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Zimbabwe: Military Coup updates & discussions

no posts so far. if this shit happens in ME or europe this thread would be full of people. it seems that in this forum black lives dont matter. sad world we live in
Truth hurts. However, we have to say things the way they are. If you are a poor weak country ruled by corrupt despots who don't care about their people's well being, then why should western powers or their media care about you? The world only respects wealthy, strong, stable, industrialised countries and the influence they have in world issues where world powers have major interests which can be affected.
So Zimbabwe is none of the above, so why should we give them more coverage than they deserve.
By contrast, if this coup was in South Africa for example, then you can bet it will be all over our news channel
 
Truth hurts. However, we have to say things the way they are. If you are a poor weak country ruled by corrupt despots who don't care about their people's well being, then why should western powers or their media care about you? The world only respects wealthy, strong, stable, industrialised countries and the influence they have in world issues where world powers have major interests which can be affected.
So Zimbabwe is none of the above, so why should we give them more coverage than they deserve.
By contrast, if this coup was in South Africa for example, then you can bet it will be all over our news channel
i was talking about the whiny brats on this forum who throw a tantrum when their problems dont get enough coverage but they ignore others' problems. how about that?
 
Truth hurts. However, we have to say things the way they are. If you are a poor weak country ruled by corrupt despots who don't care about their people's well being, then why should western powers or their media care about you? The world only respects wealthy, strong, stable, industrialised countries and the influence they have in world issues where world powers have major interests which can be affected.
So Zimbabwe is none of the above, so why should we give them more coverage than they deserve.
By contrast, if this coup was in South Africa for example, then you can bet it will be all over our news channel

The fact of the matter is that Mugabe and his cronies have run Zimbabwe into being such a deep sh*thole with little or no objection from his people that they very well deserve to stir in their hell forever. Kicking out the White farmers was the first of his stupid move since the breadbasket of Africa became a poor beggar nation. Whilst the people starved and couldn't get access to healthcare, he and his wife and kids partied it up in Singapore, China and South Africa. The people however are so stupid they just accepted a Black despot to rule over them and make their lives hell in place of a White controlled government which gave them a fairly decent standard of living. Some of these former colonies really ought to consider offering themselves a return to crown rule
 
The fact of the matter is that Mugabe and his cronies have run Zimbabwe into being such a deep sh*thole with little or no objection from his people that they very well deserve to stir in their hell forever. Kicking out the White farmers was the first of his stupid move since the breadbasket of Africa became a poor beggar nation. Whilst the people starved and couldn't get access to healthcare, he and his wife and kids partied it up in Singapore, China and South Africa. The people however are so stupid they just accepted a Black despot to rule over them and make their lives hell in place of a White controlled government which gave them a fairly decent standard of living. Some of these former colonies really ought to consider offering themselves a return to crown rule
white rule didn't go well in south africa did it?
 
Considering the current scenario in South Africa I can't really agree with you there
education and standards of living actually increased in SA after apartheid. whites didnt do anything for coloured people. they only took care of themselves
 
i was talking about the whiny brats on this forum who throw a tantrum when their problems dont get enough coverage but they ignore others' problems. how about that?
Lol true that. I can't deny this one. :D
Well, they want others to talk about them but they themselves don't care about other poor countries which doesn't affect them. Lol
 
education and standards of living actually increased in SA after apartheid. whites didnt do anything for coloured people. they only took care of themselves

I really don't know which South Africa you were led to believe this is happening at :D

I have family who live in Durban and Cape Town. The reality is that more houses were being built for the poor Blacks during apartheid than currently. The standard of education at state schools (attended by majority poor Blacks or "coloured people" as you refer to them) has dropped dismally since the Black government took over. Crime has skyrocketed. Unemployment figures are beyond belief compared to White rule when sanctions were then in place. Corruption is so endemic that it has become a laughing reality where billions of South African Rand are being siphoned off by corrupt officials (remember this is tax money which should be used to uplift the life of the people). The reality is also that an Indian national family have hijacked the state where they have bought off the President and his family (who are openly and unashamedly corrupt) and most of his ministers to the extent that they now control state owned entities. They hire and fire government ministers. If you believe that this is a great ideal in any country then heaven help you
 
Finally uncle TIM is thrown out. It came down to this at the end.

I saw how he took a very good country and in 20 years run it into the ground; further his wretched wife Grace who should be shamboked by the very people she tormented and tortured. Mugabe needs to be held accountable for all the attrocities in Matabeleland where thousands were executed.

But the very question remains, the VP if he comes back is no better than Mugabe. They are all stained and the people of Zimbabwe continue to be the victims of their leaders.

The very cry of chimurenga has all but disappeared.
 
these hoes aint loyal
Ahahahaha...... True that. :lol:


i dont think so. at least the gir from Zimbabwe that i had a crush on didn't have any respect
How can you have any respect when you know your people live in abject poverty and can't afford even the very basic things a human being needs for survival/decent life and yet who still doesn't want to leave power after taking the country hostage for almost 40years, and even after his death planned to put his wife in power(surprised he didn't try to put his son instead like many african leaders do). Lol
How can you respect such a tyrant?
 
The fact of the matter is that Mugabe and his cronies have run Zimbabwe into being such a deep sh*thole with little or no objection from his people that they very well deserve to stir in their hell forever. Kicking out the White farmers was the first of his stupid move since the breadbasket of Africa became a poor beggar nation. Whilst the people starved and couldn't get access to healthcare, he and his wife and kids partied it up in Singapore, China and South Africa. The people however are so stupid they just accepted a Black despot to rule over them and make their lives hell in place of a White controlled government which gave them a fairly decent standard of living. Some of these former colonies really ought to consider offering themselves a return to crown rule
You should take into account of several things. Zimbabwe's modern problems didn't really start until the early 90's. By then Mugabe was in power for 10 years. Though he wasn't nice toward white farmers in the 80's he wasn't antagonistic to them. In the early years of power Mugabe actually called for reconciliation. So, economically speaking, Zimbabwe was stable for sometime.

Regardless, you can't blame the blacks for wanting to change their position. You had to be educated in order to make it into Rhodesia and even so very few of them were. Rhodesia also spent a disproportional amount of their budget in funding white education over black education.
 
Zimbabwean army likely to negotiate transitional power transfer to ousted vice-president following palace coup
Theophilus Acheampong and Alan Msosa - IHS Jane's Intelligence Weekly
15 November 2017
1647012_-_main.jpg

Zimbabwean soldier in an armoured vehicle by an intersection regulating civilian traffic in Harare on 15 November. Source: Wilfred Kajese/AFP/Getty Images
Key Points
  • The military’s intervention follows the recent dismissal of the vice-president and a purge of ruling-party loyalists as First Lady Grace Mugabe vies for power.
  • The army is likely to negotiate a transitional power transfer to ousted vice-president Emmerson Mnangagwa, indicating a shift in policy direction, with areas particularly likely to be affected including economic proposals aimed at Zimbabwe’s re-engagement with the international community.
  • Violent confrontations between rival factions in the ruling ZANU-PF party and the military are likely in the coming weeks and will probably pose risks of injury to passers-by, minor damage to commercial property on the high streets in the Central Business District, and disruption to road networks in the main cities lasting up to three days at a time.
Event
The Zimbabwean military overnight (14–15 November) took control of state broadcaster Zimbabwe Broadcasting Corporation and mounted roadblocks and patrols around key government offices, courts, and the parliament building in Harare, and at the presidential palace.

In a televised speech following the takeover, Major-General Sibusiso Moyo of the Zimbabwe Defence Forces (ZDF) announced that 93-year-old President Robert Mugabe and his family are “safe and sound and their security is guaranteed”, although local media sources report that they are under house arrest. Gen Moyo claimed that the military was “in charge” for the purpose of “dealing” with “criminals” who had surrounded President Mugabe but denied a coup had taken place.

Military intervention follows dismissal of vice-president
Vice-President Emmerson Mnangagwa was expelled from the ruling Zimbabwe African National Union – Patriotic Front (ZANU–PF) party on 8 November after a meeting of its politburo acting on recommendations from the party’s provincial leaders. Mnangagwa’s dismissal as vice-president happened following events at a political rally on 5 November in which the first lady, Grace Mugabe, publicly accused him of dividing the ZANU–PF by attempting to overthrow the president with the support of the army.

http://www.janes.com/article/75703/...o-ousted-vice-president-following-palace-coup
 
n Harare, uncertainty and optimism after army takeover
by Enock Muchinjo
13 hours ago

Harare, Zimbabwe - The capital of Zimbabwefinds itself caught between hope and uncertainty as it dawns on residents that after 37 tumultuous years Robert Mugabe may no longer be ruling the country.

The mood is a major shift considering that people here usually avoid discussing sensitive political matters in public, wary of attracting the attention of authorities with little tolerance for dissent.

But after the discontent of recent years, the military's surprise takeover on Wednesday appeared to give a new impetus to free speech on the streets of Harare.

"If this comes to pass, we will regard this in the future as a 'second Independence Day', after that of April 18, 1980," said Tineyi Chimwanda, who identified himself as a local businessman.

"This is how it feels."

'Pleasing development'
In power since 1980, Mugabe, 93, led Zimbabwe's fight for independence in the 1970s.

However, he has frequently faced accusations of political repression and economic mismanagement, and many Zimbabweans - especially the urban population - blame him for a long litany of woes, including rampant unemployment, widespread poverty and acute cash shortage.

Zimbabwe tensions: Military seizes power, denies coup


In the early hours of Wednesday, the Zimbabwean army, which has previously been used as a way to suppress the opposition, placed the president under "house arrest".

A broadcast by military spokesman Sibusiso Moyo, announcing the army's seizure of power, was repeatedly aired on the Zimbabwe Broadcasting Corporation's sole TV channel - for years a mouthpiece of Mugabe and his close associates.

Moyo's speech was cheered by a group of restaurant customers during lunch time in central Harare.

The military denies it is staging a coup, saying its move is meant only to deal with "criminals" within Mugabe's circles.

The president and his family, the army said, were "safe and sound".

The statement, however, is being seen as a careful attempt by the military to keep a lid on potential unrest and ensure a bloodless transition from Mugabe's rule.

The few who reported for duty on Wednesday followed the proceedings via the state TV channel from their workplaces and from bars.

"As a junior intelligence officer, I can tell you most us are pleased by this development," said a member of the Central Intelligence Organisation, Zimbabwe's dreaded spy agency.

"Only the senior guys, our bosses, who benefit from the oppressive system, will not be happy with this."

Uncertain future
The army's intervention is believed to have been prompted by the sacking of Emmerson Mnangagwa, a war veteran, as vice president.

His dismissal came after months of a power struggle within Mugabe's ruling ZANU-PF party over the issue of a successor.

On Monday, army commander Constantine Chiwenga gave warning that the military would not "hesitate to step in" if what he called the purge of former independence war fighters at ZANU-PF continued.

Mnangagwa, an ally of Chiwenga, leads a party faction that is at loggerheads with another led by Mugabe's wife, Grace, and some younger members of the party.

Speculation is that Mnagangwa, who fled from Zimbabwe after his sacking, will return home to lead a transitional government following Wednesday's events.

As the day wore on, residents of Harare could be heard discussing the sudden turn of events with excitement and anticipation.

Few, though, were ready to view the developments as "the end of Mugabe".

"End of Mugabe? No, hard to believe. Too good to be true," said Daniel Mkwananzi, an accountant.

"I feel the old man will fulfil his ambition of dying in office."

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2017/11/harare-uncertainty-optimism-army-takeover-171115153905144.html
 
Have Mugabe's own words come back to haunt him?
by Percy Zvomuya
30 minutes ago
2238cbdc417a4830a6a352209d05db72_18.jpg

Robert Mugabe and Zimbabwe President Canaan Banana attend the ceremony for the independence of Zimbabwe, 18 April 1980 [William Campbell/Sygma/Getty Images]
PRESIDENT ROBERT MUGABE
- Born on February 21, 1924
- Came to power when Zimbabwe won independence from Britain in 1980
- Spent 37 years in power
- Married Grace Mugabe in 1996

In 1976, when Robert Mugabe was still an unknown guerilla leader in much of Europe, he gave a rousing speech in Geneva which gave theoretical coherence to chimurenga, Shona for revolutionary struggle, which as the head of the Zanu-PF's liberation movement he was spearheading.

"Our votes must go together with our guns. After all, any vote we shall have shall have been the product of the gun. The gun which produces the vote should remain its security officer - its guarantor. The people's votes and the people's guns are always inseparable twins," he said.

Four decades later, the 1976 speech has now acquired the rings of a prophecy.

This after a silent coup which started with a grumbling statement on Monday by Zimbabwe Defence Forces head General Constantino Chiwenga announcing the army's displeasure at the purges in the ruling party and country - which had resulted in Emmerson Mnangagwa, vice president and heir apparent, being fired last week - and which escalated on Wednesday with army tanks parked on key Harare streets and buildings, culminating with Mugabe's house arrest at his palace.

In the final analysis, as it became clear Mugabe was unwilling to hand over power to another gun toting veteran of that war in favour of his wife Grace, it was the army that decided to pull out guns from the national armoury to become the arbiter of the bitter succession fight.

The struggle to succeed the 94-year-old president had on side Grace Mugabe, an ambitious woman who had been plucked in the 1980s from the anonymity of the presidential typing pool to become first lady, and her faction against Emmerson Mnangagwa, a battle-hardened politician who was in prison with Mugabe in the 1960s and who in the 1970s became his personal assistant.

Naturally, when the army had to choose who would succeed Mugabe, it was Mnangagwa they opted for even though he never saw active combat in the 1970s war which forced Ian Smith to go to Lancaster House to negotiate Southern Rhodesia - now Zimbabwe - independence from Britain which came in 1980.

Why Mugabe, a suave political operator, theorist and survivor, had not seen how his words from the 1970s would come back to gnaw at him is a question that will occupy historians and political scientists for a long time to come.

ae3382f983f040b6bd9706fd3383c874_18.jpg

Mugabe listens to his wife Grace at a rally of his ruling ZANU-PF party [Philimon Bulawayo/Reuters]

Maybe it was the overweening influence of his wife Grace, born in 1965, to whom, as an old man of 94, he was increasingly reliant for his daily needs.

Maybe it was his dependence on Jonathan Moyo, a Rasputian political science scholar who turned from Mugabe's biggest critic in the 1990s into his arch-apologist and information tzar - he is accused by his enemies of saying the only way to destroy Zanu-PF is from within the party itself.

By turning to his wife Grace and to people like Jonathan Moyo, who was in Zanu-PF's guerilla camps of Tanzania for a while before he left for his studies in the United States and which act is interpreted by his enemies in the army as desertion), Mugabe forgot the compact of the vote and the gun which he eloquently spoken about then.

But, as in the statement by Chiwenga, Mugabe the person had become a liability to the military-nationalist-patriarchy project for the war veterans of that struggle to rule forever.

The country barely functions: most of what Zimbabwe uses, including milk, is imported; for over a year the country has been experiencing cash shortages because of a big import bill; unemployment is endemic and, as a result, millions of young Zimbabweans have crossed the border into South Africa, Botswana and other neighbouring countries to work in most cases as undocumented migrants.

As you and I are able to judge, the people no longer appreciate empty slogans and hollow speeches. They want us to talk about things that are meant to improve or sustain lives
PRESIDENT ROBERT MUGABE, 1992

In 1992, a senior official from the ruling Zanu-PF said: "As you and I are able to judge, the people no longer appreciate empty slogans and hollow speeches. They want us to talk about things that are meant to improve or sustain lives."

The official who said this is Mugabe and yet in his autumn years, so nonchalant and removed was the man from what ailed the average Zimbabwean. He continued to live as if Zimbabwe was the second most important regional economic powerhouse after South Africa that it was back in the 1980s and 1990s.

He never missed a chance to fly to any conference - including to conferences on oceans, an absurdity for a land-locked country - to which he was invited.

Zimbabwe crisis: What factors led to military intervention?

The most recent egregious instance of this was in September when the Zimbabwean delegation to the United Nations conference had around 70 people and included people who had no government business being in New York, including his daughter Bona and her husband, Mugabe's playboy son Chatunga and other hangers on who are paid daily allowances from the dwindling coffers of a state which every month struggles to pay its workers.

"There are some who from day to day get into the office, take off their jackets, take a piece of paper, perhaps write one or two things, take a newspaper and start reading. When they put their jackets down, it's tea time. I am not satisfied that everyone is doing a good [day]'s work," Mugabe said in 1992.

Mnangagwa: A savvy political operator resented by Mugabe
Mugabe had become that person who was anathema to him back then. He was always travelling abroad and had a laissez-faire approach to the business of governing and was perpetually fanning factional fights in Zanu-PF to perpetuate his rule.

Mnangagwa, a business savvy political operator, realised that Zimbabwe's endless isolation was unsustainable and costing the country, after all, Zimbabwe isn't the only country in the world with diamonds, gold and other natural resources.

"You cannot say there are areas of our economy which we are happy with, infrastructure we are behind by 15 to 16 years, agricultural development the same, manufacturing; in fact capacity utilisation in some areas of our industry is down to 20 percent, so again, we have to retool by acquiring new machinery, technology and machinery so that we are competitive," he told a reporter while on a visit to China in 2015. "We have to see how we can create an investment environment which will attract the flow of capital. We must know that investment can only go where it makes a return so we must make sure we create an environment where investors are happy to put their money because there is a return."

8f2b62f891d7402487d0676698236ba9_18.jpg

Mugabe looks on as Mnangagwa reads a card during Mugabe's 93rd birthday celebrations in Harare, Zimbabwe, February 21 [Philimon Bulawayo/Reuters]
For trying to reach out to the Chinese, the British and the international community, he earned Mugabe's resentment.

Mnangagwa had become a danger to Mugabe, who in Shona fits the noun "mbimbindoga", that person who stays on his own, fetishes the self and relies only on his counsel. Mugabe wanted his endless autumn of the patriarch to continue uninterrupted.

Russian poet Joseph Brodsky wrote, "the average length of a good tyranny is a decade and half, two decades at most. When it's more than that, it inevitably slips into a monstrosity."

It's not a surprise that it was ultimately the gun which Mugabe had spoken so approvingly of in 1976 which, ultimately, intervened to stop Mugabe's 37-year reign that had turned into a monstrosity from continuing any further.

http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/features/2017/11/mugabe-words-haunt-171116080432427.html
 

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