why china is so corrupt, I want to tell my own story about corruption

[livingdead]

Or would you bribe the linesman telling him to call the ball in when it is out so as to stay in the ball game?



not everyone acts like him! may be the things are worse in india!

Its difficult to compare, may be its worse in India, or may be its better.
I am more worried about the fact that few chinese members are criticizing op for bringing it up in an international forum.
Trying to suppress truth is a bigger disgrace.

 

[shuttler]

Its difficult to compare, may be its worse in India, or may be its better.
I am more worried about the fact that few chinese members are criticizing op for bringing it up in an international forum.
Trying to suppress truth is a bigger disgrace.

there is no suppression of similar cases whatsoever in China forums. Many incidences of grafts are exposed on the forums in China and actions immediately taken by the authority.

the case is not the same in india - all talks no action!

 

[itaskol]

the OP doesnt deserve to be in the buz if he needs paying bribes to survive！
he can still retain his customer and fulfill his order by airfreighting the goods
that's the “penalty” he should have paid properly for learning a lesson and be smarter next time around but definitely NOT committing a crime for the buz！

1.first of all, this kind of trouble happens not everytime. in my experience only once or twice in a year.
2.and customs officer usually dont ask directly for bribe, but if I want my goods released faster, I have to find some relation to pay bribes to them. if you dont have the "relation", you dont even have the chance to pay bribes.
3.you are talking airfreight？
for small shipment. yes. order can be fulfilled with airfreighting.
but some shipment are container shipment. In many cases the cargo weight more than 10 tons. the airfreight cost is huge.
4. "that's the “penalty” he should have paid properly for learning a lesson and be smarter next time around but definitely NOT committing a crime for the buz！" are you kidding me???

 

[shuttler]

1.first of all, this kind of trouble happens not everytime. in my experience only once or twice in a year.
2.and customs officer usually dont ask directly for bribe, but if I want my goods released faster, I have to find some relation to pay bribes to them. if you dont have the "relation", you dont even have the chance to pay bribes.
3.you are talking airfreight？
for small shipment. yes. order can be fulfilled with airfreighting.
but some shipment are container shipment. In many cases the cargo weight more than 10 tons. the airfreight cost is huge.
4. "that's the “penalty” he should have paid properly for learning a lesson and be smarter next time around but definitely NOT committing a crime for the buz！" are you kidding me???

that is how you handle your buz! not me! it seems way too sloppy and a crime is a crime!

 

[livingdead]

there is no suppression of similar cases whatsoever in China forums. Many incidences of grafts are exposed on the forums in China and actions immediately taken by the authority.

the case is not the same in india - all talks no action!

I was talking about some chinese member showing displeasure about the fact that op is telling this in an international forum.
I am not talking about govt here when I said about suppression, I am talking about members here.
Such is the eagerness to show china is all good.

And yes, slowly some of the corruption is coming out in the open ( i mean in high places, not lower level), going by your attitude, it seems more likely that many more are known and hidden.

In India too, there is a lot of corruption, but most Indian here (also pakistanis) will openly acknowledge it.

 

[shuttler]

I was talking about some chinese member showing displeasure about the fact that op is telling this in an international forum.
I am not talking about govt here when I said about suppression, I am talking about members here.
Such is the eagerness to show china is all good.

And yes, slowly some of the corruption is coming out in the open ( i mean in high places, not lower level), going by your attitude, it seems more likely that many more are known and hidden.

In India too, there is a lot of corruption, but most Indian here (also pakistanis) will openly acknowledge it.

wow where am I or are we denying there is corruption in China and telling the OP not to talk about it？ I only say he has no shame at all！

and in fact he is also a culprit fostering the proliferation of corruption in China！

 

[itaskol]

wow where am I or are we denying there is corruption in China and telling the OP not to talk about it？ I only say he has no shame at all！

and in fact he is also a culprit fostering the proliferation of corruption in China！

the thing that cause proliferation of corruption is: inefficient bureaucracy.
it is improving in better way. but not faster enough.

 

[Obambam]

1.first of all, this kind of trouble happens not everytime. in my experience only once or twice in a year.
2.and customs officer usually dont ask directly for bribe, but if I want my goods released faster, I have to find some relation to pay bribes to them. if you dont have the "relation", you dont even have the chance to pay bribes.
3.you are talking airfreight？
for small shipment. yes. order can be fulfilled with airfreighting.
but some shipment are container shipment. In many cases the cargo weight more than 10 tons. the airfreight cost is huge.
4. "that's the “penalty” he should have paid properly for learning a lesson and be smarter next time around but definitely NOT committing a crime for the buz！" are you kidding me???

The so called "Relation" is the key to getting things done. More so in China than anywhere else.
Mind you, if you have contacts powerful enough, you can even skip the bribe part. It all depends on who you know.

 

[itaskol]

The so called "Relation" is the key to getting things done. More so in China than anywhere else.
Mind you, if you have contacts powerful enough, you can even skip the bribe part. It all depends on who you know.

exactly right. even develop these kind of “relationship” is also expensive. but it is worth.
in my view all business in china are based on "Relationship"

I really hope that can be changed.
and I also hope that china will have Independent Commission Against Corruption (ICAC) someday.
even ICAC is not the key to solve corruption.
relation should neither be the key.
the key should be "EFFICIENT legal regulation and remedy"

 

[terranMarine]

we need 包公

 

[shuttler]

the thing that cause proliferation of corruption is: inefficient bureaucracy.
it is improving in better way. but not faster enough.

your bribes wont help improve the deficiency in the system but only aggravate it further!

exactly right. even develop these kind of “relationship” is also expensive. but it is worth.
in my view all business in china are based on "Relationship"

I really hope that can be changed.
and I also hope that china will have Independent Commission Against Corruption (ICAC) someday.
even ICAC is not the key to solve corruption.
relation should neither be the key.
the key should be "EFFICIENT legal regulation and remedy"

it is like you are rejected by a girl but pay loads of bucks to keep her! will the relationship last long and a pleasant ending for both？

Paying bribes to get things done is the worst choice for the society! It rots the system further!

 

[gpit]

Here is MHO:

1) 1 month delay means big loss. May lead to shutting down of my business.
If this happens once, take the loss, and you have a lesson to learn. If you don’t learn the lesson, and it happens often, that is your problem. Better shutdown your current business and explore in other areas for chances.

2) Bribery provides high efficiency.
It may be for this time, but the consequence may not be. This type of activities is very toxic to the business environment, as it is equivalent to those who break rules get rewarded and those who obey rules get punished. If you collectively turn business environment into wild jungles and only follow jungle laws, hijacking and murdering are perhaps more efficient than doing decent business. For instance you could well hijack the inspectors’ family and request a pass through of your goods. Bet you if that were the case, your business, and everybody’s business, would perhaps be eventually very low in efficiency.

3) Bureaucracy is worse than corruption.
This needs all citizens’ efforts to improve bureaucracy and regulations. Meanwhile you obviously can’t wait for the system to change, you business men must study existing laws and regulations to avoid pitfalls and caveats, and to evaluate your risks. I know some Chinese do business without thorough study, so they behave very much like Boxing Rebellion Boxer Rebellion - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia random, chaotic, acting on an impulse, so they rise fast and collaps even faster. Don’t mistake that network is not important, don't think the system would be perfect, but that can’t subvert the public rules.

I'm sorry, but if I were the authorities, I would arrest you and the inspector.

 

[Pak2]

corruption is in their blood.

 

[A.Rafay]

Corruption by people is Okay BUT Corruption by politicians and Excessive robbing of countries wealth is Not good, because they do corruption on massive scale while people do little corruption

 

[faithfulguy]

Here is MHO:

1) 1 month delay means big loss. May lead to shutting down of my business.
If this happens once, take the loss, and you have a lesson to learn. If you don’t learn the lesson, and it happens often, that is your problem. Better shutdown your current business and explore in other areas for chances.

2) Bribery provides high efficiency.
It may be for this time, but the consequence may not be. This type of activities is very toxic to the business environment, as it is equivalent to those who break rules get rewarded and those who obey rules get punished. If you collectively turn business environment into wild jungles and only follow jungle laws, hijacking and murdering are perhaps more efficient than doing decent business. For instance you could well hijack the inspectors’ family and request a pass through of your goods. Bet you if that were the case, your business, and everybody’s business, would perhaps be eventually very low in efficiency.

3) Bureaucracy is worse than corruption.
This needs all citizens’ efforts to improve bureaucracy and regulations. Meanwhile you obviously can’t wait for the system to change, you business men must study existing laws and regulations to avoid pitfalls and caveats, and to evaluate your risks. I know some Chinese do business without thorough study, so they behave very much like Boxing Rebellion Boxer Rebellion - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia random, chaotic, acting on an impulse, so they rise fast and collaps even faster. Don’t mistake that network is not important, don't think the system would be perfect, but that can’t subvert the public rules.

I'm sorry, but if I were the authorities, I would arrest you and the inspector.

In certain countries, people must pay bribe even if everything check out fine. Or a law was created to ensure that people pay bribes. Then people must pay bribes to survive.

In America, corruption occurs only in the highest level of the society. But it still exists here.