Vietnamese communists call for end to communism

[Jlaw]

Which source make you think Vietnam GDP per capital only 1,200 $ / year?
The same source identify how much for China ?

my bad. $1500/year. Better?

 

[BoQ77]

my bad. $1500/year. Better?

Oh I see, the source is your head.

As this source : GDP per capita (current US$) | Data | Table
GDP nominal of Vietnam per capita 2013 : 1,911$

2013 GDP PPP of Vietnam per capita : over 4,000 $

I estimated in 2016, the figure would show 3,000$

 

[Jlaw]

Oh I see, the source is your head.

As this source : GDP per capita (current US$) | Data | Table
GDP nominal of Vietnam per capita 2013 : 1,911$

2013 GDP PPP of Vietnam per capita : over 4,000 $

I estimated in 2016, the figure would show 3,000$

congrats to you guys. Higher than your other saviour, India.

Don't mentiona PPP because the world will laugh at you. Just an advice from your former teacher.

 

[gambit]

Your first point: SVN didn't even try to unify VN, because the US desired a second Korea.

SVN had no need for a unified VN at that time. For all that side's flaws, the South Vietnamese wanted nothing to do with communism. The 1968 Tet Offensive was proof of that. Giap did not -- DID NOT -- wanted that battle but he was overruled by the Politburo. Giap knew that the South Vietnamese was ALREADY resistant to communism and argued against the plan. The failure of the battle and the gross atrocities committed by both the NVA and the Việt Cộng reinforced the South Vietnamese resolve to resist communism. They were willing to settle for one half of the country to establish their independence.

And if you prefer living in luxury like South Korea while fearing one day a nuke missle might come raining down upon you, you are welcome.

Yeah...How much of your computer came from South Korea and how much from North Korea ?

In a sense VNese are much more extreme than North Korean ("Độc lập hay là chết"/ Independence or death).

And how much the South Vietnamese resisted is proof of that.

Your second point: The people are ready when they demand the change, with their voice or even with force. The people are ready when they need changes, not because someone tell them they need those, but because they can't live without changes anymore.

The change is already in motion. The 'old guards' are dying off one by one. If the current demographics are credible, over half of the Vietnamese are borned post war, and most likely includes ALL of the Vietnamese members here, except for myself. I and uncounted Viets, in-country and overseas, aka Việt Kiều, told the people they needed to change. All they had to do is look at the world around them. Look at the ignoble and spectacular collapse of the Soviets. Look at how China abandoned Marx, other than the facade that made up the Chinese Communist Party. Look at how other countries, such as South Korea, lives in luxury while you live in abject misery. You think the Vietnamese do not want change ? You are more naive and ngu than I gave you credit for, đồng chí. That Vietnamese phrase is perfect for drones like you, friend. For our English readers, it translate to 'same mind'. It is the Vietnamese language that gave the world the perfect descriptor for Marxists -- those with the same mind.

Your third point: If you are truly a patriot, then you should have stayed in VN. If you cannot change the ruling party, then you could have tried to change the party from inside.

Do not try to play that weak assed tactic with me, boy. I can turn around and say that if YOU are truly a patriot, you would work hard to overthrow the old commies in VN and give the people the freedoms they deserve.

I love VN as a country, not as a flag or a political system. Fighting for democracy is good, but it should not affect the normal daily life of ordinary citizens. Most democracy movements in VN often go along with anti-govt propaganda, causing quite a trouble for normal people who don't care about politic. That's why I am against most of them.

That is a lame defense against criticism for doing nothing. Proposing democracy means disrupting the lives of ordinary people ? Then what do you call waging a war against the South Vietnamese when we did not want Marxism ?

What I said before is true, communism make people stupid and the Chinese and Vietnamese members on this forum is proof of that. Despite their computer literacy and education, they are sorely lacking in critical thinking skills.

 

[BoQ77]

Dictatorship caused people wise or fool as will ...

 

[eazzy]

Some interesting things will happen in Vietnam.

 

[xesy]

@gambit Your post was too long so I won't quote it.

It's true that many people of the South Vietnam People Liberation Front were not communists. Even the leaders who formed the Front were not communists when they did that. But they disgusted the SVN govt enough to joined side with NVN communists, that's enough of a proof for you? To me, the 1968 Tet Offense came out with both sides lost. NVN lost many good soldiers, many hidden cells. SVN and the US lost face to the world. I agree with Gen Giap that the 1968 attack was a rush, and we should have prepared more. But if it wasn't for half a million US troops in SVN, the outcome might be very very different.

SVN troops, without the US troops to fight for them, lost in 2 years, even when US money poured non-stop in SVN.

It's true that current generation of VN leaders are not as good as they were during the wars. But there are good people in the VCP. If they are enough in number, it doesn't matter if they are communists or capitalists, they will do good for the country. Oh and don't call me "đồng chí", as I personally don't like communists. My imperession on them are hard-headed, stuborn, strict and old-fashioned.

I feel like overthrowing the govt now does not benefit all VNese, as it will cause disturbance to their lives, so I don't act. When I feel like it is the time, I will act, not because you or anyone tell me to, but because to me it's time for change.

Oh and your democracy fighters are not VNeses? They don't follow the laws? I am not saying about laws against anti-govt propaganda, but laws that ensure the protection of the public: like storing and using fire arms and explosive, creating illegal crowd and disturb the public peace, like leaking internal intelligence to foreign organizations, violating safety laws of air travelling? It might be legal to do so in the US or anywhere else, but not in VN. Ok? Democracy fighters? Sound like terrorists to me when they wanted to blow up the VNese soldiers statue in the middle of the park.

I can't believe as a VNese you would prefer the country broken in half rather than an unified one. I am disappointed.

 

[BoQ77]

Oh oh ... nearly 90 million of Vietnamese is not member of VCP ...
I myself, my wife, my sister, ... no ..
My parents before Yes, but after retired No ...

Woohoo ... that's communism Vietnam ...

 

[xesy]

Oh oh ... nearly 90 million of Vietnamese is not member of VCP ...
I myself, my wife, my sister, ... no ..
My parents before Yes, but after retired No ...

Woohoo ... that's communism Vietnam ...

Yeah, seriously. It's not like once a communist, a communist for life, or a family member is a communist, the whole family is communists.

Many communists do not agree with the decisions of the party but there is too much to do against the majority. I have an uncle who is a truly communist, or what we call pure "Bonsevich communist". He works in laws enforcement as a judge, and is often transfered around because he does not accept or allow bribery in his court. If there were more people like him, the party might be better. Of course life might be stricter for us thought LOL.

 

[Kyle Sun]

Vietcong kicked chinky ***, you ran back.

Yes , Vietnam is the greatest country in this planet.

 

[cnleio]

That is a lame defense against criticism for doing nothing. Proposing democracy means disrupting the lives of ordinary people ? Then what do you call waging a war against the South Vietnamese when we did not want Marxism ?

What I said before is true, communism make people stupid and the Chinese and Vietnamese members on this forum is proof of that. Despite their computer literacy and education, they are sorely lacking in critical thinking skills.

U lack intelligence, when u talk the same thing to Vietnam and China situation. One is begger Another is U.S's main creditor, and domestic economy there's simply nothing comparable.
CPC members use capitalism to make China stronger and powerful, what VCP members did for Vietnam ? As long as not a blind man, anyone can see who really did well for homeland and find out the gaps.

Inside Party, until now in PRC history there's no any senior members wrote such public letter to openly betray Party. Such case will get punishment inside Party, but free in VCP. It's just like the "FREEDOM TIME" of former Soveit Union in 1990.

I knew u extremely anti-Communism, but at least use brain to think about Vietnam and China carefully.

 

[xesy]

@cnleio I will ignore your smearing on VN for now.

What @gambit meant is that both VNese and Chinese mems here are both brain-washed by communism, cannot make right from wrong. We are too stuborn and hard-headed blindly to defend communism, which we all know that among many of us there are anti-communism mems, alright?

 

[Carlosa]

@gambit Your post was too long so I won't quote it.

It's true that many people of the South Vietnam People Liberation Front were not communists. Even the leaders who formed the Front were not communists when they did that. But they disgusted the SVN govt enough to joined side with NVN communists, that's enough of a proof for you? To me, the 1968 Tet Offense came out with both sides lost. NVN lost many good soldiers, many hidden cells. SVN and the US lost face to the world. I agree with Gen Giap that the 1968 attack was a rush, and we should have prepared more. But if it wasn't for half a million US troops in SVN, the outcome might be very very different.

SVN troops, without the US troops to fight for them, lost in 2 years, even when US money poured non-stop in SVN.

It's true that current generation of VN leaders are not as good as they were during the wars. But there are good people in the VCP. If they are enough in number, it doesn't matter if they are communists or capitalists, they will do good for the country. Oh and don't call me "đồng chí", as I personally don't like communists. My imperession on them are hard-headed, stuborn, strict and old-fashioned.

I feel like overthrowing the govt now does not benefit all VNese, as it will cause disturbance to their lives, so I don't act. When I feel like it is the time, I will act, not because you or anyone tell me to, but because to me it's time for change.

Oh and your democracy fighters are not VNeses? They don't follow the laws? I am not saying about laws against anti-govt propaganda, but laws that ensure the protection of the public: like storing and using fire arms and explosive, creating illegal crowd and disturb the public peace, like leaking internal intelligence to foreign organizations, violating safety laws of air travelling? It might be legal to do so in the US or anywhere else, but not in VN. Ok? Democracy fighters? Sound like terrorists to me when they wanted to blow up the VNese soldiers statue in the middle of the park.

I can't believe as a VNese you would prefer the country broken in half rather than an unified one. I am disappointed.

As I understand it based on what I read from American sources, from a military perspective, the Tet offensive was a complete military defeat for NV and Vietcong, but from a strategic perspective it was a major victory for them because after the Tet, the Americans realized that they could not win the war and they started to plan their withdrawal. They lost the will to continue the war.

 

[xesy]

As I understand it based on what I read from American sources, from a military perspective, the Tet offensive was a complete military defeat for NV and Vietcong, but from a strategic perspective it was a major victory for them because after the Tet, the Americans realized that they could not win the war and they started to plan their withdrawal. They lost the will to continue the war.

Good men died on that attack, there were more VNese, both North and South, than American death. The attack set back the unification effort of VN and it took more than 3 years after the US withdrew its troops for NVN to achieve the total victory. Many VNese experts said that if we had had the force before 1968, it would have took only 3 months instead of 3 years.

 

[cnleio]

@cnleio I will ignore your smearing on VN for now.

What @gambit meant is that both VNese and Chinese mems here are both brain-washed by communism, cannot make right from wrong. We are too stuborn and hard-headed blindly to defend communism, which we all know that among many of us there are anti-communism mems, alright?

I just have only one word: Those who betray the belief or lost the heart can believe others call u brain-washed.

U have no goal in ur life and don't know what u should do and what u will do.