We don't need your advice: Muslim leader to Musharraf

[vkurian]

A Indian Muslim was just trying to tell the world he is proud to be a Indian and a Muslim. He trusts the system and the constitution which guarantee him equal rights and opportunities but if their is a flaw in practices he feels he can't fight for it. This I feel is the biggest success of last 60 years that the system gives hope to all marginalized and oppressed to fight for their rights.

Friends America the champion of human rights got a black president only last year after so many years of independence. India had a Muslim president log time back and got the second one recently. This is the testimony to the free and fair systems that the nation has laid down over the years.

This is no way states we don't have problems or everything is perfect. We have a long way to go the benefits of economic growth has not reached the lower strata of the society be it Hindus, Muslims or Dalits. Various schemes are in place but the concerned section of the society also should feel they have to move up. India and Indians are not dependent on government alone we have a thriving private sector which looks no further beyond merit of the individual.

Here also I would like to point out to some members of Indian mujahidin one of the guys was working for Yahoo for a salary of two million INR per annum and was caught in the jihad web and is now stuck. All I want to say is only Muslims can limit their growth in this country and no one else. Along with faith and religion we all expect a decent standard of living.

Pakistanis should feel nothing but pride for their Muslim brothers in India and please don’t worry they are very much capable of taking care of themselves and have all the tools in terms of rule and regulation in place for this. I assume it will be difficult for you to take what I say at face value coz you see world from a Pakistani point of view where you have a state religion. Let me also tell you that India with such a sizable Muslim population is not a member of Organization of Islamic countries only because you have opposed it every time where as an African country like Gabon with population of few thousands is a member. So please hold on to those crocodile tears and believe in live and let live principal.

 

[Bhishma]

Representative of Indian Muslims? Howcome ? Is there any separate voting system for Muslims in India ?

Is there any Muslim political party in India ?

he is not representative of Muslims but the rep of majority Hindu political party that had got him elected.

Otherwise Modi was also voted by Muslims can you call him rep of Muslims who had massacared 5000 Muslims in Gujrat.

All I can say is go suck it up. Unlike Pakistan, we do not believe in segregating people by religion.

The less you talk about Muslim rights, the better it will be for you. Let me tell you, muslims have no rights in Pakistan. They are persecuted by the Taliban. Sunnis are persecuted by Shias and Shias are persecuted by Sunnis. Sufis are persecuted by the Mullahs. There is no religious freedom in Pakistan. Ahmediyyas are persecuted and insulted by one and all. Hindus are reduced to an ever-shrinking minority.

5000? atleast get your facts right, I see that you people keep increasing the number every time. First it becomes 1000, then 2000, then 5000, and soon it will become 50,000 and 1 lakh. You have no ethics or honesty. All you want to do is project Pakistan as something it is not - a safe haven for muslims.

The sad fact is that muslims in Pakistan are killing each other in far greater numbers than hindus and muslims ever did in India. Get that straight before you talk through your hat next time.

 

[SurvivoR]

A Indian Muslim was just trying to tell the world he is proud to be a Indian and a Muslim. He trusts the system and the constitution which guarantee him equal rights and opportunities but if their is a flaw in practices he feels he can't fight for it. This I feel is the biggest success of last 60 years that the system gives hope to all marginalized and oppressed to fight for their rights.

Friends America the champion of human rights got a black president only last year after so many years of independence. India had a Muslim president log time back and got the second one recently. This is the testimony to the free and fair systems that the nation has laid down over the years.

This is no way states we don't have problems or everything is perfect. We have a long way to go the benefits of economic growth has not reached the lower strata of the society be it Hindus, Muslims or Dalits. Various schemes are in place but the concerned section of the society also should feel they have to move up. India and Indians are not dependent on government alone we have a thriving private sector which looks no further beyond merit of the individual.

Here also I would like to point out to some members of Indian mujahidin one of the guys was working for Yahoo for a salary of two million INR per annum and was caught in the jihad web and is now stuck. All I want to say is only Muslims can limit their growth in this country and no one else. Along with faith and religion we all expect a decent standard of living.

Pakistanis should feel nothing but pride for their Muslim brothers in India and please don’t worry they are very much capable of taking care of themselves and have all the tools in terms of rule and regulation in place for this. I assume it will be difficult for you to take what I say at face value coz you see world from a Pakistani point of view where you have a state religion. Let me also tell you that India with such a sizable Muslim population is not a member of Organization of Islamic countries only because you have opposed it every time where as an African country like Gabon with population of few thousands is a member. So please hold on to those crocodile tears and believe in live and let live principal.

When was the last time Indian Muslims did not claim that they are not Indians?

Infact Indian Muslims never betrayed their country but its otherway round so do not try to twist the event or even this statment which is indeed politicaly motivated and outcome of fear at the hands of hardline hindus.

 

[vkurian]

When was the last time Indian Muslims did not claim that they are not Indians?

Infact Indian Muslims never betrayed their country but its otherway round so do not try to twist the event or even this statment which is indeed politicaly motivated and outcome of fear at the hands of hardline hindus.

Now who is assuming things here....

What fear and from whom......

I don’t understand with the present situation in Pakistan how do you have the cheek to speak for Muslims in other countries. First put your house in order then come preaching for you to be taken seriously

 

[SurvivoR]

Now who is assuming things here....

What fear and from whom......

I don’t understand with the present situation in Pakistan how do you have the cheek to speak for Muslims in other countries. First put your house in order then come preaching for you to be taken seriously

keeping your advice in mind if that is the case why you come to Pakistani forums to spew venom against Pakistan? would it not be better to solve your own problems before commenting on Pakistan.


We do have the check for speak for attrocities against Muslims as well as others everywhere in the world.

The situation in Pakistan is the result of supper power's proxies throughout last many decades. The situation in India against Muslims and now Christians is outcome of Hindutva ideology and not because of any world proxy or conspiracy.

Last but not the least Howcome India has any right to speak for Tamils in Sri Lanka ? What right India has to intervene into Bangladeshi affairs at all.

 

[afriend]

Minority perscution exists even in pakistan and bangladesh. However it has the voice of majority is too stong for that to come out. What i see in these countries is the clutural and religious invasion. Which explains the dwindling numbers of the minorities. The entire social justice system is tilted towards the majority, which explains why many minority violation goes un reported.

However india in there is a democracy and a strong system, and every one is equal in the eyes of our constitution. It doesnt discriminate between hindus and muslims. Mr. Madani said it right, 60-70% of people in india support muslims, which forms the majority and that is why incidents in gujarat and godhra are widely condemend and didnt spread to elsewhere in india.

And survivor yes there are muslim political parties in india, muslim league from my home state kerala is an eg. They won all the elections they contested but failed last time against communist(widely believed to be athists) in certain seats. That should explain demoracy and secularism.!!!

 

[SurvivoR]

Minority perscution exists even in pakistan and bangladesh. However it has the voice of majority is too stong for that to come out. What i see in these countries is the clutural and religious invasion. Which explains the dwindling numbers of the minorities. The entire social justice system is tilted towards the majority, which explains why many minority violation goes un reported.

However india in there is a democracy and a strong system, and every one is equal in the eyes of our constitution. It doesnt discriminate between hindus and muslims. Mr. Madani said it right, 60-70% of people in india support muslims, which forms the majority and that is why incidents in gujarat and godhra are widely condemend and didnt spread to elsewhere in india.

And survivor yes there are muslim political parties in india, muslim league from my home state kerala is an eg. They won all the elections they contested but failed last time against communist(widely believed to be athists) in certain seats. That should explain demoracy and secularism.!!!

There was no Muslim political party till some times (not an year) ago.

The Muslim entity was mainly allies to Indian Congress. But reccently the khateeb of Jamia Mosque Delhi announced in an interview to take a solo flight. Thats it. There is no party which could be called a real political party for Muslims in India.

It is high time Indian Muslims should seriously work on this ideas of a strong separat Political party to raise voice for their rights. It will be the best way to rise from slums by Muslims in India keeping in view the huge vote bank Muslims have there.

 

[afriend]

There was no Muslim political party till some times (not an year) ago.

The Muslim entity was mainly allies to Indian Congress. But reccently the khateeb of Jamia Mosque Delhi announced in an interview to take a solo flight. Thats it. There is no party which could be called a real political party for Muslims in India.

It is high time Indian Muslims should seriously work on this ideas of a strong separat Political party to raise voice for their rights. It will be the best way to rise from slums by Muslims in India keeping in view the huge vote bank Muslims have there.

IUML ie indian union muslim league was founded in 1948 and they have a minister in Cabinet E. Ahmed. But i would say a party just for a particular religion is a dumb idea. As in a secular country politics should not be played with religion and the agenda should be the development of the nation as a whole and not in sections..!!!!.

 

[SurvivoR]

IUML ie indian union muslim league was founded in 1948 and they have a minister in Cabinet E. Ahmed. But i would say a party just for a particular religion is a dumb idea. As in a secular country politics should not be played with religion and the agenda should be the development of the nation as a whole and not in sections..!!!!.

No it is not a dumb idea. It has more to do with using one's vote bank affectively than anything to do with religion.


And in secular India the politics revolved and played on religious basis.

 

[godsavetheworld]

Representative of Indian Muslims? Howcome ? Is there any separate voting system for Muslims in India ?

Is there any Muslim political party in India ?

he is not representative of Muslims but the rep of majority Hindu political party that had got him elected.

Otherwise Modi was also voted by Muslims can you call him rep of Muslims who had massacared 5000 Muslims in Gujrat.

That is not how it works in India. A minister of Parliament need not be aligned to a major political party. He can be an independent candidate or be a part of a smaller party. Mauli heads IUML. Whether you think he is maligned is your opinion, which is always based on whether Muslims in India give pro-Pakistani views or not. And like always you think all Muslim voices in India are maligned and motivated by hindus because they love India more than Pakistan.

Firstly dont inflate figures. Gujrat riots claimed dealth of 1000 people, 600 muslims and about 300-400 hindus, those are the official figures. It was extremely unfortunate. But post-Gujarat riots we saw Hindu's and Muslim together protesting against Modi.

 

[SurvivoR]

That is not how it works in India. A minister of Parliament need not be aligned to a major political party. He can be an independent candidate or be a part of a smaller party. Mauli heads IUML. Whether you think he is maligned is your opinion, which is always based on whether Muslims in India give pro-Pakistani views or not. And like always you think all Muslim voices in India are maligned and motivated by hindus because they love India more than Pakistan.

Firstly dont inflate figures. Gujrat riots claimed dealth of 1000 people, 600 muslims and about 300-400 hindus, those are the official figures. It was extremely unfortunate. But post-Gujarat riots we saw Hindu's and Muslim together protesting against Modi.

When the same Muslim voices raise their concern against bad treatment extended to them by majority Hindus in India then you never accept that and call such Muslims as maligned by outside forces.

Indians always love to have double standard when a Muslim Complaint he is bad and he is anti-India and he should go back to Pakistan. But when he speaks good about India he is all goody goody and great one.


No it was not 1000 even independent sources claimed more than 2000 Muslims were massacared to death in Gujrat.

 

[afriend]

When the same Muslim voices raise their concern against bad treatment extended to them by majority Hindus in India then you never accept that and call such Muslims as maligned by outside forces.

Indians always love to have double standard when a Muslim Complaint he is bad and he is anti-India and he should go back to Pakistan. But when he speaks good about India he is all goody goody and great one.


No it was not 1000 even independent sources claimed more than 2000 Muslims were massacared to death in Gujrat.

Well that is a perception generated from the enviornment you live in. Indian justice system and society doesnt work that way brother. If a muslim raises a concern it is a concern as good as any other individual. Its not only muslims who raises concern over gujarat 90% of india is raising concerns. However if he raises a fundementalist concern, why women drive? why women go to pubs? etc then these guys would be "DISCRIMINATED" against dont you think they should be ??? this goes for any individual hindu,muslim, christians sikhs.. parsis etc...!!!! With a constitution which barrs a member minority from becoming head of state, with laws which give more weightage to muslim statement than to a minority one i dont think you would be having any right to be sarcastic about the constituional powers that the citzens of india enjoy..i.e Equal rights and freedom for all...!!!

 

[SurvivoR]

Well that is a perception generated from the enviornment you live in. Indian justice system and society doesnt work that way brother. If a muslim raises a concern it is a concern as good as any other individual. Its not only muslims who raises concern over gujarat 90% of india is raising concerns. However if he raises a fundementalist concern, why women drive? why women go to pubs? etc then these guys would be "DISCRIMINATED" against dont you think they should be ??? this goes for any individual hindu,muslim, christians sikhs.. parsis etc...!!!! With a constitution which barrs a member minority from becoming head of state, with laws which give more weightage to muslim statement than to a minority one i dont think you would be having any right to be sarcastic about the constituional powers that the citzens of india enjoy..i.e Equal rights and freedom for all...!!!

it is the perception based on reality of life condition of Muslims in India.

It is not taken as good a concern as any other individual. Just recall the statment by Shabana Azmi even all of you here on this forum resorted to abuses against her for raising her voice.

Just recall how the majority Hindus bashed painter Hussain.

Just recall how your most educated and well known Hindu artists raised hue and cry over slumdog screen play.

It was only after the film won Oscar you suddenly realised to once again claim credit for India by celeberating it. While the world still did not forget it was not long ago when Indians were protesting against Slumdog..

Above all just recall demolition of Babri Mosque by fundamentalist Hindus.

All these realigties are basis of this which you call a perception.


And oh the concern raised about women going to pubs was by Indian fundamentalist organizations not Muslism.
Dont read too much into anti-Muslim sentiments

 

[afriend]

it is the perception based on reality of life condition of Muslims in India.

It is not taken as good a concern as any other individual. Just recall the statment by Shabana Azmi even all of you here on this forum resorted to abuses against her for raising her voice.

Just recall how the majority Hindus bashed painter Hussain.

Just recall how your most educated and well known Hindu artists raised hue and cry over slumdog screen play.

It was only after the film won Oscar you suddenly realised to once again claim credit for India by celeberating it. While the world still did not forget it was not long ago when Indians were protesting against Slumdog..

Above all just recall demolition of Babri Mosque by fundamentalist Hindus.

All these realigties are basis of this which you call a perception.


And oh the concern raised about women going to pubs was by Indian fundamentalist organizations not Muslism.
Dont read too much into anti-Muslim sentiments

What i understand by your statements is that, you are blinded by the hate against hindus. And that mind can only see the a part of the picture but never the big picture. And i dont know what would be your response to the people who blame islam for spreading terror across the world???

So please try to get the logic, all hindus are not terrorists the same way all muslims are not moderates.

 

[dabong1]

As if you are not?.

Go check statements from your own govt that says cross border movement is a fraction of what is was from before.
We have followed through on our word that if india is willing to have sincere negotiations we will take the first step and put a stop the border movement......a condtion you wanted forfilled before negotiations could start.....whats your excuse now.
Its your turn to make a major concession or we end up where we where a decade ago.

Sending in terrorists is only going to strengthen Indian resolve and make Kashmiri's hate Pakistan even more.

Why dont we ask the kashmiris what they want.......if they hate pakistan so much would they not vote to join india under a UN vote?