Wish we could have been a Federation as originally envisioned by Jinnah

[third eye]

I blame Nehru for this issue. Cabinet Mission plan is a long off, even as late as 1954, Liaquat Ali Khan had proposed a 'Joint Defence Pact' whereby Pakistan and India would have a single standing army, with the option to gradually transfer foreign relations, communications, banking and other important concerns to a joint central committee at Delhi. Nehru kept beating around the bush and avoided the issue, eventually it just became another idea.

There's a saying in our part of the world that says ' all that happens is for the better'.

With the benefit of hindsight, would this have worked ?

There no point in dividing a house amongst brothers / sons / siblings and having a common kitchen - the problem will remain.

I think what Nehru did ( if indeed he so did) was "for the better".

 

[Kambojaric]

No a federation would not suucceed. Eventually Hindus from India proper would start moving into Pakistan and the majorities that Muslims had in several areas would start disapearing. If at that point tensions between Muslims and Hindus rose again the violence would be even worse than before. Not only would this have been bad for the Muslims of the northwest but also for New Delhi as this would destablize the country and the violence would then spread to other parts of the country and seperatists in other parts of the country might be encouraged to step up their rebellions/wars of independence as well. So no at the end of the day partition was the best thing for both India and Pakistan.

 

[Splurgenxs]

Forming a federation again, especially after all that has happened in the last 63 years. Majority of Indians and Pakistanis would be against such a resolution. Most Indians and Pakistanis think of themselves as different nations, and thats how it will stay. I consider myself to be a pretty level-minded and liberal person in my late teens, but would be against any federation of Indo-Pak.

Its a shame how history has gone down between the two nations, but really too much has happened. To put it bluntly, India and Pakistan are like boyfriend/girlfriend, that broke up, went around assaulting each other, sleeping around with other people, etc. Simply too much has happened.

The best case scenario is India and Pakistan would be neutral towards one another, kind of like India and South Africa, and focus on the development of their respective nations.

Equating it to a boyfriend and girlfriend is a very simplistic terminology.

Is it possible??
ARMY which indirectly rules a country, will it allow to let it happen??
Without a HARDCORE ENEMY to fight will they have significance in public??
If Cross Border Hate Bussiness stops will not public start paying attention to Inhouse-mess going on due to bad administration??

I am afraid that Zia is still alive in minds of PA, his islamization & undoing of Jinnah's effect is going to survive till many decades to come. So I dont think its a possibility in reality.

ill try to answer both in one reply clearly. Every mass of civilization across the globe suffers from sort of a memory loss when it comes to most non personal situations.

Without propaganda one cannot expect them to remember what it is to hate. this either happens by promoting positivity with regards to the target nation ...or.... a certain generation of people are allowed to die out.

When we take large populations in consideration we canot affort to be petty or think as if somethings are just an impossibility ..i find it extremely naive..sure if u want to make a statement to get some browny points or to put ur point across it fine.But realism and politic dictate otherwise.Nothing should be and impossibility.

 

[ice_man]

whatever happened happened for the BEST. and looking at the posts by some indians it clearly shows that Jinnah was right Hindus wanted to walk all over the muslims

 

[DRaisinHerald]

Lol; who's the culprit for this horrible thread? You need to sort out your way of thinking big time.
Federation with Hindus? Not in a thousand years.

 

[Splurgenxs]

I blame Nehru for this issue. Cabinet Mission plan is a long off, even as late as 1954, Liaquat Ali Khan had proposed a 'Joint Defence Pact' whereby Pakistan and India would have a single standing army, with the option to gradually transfer foreign relations, communications, banking and other important concerns to a joint central committee at Delhi. Nehru kept beating around the bush and avoided the issue, eventually it just became another idea.

Nehru was not the only one to blame....give he was power hungry and did not want to share his power as most of the Muslims preferred Congress over Jinnah.

Nehru was an idealist and wanted India to start his way but the power play at that time wanted his powers somewhat diluted and even Gandhi(being the ultra liberal that he was) went ahead with agreeing to Muslim demands..

IF the Ideas of Muslims and Hindus cant live together ,wasn't seeded by the then Muslim ruling politicos we wouldn't have had such divergent opinions (even if it were forced down throats) India did something Pakistan did the opposite(regarding welfare decisions). India exploited this weakness alot.

 

[OrionHunter]

Yes we can take over indian territory to merge with Pakistan to provide the suppressed casts and religions the freedom of thought and expressin that we Pakistanis enjoy.

Really? Then you just need to Google 'minorities in Pakistan' and the endless Shia-Sunni wars!

Wake up and smell the coffee. Stop living in a world of make-believe!

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

If Pakistan wasnt forum i would have prefered a seperate country BALUCHISTAN with iranian Sistan Baluchistan and afghan controlled baluch areas as a part of not....... not a part of india.


OP u need to lay off those drugs buddy... coz if the so called Pak-India federation was formed... there would be no Khyber Pakhtunkhwa or Baluchistan or even Gilgit balistan in it... probably not even majority of muslim areas of punjab,sindh or even Kashmir... ask ur grandfather how hindus treated muslims....? like untouchables... ask the kashmiris how dogras harrassed them... Although sindh with its muslim "waderas" probably were in a better position.


I want Jinnahs Pak... the federation of Kashmir,Whole of bengal (including calcutta and assam) Junagarh,mavadar,hyderabad,sindh,Gilgit baltistan,punjab(including muslim cities and towns like gurdaspur etc),KPK and baluchistan (includin Sistan)...

 

[IND151]

Very stupid thought, who talks about losing his identity? and confederation with hindus? You must be a flase flagger, A Pakitani can never think along these lines. Yes we can take over indian territory to merge with Pakistan to provide the suppressed casts and religions the freedom of thought and expressin that we Pakistanis enjoy. Pakistan Zindabad.

but one's little understanding of internal situation of Pakistan and its social fabric along with policies suggests otherwise

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

Really? Then you just need to Google 'minorities in Pakistan' and the endless Shia-Sunni wars!

Wake up and smell the coffee. Stop living in a world of make-believe!

Half of my family is shia...half sunni... we have a shia president... a sunni PM... we had several shia Presidents and PMs... like Zulfiqar ali bhutti,Benzair bhutto,Musharaf,Zardari etc...

Unlike you we dont kill people for being low caste or muslims... sunshine... wake up.

 

[IND151]

Well, the Cabinet Mission Plan only cared about the well-being of Muslims, not Indians and hence was rightly rejected. It said that 35% of all Govt jobs, administrative positions, political seats would go to Muslims in each state, even states like Himachal and North East states which barely had less than 5% Muslims. You dont get jobs and political positions because of your religion, you get them because you are educated and have the ability.

It wasnt a Congress mistake, it was a move most logical people regardless of religion would support. Your Sindh province has 5 to 7% Hindus, would you support a resolution which states that 35% of all Govt jobs, administrative positions and political seats will go to Hindus in Sindh today? Hindus and non-Muslims in general have always been a minority in places like Balochistan and FATA(even before partition in British India), did they make such claims of reservation?

Anyways, both nations have gone their separate ways since and its better to focus on our own development as nation.

i agree

congress did right by rejecting Cabinet Mission Plan

 

[Splurgenxs]

If Pakistan wasnt forum i would have prefered a seperate country BALUCHISTAN with iranian Sistan Baluchistan and afghan controlled baluch areas as a part of not....... not a part of india.


OP u need to lay off those drugs buddy... coz if the so called Pak-India federation was formed... there would be no Khyber Pakhtunkhwa or Baluchistan or even Gilgit balistan in it... probably not even majority of muslim areas of punjab,sindh or even Kashmir... ask ur grandfather how hindus treated muslims....? like untouchables... ask the kashmiris how dogras harrassed them... Although sindh with its muslim "waderas" probably were in a better position.


I want Jinnahs Pak... the federation of Kashmir,Whole of bengal (including calcutta and assam) Junagarh,mavadar,hyderabad,sindh,Gilgit baltistan,punjab(including muslim cities and towns like gurdaspur etc),KPK and baluchistan (includin Sistan)...

And u people need to lay off the lube tube...

And when will Pakistani people start thinking about things beyond there own personal fetishes.

 

[indian_jigar]

Half of my family is shia...half sunni... we have a shia president... a sunni PM... we had several shia Presidents and PMs... like Zulfiqar ali bhutti,Benzair bhutto,Musharaf,Zardari etc...

Unlike you we dont kill people for being low caste or muslims... sunshine... wake up.

If thats going to be your logic, then no discrimination exists in India as well. There are plenty of mixed interreligious couples, whether Hindu-Muslim, Sikh-Christian, Hindu-Christian, Sikh-Muslim etc.

Also, we have had several non-Hindu Presidents and Prime Ministers.

Lol; who's the culprit for this horrible thread? You need to sort out your way of thinking big time.
Federation with Hindus? Not in a thousand years.

You guys seem to have no problem having a federation with Atheists (China) who openly claim there is no God

 

[ares]

well i don't know what your HINDI text books teach you but to us it is simply this:


(i) There was to be a federation of the provinces and the States, with the federal central controlling only defence, foreign affairs and communications.

(ii) At the same time, individual provinces could form regional unions to which they could surrender by mutual agreement some of their powers.

(iii) There would be three groups of provinces (i) Group 'A' was to include Madras, Bombay, U.P., Bihar, Central Province and Orissa (ii) Group 'B* was to comprise Punjab, Sindh, N.W.F.P. and British Baluchistan (Muslim majority in most of the areas) (Hi) Group 'C' was to include Bengal and Assam.

These groups would draft their own constitutions in consultation with their respective provinces included in each group.

(iv) A Constituent Assembly consisting of 389 members-292 from provinces, 4 from territories governed by Chief Commissioners and 93 from Indian Princely States would draft the Constitution of India.

(v) An interim government at the Central consisting of representatives of all the communities, provinces would be installed on the basis of parity between the representatives of the Hindus and Muslims.

1. Provisions of the CMP are not taught in schools, would not find school text books(Hindi or Urdu)..most of the information is only available on web sites, like the one you copy-pasted your information from.
Main Provisions of the Cabinet Mission Plan

2. First and fore most flaw in the plan(incidentally information that is not mentioned in the article you pasted) was "Separate electorates for Muslims"
ie. Muslim voters will only vote for Muslim candidates.
Now do tell, why would some one opt for such an obvious idiocracy...where a voter is forced to choose his representative based on his religion.

3.Second flaw in the plan, was dissolution of power..instead of having..one strong center ..you create multiple power centers..resulting in pure chaos in the country..few years later each state power center asking for autonomy..more resources and finally independence.

nothing wrong here. as for sikhs,christians they would have enjoyed a level of freedom as they do now. The muslims being the LARGEST minority would have been equal.

ideal utopia gone wrong thanks to NEHRU!


but do tell me what they teach you as the main flaws of the plan?

And do tell why should Muslims be give preferential treatment and not Sikhs and Christians?? Why should rules of democracy be bent to appease Muslims?


Finally also do tell..if CMP was such an "ideal Utopia" ..why didn't the newly independent state of Pakistan implement its provisions in its own country??

You guys are only good for demanding more rights, more power when you are minority and not giving them, when you are in Majority?..Why weren't separate electorates created for Pakistani minorities?

Why wasn't there dissolution of power b/w East and West Pakistan..why was there a single power center(West Pakistan) in your country after Independence?

 

[Pakistanisage]

I would rather have a closer relationship with China, Iran, Turkey, Indonesia - than india, just stating it, no hate involved.

But Rafi Bhai, Don't you think HATE begets HATE.

Are we really that different. We all wanted the same things for our communities.

If only our leaders could find a middle ground so millions of lives could have been saved.

Look at what Pakistan and India manage to pull off while at each others throats....now imagine what they would do working in tandem....blows your mind! I hate conspiracy theories...it assumes politicos know what the heck they are doing...but I wouldn't be suprised if the west (Britain and America) incouraged the muslim-hindu animosity to keep the region from being a real player.

(a caveat...it could be the animosity that drives them to inovate...we will never know...)

You are onto something here Juice. BTW, there was a revolt in 1857 against the British in the British Army by the Indian soldiers of all colour and creed. Muslims and Hindus fought shoulder to shoulder against the British.

Infact that bonhomie was the common occurence till the issue of Pakistan was raised in the 1930's because the leaders failed to find the common ground. The rest as they say is history.