1971 India Pakistan War: Role of Russia, China, America and Britain.

[danger007]

Posted on 25 May 2011

A General who led the Indian Army on ground in the Kargil conflict, has broken his 11-year silence to say that he believes India actually lost the war in strategic terms. In an exclusive interview to NDTV, Lieutenant-General Kishan Pal, who was then the head of the Srinagar-based 15 Corps, says India has failed to consolidate its tactical gains.

The Indian commanding officer Lt Gen (Retd) Kishen Pal goes on to say–we lost Kargil.

“I consider this loss of war because whatever we gained from the war has not been consolidated, either politically or diplomatically, it has not been consolidated militarily,” Lt Gen (retd) Kishen Pal.

Recent news stories from Bharat are shedding new light on Kargil. The final history has not been written. When we wrote the original article it was dismissed by some Bharatis. New evidence now shows that even Bharati Generals like General Kishen are echoing our original write up. Kargil keeps Kashmir alive. The world since Kargil knows that there can be no peace in South Asia if Kashmir is not resolved.

Bollywood clips cannot change the facts on the ground of Kargil. 11 years after the episode, the truth has come out. Bharat falsified records, fired innocent officers, and exaggerated the incident and hid the number of casualties.

WE ARE NOT CONVINCED THAT WE WON THE WAR. “I consider this as a loss of war”. Lieutenant-General Kishan Pal



Kashmir which had been forgotten is boiling today and on the international agenda. Kargil gave a new life to the Kashmiri freedom movement.

India Lost Kargil War – Lieutenant-General Kishan Pal
Indians have been celebrating ephemeral victories in 1948 and 1998 in Kargil. After a decade the truth has begun to percolate.

Bharati generals have begun to question their victory.

Bharat suffered more deaths than Pakistan, however that is still cloaked in lies and secrecy.

Bharat never recovered all the peaks, that is still hidden. Pakistan will not brag about it, and Bharat is too ashamed to admit it.

The Israeli role was never fully divulged. Without external help from the US and Israel, Bharat was totally doomed to lose all of Kashmir



The rest is all Bollywood.

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I always say this country cant do anything alone against Pakistan... the country is 3rd world country thats it who have just money nothing else more.. India always need support from International power but still not achieve her goal fully... the country cant capable to do any single action against Pakistan. Unfortunately a General who led the Indian Army in Kargil War finally opened his mouth!

you cant deny the fact...

Again another slap!

First announced successful missiles test after 10 years ... Indian scientist said.. our test was not successful

Again another slap on Indian faces... in past claimed that we WON THE WAR unfortunately.. A general who was fighting that war ... no 3rd source... he finally opened his mouth and accept that we not won the Kargil"



Read the rest of Full Article ...“We lost Kargil” Lieutenant-General Kishan Pal|Times of Bombay

Source: https://defence.pk/threads/“we-lost-kargil”-lieutenant-general-kishan-pal.111185/#ixzz4CyREWfOp


here you go @GURU DUTT

Are you aware PAF is not in position to interfere in the conflict? When your target is 100% .. but the outcome is around 75% of what you expecte.. you consider your self failed to reach objective.. If pak is in strong position on all these occupied IA posts.. pak will never move back.. but the reality is otherwise.. pak is isolated internationally not in position to continue war.. India increasing its fire power ... due to all these events .. pak withdraw from kargil...

 

[ThaniOruvan]

Let them come with that intention our General public are enough for your indian Army

BS !!!!
Stink mouth rhetoric won't help. What did your general public do during 1971 civil war ?
Half of you came to this side of the border with your underwear stuffed in your mouth by the Pakistani army.
And what is your general public doing today without eliminating the terrorists ?

You're entire army could be solo'd by the Pakistani Civilians alone.
Lol You noobs
only know how to make tall claims yet when it comes to backing you're talk you run away.
You couldn't even win the kargil incident even with air and naval support compared to Pakistan's Light youth infantry.
Proof is widely available on "NEUTRAL" Resources.

Foolish rhetoric and a dumb keyboard warrior banging his chest to the wall.
Pakistan's nuclear bluff was pathetically exposed during Kargil. Brainwashed nuts like you should never ever come to international forums and talk. You don't have 'that' to be a proper agent of your country. Your own countrymen have return tons of articles explaining how India kicked Pakistan in the groin when it caught India by neck. Go read that first.

 

[Major d1]

Why don't you take it one step at a time? First graduate, then we'll see about the poor in the mind.

The point was for you . Not for mine. Fox is always a fox a lion is always a lion.

South Asians are prone to conjuring up all manner of conspiracy theories when faced with unpleasant realities, but those looking for one for Dead Reckoning are at a loss, as the only explanation for what it contains is that it reconstructs what really happened on the basis of available evidence.

The process of dismantling entrenched nationalist mythologies can be painful for those who have much vested in them, but the passions stirred by the publication of Dead Reckoning has sparked the debate that the 1971 war badly needed - and set on the right course the discussion of this bitter and brutal fratricidal war that split the only homeland created for Muslims in the modern world.

America clearly sided with Pakistan in '71 but the situation for Pakistan was almost certainly, a no-win scenario. I posted this some time ago in another thread but think it relevant here...

"Well, Pakistan's was also a "two front war", the difference though was that India had interior lines of supply and communication, a clear strategic and logistical advantage. Militarily, it was virtually impossible for Pakistan to keep hold of East Pakistan,"

Nothing could change that strategic fact.

US tried to tied up both Pakistan at a time. But UK And USSR interferences failed the mission. And it's made a global conspiracy theory. India , Bangladesh became a failed state.

You need lessons in English and history.

May be you have no idea what is diplomacy . Or Diplomatic words.

 

[Mysticbuddy]

you guys aren't accepting the facts and insisting me to accept your imagined made history.



even gen pal was a part of kargil and also a lieutenant gen openly accepted that india lost kargil.

India openly accepted that they lost 587 troops lives.

Gen VK singh openly accepted musharraf crossed LOC before kargil and entered into indian occupied kashmir but we were not able to stop him.

You you mean to say that you guys are still having kargil?

Man, Pakistan did the worst by not even accepting dead bodies of there own soldiers. I respect India for this they gave them full respect even when Pakistan refused.

The point was for you . Not for mine. Fox is always a fox a lion is always a lion.

And a fool is always a fool....

Dear in today's time if india has 50 percent chance of winning against us they would have attacked us especially modi government but since their is no chance and i don't believe this report if America really had helped than their won't be any india

It's good that we saved the day for Pakistan otherwise there wouldn't be that either. There was no way Pakistan could win. It's been blunder after another coming from Pakistan. US needs to draw line the line from any more crap.

 

[Major d1]

And a fool is always a fool....

Depends on Manner and respect to a person to an another person..

 

[Uzair Shafiq [Босс]]

BS !!!!
Stink mouth rhetoric won't help. What did your general public do during 1971 civil war ?
Half of you came to this side of the border with your underwear stuffed in your mouth by the Pakistani army.
And what is your general public doing today without eliminating the terrorists ?



Foolish rhetoric and a dumb keyboard warrior banging his chest to the wall.
Pakistan's nuclear bluff was pathetically exposed during Kargil. Brainwashed nuts like you should never ever come to international forums and talk. You don't have 'that' to be a proper agent of your country. Your own countrymen have return tons of articles explaining how India kicked Pakistan in the groin when it caught India by neck. Go read that first.

When you said own countrymen
The only person that came to my mind was Mubashir luqman?

 

[Dawood Ibrahim]

Then please tell us .
Why should we attack Pakistan ?
AFAIK Pakistan is a closed chapter in India .
Waging war , diplomatic games all its depend on national interests.
So if there is grave need for our permanent national interest then we will again repeat 1971 without any doubt .

Now our national interest is a stable environment and we dont need instability in our neighbourhood.



If you 'say Bangladesh is enough for India'then please tell to us about your Army's inventory
Now our biggest problem is illegal BDis in India .Far worse than BD army.

You guys can't attack Pakistan. It's till now open chapter coz you guys are still trying to separate balochistan and creating problem in Peshawar Karachi with the help of Afghanistan and in Afghanistan you have consulates in which you guys have TTP leaders

 

[Joe Shearer]

if you are 66 years old than you should at least know how to talk.

I believe that I do know how to talk. It is just that I cannot suffer fools gladly.

You should not call someone idiot when you can't prove your claims.

I called you an idiot not because I can't prove my claims. I have in the very recent past proved every one of them. If some ignorant newbie comes on the scene and starts throwing his nonsensical theories around, after giving him a chance once, perhaps twice, why should I not put him in his place?

I don't act smart I act wise because I go with the facts and don't attack personally first.

No. You don't act wise. All your facts were wrong. And you deserve, therefore, to be criticised for not finding out the facts. Looking at stupid YouTube videos is not a substitute for looking up trustworthy references. That makes you smart, in fact, over smart, not wise.

see above I posted gen kishan pal who was a part of kargil

Lt. General Kishan Pal was caught with his pants down, tried lying his way out of the situation, and in any other army, in such a situation, would have been court-martialled. Doing that to him would have been to incriminate his GOC-in-C to some extent, for less than satisfactory supervision, and would have damaged the reputation of the COAS, who had been playing golf abroad when the crisis blew up. He was whitewashed, a very responsible and effective Brigadier was made a scapegoat, and Kishan Pal has spent the rest of his life spinning every kind of story that would put him in a less vulnerable, less culpable position. It is a different matter that the cover-up failed; such things do not survive in an open democracy like India.

and the gen's you are talking about were not a part of kargil.

If you delve into the facts, only three Pakistani generals knew about Kargil, and they are hardly likely to incriminate themselves. The facts were wide open on the Indian side, however, which is why a cover-up by those responsible was not possible.

Lot of gen's criticize musharraf because of taking over govt etc but they were not part of kargil while gen kishan pal was a lieutenant gen at the time of kargil

The criticism was not about his taking over the government, but about jumping into an extremely dangerous misadventure against an extremely dangerous enemy. And he was proved wrong, which left him vulnerable to attack by Nawaz Sharif. Everybody knows what followed.

 

[Dawood Ibrahim]

You you mean to say that you guys are still having kargil?

Man, Pakistan did the worst by not even accepting dead bodies of there own soldiers. I respect India for this they gave them full respect even when Pakistan refused.


And a fool is always a fool....


It's good that we saved the day for Pakistan otherwise there wouldn't be that either. There was no way Pakistan could win. It's been blunder after another coming from Pakistan. US needs to draw line the line from any more crap.

We made you shit and piss in kargil if it wasn't for our leader to call back our soldiers.
Make no mistake you guys only have guts to attack if other countries will attack us with you guys

 

[Mysticbuddy]

We made you shit and piss in kargil if it wasn't for our leader to call back our soldiers.
Make no mistake you guys only have guts to attack if other countries will attack us with you guys

We as USA pulled you out of the blunder in kargil which you explained by adding adjectives. Again, US of A has all had to send a drone. Objective done.

 

[SrNair]

You guys can't attack Pakistan. It's till now open chapter coz you guys are still trying to separate balochistan and creating problem in Peshawar Karachi with the help of Afghanistan and in Afghanistan you have consulates in which you guys have TTP leaders

Then all these are your delusions .
If we want your destability we can certainly destabliize you .
But now that is not our national interest.

 

[Dawood Ibrahim]

We as USA pulled you out of the blunder in kargil which you explained by adding adjectives. Again, US of A has all had to send a drone. Objective done.

O you mean US of A who you guys begged and thought with it help will give get NSG members ship and than were told you guys are not Qualified

 

[Sneaker]

May be you have no idea what is diplomacy . Or Diplomatic words.

Or English grammar.

 

[Joe Shearer]

The point was for you . Not for mine. Fox is always a fox a lion is always a lion.

When somebody like you is involved, neither foxes nor lions need to come into the picture. Donkeys are always donkeys, and you will remain one.

South Asians are prone to conjuring up all manner of conspiracy theories when faced with unpleasant realities,

That is a succinct summary of your own position.

...but those looking for one for Dead Reckoning are at a loss, as the only explanation for what it contains is that it reconstructs what really happened on the basis of available evidence.

Sarmila Bose has been discredited so fundamentally that only a conspiracy theorist can possibly still have any faith in her.

The process of dismantling entrenched nationalist mythologies can be painful for those who have much vested in them, but the passions stirred by the publication of Dead Reckoning has sparked the debate that the 1971 war badly needed - and set on the right course the discussion of this bitter and brutal fratricidal war that split the only homeland created for Muslims in the modern world.

Unfortunately, you are basing all your fanfare on one self-publicising authoress with a flawed approach, who has been taken apart too many times to count. If that is all you have to offer, go and look up the meaning of 'one trick pony'.

US tried to tied up both Pakistan at a time. But UK And USSR interferences failed the mission. And it's made a global conspiracy theory. India , Bangladesh became a failed state.

This is a first-class example of somebody out of his depth trying to come to grips with external reality.

May be you have no idea what is diplomacy . Or Diplomatic words.

Unfortunately, you are not a diplomat. Nor do you use diplomatic words; you only misuse idiom over which you have a very sketchy hold. All in all, a failure in facts as well as a failure in phrasing.

 

[Dawood Ibrahim]

Then all these are your delusions .
If we want your destability we can certainly destabliize you .
But now that is not our national interest.

You guys are trying heard but no success till now