Vietnam Defence Forum

[Carlosa]

Lol....what are you talking About, we never give anything For the Chinese, especially yakhont missile lol....btw, Indonesia is not interested in Brahmos or any Indian Made weapons

Yes, they did, not because they wanted but because the chinese blackmailed them, the chinese refused to give the tot of the antiship missile that they sold to Indonesia even that they were supposed to, but kept delaying until Indonesia agreed to give them one copy of the Yakhont. This is well know, but its not official of course, but is what the Russians think. Only 3 countries have the Yakhont other than Russia, Vietnam, Indonesia and Syria. When China came up with the copy of it, Russia knew that one of those had to do it and it wasn't Vietnam or Syria. At least this is what the Russians believe.

Much better than Sigma. Fremm would be a dream comes true if we can grab it. 140m long, 20m wide, 6,000 tons, can be configured for different missions. France and Italy build the ship as submarine hunter and land attacker. The Italian version is heavier: 6,900 tons. We would build it as air defense destroyer. The question is the price tag, transfer of technology and if we can build some ships in Vietnam.

The French seem seriously wanting to step in the troubled waters. They previously proposed joint European patrols. Not necessary bad. The more guests the better the party

Its good, but I think its too expensive for Vietnam.

 

[initial_d]

Yes, they did, not develophey wanted but because the chinese blackmailed them, the chinese refused to give the tot of the antiship missile that they sold to Indonesia even that they were supposed to, but kept delaying until Indonesia agreed to give them one copy of the Yakhont. This is well know, but its not official of course, but is what the Russians think. Only 3 countries have the Yakhont other than Russia, Vietnam, Indonesia and Syria. When China came up with the copy of it, Russia knew that one of those had to do it and it wasn't Vietnam or Syria. At least this is what the Russians believe.



Its good, but I think its too expensive for Vietnam.

Errrr rite its a hear say without A proof, first of all indonesian developed our own ASHM missile based on our own RX technologies. We only purchase several Chinese Made ashm For fast attack boat only, and i think the tot between China and us has become sour, there were no news About it since, its baseless if the russian say we sell yakhont to China.

 

[Viet]

Hollande says France and Vietnam have ‘overcome’ difficult past

© Stephane de Sakutin, AFP | French President Francois Hollande (L) and Vietnam's President Tran Dai Quang attend a signing ceremony at the Presidential Palace in Hanoi on September 6, 2016.

Text by FRANCE 24
Latest update : 2016-09-06

President François Hollande on Tuesday declared that France and Vietnam had “overcome” their conflictive past during a historic visit to the Southeast Asian country, which was marked by lucrative deals for French aviation giant Airbus.

Speaking to French expatriates in the Vietnamese commercial hub of Ho Chi Minh City, Hollande once again acknowledged that the two countries shared a “tumultuous past”, but insisted they now enjoyed a new era of robust diplomatic and commercial ties.

“Hollande stressed that France has a very special role to play here in Vietnam. It’s about culture, it’s about preserving an identity and defending certain values,” said France 24 correspondent Clovis Casali from Ho Chi Minh City.

France fought Viet Minh fighters between 1946 and 1954, before being forced out of its former colony by the armed insurgency. Vietnam’s national holiday on September 2 commemorates its declaration of independence from France.

Hollande is only the third French president to visit Vietnam since independence, and the first in 12 years. “He stressed the need to strike a new partnership with Vietnam, especially on the economic level,” Casali added.

Hollande said the "very important deals" in the aviation industry deepened ties with Vietnam, where France's legacy remains ubiquitous – from the country's colonial-era buildings to French-influenced cuisine.

The French president was also expected to meet with French entrepreneurs in Ho Chi Minh City, including some from Vietnam's burgeoning tech sector.

Big planes for a growing economy

Earlier, as Hollande met his counterpart Tran Dai Quang in the capital of Hanoi, Vietnam airlines announced it had bought 40 jets worth $6.5 billion from France's Airbus.

The deal is the latest move by Vietnamese aviation firms to boost fleets and feed demand from a mushrooming middle class with money to burn on air travel both at home and abroad.


Low-cost private airline VietJet, famous for its bikini-clad hostesses, also bought 20 planes for a total of $2.39 billion.

Another regional budget carrier, Jetstar Pacific, also bought 10 airplanes, according to an Airbus Asia spokesman.

The three carriers are making a major move into the lucrative Southeast Asian aviation sector.

With a GDP growth rate of 6.7 percent last year, an ever-increasing chunk of Vietnam's 90 million people have spending power that airline and other industries are keen to tap.

Maritime disputes

Hollande also spoke to President Quang about maritime freedom, a key issue for Hanoi, which is locked in an increasingly testy bitter row with Beijing over competing claims in the South China Sea.

"The president and I committed to respect the rule of law in the seas and oceans, reaffirming the commitment to maintain freedom of maritime and aviation," Quang said.

"The two sides stressed the importance of solving disputes by peaceful means, not to use or threaten to use violence on the basis of international laws."

A UN-backed tribunal ruled in July that China's claims to almost all of the South China Sea had no legal basis and that its construction of artificial islands in disputed waters was illegal.

Ahead of his visit, Hollande was urged by activists to raise the issue of human rights with authorities in tightly controlled Vietnam, where bloggers and dissidents are routinely jailed for criticising the regime.

But rights are not on the official agenda for what is slated as a trade visit.

 

[Aqsuperman]

Pfff as a expect, another load of crap. Not that i expect anything else from US Shamecum anyway

I read though the first half of your argument and its seem plausible enough, but then this.

Now let's say that the wing span is twice the length of the uav

LOL LOL LOL Are you high on drug or something ? Sure there are UAV that has dimensions around that such as the MQ-1 Reaper with the length of 8 meters and the wingspan of 14.8 meters. But then there is UAV like RQ-4 Global Hawk with the wingspan that nearly 3 times the length so that assumption about " Wingspan is twice the length" smell very cummy.

You are like "1+1 = 2, 2+2 = 4 and therefore the Earth is flat". Sound really stupid if not utterly retarded. Symptoms of a person that got his head hit the ground extremely hard after being kicked off from a helicopter by an American.

And you seem doubtful of the UAV wingspan ? Then take a guess of this UAV wingspan and you will see that such angle cannot be used to determine precisely a object. Much easier if you assume every square is 1 feet long though :v

And the assumption that those bricks that made up the floor is "1 feet long" is another point that very cummy. Since 30 x 30 and 20 x 20 bricks are mostly used in household while large open space for demonstrating purpose use much larger size bricks which usually fall into 40 x 40 to say the least.

Now its possible that the machine that in the clip is only a model to fit the space but its wingspan will never be a 5m in any way, so now lets check the clip below.

Look carefully at 1 : 01. I see at least 10 visible bricks under the right wings, maybe a lot of more since the pillar is blocking the view. In the worst case that this is also the true size of the the UAV, its still offer more than 10 meter of wingspan. And with the using of Rotax power plant, covering 4,000 km without having to carry any weapons is a feasible task.

You are not exposing anyone, you just pretend to be sophisticated while weasel your way through any questions that seem too high for your knowledge, that is it, plain and simple.

 

[Carlosa]

Errrr rite its a hear say without A proof, first of all indonesian developed our own ASHM missile based on our own RX technologies. We only purchase several Chinese Made ashm For fast attack boat only, and i think the tot between China and us has become sour, there were no news About it since, its baseless if the russian say we sell yakhont to China.

What I had read is that the tot issue was resolved. Yes, this is a rumor, but this is what the Russians think, somebody gave a copy of the missile to China according to them and they feel is Indonesia under chinese pressure. Even if the Russians were to have proof, they are not going to come out in public with this and make Indonesia lose face, but this is what they think. I had mentioned this one time to madokafc and she didn't say a word, that tells me that she probably knows something about it, but I'm not sure.

 

[Viet]

Its good, but I think its too expensive for Vietnam.

the french should copy the japanese: put it in an envelope called ODA

remembering the old colonial days. François Hollande tours the Hanoi Old Quarter.

 

[Carlosa]

Nope, the tot of Chinese c705 stil cold, there still no news we produce it.
Btw, Madoka is A civillian, if you want to know For sure ask some of senior member at Kaskus Military forum, lots of the lad there Work For the Military, DoD and arms and defense FIRM in indonesia

Ok man, I certainly don't have direct knowledge of this, I can only tell you what the Russians think. I have no way to know if this is true or not, but I would not be surprised at all of the chinese trying something like this since they are know to be very tricky in these matters and they do all they can to steal tech from other countries. I would want to think that Indonesia didn't give in to them, but I just don't know, this is just what the Russians think. That's all.

And how you’d know Sigma 10514 would be more likely selected next?

Sigma even has less of a chance than FREMM, namely the Dutch govt wasn’t willing to back a loan/credit line for the Viet Sigma plan, no matter how hard Damen tried to lobby the Dutch govt. On the other hand, with Hollande....

I only know rumors, same as you. What would be the reason why the FREMM has a better chance other than the loans? Loans help, but the ship is also quite expensive and that makes a big difference also.

I think the FREMM is too big and too expensive for VN's needs and having only 16 air defense missiles in the French version is clearly not enough, it would it have to be customised for Vietnam. I don't know, but I think Vietnam needs smaller ships.

 

[Viet]

we can dream a bit, can´t we?

since our defence budget is thin, I think we could start with 3 Fremm destroyers, that would serve as the shield of our three fleets: north, center and south fleet.

Every fleet has 4 x TT400 gunships, 4 x Molynia guided missile corvettes, 2 x Gepard guided missile frigates (with 1 heli aboard each), 1 x Fremm air defence destroyer (with 1 heli aboard) and 2 x Kilo attack submarines. several replenishment vessels and tug boats accompany the group.

to reduce the cost of future destroyers as much as possible, we should use Vietnam made components wherever possible. including trying to build the ships we need at home. the latest picture of Vietnam made antiship missile Kct15. The missile warhead can blow up enemy warship up to 5,000 tons tonnage with a single hit. flying 4m over the sea surface en route to target, range 130 km.

there are reports with newer missile range 300 km. waiting for someone posting pictures

Kct15 AShM

 

[Carlosa]

we can dream a bit, can´t we?

since I think we could start with 3 Fremm destroyers, that would serve as the shield of our three fleets: north, center and south fleet.

Every fleet has 4 x TT400 gunships, 4 x Molynia guided missile corvettes, 2 x Gepard guided missile frigates (with 1 heli aboard each), 1 x Fremm air defence destroyer (with 1 heli aboard) and 2 x Kilo attack submarines. several replenishment vessels and tug boats accompany the group.

to reduce the cost of future destroyers as much as possible, we should use Vietnam made components wherever possible. including trying to build the ships we need at home. the latest picture of Vietnam made antiship missile Kct15. The missile warhead can blow up enemy warship up to 5,000 tons tonnage with a single hit. flying 4m over the sea surface en route to target, range 130 km.

there are reports with newer missile range 300 km. waiting for someone posting pictures

Kct15 AShM

If that's the case, those FREMM "destroyers" better have no less than 32 air defense missiles, otherwise they can't protect anything.

 

[Viet]

If that's the case, those FREMM "destroyers" better have no less than 32 air defense missiles, otherwise they can't protect anything.

yes, 32 is minimum.

 

[Silent Knight]

Well, if it is true then FREMM would be put against De Zeven Provicien class for fleet air defense role, not the SIGMA.

The SIGMA is rumored to be 10514 variant instead of 9814 as originally revealed.

 

[Farhan Bohra]

Well, if it is true then FREMM would be put against De Zeven Provicien class for fleet air defense role, not the SIGMA.

The SIGMA is rumored to be 10514 variant instead of 9814 as originally revealed.

Well, well if that happened, and Vietnam rolled out a tender for 6000-7000 tonne frigate , then GRSE indeed going to participate with P-17 A.

 

[Silent Knight]

@Farhan Bohra

You have any idea about what kind of OPV we could buy with 100 million USD? I heard the 100m credit from India has been changed from purchasing several high-speed patrol boats to offshore patrol vessels.

 

[Farhan Bohra]

@Farhan Bohra

You have any idea about what kind of OPV we could buy with 100 million USD? I heard the 100m credit from India has been changed from purchasing several high-speed patrol boats to offshore patrol vessels.

Yup

APOV is more for SAR, patrolling EEZ and Relief Disaster missions.

But I dont think till now Vietnam ordered anything with $100 mn LoC, there are rumors that Vietnam ordered fast patrol boats like this
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rani_Abbakka-class_patrol_vessel
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aadesh-class_patrol_vessel

But I dont think Vietnam Navy ordered anything till now, maybe they are confused.

 

[Silent Knight]

But I dont think till now Vietnam ordered anything with $100 mn LoC, there are rumors that Vietnam ordered fast patrol boats like this
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rani_Abbakka-class_patrol_vessel
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aadesh-class_patrol_vessel

But I dont think Vietnam Navy ordered anything till now, maybe they are confused.

Yup, not for the Navy, that fund was for the Coast Guard. And it was originally destined for fast patrol boats.

We're looking for a 1000-ton patrol/OPV, as Vietnam can build small patrol boats (TT-120, TT-200, TT-400 class) and large OPV (DN-2000 and DN-4000 class) locally. The gap lies in medium displacement vessels, we only have a single 1500-ton patrol boat (CSB-8003) that was transferred from the Korean Coast Guard.