Why Pashtunwali when Islam is there?

[farhan_9909]

Well Pre Islam Pashto was considered as the religion of pashtuns.

If you still go to FATA or the adjacent places.you would find that Many local pashtun would say

Pa pashto me dey kasam wee

They considered sometime pashto above or at par with religion.

Pashtunwali is necessary.as it define our culture and language.

 

[Menace2Society]

They have beautiful traditions and customs, such culture.

Why would anyone not want that.

My only wish is those areas become peaceful so I can visit my Pashtun brothers and take in the scenery and culture.

 

[livingdead]

I want to ask this question primarily from Pukhtun members that as we know that Islam is not just a religion consisting of rituals but a complete code of life which guides us in every matter and sphere of life whether social, economic, political etc but as we know that in traditional Pukhtun society Pashtunwali is given great importance and following and honouring Pashtunwali is expected from every self respecting Pukhtun but what i dont understand is that in a society like Pukhtuns where Jumat and Mula are such an important part of Pukhtun culture and social fabric why isn't Islamic law and Shariah are applied and followed in resolving disputes in Jirga and also on individual level rather than Pashtunwali because Islamic law and Shariah are supreme and supersedes every riwaj, tradition, custom etc.

I mean to say that why just the need arises to follow Pashtunwali in first place when Islamic law and Shariah are there?

islam has quite a bit of arabic way of life during that period and cultural practice embedded in it, most muslims try to adopt it to their own cultural ways and are quite at peace with themselves, till puritans came and asked why not follow 'completely'. This has caused a bit of friction.

 

[cleverrider]

"
My personal opinion is this -
You won't find the answers in organized religion. You will need to dive into spiritualism. It is a leap of faith. And it is a tough one. No offense meant to anyone.

Yes i do Get you, there seem to have no answer for it. However you know if you do that then you brain/mind is influenced. Its like Studying science and you will believe more in what science say.

I would like to remain on the point where i am in middle, & in the future go with whatever seems logical/valid/true and so on.

 

[SarthakGanguly]

True. Ultimately you need to find your way and find peace in it. Best wishes.

Yes i do Get you, there seem to have no answer for it. However you know if you do that then you brain/mind is influenced. Its like Studying science and you will believe more in what science say.

I will like to remain on the point where i am in middle, & in the future go with whatever seems logical/valid/true and so on.

 

[livingdead]

Sanga YE!

Can you answer my 2 Questions above/ask someone or there is no answer to it? Because its really bothering me & no one seem to have an answer for it.

I would invite resident experts on this subject @Zarvan @Armstrong and @Slav Defence ... they might have answer..

 

[cleverrider]

True. Ultimately you need to find your way and find peace in it. Best wishes.

Cheers mate.

Let me share some examples about what i mean by influenced mind/engineered brain. Recently went to Pakistan & my cousin started arguing with me about war between Pakistan & India. I said to him if Pakistan and India fight a war without nuclear weapons Pakistan will lose if not days then in matter of weeks. IF they use nuclear weapons there will be no winners. (He in the final year of engineering within Pak army). He said No we will Win and i told him we cant, told me the facts and figures and you know what he said after, we are muslims, we got Allah on our side! (coming from a 21 year old). To make him understand in his language i went to him ok in india there are 20 crore Muslims so i think allah will listen to them more! & he was still arguing.

other example.

Look what Pakistan army has done to this country from the start (not letting go of power from the start) (installing/keeping corrupt politicians in power so they can control them) list goes on & majority still support the army.

its always that 1% that controls the country through force, through money, through demcracy.

coming back to religion, there is a good point that i would like to make. The goal is to control a bunch of people, back in the days it was through religion, now through democracy/dictatorship and so on. (because we are animals). Now democracy do work to some extent & not sure what it will be in the future.

 

[notsuperstitious]

@cleverrider thanks for some rationality on the forum. I'm tired of people mixing real world issues with fairytales and then obviously failing and then blaming themselves for not reading - following the fairytales properly enough.

 

[pak-marine]

@ unitedstatesofislam Why Bangladesh when Islam was there?

 

[Shardul.....the lion]

why Turkey, Saudi Arabia and Iran or Pakistan, when islam was there?

even in earlier ages there were mughals, nizams, sultans were independent even though they followed islam..

Because culture is important part of life.

Germans and English, both were christian countries yet killed millions of each other

 

[v9s]

IF allah knows everything & he also knows who is going hell and heaven. No point sending us here?

Don't give me the Zakir naik answer. That God give you an option of choosing the right path and the wrong path, its up to you! BUT allah Knows what path that specific person gonna choose from the start and he is going hell so why send him here?

Life's a test. Say you're a student of aeronautical engineering, and you claim to your teacher you can build a plane.
The best way to test this claim would be to actually let you build the plane, even if the teacher has a fair idea of what the outcome will be, wouldn't you agree?

 

[Slav Defence]

Yes i do Get you, there seem to have no answer for it. However you know if you do that then you brain/mind is influenced. Its like Studying science and you will believe more in what science say.

I would like to remain on the point where i am in middle, & in the future go with whatever seems logical/valid/true and so on.

There is a false concept that if you have accepted Islam then you will loose your cultural values completely,or it is necessary for you to wear jabba and ammama after accepting Islam,Islam will not snatch away your culture from you but it will modified it to some extent.
For Example,If a tribe wears half cloths then after Islam,their culture will be modified to such a way that they will wear full cloths.Islam increases decency and beauty to a nation's culture.

 

[unitedstatesofislam]

Pashtun Wali is an ancient Pashtoon practice and if they are willing to practice this code, its their free choice and democratic right to do so. Islam doesn't come in conflict with Pashtun Wali, all blocks of Pashtun Wali were altered over the years to meet Islamic Theology.... Not that it is perfectly practiced, that is a different topic.

@Pak-one; @farhan_9909

But what about honour killings which are haram and would be seen as unlawful murder of an innocent human being as per islamic shariah. Are honour killings legitimate as per Pashtunwali? If a someone's female relation is romantically involved with some one what would Pashtunwali demand in such a situation? Wouldn't that be dead penalty and if so isn't this in conflict with islamic law?

 

[cleverrider]

Life's a test. Say you're a student of aeronautical engineering, and you claim to your teacher you can build a plane.
The best way to test this claim would be to actually let you build the plane, even if the teacher has a fair idea of what the outcome will be, wouldn't you agree?

Firstly your example is far off, secondly you cant have any example or compare when it comes to this because you're talking about god here. You either have answer for this or you dont.

There is a false concept that if you have accepted Islam then you will loose your cultural values completely,or it is necessary for you to wear jabba and ammama after accepting Islam,Islam will not snatch away your culture from you but it will modified it to some extent.
For Example,If a tribe wears half cloths then after Islam,their culture will be modified to such a way that they will wear full cloths.Islam increases decency and beauty to a nation's culture.

Yeah you made some points

but not close to what i asked about

 

[unitedstatesofislam]

@Pak-one sahab; @Aeronaut; @farhan_9909

If a Pukhtoon discovers that a particular person is carrying a liaison with any female of his house, then he neither spares the life of the female nor that of her seducer. This is called Tor in Pashto

Besides adultery, death penalty is also prescribed for elopement which also falls under the purview of Tor. In cases of Tor murder is not accounted for and the woman relatives are justified by the tribal law to kill their female relation as well as her paramour

Sir aren't these two customs clearly in conflict with Islam. We all know that Islam prescribes death penalty ie rajam or stoning for adultery but if and only if the adulterer is married and 4 reliable eye witnesses are presented by the claimant otherwise the claimant would be liable to qazaf punishment ie lashes. Now how is the above compatible with Islam as no such pre-conditions are required by Pashtunwali before carrying out the punishment. Please explain?