Why Pakistan should be wary of IAF's MiG-29UPG deployment

[HalfMoon]

Oh how the mighty have fallen....Indians used to slate pakistanis for buying 2nd hand birds and now all the talk is 2nd hand migs and Mirages is a good thing for IAF...bloody hypocrites

This is due to the possibility of Rafale & MMRCA deals getting cancelled post Indian elections in May-2019.

 

[Chanakyaa]

Lol, In the hands of Indian pilots, if anything, it should be the Indian public that should be worried.
BTW, when was the last time the IAF even delivered.

Ask the mujahdeens and PA men targeted by LGBs in kargil. It was IAF that actually made that win possible.

https://www.rbth.com/blogs/stranger...-dominated-the-skies-during-kargil-war_615175

 

[YeBeWarned]

What Pakistan need worry is huge numbers of Su-30's , Rafale , and S-400 ..

 

[Raider 21]

Definitely. Considering the falling squadrons, adding 2 squadrons to the mix is pretty good.



The situation is not the same.

We are buying new aircraft through multiple programs and we need band-aid solutions in the meantime.

We have the ongoing MKI program. We have three LCA programs, Mk1, Mk1A and Mk2. Then we have the MMRCA tender. And we have a next gen program, AMCA. Apart from that we have the option of picking up FGFA again. The navy also has a new MRCBF program. And we are planning on getting 100-200 UCAVs and 200-300 attack helicopters. Even with all of these, we are still in need of more aircraft. Not the same situation at all.

Great aircraft programs. But the IAF is known for logistical issues. This is not that it is hate from here, I have respect for the IAF.......but have heard numerous stories from contractors who were posted on aircraft programs with the IAF.

This is due to the possibility of Rafale & MMRCA deals getting cancelled post Indian elections in May-2019.

Rafale is a fantastic aircraft by selection, unit price is expensive but maintenance is great and its capabilities are superb. What is happening behind closed doors with the deal sounds like a fiasco.

 

[Windjammer]

Ask the mujahdeens and PA men targeted by LGBs in kargil. It was IAF that actually made that win possible.

https://www.rbth.com/blogs/stranger...-dominated-the-skies-during-kargil-war_615175

Big deal, doing limited operation on a designated area within own side of the border with no air opposition or any real threat of ground fire. When the real test came, the nerves rattled.

 

[CHACHA"G"]

ooooooooooooo come onnnnnnnnnnnn ,,,,,,,,,, Pakistan worry this , Pakistan should worry that...…………………… Give me a break bhartis ………. Why we worry about any thing bharat do ?????????????????

 

[Raider 21]

The cost of converting the MiG-29 to the MiG-29UPG is said to be $15 million each while new Su-30mki costs $65 million, new MiG-35 more than $50 mn. Why don't we buy more old MiG-29s from other countries and upgrade them?

Pakistan does not worry like the Indian government does. Over 300 fighter jets....Rafales, 250 Su-30MKIs, MiG-29s, Mirage 2000 upgrades....nobody bats an eye. Pakistan sets eyes to third hand F-16s from Jordan or 8 brand new F-16 Block 52+ jets.....Indian government loses their minds.....

 

[Daghalodi]

Pakistan does not worry like the Indian government does. Over 300 fighter jets....Rafales, 250 Su-30MKIs, MiG-29s, Mirage 2000 upgrades....nobody bats an eye. Pakistan sets eyes to third hand F-16s from Jordan or 8 brand new F-16 Block 52+ jets.....Indian government loses their minds.....

This is a disease called "pakistanphobia" and all indians are infected with this disease to the core.

 

[HalfMoon]

Rafale is a fantastic aircraft by selection, unit price is expensive but maintenance is great and its capabilities are superb. What is happening behind closed doors with the deal sounds like a fiasco.

Bofors was also fantastic but that deal got curtailed due to corruption charges and politics. Unfortunately, Rafale is following Bofors' foot steps. My guess is not a single Rafale would be inducted by IAF. The deal would be scrapped once the new government is in place.

Pakistan does not worry like the Indian government does. Over 300 fighter jets....Rafales, 250 Su-30MKIs, MiG-29s, Mirage 2000 upgrades....nobody bats an eye. Pakistan sets eyes to third hand F-16s from Jordan or 8 brand new F-16 Block 52+ jets.....Indian government loses their minds.....

This is a disease called "pakistanphobia" and all indians are infected with this disease to the core.

That's because India has to worry about two front war while Pakistan only has one fro

Indian procurement is not even keeping up with the requirements to fight a defensive war on two fronts. The less we talk about the Indian offensive preparedness the better.

 

[Mrc]

I think i will have to spill the beans tonight...



Actually ... No one gives a flying fck on this side of the border

 

[Chanakyaa]

Big deal, doing limited operation on a designated area within own side of the border with no air opposition or any real threat of ground fire. When the real test came, the nerves rattled.

Its LOC. I dont wanaa continue with a kid you runs away each time I ask for proof.

First tell me where is the proof that S400 are comoromised , then I will explain this one as well, else its a waste of my time.

 

[Raider 21]

Bofors was also fantastic but that deal got curtailed due to corruption charges and politics. Unfortunately, Rafale is following Bofors' foot steps. My guess is not a single Rafale would be inducted by IAF. The deal would be scrapped once the new government is in place.





That's because India has to worry about two front war while Pakistan only has one fro

Indian procurement is not even keeping up with the requirements to fight a defensive war on two fronts. The less we talk about the Indian offensive preparedness the better.

Pakistan as well.

Cheers !!!

 

[randomradio]

Great aircraft programs. But the IAF is known for logistical issues. This is not that it is hate from here, I have respect for the IAF.......but have heard numerous stories from contractors who were posted on aircraft programs with the IAF.

The Gagan Shakti exercise went well though. More than 80% availability across the entire fleet. And obviously bound to improve over the next 5 years when the Migs leave service and the Russians set up production centres for the MKI's spares. So the loose ends are being tied up.

Back in 2017, India and Russia reached an agreement which allowed HAL to directly import spares from the manufacturers instead of going to RBE. This has allowed HAL to negotiate for long term agreements to create a spares hub. This is happening for the first time in Soviet-Russia history. Earlier, you could buy only a year's worth of spares and there was a waiting period of 1 year to get through RBE's bureaucracy, which was the primary cause of low availability of Russian aircraft worldwide. So you can expect the availability of Russian aircraft in IAF's inventory to improve significantly.

What is happening behind closed doors with the deal sounds like a fiasco.

It's just pre-election noise, I wouldn't pay much mind to it. Even the Congress knows nothing's wrong with the deal. The CAG report that will be released will clear a lot of things, and the Supreme Court has already thrown out all the frivolous PILs.

Even if RaGa comes to power, he will likely order 36 more Rafales without the need for customisation and basing requirement, which will reduce the cost by $2B+. The govt's bought infrastructure for 80+ Rafales and customisation is a one-time payment, so there's no need to repeat the same. He is free to sell that as a victory to the public.

Pakistan sets eyes to third hand F-16s from Jordan or 8 brand new F-16 Block 52+ jets.....Indian government loses their minds.....

It's because we didn't want someone else to subsidise Pakistani military's modernisation.

India's argument was to allow Pakistan to buy the F-16s using their own funds, while spending the CSF and military aid money on stuff that's actually required to fight the TTP rather than propping up Pakistan's ability to fight India. Pretty fair.

For example, India wouldn't have complained if the money was used to buy weaponised LIFTs for Pakistan to fight the TTP instead of the F-16s.

 

[Raider 21]

The Gagan Shakti exercise went well though. More than 80% availability across the entire fleet. And obviously bound to improve over the next 5 years when the Migs leave service and the Russians set up production centres for the MKI's spares. So the loose ends are being tied up.

Back in 2017, India and Russia reached an agreement which allowed HAL to directly import spares from the manufacturers instead of going to RBE. This has allowed HAL to negotiate for long term agreements to create a spares hub. This is happening for the first time in Soviet-Russia history. Earlier, you could buy only a year's worth of spares and there was a waiting period of 1 year to get through RBE's bureaucracy, which was the primary cause of low availability of Russian aircraft worldwide. So you can expect the availability of Russian aircraft in IAF's inventory to improve significantly.



It's just pre-election noise, I wouldn't pay much mind to it. Even the Congress knows nothing's wrong with the deal. The CAG report that will be released will clear a lot of things, and the Supreme Court has already thrown out all the frivolous PILs.

Even if RaGa comes to power, he will likely order 36 more Rafales without the need for customisation and basing requirement, which will reduce the cost by $2B+. The govt's bought infrastructure for 80+ Rafales and customisation is a one-time payment, so there's no need to repeat the same. He is free to sell that as a victory to the public.



It's because we didn't want someone else to subsidise Pakistani military's modernisation.

India's argument was to allow Pakistan to buy the F-16s using their own funds, while spending the CSF and military aid money on stuff that's actually required to fight the TTP rather than propping up Pakistan's ability to fight India. Pretty fair.

For example, India wouldn't have complained if the money was used to buy weaponised LIFTs for Pakistan to fight the TTP instead of the F-16s.

Good to know. I don't think India's argument for funds was an issue. Indian government should never dictate on what Pakistan armed forces should or should not do. They (Pakistan) have been fighting someone else's war for years and have been far more victimised than anybody else.

Cheers and ending it here.

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

This is a disease called "pakistanphobia" and all indians are infected with this disease to the core.

Once you have a thousand year history from the North you worry, get paranoid etc....