Analysis: China vs India — Competition of Civilisations

[Capt.Popeye]

Tibetan Buddhism do.

You are speaking about a "class system", that is not the same as a "caste system". They are not synonymous.

 

[gpit]

I asked the question earlier per the article:

why a powerful China would put India in a painful thorn

Any analysis from Indian friends whether there are any cultural or mental factors behind the psychology? Is this perception universal in India or is it just from your infamous media?

 

[tanlixiang28776]

You are speaking about a "class system", that is not the same as a "caste system". They are not synonymous.

What? slavery by itself isn't bad enough?

 

[EjazR]

The Huttington "Civilisational appraoch" to international relations is a flawed appraoch and has so many loopholes that no one worthy of concern looks at it to explain international relations.

All the peaceful talk is well and good, but the fact of the matter is that rising powers will expand and try to undermine rival powers. Its just something that happens in the International system.

Historically Chinese influence was coastal and never across the Himalayas. But with the close partnership with Pakistan it has done something it never did before in its history. Mainly out of concern against India. There are more than enough examples last year that China will try to alter the balance of power in its favor like the Japan fishermen incident. And until a democratic form of government comes into being that will be transparent with its intentions, there will be this issue.

All we can hope for is that this dilemma is managed and doesn't become a full blown security competition. And one way to do that is that China sticks to its traditional area of influence i.e. north of the himalayas, while India sticks to its traditional area - south of the himalayas.

 

[below_freezing]

The Huttington "Civilisational appraoch" to international relations is a flawed appraoch and has so many loopholes that no one worthy of concern looks at it to explain international relations.

All the peaceful talk is well and good, but the fact of the matter is that rising powers will expand and try to undermine rival powers. Its just something that happens in the International system.

Historically Chinese influence was coastal and never across the Himalayas. But with the close partnership with Pakistan it has done something it never did before in its history. Mainly out of concern against India. There are more than enough examples last year that China will try to alter the balance of power in its favor like the Japan fishermen incident. And until a democratic form of government comes into being that will be transparent with its intentions, there will be this issue.

All we can hope for is that this dilemma is managed and doesn't become a full blown security competition. And one way to do that is that China sticks to its traditional area of influence i.e. north of the himalayas, while India sticks to its traditional area - south of the himalayas.

Democratic, hahahahahaha

you wanna look at some "democratic" Chinese forums? Other than beating down the CPC, they talk about nuking Japan, conquering Russia, genociding Vietnam, enslaving India... but if Indians truly think this way, I guess the democrats are right, at least the enslaving Indians part.

 

[gpit]

The Huttington "Civilisational appraoch" to international relations is a flawed appraoch and has so many loopholes that no one worthy of concern looks at it to explain international relations.

I completely agree with you on this. Mr. Huntington talked too much civilization conflict but too less, or none, mutual cultural benefit: a typical Western psychology.

In the vast history, before modern times, India culturally benefited China by transmitting Buddhism, and China culturally benefited India by transmitting silk technologies. Those things are nowhere to see in Huntington’s book.

…
Historically Chinese influence was coastal and never across the Himalayas. But with the close partnership with Pakistan it has done something it never did before in its history. Mainly out of concern against India. There are more than enough examples last year that China will try to alter the balance of power in its favor like the Japan fishermen incident. And until a democratic form of government comes into being that will be transparent with its intentions, there will be this issue.

To say that democracy is a panacea is too naïve, if not a joke. If you are sane, in modern times, democratic countries launch more wars and evasions than non-democratic countries.

In fact, democracy in under-developed countries can fan-up more irrational nationalism, and result in wars, because democracy is all about voting bank. If China were a (western style) democracy country, I have no question that a war to conquer Taiwan would have been witnessed, given such rising nationalism.

As I elaborated numerous times, China was pushed by India to Pakistan side. You couldn’t refute this fact!

All we can hope for is that this dilemma is managed and doesn't become a full blown security competition. And one way to do that is that China sticks to its traditional area of influence i.e. north of the himalayas, while India sticks to its traditional area - south of the himalayas.

Well said. So let Dalai Lama leave to the north and let negotiation on Zang Nan (AP) begin!

 

[CardSharp]

Every people have their own brand of conceit. What I am starting to understand about India and Indians is that their reason for thinking itself superior is based on spirtuality and the effemoral realm of religion. Superstitions and gods is what they think is important, and because China and the rest of east asia adopted buddhism, a dharmic religion, they see themselves as superior to us.


Think carefully about the response Ghandi gave when a westerner asked him about western civilization, he said "western civilization? It would be a good idea". Clearly admitting to no such thing as a western civilization. Incredible when you think about, this is coming from an Indian at a time when western hard power ruled over them absolutely and when the standards of living in the west exceed theirs in every measurable metric, education, health, etc etc.


To myself (and probably other Chinese here), being brought in a scientific family and without a religion, this mentality probably escaped me for the longest time.

(also this kind of thinking probably offers an insight into Indian thinking on Tibetan matters, they see the monastic Tibetans as civilized and the areligious Chinese as heathens)

 

[CardSharp]

"…Modern civilization represents forces of evil and darkness, whereas the ancient Indian civilization represents in its essence the divine force. Modern civilization is chiefly materialistic, as ours is chiefly spiritual. Modern civilization occupies itself in the investigation of the laws of matter and employs the human ingenuity in inventing or discovering means of production and weapons of destruction, ours is chiefly occupied in exploring spiritual laws."

-Mahatma Gandhi

mkgandhi-sarvodaya.: On & By Gandhi


The original article is an updated iteration of the same conceit

 

[CardSharp]

^^^^^^

India wasn't held back by Nehru's pseudo socialist belief, but rather Nehru's pseudo-socialist beliefs were a continuation of deeper Hindu beliefs.

 

[Water Car Engineer]

After exterminating most of Native Indians, European colonists in N America felt bad and established reserves for the vanished, well feed them, and called for human rights and democracy all over the world. Don’t you think the story sounds similar to that of Ashoka? Do you love the colonists?

Ashoka did not exterminate Kalingans like colonist did to the Native Americans. Kalingans not long after Mauryans build up an empire for a short period of time.

Kalingans are still there.

I meant your invention of non-violence, which was only under British rule. Before and after that, it is very violent. But again your statement also refuses what the article touted about “peaceful India”.

Battle of Plassey - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Battle of Buxar - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

First Anglo-Mysore War - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Second Anglo-Mysore War - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Third Anglo-Mysore War - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Fourth Anglo-Mysore War - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

First Anglo-Maratha War - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Second Anglo-Maratha War - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

etc
etc
etc

This is what India went through before 89 years of British raj. Prove that after Kalingan war and when India was unified by Ashoka there wasn't peace, because it is well known for us Indians after the Kalingan war Ashoka stopped the conquest and there was a short span of peace all through out India after unification.


About the whole Indians feeling superior to Chinese thing. It's obviously a bunch of garbage so do give it to much attention.

 

[CardSharp]

By the way, when Buddhism in China was at its height, China also went through its greatest period, the Sui and Tang dynasty.

Cause and effect.

 

[praveen]

Every people have their own brand of conceit. What I am starting to understand is about India and Indians is that their reason for thinking itself superior is based on spirtuality and the effemoral realm of religion. Superstitions and gods is what they think is important, and because China and the rest of east asia adopted buddhism, a dharmic religion, they see themselves as superior to us.


Think carefully about the response Ghandi gave when a westerner asked him about western civilization, he said "western civilization? It would be a good idea". Clearly admitting to no such thing as a western civilization. Incredible when you think about, this is coming from an Indian at a time when western hard power ruled over them absolutely and when the standards of living in the west exceed theirs in every measurable metric, education, health, etc etc.


To myself (and probably other Chinese here), being brought in a scientific family and without a religion, this mentality probably escaped me for the longest time.

(also this kind of thinking probably offers an insight into Indian thinking on Tibetan matters, they see the Tibetans as civilized and the godless, and areligious Chinese as heathens)

Actually most indians find chinese amusing and vice versa .Both are an enigma to each other

 

[praveen]

Cardsharp where did you get that idea indians feel superior to chinese.This is very new to me

 

[indianpatriot]

China
1. Invented paper to write.....others made crazy books which asked to kill each other in the name of GOD.
2.Invented Gunpowder....others used it to make destruction of human life an easier and effective process.
3.Invented coffin...others created dead bodies.

 

[praveen]

chinese song invented the cannons and we can credit them with the first seismometer