A political solution for Kashmir and lasting peace for India and Pakistan

[Naofumi]

One liner and out of context posts will not be replied.

You yourself quoted three single lines from @jamahir's post. Just saying.

 

[Baghial]

only 1 solution

conquer and rule...

and if you cant , well die conquering it.

the other solutions are for faggets and eunuchs.

 

[padamchen]

only 1 solution

conquer and rule...

and if you cant , well die conquering it.

the other solutions are for faggets and eunuchs.

Faggots.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

Secondly, as for the Pakistani military accepting to put more national focus on overall economic development of the country instead of just military development I will ask the Pakistani member

This idea that everything that ails Pakistan is fault of the military is plain silly. I imagine from Indian perspective the fist they see is the military and thus find it easy to take out their frustration by blaming everything on the army. While the military no doubt has at times contributed to being a problem in Pakistan but real problems lie in the political economy and misuse of religion as a sop to confuse the masses. Both are interlinked.

A small elite has captured the economy and operates like a racket. The business class instead of generating wealth actually act like a parasite. This can be seen in sugar scams, hoarding, shoddy products, poor service, auto industry that acts like a mafia.

Instead of education, emancipation and progress rligion has been used to literally stifle thought turning the masses into flock of primitive sheep. But while I acknowledge this refuse to accept that India is leaping ahead of Pakistan. Poverty is more widespread in India despite dazzling numbers coming out of New Delhi etc

small elite

And it is no differant in India. This picture I think sums it.

A interesting lay man's comparison of both countries ..

 

[jamahir]

You mean all the sacrifices of Muslims from Pakistan and Kashmir should be p1$$3d upon and agree for loc as ib(long lasting Bharti demand)?

@Indus Pakistan also raised that issue but politely and slightly differently.

So what do you want ? That we keep saying that some Kashmiris have fought until now and that this fact be applied to all eternity and never be discussion of peace ?

Not to mention the chaos which will engulf Pakistan after that(not even the most bhart lover Nawaz could do that, or the secular Zardari could, that will be end of their political career).

I am not just speaking of a solution for Kashmir but a larger one for India and Pakistan as well, solving which will automatically solve Kashmir.

Why should that bring chaos, except for those who have kept both countries socially and politically backward for 70 years ?

And what is wrong in being secular ?

1) status quo - meaning your Bharti occupier terrorists 9lakh keep getting hunted by Pakistan and Kashmir and your Bharti govt keep wasting resources.

Firstly, if we are to talk peace then you should be using polite language and not something like "occupier terrorists".

Secondly, how long do you want the Indian Establishment to keep the few hundred thousand soldiers stationed in Kashmir Valley ? If for ten years more, do you in Pakistan really want that ? Maybe the Indian Establishment can decide to allocate special funds for this reason. So status quo doesn't work.

Thirdly, not all Kashmiris want to pick up the gun. Please go through an earlier post of mine about this in this thread. So please don't generalize by using the word "Kashmir".

2) Referendum - that was what nehru also promised and that is acceptable by Pakistan and Kashmir and even UNO.

I have said in the OP why will cannot be applied. Please read the OP again.

3) Chenab Formula - India will get majority hindu areas while Pakistan get majority Muslim. Chenab river will form a natural border and anything west of Chenab goes to Pakistan while anything east goes to bhart.

Just to be sure, you are claiming for Pakistan the entire Indian state of Jammu and Kashmir ( Jammu, Kashmir Valley and Ladakh ) ?

 

[Naofumi]

This idea that everything that ails Pakistan is fault of the military is plain silly. I imagine from Indian perspective the fist they see is the military and thus find it easy to take out their frustration by blaming everything on the army. While the military no doubt has at times contributed to being a problem in Pakistan but real problems lie in the political economy and misuse of religion as a sop to confuse the masses. Both are interlinked.

A small elite has captured the economy and operates like a racket. The business class instead of generating wealth actually act like a parasite. This can be seen in sugar scams, hoarding, shoddy products, poor service, auto industry that acts like a mafia.

Instead of education, emancipation and progress rligion has been used to literally stifle thought turning the masses into flock of primitive sheep. But while I acknowledge this refuse to accept that India is leaping ahead of Pakistan. Poverty is more widespread in India despite dazzling numbers coming out of New Delhi etc

The jazba of Army is not religious inspired? Serious question, not rhetorical.
https://www.brownpundits.com/2020/04/19/interview-with-a-mujahid-maj-gen-tajammal-hussain-malik/
Secondly, India outperforms Pakistan in many indicators (like ease of doing business in recent years) except those in which Pakistan had a good head start.

 

[jamahir]

only 1 solution

conquer and rule...

and if you cant , well die conquering it.

the other solutions are for faggets and eunuchs.

Even the imperialist American presidents will not be so in-the-face as you.

And please educate us who will be the conqueror in this case ?

 

[Indus Pakistan]

Does the jazba of Army is not religious inspired?

The army is a professional force and has it origins in the British Raj and military traditions nurtured in Sandhurst, England. It will fight for whatever political masters it is bestoed to. Pre 1947 it fought for the British crown. Overnight in 1948 it fought for Pakistan. In 1965 when most of it's officer corp were from British era fought for Pakistan. The 'jazba' was no more or no less.

India outperforms Pakistan in many indicators

Indicators mean nothing. The reality on the ground means everything. If the car I am in and the car you are in are roughly abreast but your speed indicator says 100 mph and mine 40 mph are you going to jump up and brag to me about how fast your moving?

Fact is India is as fucked up if NOT more than Pakistan. That is the impression any visitor who goes to both countries makes. It's not like across Wagah in India is land of milk/honey.

However various religous outfits like Tehrek Taliban Pakistan, Sipah Sahaba etc indeed are religious inspired and display the 'jazba' you alluded to.

 

[dreamer11]

The army is a professional force and has it origins in the British Raj and military traditions nurtured in Sandhurst, England. It will fight for whatever political masters it is bestoed to. Pre 1947 it fought for the British crown. Overnight in 1948 it fought for Pakistan. In 1965 when most of it's officer corp were from British era fought for Pakistan. The 'jazba' was no more or no less.

Indicators mean nothing. The reality on the ground means everything. If the car I am in and the car you are in are roughly abreast but your speed indicator says 100 mph and mine 40 mph are you going to jump up and brag to me about how fast your moving?

Fact is India is as fucked up if NOT more than Pakistan. That is the impression any visitor who goes to both countries makes. It's not like across Wagah in India is land of milk/honey.

However various religous outfits like Tehrek Taliban Pakistan, Sipah Sahaba etc indeed are religious inspired and display the 'jazba' you alluded to.

INDICATORS MEANS EVERYTHING.Somalia and Some other countries always 'Failed countries' of-course they are failed countries whatever they project themselves.

India is compared to China and Pak with Afghan in most indicators.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

India is compared to China

I can compare myself to Bill Gates if I want. My height is same as him.

Population.

China ~ 1,370 million
India ~ 1,350 million


However India compares very well in poverty with Africa.

Keep living in your delusions ....

 

[dreamer11]

I can compare myself to Bill Gates if I want. My height is same as him.

Population.

China ~ 1,370 million
India ~ 1,350 million


However India compares very well in poverty with Africa.

Keep living in your delusions ....

FYI AFRICA IS CONTINENT NOT A COUNTRY

know THE basics like 'difference between continents and countries' then we can discuss further economy&etc.

 

[Naofumi]

The army is a professional force and has it origins in the British Raj and military traditions nurtured in Sandhurst, England. It will fight for whatever political masters it is bestoed to. Pre 1947 it fought for the British crown. Overnight in 1948 it fought for Pakistan. In 1965 when most of it's officer corp were from British era fought for Pakistan. The 'jazba' was no more or no less.

Things may change significantly, especially when you had the likes of Zia on top posts though counter examples exists too, I guess it all reduces to speculation, maybe someone more knowledgeable can add to that.

India is compared to China and Pak with Afghan in most indicators.

Indicators mean nothing. The reality on the ground means everything. If the car I am in and the car you are in are roughly abreast but your speed indicator says 100 mph and mine 40 mph are you going to jump up and brag to me about how fast your moving?

Fact is India is as fucked up if NOT more than Pakistan. That is the impression any visitor who goes to both countries makes. It's not like across Wagah in India is land of milk/honey.

I did not meant that there's a huge gap, the gap is usually slight in most of the cases but in my knowledge the trend is more favourable to India i.e. the gap is more likely to increase. @Nilgiri

Say the gross enrollment rate, India have around 90% while Pakistan struggles at 44%.
https://www.dawn.com/news/1418208

 

[jamahir]

A interesting lay man's comparison of both countries ..

Nice vid. And at last a foreigner has spoken about the number of stray dogs in India.

 

[Cliftonite]

The jazba of Army is not religious inspired? Serious question, not rhetorical.
https://www.brownpundits.com/2020/04/19/interview-with-a-mujahid-maj-gen-tajammal-hussain-malik/
Secondly, India outperforms Pakistan in many indicators (like ease of doing business in recent years) except those in which Pakistan had a good head start.

Uptil the 90s, Pakistan's economy was on a much better footing. Our currency was bigger than India's. This lag is temporary. Our per capita and purchasing power is still higher than an average Indian's.

 

[Naofumi]

Uptil the 90s, Pakistan's economy was on a much better footing. Our currency was bigger than India's. This lag is temporary. Our per capita and purchasing power is still higher than an average Indian's.

http://statisticstimes.com/economy/india-vs-pakistan-economy.php