Viper Infantry Fighting Vehicle.

[Zhukov]

Very impressive and I like the namre 'Viper' as well. I am entirely against large scale investment in conventional forces in Pakistan. The reason is very simple. However much we spend India will spend more and we will always face overwhelming odds. Simply put India is nearly 7 times more populous so it can field more men, more guns, more tanks, more artillery, more aircraft then we ever will.

The only real defence we have right now that holds India behind the Radclife Line is our nukes which effectively equalize the conventional imbalance. Meaning our shield now is the nukes. The only role conventional forces play is in limited tactical situations and giving us the time until nukes are used. By increasing our conventional capability we merely extend the time to nuke activation. 24 hours, 7 days, 4 weeks or 3 months etc until our conventional forces are overwhelmed and we fall back on nukes. I personally think the conventional forces should just be enough to hold back India for 7 days. Anything in excess of that we cannot afford. Make our low nuclear threshold known to Indians.

Going back to the IFV I think this is area where Pakistan needs to invest in. Tracked IFVs, 8/6 wheeled IFVs and heavily armed scout vehicles. These should be made in large numbers say in excess of 4,000. Half go to the army and wheeled IFVs go to Rangers/FC. We really need to beef up internal security. All regions of Pakistan with issues like Balochistan, Sindh, South Punjab and FATA should be heavily patrolled by GC/Rangers. Helicopters to reinforce the patroling should also be bought. Pakistan needs to shift focus from borders to internal threats. The state should have iron fist visible everywhere.

And vehicles like Viper or wheeled derivatives would be the 'ironfist'.

No Sir this is not the case.
India may be 7 times larger in terms of population and Area
But Except Indian Navy Indian Conventional forces are roughly just Twice the size of Pakistan. And that size is not enough to overwhelm a country on its own territory. Considering they have 7 times more Strategic Assets and Area to Defend. Do some research on sheer numbers of Pakistani and Indian Inventory or Weapons and Servicemen and you will be astonished how narrow the Gap is compared to like 50 years before when it was 4 to 1
Its not World War 2 where armies will collide heads on gun to gun. With the Massive Advancements in Maneuverability, Intel apparatus and Tactical combat of modern age, warfare is very different. Nuclear deterrent was developed only to counter Indian nuclear Threat(which India developed before us) not the threat of their conventional forces.
2 times stronger armies or even 3 times stronger armies cannot win a modern war unless the Adversary is totally Outclassed by Technology and Battle Tactics like USA outclassed Iraq. Which India does not hold over Pakistan no matter how hard they try to portray it in front of their public.
You mean Indian Air force can totally annihilate Pakistan air force on Pakistani Skies?
and Indian army of 1.4 Million with will run head on in Pakistani Soil in our Cities with Extremely Hostile population towards India against out 700,000 Armed forces and overwhelm our defenses with that number? (Even If they deploy whole our there army of 1.4 M which is ridiculous.will they leave their home front undefended to be flanked by Pakistan Forces from some other sector? or Chinese threat)
Infact, Except USA and Russia no other army of the world can totally outclass and subdue Pakistan Defenses (If you don't count Chinese as they are your Allies and European Union ans they are not a United Army) neither can any army except USA and Russia Outclass Indian Defenses.
Its naive to think Pakistan can invade India and Defeat Indian Defenses and Capture Delhi like some Pakistanis believe. But it is equally Stupid and Laughable to think that Pakistan can be subdued by Indian Forces in a conventional confrontation.
Only way India can Defeat Pakistan is if their is a massive internal Mutiny Inside Pakistan and Locals turn hostile towards federation in support Indian Army Choking Pakistani Forces Operations. Decide for your self if it is possible in near foreseeable future

 

[Foxtrot Delta]

The viper IFV looks really Bad ***! The chassis and armor shape look very very good and durable. Weapon systems and target systems im not sure about look wise its 10/10 even when compared to chinese or western designs

 

[Arsalan]

Yeah and viper was the only choice for that, I agree. A defence product not called viper simply cannot be sold, you are right.

hahahah,, why are you so pissed off??
Ok tell me, what would you want it to be called?

 

[Dreamer.]

Well, the Chinese name their systems according to Chinese traditions, such as Shaolong, or Hualong etc. Russians have names like Iskander. Everyone tries to portray their history, and that is what makes the naming interesting. The world today expects diversity and we should not shy away from promoting our history and culture.

In addition, buyers usually change the name of a product in their service to whatever suits them. There are many examples of the same product serving in different counties under different names. I am not totally against a name in english but at least it should be something meaningful and original.

 

[punit]

lolz!!
Well that would have just meant "Armored Vehicle"
I was actually talking about naming these systems after people etc. VIPER have a more lethal and professional sound to it!!

Viper for something solid and heavy duty does not sound good..

 

[Windjammer]

 

[Signalian]

Pakistan’s HIT unveils Viper IFV

Dmitry Fediushko, Karachi - Jane's Defence Weekly
29 November 2018

Pakistan’s Heavy Industries Taxila (HIT) armour manufacturer unveiled its Viper IFV at the IDEAS 2018 international defence exhibition and seminar held in Karachi, Pakistan, on 27-30 November. Source: Dmitry Fediushko

Pakistani armour manufacturer Heavy Industries Taxila (HIT) unveiled its latest infantry fighting vehicle (IFV), the Viper, at the IDEAS 2018 international defence exhibition, held in Karachi, Pakistan, between 27-30 November.

The Viper is based on a lengthened chassis derived from the M113 tracked armoured personnel carrier (APC) and has six road wheels on each side compared to the M113's five. Unlike the M113, the IFV is additionally protected by appliqué armour.

"The Viper weighs some 16 tonnes and is protected in accordance with Level IV STANAG 4569 [all-round protection against 14.5 mm armour-piercing bullets fired at a distance of 200 m]," a source from HTI told Jane's at IDEAS 2018.

The Viper has retained the internal layout of the M113 APC, with the powerpack mounted in the front right part of the hull. The vehicle transports up to 13 soldiers (including a crew of three) in anti-blast seats without neck protection. However, the hull lacks a spall liner or any additional anti-fragmentation protection for the crew and dismounts. The vehicle's troop compartment is fitted with an exit ramp.

The prototype of the Viper has been fitted with a modified Turra 30 remotely controlled weapon station (RCWS) armed with a Slovak-made Shipunov 2A42 30 mm automatic cannon, Kalashnikov PKT 7.62 mm medium machine gun (MG), two ready-to-use 9M113 Konkurs (AT-6 'Spandrel') anti-tank guided missiles and smoke dischargers. The Konkurs missiles and Kalashnikov MG, the source noted, were supplied by East European NATO member states.

The RCWS's sensor suite incorporates a daylight TV camera, infrared sight, and laser rangefinder. The commander's workstation can additionally be fitted with a panoramic sight.

To read the full article, Client Login
(292 of 395 words)

Pakistan’s HIT unveils Viper IFV | Jane's Defence Weekly



IDEAS 2018: Heavy Industries Taxila unveils new Viper Infantry Fighting Vehicle

IDEAS 2018 News Official Show Daily
POSTED ON THURSDAY, 29 NOVEMBER 2018 13:56

At this year’s edition of IDEAS, being held in Karachi (Pakistan), the local armament group Heavy Industries Taxila (HIT) unveiled a new tracked IFV dubbed “Viper”.

The Viper Infantry Fighting Vehicle showcased at IDEAS 2018
(Credit: RealKarachi / youtube.com)

The Viper is a further development of the Talha armoured personnel carrier, which is a modern variant of the well-known American M-113 APC, produced in this country for a long time.

The vehicle integrates a remote control combat module which mainly incorporates Russian systems. It features a 2A42 30 mm automatic cannon, an NSV 12.7 mm machine gun mounted above the gun, and two AT-5B Konkurs-M anti-tank guided missiles on the left side of the turret. A digital optronic sensor also provides EO/IR sights for the gunner and commander. This modular optronic mast is ideal for long day and night surveillance missions.

The Viper can carry up to nine dismounted soldier and a crew of three: a driver, a gunner and the vehicle’s commander.

In its basic version, the Viper has a MTOW of 11,000 kg. It is powered by a 360 hp diesel engine, providing a maximum speed of 62 km/h.

As it can be seen on the pictures, the HIT designers have seriously worked on enhancing the protection. Besides extensive armor plates, the vehicle is also equipped with two series of four smoke grenade launchers mounted on each side of the 2A42 gun. The crew compartment includes suspended seats for a better survivability against IEDs and mines.

According to local media, the Viper IFV will undergo acceptability trials soon.

Heavy Industries Taxila is one of the largest defence manufacturer in Pakistan and has grown into a military industrial complex since its foundation 1971.

IDEAS 2018: Heavy Industries Taxila unveils new Viper Infantry Fighting Vehicle | armyrecognition.com

@HRK @Path-Finder @Signalian @Inception-06

I posted this idea of PA using an IFV based on Saad with 6 road wheels.

will search for that post.

@Gryphon

found it, i was replying you infact about IFV's.

Post :93

Using Saad as IFV instead of VN-17

https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/mechanised-divisions-pakistan-army.529460/page-7#post-10049128

Also advocated previously using SAAD instead of TALHA.

Post : 123

https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/paki...-main-battle-tanks.492961/page-9#post-9063606

That 6th road wheel makes a difference

 

[Gryphon]

I posted this idea of PA using an IFV based on Saad with 6 road wheels.

will search for that post.

@Gryphon

found it, i was replying you infact about IFV's.

Post :93

Using Saad as IFV instead of VN-17

https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/mechanised-divisions-pakistan-army.529460/page-7#post-10049128

Also advocated previously using SAAD instead of TALHA.

Post : 123

https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/paki...-main-battle-tanks.492961/page-9#post-9063606

That 6th road wheel makes a difference

Assuming this IFV uses the same 408 hp diesel engine as APC Saad, the weight of 16t gives a good power-to-weight ratio of 25.5 hp/t which is higher than BMP-2's 21 hp/t.

Meanwhile, a report by TASS




Pakistan decides against purchasing Ukrainian combat modules

Military & Defense
November 29, 18:47

Pakistan’s largest armor manufacturer Heavy Industries Taxila has decided against purchasing Ukrainian remote-controlled combat modules

KARACHI /Pakistan/, November 29. /TASS/. Pakistan’s largest armor manufacturer Heavy Industries Taxila (HIT) has decided against purchasing Ukrainian remote-controlled combat modules when choosing armament for its new infantry fighting vehicle Viper, a source in HIT told TASS at the IDEAS international defense exhibition on Thursday.

"HIT is currently developing the new Viper infantry fighting vehicle that will replace the Pakistani army’s outdated M113 armored personnel carrier assembled under the license. The Ukrainian BM-7 Parus combat module was considered as the basic version of its armament," the source said.

"However, a decision was made to reject it due to the low reliability of the basic armament, the 30mm gun, its low turning speed and the short service life. The Slovakian Turra 30 module furnished with similar armament but characterized by its compliance with the requirements of the Pakistani army has been chosen for the Viper," the source said.

HIT held comprehensive trials of the Ukrainian Parus module before rejecting it, the source said.

"The BM-7 remote-controlled combat module has failed to meet the requirements of the Pakistani army both by its quality and its price," the source said.

Pakistan decides against purchasing Ukrainian combat modules | tass.com



Hopefully, will see it in PA service soon.

 

[Signalian]

Assuming this IFV uses the same 408 hp diesel engine as APC Saad, the weight of 16t gives a good power-to-weight ratio of 25.5 hp/t which is higher than BMP-2's 21 hp/t.

Meanwhile, a report by TASS




Pakistan decides against purchasing Ukrainian combat modules

Military & Defense
November 29, 18:47

Pakistan’s largest armor manufacturer Heavy Industries Taxila has decided against purchasing Ukrainian remote-controlled combat modules

KARACHI /Pakistan/, November 29. /TASS/. Pakistan’s largest armor manufacturer Heavy Industries Taxila (HIT) has decided against purchasing Ukrainian remote-controlled combat modules when choosing armament for its new infantry fighting vehicle Viper, a source in HIT told TASS at the IDEAS international defense exhibition on Thursday.

"HIT is currently developing the new Viper infantry fighting vehicle that will replace the Pakistani army’s outdated M113 armored personnel carrier assembled under the license. The Ukrainian BM-7 Parus combat module was considered as the basic version of its armament," the source said.

"However, a decision was made to reject it due to the low reliability of the basic armament, the 30mm gun, its low turning speed and the short service life. The Slovakian Turra 30 module furnished with similar armament but characterized by its compliance with the requirements of the Pakistani army has been chosen for the Viper," the source said.

HIT held comprehensive trials of the Ukrainian Parus module before rejecting it, the source said.

"The BM-7 remote-controlled combat module has failed to meet the requirements of the Pakistani army both by its quality and its price," the source said.

Pakistan decides against purchasing Ukrainian combat modules | tass.com



Hopefully, will see it in PA service soon.

It would be interesting to see, if inducted, how will it be inducted into MIB's.
1.50:50 ratio with IFV's in MIB.
2. 1 x Coy IFV 3 x Coy's APC in MIB.
3. Separate IFV and APC MIB's.
4. IFV's in HAT's.


It would be useful to give each Infantry Division an MIB equipped with IFV to work in conjunction with MBT's of its Armored Regt.

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

Decent upgrade an Improvement

 

[Gryphon]

It would be interesting to see, if inducted, how will it be inducted into MIB's.
1.50:50 ratio with IFV's in MIB.
2. 1 x Coy IFV 3 x Coy's APC in MIB.
3. Separate IFV and APC MIB's.
4. IFV's in HAT's.


It would be useful to give each Infantry Division an MIB equipped with IFV to work in conjunction with MBT's of its Armored Regt.

50:50 IFV/APC ratio in MIBs should be good, but that means there is a requirement of equal number of Viper IFV's (3000+) in PA as M113 type APCs (M113: 2 crew + 11 dismounts, Viper: 3 crew + 10 dismounts).

Raising such a force will take decades and billions of dollars. Since PA has acquired surplus M113 type APCs from US, Italy & Jordan, I wonder why not use the same approach and acquire surplus BMP-2s from Europe & elsewhere, establish rebuild/maintenance facilities in Pakistan, modernize with Turra 30 RCWS, etc.

In this way, PA can induct a 1000 in 2 years & at an affordable cost.

 

[CriticalThought]

Question: How are the ATGMs reloaded on the Viper? What is the capacity for carried missiles? And as we move towards advanced missile systems, how easy would it be to upgrade?

 

[truthseeker2010]

Any idea on the unit cost?

 

[Signalian]

Been pondering over the aluminium armor of M-113 which catches fire. PA M-113's used as APC do not make direct contact with enemy being used ab battle taxis. But the IFV is supposed to make contact.

Wonder how good would be aluminium armor of a M-113 derivative used as IFV and carrying troops ?

 

[ziaulislam]

No Sir this is not the case.
India may be 7 times larger in terms of population and Area
But Except Indian Navy Indian Conventional forces are roughly just Twice the size of Pakistan. And that size is not enough to overwhelm a country on its own territory. Considering they have 7 times more Strategic Assets and Area to Defend. Do some research on sheer numbers of Pakistani and Indian Inventory or Weapons and Servicemen and you will be astonished how narrow the Gap is compared to like 50 years before when it was 4 to 1
Its not World War 2 where armies will collide heads on gun to gun. With the Massive Advancements in Maneuverability, Intel apparatus and Tactical combat of modern age, warfare is very different. Nuclear deterrent was developed only to counter Indian nuclear Threat(which India developed before us) not the threat of their conventional forces.
2 times stronger armies or even 3 times stronger armies cannot win a modern war unless the Adversary is totally Outclassed by Technology and Battle Tactics like USA outclassed Iraq. Which India does not hold over Pakistan no matter how hard they try to portray it in front of their public.
You mean Indian Air force can totally annihilate Pakistan air force on Pakistani Skies?
and Indian army of 1.4 Million with will run head on in Pakistani Soil in our Cities with Extremely Hostile population towards India against out 700,000 Armed forces and overwhelm our defenses with that number? (Even If they deploy whole our there army of 1.4 M which is ridiculous.will they leave their home front undefended to be flanked by Pakistan Forces from some other sector? or Chinese threat)
Infact, Except USA and Russia no other army of the world can totally outclass and subdue Pakistan Defenses (If you don't count Chinese as they are your Allies and European Union ans they are not a United Army) neither can any army except USA and Russia Outclass Indian Defenses.
Its naive to think Pakistan can invade India and Defeat Indian Defenses and Capture Delhi like some Pakistanis believe. But it is equally Stupid and Laughable to think that Pakistan can be subdued by Indian Forces in a conventional confrontation.
Only way India can Defeat Pakistan is if their is a massive internal Mutiny Inside Pakistan and Locals turn hostile towards federation in support Indian Army Choking Pakistani Forces Operations. Decide for your self if it is possible in near foreseeable future

Or through economic collapse