Vietnam Defence Forum

[William Hung]

As I understand, VN is developing a domestic ship, larger and better than the Molniya, that's why they are keeping the Molniya numbers at just 8.

Yes, those boats are a bit too small.

hmm you're right. I read that S-100 article again and the company rep clearly said they would be integrated with the Sigma.

I don't know why that analyst think it could be for those Scorpion and Katran.

So who could these 2 navies be?

btw, S-300 and S-400 has very very limited capabilities against BM. BMD is what Russia is developing the S-500 for.

 

[Carlosa]

hmm you're right. I read that S-100 article again and the company rep clearly said they would be integrated with the Sigma.

I don't know why that analyst think it could be for those Scorpion and Katran.

So who could these 2 navies be?

btw, S-300 and S-400 has very very limited capabilities against BM. BMD is what Russia is developing the S-500 for.

S-300 and S-400 are capable against ballistic missiles of a range up to 3500 km which is what china will most likely use; they are not going to use their limited numbers of ICBM's which are dedicated to nuclear warheads anyway. The S-500 is for the whole defense against any type of missiles including ICBM's, even satellites, etc. That one is tops, but is not for export, only for Russia. I think not many options to get better than S-300 and S-400 for VN, maybe the Israeli Arrow. BMD defense is a very small club and USA is not going to provide such systems to VN at this point, so I think there is no other options.

 

[William Hung]

S-300 and S-400 are capable against ballistic missiles of a range up to 3500 km which is what china will most likely use;

I've read that S-400 can only intercept BM in their terminal phase and that the interception range is really short (well under 80km). That means the defense shield is really limited depending on how many missile batteries you can spread out.

The American ABM like the SM-3 can do mid-course interception.

I think not many options to get better than S-300 and S-400 for VN, maybe the Israeli Arrow. BMD defense is a very small club and USA is not going to provide such systems to VN at this point, so I think there is no other options.

CRS has already talked about selling American BMD system to VietNam. But no doubt there will be strings attached, like joining the alliance or becoming more closer, etc.

 

[Carlosa]

I've read that S-400 can only intercept BM in their terminal phase and that the interception range is really short (well under 80km). That means the defense shield is really limited depending on how many missile batteries you can spread out.

The American ABM like the SM-3 can do mid-course interception.



CRS has already talked about selling American BMD system to VietNam. But no doubt there will be strings attached, like joining the alliance or becoming more closer, etc.

Yes, correct, terminal phase only. AEGIS is way expensive for VN with those ships and they are vulnerable anyway. The land based AEGIS Ashore is the same as the naval version, that would be better for VN, Japan is thinking about buying it. This is all crazy expensive stuff for VN in my opinion. Barak 8 is also supposed to have some BMD capability. I don't trust Patriot as much as AEGIS and Japan seems to think so also, that's why they want to get AEGIS Ashore.

I'm really surprised about US willing to sell BMD systems to VN, I think not likely the government will approve that so soon, but would be nice. Actually, I think Arrow 3 maybe the most cost effective solution for mid course interception.

 

[Viet]

How to convince McCain? send some money to me and I'll come up with a plan to convince him.

LOL no, you get no money from me, earn your money by yourself, dude.
what I mean is we offer more port visits to the US navy and get military hardware in return.

Keep in mind those OHP class frigates only runs on gas turbine engines. But oil price has gone down anyway.

if you haven´t noticed, in Asia we are just behind China and India in terms of oil reserves: 4.4 billions barrels as of January, 2014. And we have discovered a new gas field recently. so that should not be a problem to operate gas powered vessels.

Vietnam - U.S. Energy Information Administration (EIA)

 

[Viet]

I've read that S-400 can only intercept BM in their terminal phase and that the interception range is really short (well under 80km). That means the defense shield is really limited depending on how many missile batteries you can spread out.

The American ABM like the SM-3 can do mid-course interception.

okay, thank for the clarification. exactly what I suspect: we have a gap in air defence.

CRS has already talked about selling American BMD system to VietNam. But no doubt there will be strings attached, like joining the alliance or becoming more closer, etc.

here is the opinion that reflects the concern in vietnam what happens if we join a US military alliance?

The Absurd Idea of an Alliance with Vietnam | The American Conservative

From our perspective, an alliance with Vietnam would be worse than worthless. It would be actively harmful. In exchange for promising to defend Vietnam, the U.S. would get the opportunity to support Vietnamese territorial claims in disputed waters, and it would have the added benefit of being tied to yet another abusive dictatorship whose repression it would be supporting one way or another.

On top of all that, it wouldn’t even make the region more secure. Beijing would react very badly to the creation of such an alliance, which would undeniably be directed against China, and it would probably expose Vietnam to more Chinese provocations and threats rather than fewer. Allying with Vietnam is the sort of short-sighted and irresponsible thing that people who hate realists think that realists would want to do.

 

[Carlosa]

if you haven´t noticed, in Asia we are just behind China and India in terms of oil reserves: 4.4 billions barrels as of January, 2014. And we have discovered a new gas field recently. so that should not be a problem to operate gas powered vessels.

Vietnam - U.S. Energy Information Administration (EIA)

Wow! I didn't know VN had so much oil; some bro that I know might ended up getting his wish for destroyers sooner than expected.

 

[Viet]

Yes, correct, terminal phase only. AEGIS is way expensive for VN with those ships and they are vulnerable anyway. The land based AEGIS Ashore is the same as the naval version, that would be better for VN, Japan is thinking about buying it. This is all crazy expensive stuff for VN in my opinion. Barak 8 is also supposed to have some BMD capability. I don't trust Patriot as much as AEGIS and Japan seems to think so also, that's why they want to get AEGIS Ashore.

I'm really surprised about US willing to sell BMD systems to VN, I think not likely the government will approve that so soon, but would be nice. Actually, I think Arrow 3 maybe the most cost effective solution for mid course interception.

ha ha ha...you are no fan of aegis, but maybe you are right: arrow system seems to be suitable for our needs: a range of 100km sounds good to me.
but I guess not too easy to convince Israel to deliver us with the system.

 

[Carlosa]

ha ha ha...you are no fan of aegis, but maybe you are right: arrow system seems to be suitable for our needs: a range of 100km sounds good to me.
but I guess not too easy to convince Israel to deliver us with the system.

Actually, I think no problem to get it from Israel, 12 million per missile plus the radars, etc. Israel will sell anything for money, no worries there (they are still helping the chinese against US wishes).

Keep in mind also that you don't have to cover the whole country against ballistic missiles, just the important targets, which means that most of the country does not need cover. Ballistic missiles would only be used against the main cities, important military and economic targets, so actually, having enough S-300 / 400 batteries to cover the Hanoi / Haiphong, Danang and HCMC areas and a few other spots such as Cam Ranh bay is already enough and enough batteries of S-300 / 400 batteries should do the job.

Have nothing against AEGIS, its just that its way expensive (Patriot too), Any of those systems is billions.

 

[William Hung]

here is the opinion that reflects the concern in vietnam what happens if we join a US military alliance?

The Absurd Idea of an Alliance with Vietnam | The American Conservative

From our perspective, an alliance with Vietnam would be worse than worthless. It would be actively harmful. In exchange for promising to defend Vietnam, the U.S. would get the opportunity to support Vietnamese territorial claims in disputed waters, and it would have the added benefit of being tied to yet another abusive dictatorship whose repression it would be supporting one way or another.

On top of all that, it wouldn’t even make the region more secure. Beijing would react very badly to the creation of such an alliance, which would undeniably be directed against China, and it would probably expose Vietnam to more Chinese provocations and threats rather than fewer. Allying with Vietnam is the sort of short-sighted and irresponsible thing that people who hate realists think that realists would want to do.

Who the heck is "The American Conservative"? I dont know who they are.

The group that talked about selling BMD to VietNam is the CRS. Do you know who CRS is?

Check out this bill here. Look carefully to see who helped to author the bill (hint: CRS):

S.12 - 113th Congress (2013-2014): Naval Vessel Transfer Act of 2013 | Congress.gov | Library of Congress

LOL no, you get no money from me, earn your money by yourself, dude.
what I mean is we offer more port visits to the US navy and get military hardware in return.

You are rich and even have spare money to play around with stocks. I'm only a poor student, and I need money to pay Jane's subscription.

Here is a fact about the OHP class: They have a higher survivability standard of 2 while the newer LCS has a lower survivability standard of 1+.

 

[NiceGuy]

okay, thank for the clarification. exactly what I suspect: we have a gap in air defence.

here is the opinion that reflects the concern in vietnam what happens if we join a US military alliance?

The Absurd Idea of an Alliance with Vietnam | The American Conservative

From our perspective, an alliance with Vietnam would be worse than worthless. It would be actively harmful. In exchange for promising to defend Vietnam, the U.S. would get the opportunity to support Vietnamese territorial claims in disputed waters, and it would have the added benefit of being tied to yet another abusive dictatorship whose repression it would be supporting one way or another.

On top of all that, it wouldn’t even make the region more secure. Beijing would react very badly to the creation of such an alliance, which would undeniably be directed against China, and it would probably expose Vietnam to more Chinese provocations and threats rather than fewer. Allying with Vietnam is the sort of short-sighted and irresponsible thing that people who hate realists think that realists would want to do.

We wont ally wt US ,too. We just need their weapons and support. Our men r goot at fighting, we dont need any foreigners to fight for us.

Good news is that US will sell lethal weapon to Vn soon.

 

[NiceGuy]

Can increase the enlistment age to 27

Defence Minister Phung Quang Thanh said the draft law amending Military Service proposed to increase the maximum enlistment age 2 years. / Officers and employees must also enlist children as farmers


Presentation of the Report on the bill on military service (as amended) and the National Assembly pm 3/11, Defence Minister Phung Quang Thanh said the duration of military service in peacetime of commissioned officers and soldiers accordance with the provisions of the current Act has revealed many shortcomings, failing to meet the requirements of building the people's army and national defense missions in the new situation.

Defence Minister Phung Quang Thanh. Photo: VNA.

So, the bill stipulated deadline agreed to serve in the army in time of peace of commissioned officers and soldiers of 24 months in order to ensure enough time training, combat readiness to meet the requirements of building military and national defense in the new situation; reduce the level of damage to people and weapons to combat occurs.

According to General Phung Quang Thanh, Vietnam People's Army is building Navy, Non - Air Force Army Navy and some straight up with more modern weapons and technical equipment and high technology.

Therefore, the team should have enough time to raise the level of training. In addition to performing the tasks of training, combat readiness, the military must also perform many other important tasks assigned by the Party and State as: Salvage and rescue, disaster prevention, remedial strategy War, mass mobilization work ... has occupied a significant portion of the training period the team.

"The current law stipulated deadline of two different active service (18 months and 24 months), is not really fair, ideological influence of non-commissioned officers and soldiers, especially for those serving Active 24 months. Every year, the Ministry of Defence must also organize recruitment, demobilization two tranches, costly material and local time ", General Thanh said.

A new project for military service law amendment changes the time this is called citizen age for enlistment. Military Service Law applicable regulations known age citizens in peacetime enlistment from full 18 to 25 years should the annual percentage of citizens with college degrees or higher military enlistment on low.

On the other hand, some citizens are preferred to postpone enlistment to college, after graduating the majority has expired enlistment age. So, the bill provides for additional enlistment age in time of peace to all citizens 27 years of age for study programs of higher education has been postponed enlistment.

"Military Service Law does not specify operating time of enlistment of citizens should not take the initiative to arrange learning time and labor. Bill on specified times to call citizens to enlist be done in February or March each year, "Defence Minister said.

Military Service Law provisions applicable object postpone enlistment during peacetime so broad citizen graduation rate colleges and universities to serve in the army is not much. Some citizens are taking advantage of the postponement of enlistment to evade military service performed ...

So, the bill has provisions only for those suspended are high school students, college students formal training and deregulation of the postponement of citizens "Go build economic zone The new first three years. "

To ensure policy with Agent Orange, the bill stipulated additional deferred enlistment during peacetime for a child of Agent Orange impaired working capacity by 81% or more.

Enlistment age could rise to 27 (Artwork)



Theo: Nông học - tin: Can increase the enlistment age to 27

Seem like we want a well preparation for the next war (if happen) .

 

[Carlosa]

Who the heck is "The American Conservative"? I dont know who they are.

The group that talked about selling BMD to VietNam is the CRS. Do you know who CRS is?

Check out this bill here. Look carefully to see who helped to author the bill (hint: CRS):

S.12 - 113th Congress (2013-2014): Naval Vessel Transfer Act of 2013 | Congress.gov | Library of Congress



You are rich and even have spare money to play around with stocks. I'm only a poor student, and I need money to pay Jane's subscription.

Here is a fact about the OHP class: They have a higher survivability standard of 2 while the newer LCS has a lower survivability standard of 1+.

CRS = congressional research service

I could not find the one that talks about selling BMD systems to vn, do you have the link?

 

[Carlosa]

You are rich and even have spare money to play around with stocks. I'm only a poor student, and I need money to pay Jane's subscription.
.

Oh really? Then Viet should contribute some money towards those AEGIS destroyers, otherwise is just cheap talk, ha ha.

 

[Carlosa]

Here is a fact about the OHP class: They have a higher survivability standard of 2 while the newer LCS has a lower survivability standard of 1+.

Oh my God, an small missile boat has more firepower than an LCS, so that's not much of a reference.

In my opinion the Perry class ships are quite ok once an upgrade is done. The main issue for VN is having to absorb all the logistical impact of having to deal with a lot of American systems and that's not a little thing, but the price is right.

Navy to Decommission 7 Frigates, MCM and SSN. - USNI News

7 available by the end of 2014.