What is your impression of China?

[OIO]

That's bullshit. China would have started developing in the 50s. It would have been an ally of the US and would've taken off economically in the 50s along with S. Korea, Singapore, Japan, etc. China would have become an economic powerhouse by the 70s and probably surpass the US as the world's largest economy by the 80s or 90s. Chinese society would not have gone through the trauma of the Great Leap Forward, Cultural Revolution, it would not have been run by an insane madman like Mao Zedong. Chinese traditional culture would have been preserved and Chinese society would have a basic level of human dignity and decency like Taiwan has today. Something that is sorely lacking in Mainland China.

The CCP are a bunch of barbarians, there is no doubt about that. Ask yourself why ethnic Chinese from Taiwan and Singapore are 100x more civilized than Mainland Chinese? It's because they were ruled by civilized people. Mainland China, on the other hand, was ruled by barbaric and savage CCP peasants.

This topic has been discussed too much, no need too talk anymore.

The only thing you need to remember is kmt is a loser from the beginning to the end.

 

[tower9]

This topic has been discussed too much, no need too talk anymore.

The only thing you need to remember is kmt is a loser from the beginning to the end.

It's an unfortunate twist of history. CKS was a horrible military commander. Mao was a military genius. That was why he had won. But Mao was an insane madman. The first 30 years of the PRC was a nightmare hellhole. Deng Xiaoping saved China. Mao was literally the absolute worst ruler China could've had and he ran the PRC as a God for the first 30 years.

If the KMT won, China today would be a 1st world country, no doubt about that. It would have become 1st world by the 90s. It would not have wasted 30 years with Communist nightmares that destroyed both the economy and the human spirit. China today would have excellent human rights, be respected throughout the world, well liked, its tourists would be well behaved, well educated and highly cultured instead of the shit behavior Chinese are well known for.

 

[beijingwalker]

If KMT won China would be at least one third smaller than what China is today, regional government would have muchmore power and central government maintains a minimal central power. More civil wars were very likely cause KMT only managed to effectively control a small part of China during its rule,every province had their own everything like an independent state. Yes, China would be more like today's India where every province fights for their own interests and puts restrictions on everything from other provinces.

various multinational opinion surveys consistently find a “high level of regime support” in China, even after factoring in the possibility that some people hide their dissatisfaction for fear of political repercussions. In 2014, Pew Global Research found that a staggering 92% of respondents had “confidence” in their country’s leader, Xi Jinping.

I m pretty sure vast majority of Chinese citizens share similar thought like mine, but overseas Chinese, being exposed to western media for so long may have a different opinion.

 

[tower9]

If KMT won China would be at least one third smaller than what China is today, regional government would have muchmore power and central government maintains a minimal central power. More civil wars were very likely cause KMT only managed to effectively control a small part of China during its rule,every province had their own everything like an independent state. Yes, China would be more like today's India where every province fights for their own interests and puts restrictions on everything from other provinces.


I m pretty sure vast majority of Chinese citizens share similar thought like mine, but overseas Chinese, being exposed to western media for so long may have a different opinion.

I have no doubt that the majority of Chinese citizens support the CCP. I agree that the CCP has been adept at developing the country in the last 30 years. However, China could've become much greater much earlier without the CCP and Mao.

 

[beijingwalker]

I have no doubt that the majority of Chinese citizens support the CCP. I agree that the CCP has been adept at developing the country in the last 30 years. However, China could've become much greater much earlier without the CCP and Mao.

It can be everyone's guess since it'd never happened, I agree if Mao died a decade earlier China could be more developed, but I don't think KMT can manange China better, KMT's fall happened for a reason.

 

[tower9]

It can be everyone's guess since it'd never happened, I agree if Mao died a decade earlier China could be more developed, but I don't think KMT can manange China better, KMT's fall happened for a reason.

Obviously the KMT failed for many reasons. But if they had won, China would be a better country today.

Hell, I would even say if Mao had died at 1949 and China was ruled by Zhou Enlai, Liu Shaoqi and Deng Xiaoping, China would probably be 1st world today even with the Cold War. At least they would have ruled China in a logical way and instituted good policies. Mao was an evil fucking madman.

 

[beijingwalker]

Obviously the KMT failed for many reasons. But if they had won, China would be a better country today.

I highly doubt about it, KMT was very corrupted and weak, it was never a strong force powerful enough to hold China together.

Hell, I would even say if Mao had died at 1949 and China was ruled by Zhou Enlai, Liu Shaoqi and Deng Xiaoping, China would probably be 1st world today even with the Cold War.

I agree with you on this part.

 

[GumNaam]

the mighty red dragon that rose from the ashes of world war 2 and dominated her enemies in a mere 70 years.

 

[kankan326]

That's bullshit. China would have started developing in the 50s. It would have been an ally of the US and would've taken off economically in the 50s along with S. Korea, Singapore, Japan, etc. China would have become an economic powerhouse by the 70s and probably surpass the US as the world's largest economy by the 80s or 90s. Chinese society would not have gone through the trauma of the Great Leap Forward, Cultural Revolution, it would not have been run by an insane madman like Mao Zedong. Chinese traditional culture would have been preserved and Chinese society would have a basic level of human dignity and decency like Taiwan has today. Something that is sorely lacking in Mainland China.

The CCP are a bunch of barbarians, there is no doubt about that. Ask yourself why ethnic Chinese from Taiwan and Singapore are 100x more civilized than Mainland Chinese? It's because they were ruled by civilized people. Mainland China, on the other hand, was ruled by barbaric and savage CCP peasants.

Even if KMT controlled China, US would not help China like they did to Japan and S.Korea. China is so different from the small countries. US knew it has potential to become another big power. And unlike Japan and S.Korea, who sacrificed their sovereignty to US, Chiang Kai-shek would never do that. You can find the sign of this from the fact that Chiang Kai-shek refused to let Joseph Stilwell command his armys. The relationship between US and China would be more like today's US-Inida relationship(KMT happened to have good relationship with Soviet Union before it was defeated).

 

[Indos]

A region where Islam get so difficult to penetrate event though Islam has already been in China since early Islam period.

 

[kankan326]

That's bullshit. China would have started developing in the 50s. It would have been an ally of the US and would've taken off economically in the 50s along with S. Korea, Singapore, Japan, etc. China would have become an economic powerhouse by the 70s and probably surpass the US as the world's largest economy by the 80s or 90s. Chinese society would not have gone through the trauma of the Great Leap Forward, Cultural Revolution, it would not have been run by an insane madman like Mao Zedong. Chinese traditional culture would have been preserved and Chinese society would have a basic level of human dignity and decency like Taiwan has today. Something that is sorely lacking in Mainland China.

The CCP are a bunch of barbarians, there is no doubt about that. Ask yourself why ethnic Chinese from Taiwan and Singapore are 100x more civilized than Mainland Chinese? It's because they were ruled by civilized people. Mainland China, on the other hand, was ruled by barbaric and savage CCP peasants.

It is said if it wasn't Mao controlled China, it is very possible Stalin would annex Manchuria with the cold war getting increasingly feirce. Or establish a puppet regime there.
KMT was an utterly corrupt and incompetent political group. Their 22 years' rule of China was a total disaster. Their performances in industry(couldn't produce any decent weapon), war, feeding its people, education(90 illiteracy), economy etc, were bad as hell. And most of all, KMT worships westerners. It doesnt' have balls to challenge US. Which sometimes is necessary if you want China, such a big country, to be a fully independent and developed country. China would never have a bright future if led by these cowards

 

[OIO]

A region where Islam get so difficult to penetrate event though Islam has already been in China since early Islam period.

Chinese society was mature enough, would not let any religions to dominate, this is best time for religions in China if you open the books about religions history in China.

 

[tower9]

Even if KMT controlled China, US would not help China like they did to Japan and S.Korea. China is so different from the small countries. US knew it has potential to become another big power. And unlike Japan and S.Korea, who sacrificed their sovereignty to US, Chiang Kai-shek would never do that. You can find the sign of this from the fact that Chiang Kai-shek refused to let Joseph Stilwell command his armys. The relationship between US and China would be more like today's US-Inida relationship(KMT happened to have good relationship with Soviet Union before it was defeated).

Untrue. That is CCP propaganda.

US by the 50s would have been obsessed with defeating the USSR. A KMT China would be the US's most important ally. The US would provide all kinds of aid to China, military, political, economic in order to keep China as a stalwart ally.

If the US has provided market access and immense opportunities for China in the last 40 years to a Communist controlled China, what makes you think they wouldn't do the same and more to an allied Nationalist China?

Also, CKS would have instituted land reforms like he had always planned once he was able to win the Civil War and solidify rule over China. He would have accomplished all that 20 years prior if it weren't for the Japanese invasion which interrupted his progress. In the 20s, China was growing rapidly in the KMT controlled regions. Also, add to that China would have never gone through the disasters that Mao enforced. China would have had a steady development pattern managed by professionals and would have taken off in the 50s, far earlier than our current timeline. By the 90s, China would be a 1st world country.

 

[kankan326]

Untrue. That is CCP propaganda.

US by the 50s would have been obsessed with defeating the USSR. A KMT China would be the US's most important ally. The US would provide all kinds of aid to China, military, political, economic in order to keep China as a stalwart ally.

If the US has provided market access and immense opportunities for China in the last 40 years to a Communist controlled China, what makes you think they wouldn't do the same and more to an allied Nationalist China?

Why didn't US help KMT when it was about to be defeated by CCP then? US was just standing by watching CCP occupied China mainland. And for your information, if it wasn't for Korea war, the CCP would have liberated Taiwan and US would still do nothing. Your logic doesn't match the history.

 

[tower9]

Why didn't US help KMT when it was about to be defeated by CCP then? US was just standing by watching CCP occupied China mainland. And for your information, if it wasn't for Korea war, the CCP would have liberated Taiwan and US would still do nothing. Your logic doesn't match the history.

The US was helping the KMT but CKS was very incompetent in warfare. The US helped the KMT at every stage of the way, even providing the boats for them to escape to Taiwan.

Also, the Cold War began to heat up after the Korean war, during that stage the US would definitely support a KMT China against the USSR. Not to mention the fact that besides US support, the KMT would have allowed a free market capitalist economy that would have enriched China and allowed for massive foreign investment. American capitalists would have invested in China early on in the 50s, thus cementing China's rise 30 years earlier without the disasters of Mao's rule.