American attack aftermath: Pakistan declares attack a 'plot'

[uswrld]

[QU^^ For all those who were doubting whether there would be any joint investigation with Pakistan as an investigating party.
^^^ For all those who think it was a deliberate NATO sanctioned attack to kill a few Pakistani troops... for what? Sh!ts n giggles??? This attack is a bigger loss to NATO than it is to Pakistan. For a nation or an army, troops can be replaced, but the opportunities and strategic moments and allies cannot. They are not fools to shoot themselves in the foot after coming so long into this war.

We take your word and say NATO is a bunch of stupids, idiots and dumbos who are being run being Afhan Intelligence agencies. Poor guys were cheated or were victim of Afghan intelligence. There are few messages for the people who want to think:
It is a symbolic attack ( Molin Memo) like the one was done after Raymond Davis release
Increase pressure to fight American war with Pakistani soldiers as Americans are not born to die
Gauge reaction of pakistani people and how their installed pup[pet regime handles the pressure

 

[lem34]

what makes me sick is that cheng keeps making off topic comments not related to our tragedy of 28 valuable young lives terminated in their prime for no reason with smilys. Irfanbhai why dont you send this troll where he should be.

 

[53fd]

RD has been booked for attacking a senior citizenin the US , that where he is now

He is being deliberately disingenuous, & he knows it. There is no solution for that attitude.

 

[VCheng]

RD has been booked for attacking a senior citizenin the US , that where he is now

At least he was escorted to the airport and flew out of the country while on the Exit Control List!

But this is not related to this topic, so I will stop here.

===============================

Back to the topic: It is likely that the supply routes will reopen within one month.

---------- Post added at 08:02 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:01 PM ----------

what makes me sick is that cheng keeps making off topic comments not related to our tragedy of 28 valuable young lives terminated in their prime for no reason with smilys. Irfanbhai why dont you send this troll where he should be.

I respect the fallen soldiers.

My smilies are reserved for your childish antics.

 

[Gin ka Pakistan]

VCheng : Pakistan should be thankful to RD for exposing them and putting the visa checks and cutting activities of Uncle Sam in Pakistan, because of him common people came to know what Zardari and Co are up too (now one less the ambassador and RD is also one reason he was not liked by the army as he gave them the visa ).
Well Quraishi sub will tell the nation more about Zardari and Co in his Karachi address and to him RD had no immunity.

 

[VCheng]

VCheng : Pakistan should be thankful to RD for exposing them and putting the visa checks and cutting activities of Uncle Sam in Pakistan, because of him common people came to know what Zardari and Co are up too (now one less).
Well Quraishi sub will tell the nation more about Zardari and Co in his Karachi address and to him RD had no immunity.

Good points!

Always glad to help!

 

[53fd]

Back to the topic: It is likely that the supply routes will reopen within one month.

This is this topic of this thread:

NATO Kills 28 Pakistani Soldiers in Unprovoked Night Attack

Anyways, you are entitled to your opinions, at least you aren't claiming you are using facts to explain your position.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

That is only their side of the story; a balanced view can only be formed when facts from both sides are known.

Keep that in mind when accusations against Pakistan, and specifically accusations against the PA and ISI, get flung by the West.

So an outcome where Pakistan is as isolated as Iran would be acceptable to you, with the economic troubles multiplied manifold over those of Iran due to a lack of oil and increasing social pressures?

Yes - an outcome such as a revolution ala Iran (religious or otherwise) is acceptable to the status quo, even without the oil. The one thing the Islamic Revolution in Iran did deliver was good basic governance and investment in education and basic infrastructure. With just that and Pakistan's agrarian backbone and existing industrial base, Pakistan will prosper.

Please mourn in a dignified, and not hysterical, manner.

You of all people cannot call for 'Mourning in a 'dignified manner' when you argue for 'accepting the ground realities of injustice and inequality' and argue for a cessation of the condemnation directed against the perpetrators of this crime.

I have no hatred against anyone or any entity, pathological or otherwise. I only analyze dispassionately and express the results truthfully.

You may think you 'analyze dispassionately and express the results truthfully', others obviously disagree, and why they disagree has been made clear in the arguments made on this thread.

Mark my words again: The Army will be the downfall of Pakistan. Many will disagree with this opinion, and i respect that, but to call the motivation mere hatred is wrong. The roots of that opinion are factual and logically supportable. The unfolding events will only serve to reinforce that opinion, sadly.

It is an unjustified argument, and there are existing threads where this argument has plaid out and my (and others) position made clear as to why this argument is unjustified.

 

[VCheng]

This is this topic of this thread:

NATO Kills 28 Pakistani Soldiers in Unprovoked Night Attack

Yes.
And as a response, NATO supply routes have been closed, and I am opining that they will reopen within one month.

Entirely relevant on-topic post.

 

[53fd]

Good points!

Always glad to help!

Huh?

---------- Post added at 06:07 AM ---------- Previous post was at 06:07 AM ----------

Yes.
And as a response, NATO supply routes have been closed, and I am opining that they will reopen within one month.

Entirely relevant on-topic post.

I never said this post was off-topic. You are entitled to your opinions, at least you aren't claiming you are using facts to explain your position.

 

[lem34]

Back to the topic: It is likely that the supply routes will reopen within one month.

---------- Post added at 08:02 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:01 PM ----------



I respect the fallen soldiers.

My smilies are reserved for your childish antics.

So you are resorting to personal attacks now are you?? calling me childish when you are the most self centered brat on this forum!

Even americans expect payback for what they have done, you are being more american than american. They still will never accept you...

One Isaf source voiced concern that the Pakistani intelligence agency, the ISI, could go much further and use its suspected influence over insurgent groups in the tribal areas along the Afghan border to launch reprisal attacks on Nato. "This will come back at us, and at a time and a place of their [the ISI's] choosing," the source predicted. In September the chairman of the US joint chiefs of staff, Admiral Mike Mullen, said the ISI was using insurgent groups such as the Haqqani network to wage a "proxy war" in Afghanistan.

 

[Bhairava]

The opinion of the majority of Pakistanis here, based on the arguments made and information known so far, would be that it is VC and others supporting the NATO position that are the ones' blinded by a pathological hatred of the Pakistani Military and blood lust' - certainly the commentary by users in many Western media outlets (online) indicates a very high degree of the above, as a result of years of brainwashing and propaganda fed by the Western Establishment to the populace via the Western media.

The information known so far is only the tip of the ice-berg.

Justifying your opinion bases on that is not a sound practise. There is more to this than just meets the eye/available in media right now.

Let the final investigation from both sides submit their reports.

At the risk of going against popular opinion I say, Pak side may not have been completely innocent in this whole episode. The rather muted response from ISPR only adds to that suspicion that they want to play this down.

 

[VCheng]

Keep that in mind when accusations against Pakistan, and specifically accusations against the PA and ISI, get flung by the West.

Absolutely I do, and will. Thank you for the reminder.

Yes - an outcome such as a revolution ala Iran (religious or otherwise) is acceptable to the status quo, even without the oil. The one thing the Islamic Revolution in Iran did deliver was good basic governance and investment in education and basic infrastructure. With just that and Pakistan's agrarian backbone and existing industrial base, Pakistan will prosper.

If such a revolution provides for good basic governance and investment in education and basic infrastructure, then even I might find grounds to support it!

You of all people cannot call for 'Mourning in a 'dignified manner' when you argue for 'accepting the ground realities of injustice and inequality' and argue for a cessation of the condemnation directed against the perpetrators of this crime.

Condemn and mourn, of course, but without the hysteria please. That is all I am saying.

You may think you 'analyze dispassionately and express the results truthfully', others obviously disagree, and why they disagree has been made clear in the arguments made on this thread.

I respect differing opinions too, and ask for no less for mine.

It is an unjustified argument, and there are existing threads where this argument has plaid out and my (and others) position made clear as to why this argument is unjustified.

We will discuss that topic further elsewhere, I am sure.

---------- Post added at 08:11 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:10 PM ----------

........................
One Isaf source voiced concern that the Pakistani intelligence agency, the ISI, could go much further and use its suspected influence over insurgent groups in the tribal areas along the Afghan border to launch reprisal attacks on Nato. "This will come back at us, and at a time and a place of their [the ISI's] choosing," the source predicted. In September the chairman of the US joint chiefs of staff, Admiral Mike Mullen, said the ISI was using insurgent groups such as the Haqqani network to wage a "proxy war" in Afghanistan.

Sure, they might be a few attacks here and there, but that will be about as effective as a bug hitting a windshield. Nobody in NATO is losing sleep over this type of retaliation, I assure you.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Yes it is the same TYPE of misguided zeal that leads to blindly following a set doctrine, no matter how erroneous and outdated it may be.

They are BOTH blinded to reality, one by nationalist zealot ideology, and one by extremist religious ideology, and both cannot see the inevitable outcomes.

My comment stands.

There is a significant difference between the two positions - it is in fact your position on 'nationalist issues' that has more in common with the arguments of the religious extremists.

The religious extremist only cares for 'equality and justice' as long as it is the religious extremists twisted version of 'equality and justice' that is being implemented, and the religious extremist has no qualms about claiming 'might is right' and enforcing 'injustice and inequality' at the barrel of a gun.

Pakistani nationalists are, however, arguing in favor of 'justice and equality for all' in the international comity of nations, as an extension of 'justice and equality for all' at the national level. Your response to that position is largely analogous to the religious extremist - 'accept the ground realities and accept injustice and inequality, for I (the US) have the bigger gun and it is only what the US cares about that matters.' The US as a nation, like the religious extremists, has no qualms about using violence and coercion of various kinds to enforce its policies and get its way.

 

[iPhone]

VCheng, you're epitome of double standards, that much is clear. You keep asking for investigation to be finalized and that's fine. But your track record shows you haven't asked for the same for Pakistan when it was accused by the west. You believed the west outright without waiting for the Pakistani side of the story. You demonstrated that as late as when Mr. Mullen accused the ISI.

So come out of this facade that you have anything good for Pakistan in you. you're not fooling anyone.