elements like life style , the structure of society, the dress code in place , the general customs (like Jirga like setup we also see in KPK)

This is inline with the stories we partially hear that back in day Kadijah the first wife of Prophet was a trades women because these stories contradict the Wahabism main stream views

These ideas do not match . the Wahhabism narrative to lock up women

I don't want to see the Arabic Language is being used as a tool to grow the 80's Wahabist elements inside Pakistan


Language should be learned to grow ties with other friendly nations

Turkish-Persian-Chinese-Arabic

All are ideal languages for Pakistan to grow our relations with our regional brothers


Note: Modern Saudia now allows Women to drive , work in Airlines and play soccer , and drive
alot has changed since I lived in Saudia as a child

 

[VCheng]

Masah'Allah, that is absolutely incredible.

But I already stated that it is too late to adopt Persian now especially since it doesn't offer any practical benefits, unlike Arabic and Mandarin so where's the disagreement? I must say I never expected you of all people to advocate for the Arabization of Pakistan. Considering how the gulf countries are progressing, I too advocate for more Arabization of Pakistan. I would also like our government to create cultural exchange programs with the Gulf countries.

I agree with the above 100%. This process will help cement the national direction more solidly in keeping with national aspirations of the majority of the people.

 

[Foinikas]

@_NOBODY_ At first it looked like robotic script though...lol

 

[Corruptistan]

Pakistanis are very unique. If we have to consider DNA in Pakistan, the ethnic races such as Punjabis, Pashtuns, Kashmiris, Balochis and Sindhis are of same or similar makeup yet if we have to consider cultural practices we are all distinct. For example in the north, Pashtuns have a tribal culture but Baltistanis / dardics don't and women have greater rights. If there is something to be said about Pakistan in essence it is a true multi-cultural state found very rare in the world and I believe that's our strength. Generally I'm not in favour of any national languages and would prefer a Switzerland type model in which they have 4 official languages due to 4 different cultural groups. However, if someone were to ask me if I had to chose between Farsi and Arabic, I would rather have Farsi because our history and cultures came from that part of the world and Islam in Pakistani territories came via sufis.

I don't disagree and the same thing can be said about Arabs or any other major ethnicity. Such ethnicities share much more in common with each other than the opposite although there are regional differences and differences across countries. Only adds to the beauty of diversity.

Most of our Sufis were Arab in origin so that logic goes right out of the window. The earliest Sufi orders were also founded by Arabs. Islam was first spread by Arabs in what is today Pakistan (Sindh) as well gaining a solid foothold.

The idea that Islam was spread to Pakistan by Turkic invaders and a few 100 Sufis does not hold up to history or scrutiny. Of course conversions were a gradual process but among Sindhis, Pashtuns and Baloch of Pakistan, Islam was well-established before the mostly Turkic invasions.

Anyway I do agree that from a linguistic viewpoint Farsi would be/is easier to learn at least for Pashtuns, Baloch etc. than Arabic which is a hard language to master however there is no comparison in which language has a wider worldwide reach. Here Arabic is in a different galaxy. Similarly Mandarin compared to Turkish.

Anyway as I wrote, I would focus on LOCAL languages and English but if I should pick 2 foreign languages, due to the arguments that I wrote and many others before me in this thread, I would only be picking Mandarin and Arabic.

 

[Edevelop]

I don't think that Arabs are obsessed about anything Ottoman related. If they are, they are quite ignorant of their own history. This Ertugal obsession is mostly a South Asian Muslim phenomenon. I have not seen it among any other people. And that too only among the ignorant lot who don't know Islamic history.

Politically, yes, you an make the argument that Arabs and Turks alike are not fond of each other. I have friends in Turkey who are sick and tired of Arabs, well not just because millions live in their country illegally and uninvited, they also do not want to become part of their society, accept their social norms and learn and speak the Turkish language.

Yet if you look at the Arabs who are in their home countries and have never been to Turkey or lived in Turkey, they view Turkish tv series from a different perspective. The women and children are inspired by their culture.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

As for local backwardness etc. in Pakistan, it has nothing to do with any outside influence, it is a "made in Pakistan" problem. When a girl caught with a phone is stoned to death in KPK by illiterate village mobs it is not the fault of any outsiders. When Sardars employ local slaves in Baluchistan and Sindh, it is not an outside influence. I could go on forever, as the list is endless.

This has mostly to do with Islam. You see Balkans, Turks, Central Asians etc were class A savages until recently. In Balkans Muslim women often walked around in mobile tent - shuttlecock burka. They had arranged marriages and some of this filth is still swirling in places like Albania.

However these regions were influenced by wave of enlightenment which came from Western Europe. Since they were Christian societies Western enlightenment seeped in. Post WW2 this process was speeded up by US geo-political needs and EU membership has consolidated these societies as modern and progressive.

In Turkey, Central Asia Islam was ripped out of the public realm and in it's place Western enlighenment was actively encouragebring about a revolution in those societies. Which is why modern Turks look at rest of the Muslim world as savages.\

In Pakistan Islam acted like a shield to prevent any ingress in society of progressive ideas. Indeed the mullah has become a handmaiden of preventing change and continuing the sick practices you see.

Any attempt to bring social change will bring mullahs and their zombie hordes on the streets in what they call 'defending the prophet [pbuh'. We saw example of this when certain sicko shot the Governor of Punjab because the later was standing by a poor victim.

they view at Turkish tv series from a different perspective.

You are aware that this whole Ertrugul thing is a fantasy manufactured by Turkish athiests and Kemalist Secular film industry. Check out the actors, actresses and directors. They have more in common with London, Berlin, New York then any Pakistan or 'Muslim culture' if there is such a thing. They are just goras/goris making money out of your freakin insecurities for fcuks sakes.

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

I already know Arabic (It did not yielded in any tremendous chance for me in Arabia but I was too young not able to work as well)
I already can speak Arabic

Pakistani Children were not even allowed to go Colleges at that time so obviously families left Arabia migrated to different nation when that happens

I already speak Urdu (National Language) , Punjabi is of course close to Urdu lie Lassi and milk
I already speak English

For me if I knew Turkish + Chinese or Even Persian
Sure why not but it is best to learn these languages when you are very young


When you are reading Quran you are actually reading a narrative in Arabic so in essence 99% people who can read Quran already know Arabic


Certain segments who expect "Donation" from Arabs for their Mosques they want to push the Arabic narrative (It is all for Donation for the Local Pakistani Mosque in some Pakistani City)

However I can see beyond that , for Pakistan , we must also make effort to learn

a) Turkish
b) Persian
c) Chinese (Language for Future)


The Arab - Persian narrative , of dislike and mistrust is their own issue for last 1300 years
as Pakistani we will never be able to understand that


Similarly the Turkish - Arabic angle is also there , but they often do trade freely it is less Severe then the Arab vs Persian angle, I was surprised to see so many Turkish food stores in Saudia which was not the case in past , so these nations have bee coming close (if it not for the recent story of some reporter being killed) , I personally think it was a Deep Fake video to ruin Arab-Turkish ties


In Saudia during the Wahabism peak they used to censor all Iranian Stories and also Turkish , it was only during Hajj season you would hear about Iranians or Turkish people.


But things are changing

 

[Foinikas]

You are aware that this whole Ertrugul thing is a fantasy manufactured by Turkish athiests and Kemalist film industry. Check out the actors, actresses and directors. They have more in common with London, Berlin, New York then any Pakistan or 'Muslim culture' if there is such a thing. They are just goras/goris making money out of your freakin insecurities for fcuks sakes.

Wait a minute,I thought Ertugrul was on TV during the Erdogan leadership? Erdogan's governments tend to promote such series about Turkish history and especially if they portray Turkish leaders as strong,honorable Islamic leaders.