American attack aftermath: Pakistan declares attack a 'plot'

[pakdefender]

Both the parties have exchanged fires in the past - despite all the communication in place. Both the parties have had losses in those fires too.

Such things happen in times of war, and yes - they are accidents, they are not deliberate actions, and they are not rare either. Remember how Pat Tillman died? That's a famous case - you must know. The NATO troops had great and sophisticated modes of communication between them, yet accident happened. Sinking of Seawise Giant? In fact quite a few times Pakistani troops too have killed their own! And so have others.

AM, I am not giving out judgements here. I am not saying Pakistani troops were harboring terrorists, and I am not even saying the fire from the chopper was to cover the infiltration of terrorists into Pakistani territory (It would be stupid to not just fire, but even kill so many simply to infiltrate the terrorists). But I strongly feel you are judging a bit too quickly, with nothing but your own speculation fueled with your bias in favor of Pakistani troops.

Patriotism, yes I understand it is a very powerful emotional force, but unless you know all the outcome of the investigation reports beforehand, or unless you were there at the post as well as in the chopper at the same time to witness everything that took place, you shouldn't be throwing such accusations with the confidence you show.

This is an undeclared war on Pakistan and the western block ( NATO and America ) is seeking to damage us as part of the broader offensive against Muslim countries.
They have used same perverted arguments and have engineered conflicts in the past to kill thousands ( perhaps even more than a million ) people in other muslim courtiers like iraq , libya and afghanistan and in Pakistan's case they dont have absolute dominance over us .. At least not yet ... they don’t have the dominance they want to cause unprecedented murder in Pakistan since they are stuck in Afghansitan and have been unable to subdue the insurgency there.
If we did not have Nuclear capability they would have attacked us long time back. This attack should be wake up call for all Pakistanis.
Pakistan indeed has many enemies, NATO/US is the most potent one, India is the most annoying one and Israel is the most clever one!!

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

The Pakistani FO still has not decided yet about RD's status.

My posts are correct.

You did not state that 'the facts regarding RD's diplomatic status be established', you argued that the US government position WRT RD's status was correct, and that 'Pakistan should accept the ground realities and fall in line with the US position'.

Much as your positions on this thread are contradictory and your arguments circular - either you need to either choose your words better when making an argument, or the choice of words is intentional and, as I pointed out, your claim that you are being 'objective and neutral' is simply a veneer for bashing Pakistan and supporting the US/West no matter what their crimes.

 

[VCheng]

Save your breath; this is the same type of misguided crowd that celebrated the murder of Salman Taseer too...................

No it isn't - you make the typical 'Pakistani elite liberal fascist' mistake of conflating support for nationalist policies with support for regressive and extreme religious and cultural interpretations.
.....................

Yes it is the same TYPE of misguided zeal that leads to blindly following a set doctrine, no matter how erroneous and outdated it may be.

They are BOTH blinded to reality, one by nationalist zealot ideology, and one by extremist religious ideology, and both cannot see the inevitable outcomes.

My comment stands.

 

[53fd]

From your own source: "The Foreign Ministry has concluded that Raymond Davis, the American killer of two Pakistanis, is a non-diplomatic staff member of the US Consulate,

Yes, Davis is a "non-diplomatic staff member". Meaning Raymond Davis was not a diplomat, he was a non-diplomatic staff member. Can't get any more clearer than that.

I have been consistent is saying that let us wait for the final investigation report.

Yes, you have been consistent in your conjecture, but your posts have been off-topic & have not contributed anything with respect to the incident mentioned in this thread.

 

[VCheng]

You did not state that 'the facts regarding RD's diplomatic status be established', you argued that the US government position WRT RD's status was correct, and that 'Pakistan should accept the ground realities and fall in line with the US position'. ..................

Not to take this thread off topic, but the US government position WAS proven to be correct and Pakistan DID accept the ground realities and let RD go.

---------- Post added at 07:50 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:48 PM ----------

Yes, Davis is a "non-diplomatic staff member". Meaning Raymond Davis was not a diplomat, he was a non-diplomatic staff member. Can't get any more clearer than that...................

Please quote the COMPLETE sentence and see the clearer picture.

 

[53fd]

Please quote the COMPLETE sentence and see the clearer picture.

I have quoted the statement. He was not a diplomat & was not eligible for diplomatic immunity.

He was not given diplomatic immunity, because he was a a non-diplomatic staff member. It has been made adequately clear. Can you please stop posting off-topic, & concentrate on this thread?

So where is RD now?

That doesn't determine whether he was a diplomat or not. He was not a diplomat & was tried in court.

 

[Gin ka Pakistan]

No it isn't - you make the typical 'Pakistani elite liberal fascist' mistake of conflating support for nationalist policies with support for regressive and extreme religious and cultural interpretations.

As I said, 'schadenfreude exists in both the West and Pakistan', though the West likes to pretend that its 'shite don't stink'.

I repeat what you said:
"typical 'Pakistani elite liberal fascist' mistake of conflating support for nationalist policies with support for regressive and extreme religious and cultural interpretations."

Totally agreed , you made my day

 

[lem34]

what saddens me is that any death of an individual should be regarded as a tragedy including american deaths but it is american reactions to our people being killed that sometimes makes me feel that non white non american lives are cheaper and in turn makes all of us bitter. Americans in their disproportionate response to sept 11 attacks have made americans to be viewed in the same light as the like of the terrorists that theey claim to be their enemies.

Americans soldiers are now responsible for more innocent deaths than al qaida and co

 

[53fd]

Not to take this thread off topic, but the US government position WAS proven to be correct and Pakistan DID accept the ground realities and let RD go.

The US position was not correct, because he was not given diplomatic immunity: he was tried & had to pay a penalty before he was released. Anyways you are right, this is off-topic, like most of your posts

 

[VCheng]

I have quoted the statement. He was not a diplomat & was not eligible for diplomatic immunity.

This is the complete statement:

"The Foreign Ministry has concluded that Raymond Davis, the American killer of two Pakistanis, is a non-diplomatic staff member of the US Consulate, who was given a certain level of immunity but not absolute immunity, it is learnt.".

---------- Post added at 07:54 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:53 PM ----------

The US position was not correct, because he was not given diplomatic immunity: he was tried & had to pay a penalty before he was released. Anyways you are right, this is off-topic, like most of your posts

So where is RD now?

 

[53fd]

This is the complete statement:

"The Foreign Ministry has concluded that Raymond Davis, the American killer of two Pakistanis, is a non-diplomatic staff member of the US Consulate, who was given a certain level of immunity but not absolute immunity, it is learnt.".

He was not given diplomatic immunity, because he was a a non-diplomatic staff member. It has been made adequately clear. Can you please stop posting off-topic, & concentrate on this thread?

 

[lem34]

Yes it is the same TYPE of misguided zeal that leads to blindly following a set doctrine, no matter how erroneous and outdated it may be.

They are BOTH blinded to reality, one by nationalist zealot ideology, and one by extremist religious ideology, and both cannot see the inevitable outcomes.

My comment stands.

No it doesnt you were referring to me. Knowing full well that I had been critical of the person who was responsible for taseer murder. you were playing to the anti pakistani gallery and dismissing and lumping me in with extremist when you know full well that I am no misguided al quaida terrorist wannabe

 

[pakdefender]

what saddens me is that any death of an individual should be regarded as a tragedy including american deaths but it is american reactions to our people being killed that sometimes makes me feel that non white non american lives are cheaper and in turn makes all of us bitter. Americans in their disproportionate response to sept 11 attacks have made americans to be viewed in the same light as the like of the terrorists that theey claim to be their enemies.

Americans soldiers are now responsible for more innocent deaths than al qaida and co

one just has to read the CNN comments section to see the hate filled vomit that comes out of american and indian posters. americans are war mongers , war is always an election item , the american population has enough blood lust that politicans talk war as part of their election campaign ... that should tell us something about what sort of people we are dealing with

 

[President Camacho]

I would advise you to check out the comments sections of the major Western media outlets, as well as blogs like LWJ, to see the 'rejoicing Westerners' when tragedy hits Pakistan - and that attitude has been present for several years now.

Hey man, come on now don't be referring me to YouTube next. Are we supposed to define our standards by looking at others? That blog, LWJ, Yahoo News, or say YouTube etc, they do not have Mods there. Their gates are open to anyone who may come, post, and leave.

Those are specifically comments section. They are not a place where people deliberate on situations in disciplined and organized fashion. To make sure of that we need Moderators, such as you on here, or some on other sites with WDN.

I have been to many forums, and those who rejoice the deaths of others, even enemies, do not last long. However, I particularly note that the presence of those who get into such petty habits, is one of the foremost signs of declining quality of the forum.

'Friendly fire' during combat while deployed in a theater is understandable - 'friendly fire' against two fortified Pakistani Army positions whose location was communicated to ISAF several times is, as I pointed out, inexplicable, especially given the fact that much smaller scale events have occurred in the past and supposedly actions were taken to prevent them.

Yes, I know what you are saying AM. I too do not understand how could they just blast out a post full of so many troops. But also AM, every act has a motive. The bigger the act, the stronger the motive.

What are NATO/US supposed to gain by deliberately killing 28 Pakistani soldiers? It jeopardized their most economic route of supply. That's a consequence that even a kid could guess. So what exactly did they gain?

Schadenfreude cuts both ways here - it isn't just exclusive to the Muslim world and/or Pakistan.

AM, brother, you are in a pretty bad mood today. I am sorry for whatever got you like this... I'd say please sit back and have some chai/coffee/whatever you like. Take a short break, calm down man.

 

[pakdefender]

This is the complete statement:

"The Foreign Ministry has concluded that Raymond Davis, the American killer of two Pakistanis, is a non-diplomatic staff member of the US Consulate, who was given a certain level of immunity but not absolute immunity, it is learnt.".

---------- Post added at 07:54 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:53 PM ----------





So where is RD now?

RD has been booked for attacking a senior citizen in the US , thats where he is now