Vietnam Conducts Air-Ground Military Exercises

[cnleio]

Yes, I know, the type 59G with the 125 mm gun as done by Pakistan and Bangladesh.

The vietnamese upgrade includes a much more powerful engine at 1000 hp, but still decided for a 105 mm gun. I don't like that decision.

More than one ...

Pakistan Al-Zarar tank, a standard 59-125 tank with more powerful engine

China export verson VT-III tank, a 59-125 tank with new chassis + additional armors for turret

Future MBT's 125mm gun will update to 140mm or 155mm, Russia / U.S / China under R&D.

 

[Carlosa]

More than one ...

Pakistan Al-Zarar tank, a standard 59-125 tank with more powerful engine
View attachment 154033


China export verson VT-III tank, a 59-125 tank with new chassis + additional armors for turret
View attachment 154035


Future MBT's 125mm gun will update to 140mm or 155mm, Russia / U.S / China under R&D.

Yes, I had heard about that. A gun like that will have tremendous penetrating power.

Frankly, I don't know how Vietnam plans to use the upgraded T-55's.
If they are going to be deployed in the south, like to respond to possible threats in that region like Cambodia, Laos, etc, then that's ok, but for the northern border it would definitely not be ok. That upgrades cost $930.000 which is not cheap. There are better second hand tanks that can be upgraded to a better standard.

 

[cnleio]

Yes, I had heard about that. A gun like that will have tremendous penetrating power.

Frankly, I don't know how Vietnam plans to use the upgraded T-55's.
If they are going to be deployed in the south, like to respond to possible threats in that region like Cambodia, Laos, etc, then that's ok, but for the northern border it would definitely not be ok. That upgrades cost $930.000 which is not cheap. There are better second hand tanks that can be upgraded to a better standard.

Well if upgrades cost $930.000 ... it's better to buy second hand Leopard-IIA4 from some West nation like Indonesia Army bought them few months ago.

 

[Carlosa]

Well if upgrades cost $930.000 ... it's better to buy second hand Leopard-IIA4 from some West nation like Indonesia Army bought them few months ago.

Exactly, or even upgraded Leopard l (they are also available) since its lighter, Leopard ll maybe too heavy for Vietnam's roads.

 

[William Hung]

Seriously, what are the chances of Chinese heavy MBT entering VN from its northern border? I think very unlikely. I think modern man-portable ATGM are good enough in the northern VN terrain.

Maybe buying a small amount of T-90 to protect the Hanoi area just in case. But I highly doubt the PLA would be driving MBT down to VietNam soon.

VN needs to set up a BMD system first.

 

[cnleio]

Exactly, or even upgraded Leopard l (they are also available) since its lighter, Leopard ll maybe too heavy for Vietnam's roads.

I only say the Leopard I or AMX30, they all r standard high-mobile tanks with thin tank armors ... that's not a good idea when face a 125mm gun. Leopard I's front armor designed weaker than T-54.

Leopard I at most 75mm/30° armors, it's as thin as a paper even face a 25mm machine-gun like above pic.

Here will change u mind !

 

[Carlosa]

I only say the Leopard I or AMX30, they all r standard high-mobile tanks with thin tank armors ... that's not a good idea when face a 125mm gun. Leopard I's front armor designed weaker than T-54.

View attachment 154039

Leopard I at most 75mm/30° armors, it's as thin as a paper even face a 25mm machine-gun like above pic.

Here will change u mind !
View attachment 154046
View attachment 154047
View attachment 154048
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View attachment 154050

Very interesting, good to know, thank you. Leopard ll it should be then or to buy / develop a new tank with good armor such as T-90, etc..

 

[Viet]

I see, ATM is good for Vietnam but a updated T-54 only looks good when face China 125mm gun, prepare for 3-gen West MBTs.

Its penetration depth to tank steel armor reach > 1,000 mm
View attachment 153984
View attachment 153986
View attachment 153987
View attachment 153988

Wow, 1 metre. that is very impressive.

 

[Viet]

105mm vs China tanks ? Im sure it can damage old type59 ... but when face ZTZ96A, ZTZ99 and ZTZ99A, 105mm is so weak.

how about T62 tanks with 115mm smooth-bore cannon?

 

[Carlosa]

Seriously, what are the chances of Chinese heavy MBT entering VN from its northern border? I think very unlikely. I think modern man-portable ATGM are good enough in the northern VN terrain.

Maybe buying a small amount of T-90 to protect the Hanoi area just in case. But I highly doubt the PLA would be driving MBT down to VietNam soon.

VN needs to set up a BMD system first.

North Vietnam's border is mountain type of terrain, very difficult for tank operations and good for defense. The right ATGM's are definitely more important than MBT's. And yes, T-90's to protect the Hanoi area sounds right and that's probably why they are getting them.

I also think BMD system should come first.

 

[Carlosa]

how about T62 tanks with 115mm smooth-bore cannon?
View attachment 154064

Old gun in my opinion, I don't think there is alternative to a good 125 mm gun.

The best thing about all these old guns is the fact that they carry a missile, that's the edge.

The 105 mm of the T-55 upgrade has the Lahat Israeli missile, hopefully that one is good enough.

 

[cnleio]

how about T62 tanks with 115mm smooth-bore cannon?
View attachment 154064

115mm smooth-bore gun is good enough to type59 / IFV / armour vehicle etc ... to face a 3-gen MBT with >500mm Composite Armors (Alloy Armor+Ceramic Armor+ERA), it's not that good. Like China MBT, as far as i knew has three~four layers armors.

A bigger gun also need a good ammo, to hit 3-gen MBT at least need APFSDS ... i don't know whether Vietnam can produce the Armor Piercing Fin Stabled Discarding Sabot (APFSDS) ? The best is Uranium-238 APFSDS >> Tungsten-alloy APFSDS >> APFSDS ... all can Made in China.


(Just for reference) Some media said, West APFSDS can easily hit through 600~700mm steel armors in 2,000m distance ... China Tungsten-alloy APFSDS hit through 850mm steel armors in 2,000m distance, China Uranium-238 APFSDS can through 960mm steel armors in 2,000m distance.

西方国家的APFSDS在2000米距离上的穿甲厚度在600-700mm左右（以均质钢装甲计），网上有文章说我国的ZTZ99G/99A装备的钨合金APFSDS在2000米距离上的穿甲厚度为850mm，换用特种合金（贫铀）APFSDS为960mm，而美国的M1A2抗APFSDS能力相当于550-600mm均质钢装甲，根据尾翼稳定脱壳穿甲弹的几何形状特点，建立了尾翼稳定脱壳穿甲弹三维振动分析有限元计算模型，计算分析了某工程尾翼稳定脱壳穿甲弹的振动固有频率特性，得到了各阶振动的固有频率及相应振型，数值模拟了弹丸系统在共振条件下的振动响应，讨论分析了尾翼稳定脱壳穿甲弹振动特性对弹丸系统发射安全性的影响，为尾翼稳定脱壳穿甲弹的设计和事故分析提供一种工程方法。

Whatever 115mm or 125mm gun, u need this

 

[Toss The Lemon]

All good points, thank you, but what about the Type 59G upgrade and the Pakistani and Bangladeshi upgrades of T-55 which are based on it? They did integrate the 125 mm gun and all the reports about that gun seem to be that is working out well. The Pakistanis are very happy with it.

By the way, you mentioned that it doesn't have room for a new engine, but actually, the vietnamese upgrade includes a new 1000 hp engine.

I also think that Vietnam still need to develope new tanks along with new tank guns (bigger caliber), the upgraded T-55 is a second tier tank and anyway, Vietnam is buying T-90's.

Hmmm...To increase gun caliber is a systematic upgrade. Larger gun means recalculation of the recoil, suspension intensity (especially the compatibility of FCS, extremely important), redesign of main chassis's layout style & structure. And also left less space to install ballistic computer, crosswind sensor n other stuff (or change a bigger turret)...etc. Then It also has to tested countless times to prove the final result. I don't know how exactly it has been done, other wise somebody would "knock my door and check my water metre" (查水表~ :>).

So overall I guess that's way too much effort for Isreal side, or the price is going to be ridiculously high. So the 105mm is the way to go for now, plus it can shoot Isareali hollow charge HEAT, or even IMI's M426 APFSDS, good enough. But that's also why its crucial for Vietnam to develope its own heavy industrial capability, ASAP, so it's not gonna restricted when comes to design and produce your very own weapons, or other products. China has gone thru that stage before, resitricted by foreign tech doens't taste good, not at all.

Anyway back the on the track, I think 105mm rifle gun isn't a bad choice for now, I also found out this tank equiped with a 60mm motar, which gives additional infantry support. I think Vietnam wants to modify those T-55s into comprehensive combat castle? Also, you are right.on the engine part. Vietnam took German MT 881 Ka-501 CRI heavy vehicle engine (MTU co.) which produces maxium 800kw ≈ 1072 hp. That's pretty powerful.

 

[Viet]

North Vietnam's border is mountain type of terrain, very difficult for tank operations and good for defense. The right ATGM's are definitely more important than MBT's. And yes, T-90's to protect the Hanoi area sounds right and that's probably why they are getting them.

I also think BMD system should come first.

that is right. Northern part of VN to China is not a nice place for tanks. Sending tanks across is a costly business. but the last war of 1979 shows if the PLA was willing to swallow severe losses in men and equippments, their tanks could break through vietnamese defence.

 

[Viet]

Old gun in my opinion, I don't think there is alternative to a good 125 mm gun.

The best thing about all these old guns is the fact that they carry a missile, that's the edge.

The 105 mm of the T-55 upgrade has the Lahat Israeli missile, hopefully that one is good enough.

bro, how about installing RGP-29 on our tanks?