VIEW: Jihadism and the military in Pakistan

[superNova]

Irfan

There are reports of the government considering a national "De-radicalization program" - The army itself and the entire armed forces should be the subject of this sort of De-radicalization. Islah and Tameer in Pakistan must by necessity begin with her institutions.

muse lives in world were pigs fly

here general kayani speaks of otherwise, american lackeys feel desparate

 

[venu309]

Sir the bottom line is Pakistan army is working on Quiad e Azam and Iqbal's vision and will kill all the indian soldiers who every try to invade us now whether you Call it Jihad,Duty,Moral Obligation,Employer's demand,Holy war,Hobby,Call of duty,Public service,Passion or whatever.......

a Pakistani foot soldier derieves his strength from what religion has to offer him in the form of incentives such as Ghazi and Shaheed....unlike indian soldiers who count on brandy.

There is hell lot of a difference between the morale of a soldier who believes in one God and an indian soldier who worships rats,cats,monkeys,elephants and snakes.......Now put yourself in the shoes of a soldier who is on the front and he has thoughts in his mind that when he will die what would happen to him...will he appear before one large rat sitting on a throne made from gold and other small rats and monkeys serving him cheese..and also that he would have to send the rest of his eternal life in paradise with rats,bats,snakes,monkeys and elephants who he consider are his gods.

I wonder where did you recieve such intellectual ideas....

 

[dexbarman]

Sir the bottom line is Pakistan army is working on Quiad e Azam and Iqbal's vision and will kill all the indian soldiers who every try to invade us now whether you Call it Jihad,Duty,Moral Obligation,Employer's demand,Holy war,Hobby,Call of duty,Public service,Passion or whatever.......

a Pakistani foot soldier derieves his strength from what religion has to offer him in the form of incentives such as Ghazi and Shaheed....unlike indian soldiers who count on brandy.

There is hell lot of a difference between the morale of a soldier who believes in one God and an indian soldier who worships rats,cats,monkeys,elephants and snakes.......Now put yourself in the shoes of a soldier who is on the front and he has thoughts in his mind that when he will die what would happen to him...will he appear before one large rat sitting on a throne made from gold and other small rats and monkeys serving him cheese..and also that he would have to send the rest of his eternal life in paradise with rats,bats,snakes,monkeys and elephants who he consider are his gods.

and you want us to respect your religion idiot . we worship elements dont rant about religion you cant understand and btw this rat worshipping army formed bangladesh from pakistan . and advice to you join the laskhars if u think u can kill every indian soldiers and cross the loc . the difference between u and me is that i dont have superioty complex while u my friend .......

 

[muse]

The cat is away and the mice have had a field day - well, to business: Kids say the funniest things --We said Islamicans were not the brightest bulbs and end up giving it away, consider : Our Islamicans say that the Pakistan army is the guardian or Islamism in Pakistan - and this is exactly why the "De-radicalization" program is being considered as nation wide project.


The Pakistan army, if as our islamicans say, is the islamist in command, is therefore a candidate for such "De-radicalization", surely.

But this raises a problem for the Muslims of Pakistan, will the baby be thrown out with the Islamican bathwater? We must be reminded of the words of the Quaid e Azam, “You are free; you are free to go to your temples, you are free to go to your mosques or to any other place of worship in this State of Pakistan. You may belong to any religion or caste or creed that has nothing to do with the business of the State. Now I think we should keep that in front of us as our ideal and you will find that in course of time Hindus would cease to be Hindus and Muslims would cease to be Muslims, not in the religious sense, because that is the personal faith of each individual, but in the political sense as citizens of the State.”

So Muslims have nothing to fear, but Islamicans, well, yes, that is the bathwater that is going to tossed away.

 

[Zarvan]

The cat is away and the mice have had a field day - well, to business: Kids say the funniest things --We said Islamicans were not the brightest bulbs and end up giving it away, consider : Our Islamicans say that the Pakistan army is the guardian or Islamism in Pakistan - and this is exactly why the "De-radicalization" program is being considered as nation wide project.


The Pakistan army, if as our islamicans say, is the islamist in command, is therefore a candidate for such "De-radicalization", surely.

But this raises a problem for the Muslims of Pakistan, will the baby be thrown out with the Islamican bathwater? We must be reminded of the words of the Quaid e Azam, “You are free; you are free to go to your temples, you are free to go to your mosques or to any other place of worship in this State of Pakistan. You may belong to any religion or caste or creed that has nothing to do with the business of the State. Now I think we should keep that in front of us as our ideal and you will find that in course of time Hindus would cease to be Hindus and Muslims would cease to be Muslims, not in the religious sense, because that is the personal faith of each individual, but in the political sense as citizens of the State.”

So Muslims have nothing to fear, but Islamicans, well, yes, that is the bathwater that is going to tossed away.

Sir quote other speeches of Jinnah as well in those he has clearly said Pakistan Law will be based on Quran and sir Islam will rise and takeover if Army stands by it good for them

 

[yousaf goebbels]

You are free; you are free to go to your temples, you are free to go to your mosques or to any other place of worship in this State of Pakistan. You may belong to any religion or caste or creed that has nothing to do with the business of the State.:

sir sorry to burst your bubble but when Hazrat Quaid e Azam said you may belong to any religion,caste,creed thats has nothing to do with business of the state..he was pointing at misuse of authority by Officials...like he wanted to say that a muslim when he goes to some public office for work he wont be given any undue advantage over a non muslim.or on motorway muslim will also get challaned for overspeeding and also a non muslim cause challan and law enforcement is the business of the state.

it also means that a non muslim or a secular fascist has nothing to do with the business of the state that includes legislation by 98 percent majority with 2/3 majority in the parliament and makes pro islamic laws.

it nowhere says that install a shameless secular fascist as the head of the state who wants to recognise isreal and work on David Ben Gurion's ideology of weakening Islamic Republic of Pakistan.

 

[third eye]

please Please substantiate instead of a one liner that can get deleted by Mods.
If you have your opinion then explain it further why you disagree
If you have facts and references to prove his statement wrong then do share with us.

Looking forward to a better post than this one.
thanks

My comments are as follows:

1. Hindus more loyal than Muslims: How can one generalize ? Between 1857 & 1947 the Hindus did make the best of the education system . Infact orgnisations like DAV ( Dayanand Anglo Vedic) Schools & Colleges was founded by enlightened Hindus who grasped the relevance of education. Something that stands validated now. I do not want to go into petty details to counter such ludicrous claims it would be worth checking how many Muslims joined the ranks of Chandrashekhar Azad, Rajguru and the like in attempts to bring down Brit rule.
2. Deen. There was no difference among the Hindus & Muslims in the language used in the Bengal Army – even today Urdu words are used freely in the Judicial system in N India. Just coz the mutineers cried ‘ Deen Deen’ does not make them muslims. Mangal Pandey most defineitely was not Muslim .
3. Inviting Abdali. Did Abdali save the Muslims from Marathas ? No ,he looted & left. If this ‘ invitation’ is correct it showed the weakness, lack of foresight and stupidity of the Gent in question.
4. The jihadi element had been deeply embedded in the psyche of Indian Muslims. Another loose statement with nothing to substantiate it with .
5. Sayyid Ahmad Barelvi and his colleague Shah Ismail embarked on a jihad against the Sikh rule in Muslim Punjab and the North-West Frontier. Ended up being killed by fellow Muslims – not much of Jihad was it ?

No comments on the rest being post independence.

 

[muse]

Sir quote other speeches of Jinnah as well in those he has clearly said Pakistan Law will be based on Quran and sir Islam will rise and takeover if Army stands by it good for them

We don't make stuff up - Quaid is very clear,

You may belong to any religion or caste or creed that has nothing to do with the business of the State.

Pakistan is a Muslim country not a Islamist country. But of course I will grant you that is exactly the struggle, My money is on the Muslims - Islamicans to arabia

 

[superNova]

We don't make stuff up - Quaid is very clear,

Pakistan is a Muslim country not a Islamist country. But of course I will grant you that is exactly the struggle, My money is on the Muslims - Islamicans to arabia

one quote which fascists use, what about countless quotes which quaid used, for example islamic banking etc??

“Our salvation lies in following the Golden Rules of conduct set for us by our great Law-Giver, The Prophet of Islam (PBUH).”

“We must work our destiny in our own way and present to the world an economic system based on true islamic concept of equality of manhood and social Justice.”

stop bullshitting right!!!

 

[Zarvan]

We don't make stuff up - Quaid is very clear,

Pakistan is a Muslim country not a Islamist country. But of course I will grant you that is exactly the struggle, My money is on the Muslims - Islamicans to arabia

Sir I am not talking about make up stuff I am talking about the speeches of Iqbal in which many times he has said that law of Pakistan will be based on Quran and these speeces are also after 11th August 1947 that shows how much you are afraid of Islam

 

[muse]

GO ahead - no one is stopping you from quoting the Quaid wanting a Islamist state - the reason you don't is because you guys are the real bullshit artists - you live with lies and make stuff up -- away to arabia with you - where your black behinds can wait for another 50 years to be real arbis - but of course you never can be

 

[superNova]

GO ahead - no one is stopping you from quoting the Quaid wanting a Islamist state - the reason you don't is because you guys are the real bullshit artists - you live with lies and make stuff up -- away to arabia with you - where your black behinds can wait for another 50 years to be real arbis - but of course you never can be

mr pir sahab explain this

“Our salvation lies in following the Golden Rules of conduct set for us by our great Law-Giver, The Prophet of Islam (PBUH).”

why bullshitting

why r u silent now??

 

[Zarvan]

GO ahead - no one is stopping you from quoting the Quaid wanting a Islamist state - the reason you don't is because you guys are the real bullshit artists - you live with lies and make stuff up -- away to arabia with you - where your black behinds can wait for another 50 years to be real arbis - but of course you never can be

I will quote those speeches very soon first one comes here
He returned to this more extensively in his Id message in September 1945, saying:



"Everyone, except those who are ignorant, knows that the Quran is the general code of the Muslims. A religious, social, civil, commercial, military, judicial, criminal, penal code, it regulates everything from the ceremonies of religion to those of daily life; from the salvation of the soul to the health of the body; from the rights of all to those of each individual; from morality to crime, from punishment here to that in the life to come, and our Prophet has enjoined on us that every Musalman should possess a copy of the Quran and be his own priest. Therefore Islam is not merely confined to the spiritual tenets and doctrines or rituals and ceremonies. It is a complete code regulating the whole Muslim society, every department of life, collective[ly] and individually."

 

[Zarvan]

On the opening ceremony of the state bank of Pakistan Jinnah pointed out that the financial setup of the state should be based on Islamic economic system.
We must work our destiny in our own way and present to the world an economic system based on true Islamic concept of equality of manhood and social justice. We will thereby be fulfilling our mission as Muslims and giving to humanity the message of peace which alone can save it and secure the welfare, happiness and prosperity of mankind. Speech at the opening ceremony of State Bank of Pakistan, Karachi July 1, 1948

---------- Post added at 09:38 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:36 AM ----------

On October 11, 1947, in an address to Civil, Naval, Military and Air Force Officers of Pakistan Government, Karachi, he said:
We should have a State in which we could live and breathe as free men and which we could develop according to our own lights and culture and where principles of Islamic social justice could find free play.[58]
On February 21, 1948, in an address to the officers and men of the 5th Heavy and 6th Light Regiments in Malir, Karachi, he said:
You have to stand guard over the development and maintenance of Islamic democracy, Islamic social justice and the equality of manhood in your own native soil. With faith, discipline and selfless devotion to duty, there is nothing worthwhile that you cannot achieve.[59]

 

[muse]

Islamists are so lost - none of these quoites suggest that Quaid wanted a islamista state instead of a Muslim state -
here this is what you really meant to quote:

The great majority of us are Muslims. We follow the teachings of Prophet Muhammad (PBUH). We are members of the brotherhood of Islam in which all are equal in rights, dignity and self respect. Consequently we have a special and a very deep sense of unity. But make no mistake: Pakistan is not a theocracy or anything like it.” – Broadcast talk to the people of Australia recorded on 19th Feb, 1948.

Khush?? To Arabia with you - ,