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US to hit militant safe havens in Pakistan


11 Sep 2008

ISLAMABAD, Pakistan (AP) — Pakistan's prime minister on Thursday backed a harsh rebuke of the U.S. by the Muslim nation's military chief, a sign of a strain in relations seven years after the Sept. 11 attacks forged the two countries' anti-terror alliance.

Pakistan's public show of anger with the U.S. comes amid revelations that President Bush secretly approved new U.S. military raids in that country.

A former intelligence official told The Associated Press that President Bush signed the classified order over the summer. It gives new authority to U.S. special operations forces to target suspected terrorists in the dangerous area along the Afghanistan border.

U.S. counterterror operations along the border are highly unpopular in Pakistan, whose new leadership is trying hard to show independence from Washington. The official spoke on condition of anonymity to describe the classified order.

Gen. Ashfaq Parvez Kayani, the powerful but media-shy army leader, said nearly a week after a deadly American-led ground assault in Pakistani territory that Pakistan would defend its sovereignty and that there was no deal to allow foreign forces to operate inside its borders.

He said unilateral actions risked undermining joint efforts to battle Islamic extremism.

"Reckless actions" which kill civilians "only help the militants and further fuel the militancy in the area," he said.

"The sovereignty and territorial integrity of the country will be defended at all cost and no external force is allowed to conduct operations inside Pakistan," he said in the Wednesday statement.

Prime Minister Yousaf Raza Gilani, in comments reported Thursday by state media and confirmed by his office, said Kayani's words reflected government opinion and policy.

U.S. officials say clearing militants from such pockets in Pakistan's semiautonomous tribal regions is critical to reducing attacks on NATO and American forces in Afghanistan.

"Until we work more closely with the Pakistani government to eliminate the safe havens from which they operate, the enemy will only keep coming," Adm. Mike Mullen, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, told the House Armed Services Committee on Wednesday.

A Pentagon spokesman would not directly respond to Kayani's remarks, but said the two countries were cooperating.

Still, the Pakistani leaders' comments indicate growing frustration and fading trust in both countries on the anniversary of the attacks in the United States.

Many Pakistanis blame their nation's alliance with the U.S. for fueling violence in their country, while U.S. officials worry that Pakistan's government is secretly aiding militant networks — keeping them as a wedge against longtime rival India.

The former U.S. intelligence official said the Pakistani government is not told about the targets of U.S. attacks in advance because of concerns that the Pakistani intelligence service and military are infiltrated by al-Qaida and Taliban supporters.

The "rules of engagement" have been loosened, allowing troops to conduct border attacks without being fired on first if they witness attacks coming from the region, the official said. That would include artillery, rockets and mortar fire from the Pakistan side of the border.

While Pakistan's government earlier issued strident protests over last week's ground assault, even summoning the U.S. ambassador, Kayani's statement was significant because he so rarely speaks publicly and because he heads Pakistan's most powerful institution.

In his first public criticism of American policy, Kayani indicated he was sensitive to anger among Pakistanis, and possibly even within the military, over the assault and suspected missile strikes, analysts said Thursday.

"It expresses a deep concern in Pakistan and was quite timely because of the feeling in Pakistan as if the army and the government of Pakistan has surrendered to whatever Americans want to do in the tribal regions," political analyst Rasul Bakhsh Rais said.

Asked to comment on Bush's green-lighting of new U.S. military raids, which was first reported in the New York Times, the Foreign Ministry referred to Kayani's statement.

U.S. officials have acknowledged that American troops carried out the operation in South Waziristan but have not given details. The mission's goal and results remain unclear. Local residents said at least 15 people died.

The cross-border strike comes at politically sensitive times in both countries.

The Bush administration is on its way out, leading some analysts to speculate it is turning to missiles and ground assaults in Pakistan to try to score last-minute victories in the face of a growing Taliban insurgency in Afghanistan.

In Britain, Prime Minister Gordon Brown said he and Bush would hold a videoconference Thursday to discuss a new approach to policing the Afghan-Pakistan border.

"What's happening on the border of Pakistan and Afghanistan is something where we need to develop a new strategy," Brown said. He offered no specifics.

Pakistan, meanwhile, just elected a new president, Asif Ali Zardari, the widower of slain ex-Prime Minister Benazir Bhutto, who is generally considered pro-American and has said terrorism is Pakistan's chief challenge.

Zardari was sworn in Tuesday and visited his wife's grave to pay respects Thursday. He has faced some criticism for not being more outspoken in condemning U.S. strikes in Pakistan.

Also Thursday, residents found the bodies of two men believed to be among 25 police recruits reported abducted by militants in northwest Pakistan. The partially beheaded bodies were found in an open area in Orakzai town, said Khan Afzal, the mayor of nearby Hangu district.

Meanwhile, the bullet-riddled bodies of three men active in anti-Taliban activities were found Thursday in the Bajur tribal region, witnesses and officials said.

Government official Jawed Khan said the bodies were found with a letter saying, "This is the result of working against the Taliban and cooperating with the army instead of joining jihad."

Tribal leaders in the Salarzai area of Bajur have denounced the Taliban. Recently, armed tribal members torched and destroyed several suspected militant houses and hideouts.
 
The pakistan military reacting without sanction from the GoP pretty much opens the doors for:

1. Another Martial law, and this time we will be treated like Burma, since the military will be acting against an entity that supports US policy, and directly acting to prevent the execution of said US policy.

2. It will lead to senior Military leadership being removed from ofice and the military being brought into line in that manner. This approach especilly will undermine both Pakistan and the military, as those opposed to US actions in Pakistan will see the Zardari appointees as US Lackey's, and you could possibly see attempts within the institution of the Army to sieze control.

The army acting unilaterlally has no benefits, other than settling some 'pride' issues.

AM,

Now it seems that GOP has sanctioned PA to react.
 
The pakistan military reacting without sanction from the GoP pretty much opens the doors for:

1. Another Martial law, and this time we will be treated like Burma, since the military will be acting against an entity that supports US policy, and directly acting to prevent the execution of said US policy.

2. It will lead to senior Military leadership being removed from ofice and the military being brought into line in that manner. This approach especilly will undermine both Pakistan and the military, as those opposed to US actions in Pakistan will see the Zardari appointees as US Lackey's, and you could possibly see attempts within the institution of the Army to sieze control.

The army acting unilaterlally has no benefits, other than settling some 'pride' issues.

Exactly my point, that we will not do anything because there is no political will to do it and this time i doubt Kyani will go beyond the decision making of the political forces. But under any circumstances, a direct US assualt on Pakistan with both the democratic setup and the PA doing nothing about it will raise some serious feelings into the minds of oridinary emotional Pakistanis and they will be forced to think how secure they actually are specially since the nation literally cuts its stomach to feed the military and yet no one is there to defend them when the need arises.
 
AM,

Can you please merge this thread with current one as important posts get divided in two and both are discussing same topic.
 
The issue is one in which it has become increasingly easy to trace and track combatants that engage over either side of the border. Kindly note that the targets were "4 foot soldiers". They had engaged in recent operations, and were subsequently counter engaged. The balance of intelligence gathering has shifted significantly in this respect.

There are some sentiments here that this is some grand scheme to destabilise governments, or to play towards some geopolitical hidden agenda. This issue is one which is much more base than that. For a period of some 5 years now intelligence has been gathered on Taliban & Al-Q "foot soldiers" throughout the region.

This has not been a one way exchange in which NATO are the studious recipients waiting to receive gradual information in a piecemeal exchange. Methods and practices have evolved significantly, and have increasingly begun to yield some devastatingly real results.

To cite just one example for a single unit, over a period of 20 months several thousand enemy combatant targets were removed by extremely precise engagements for a remarkably low attrition rate of just 6 men. This represents a very real dynamic that can be brought rapidly to bear against the Taliban.

I stress the point that there is tension at all levels of the Chain of Command, on all sides. Capabilities have been proven, but have not yet been demonstrated in this region to the effect they have been a few thousand miles to the West in Iraq.

It is an expectation that Pakistan and NATO will emerge through this with an increased understanding rather than a purely adversarial outlook. I expect there will be a redeployment of forces, a shift of focus, and a greater degree of understanding about the mode of future integrations.

No external forces are welcome. That's not a problem. Expect vastly increased internal capabilities soon.

Task Force Black
 
AM,

Now it seems that GOP has sanctioned PA to react.

I won't believe that unless Zardari specifically issues statements saying that the PA and PAF is authorized to act to prevent US invasions into Pakistani territory.

Domestically the PPP is left with almost no choice but to tow the Gen. Kiyani line.

One sad outcome of this, if the US continues with such actions, will be that a moderate and progressive coalition, that represented taking Pakistan in a new direction, will be overthrown, either through coalition partners pulling out, or 'extra-constitutional' measures.

A free and fair election will then guarantee Nawaz a victory, and the direction he tried to take Pakistan in the last time he had power wasn't very appealing to say the least.

Quite sad really, that this attempt at democracy in Pakistan had to coincide with terrorism and economic events, regionally and globally, that are out of control.
 
The issue is one in which it has become increasingly easy to trace and track combatants that engage over either side of the border. Kindly note that the targets were "4 foot soldiers". They had engaged in recent operations, and were subsequently counter engaged. The balance of intelligence gathering has shifted significantly in this respect.

There are some sentiments here that this is some grand scheme to destabilise governments, or to play towards some geopolitical hidden agenda. This issue is one which is much more base than that. For a period of some 5 years now intelligence has been gathered on Taliban & Al-Q "foot soldiers" throughout the region.

This has not been a one way exchange in which NATO are the studious recipients waiting to receive gradual information in a piecemeal exchange. Methods and practices have evolved significantly, and have increasingly begun to yield some devastatingly real results.

To cite just one example for a single unit, over a period of 20 months several thousand enemy combatant targets were removed by extremely precise engagements for a remarkably low attrition rate of just 6 men. This represents a very real dynamic that can be brought rapidly to bear against the Taliban.

I stress the point that there is tension at all levels of the Chain of Command, on all sides. Capabilities have been proven, but have not yet been demonstrated in this region to the effect they have been a few thousand miles to the West in Iraq.

It is an expectation that Pakistan and NATO will emerge through this with an increased understanding rather than a purely adversarial outlook. I expect there will be a redeployment of forces, a shift of focus, and a greater degree of understanding about the mode of future integrations.

No external forces are welcome. That's not a problem. Expect vastly increased internal capabilities soon.

Task Force Black

Very interesting.

I have no issues with accurate drone attacks and the like, nor do I have issues with a PA redeployment, provided the US can act as a gurantor against Indian shenanigans.

Beyond the emotion generated by 'foreign invasion' the cause remains a worthy and just one. The terrorist threat has to be defeated, and whatever shortfalls Pakistan finds within its capabilites, (rogue, training, equipment ..whatever) need to be removed - some through its own endeavours, and others with US help.
 
Very interesting.

I have no issues with accurate drone attacks and the like, nor do I have issues with a PA redeployment, provided the US can act as a gurantor against Indian shenanigans.

Beyond the emotion generated by 'foreign invasion' the cause remains a worthy and just one. The terrorist threat has to be defeated, and whatever shortfalls Pakistan finds within its capabilites, (rogue, training, equipment ..whatever) need to be removed - some through its own endeavours, and others with US help.


Well PAK has 5 Lakh Troops , not all are deployed on Indian Boader. It may be lakh or 2.

The real reason is that PAK dont have any Authority in those region. Not Even PAK Army have any presense in that Area.

What is supposed to be done by PAK is now doing by US Army. Why PAK is not talking againt those Terriorst?

Where all 10 USD Billion gone which ment for tranning and Equip Forces gone? Their is serious Questoin to Answer?
 
Where all 10 USD Billion gone which ment for tranning and Equip Forces gone? Their is serious Questoin to Answer?

please dont tell uncle sam, i bought 10 billion dollars worth of **** that was suppose to be used for TOT.. :D
just kidding...
come on... US has spend trillions of dollars on TOT and they expect us to finish off terrorism from just 10 billion dollars??
 
hey mr niteshkjain what are you doing on this forum?:pdf:
friends i want to show what really mr nitesh tinks of all about this

his 1st post on i.d.f. on this same topic: The time for joint India US operation is coming close. De nuke pakistan that's all is needed rest everything will happen automatically

2nd post:sir somehow I feel the time is coming close. I am getting excited to see IN and USN ponding hell out of karanchi and gwadar and B 52 in escort of MKI pounding hell out of all facilities there and US and Indian commandos taking the nukes out of that country. this is on i.d.f you can go and chek.


if i have permission i can put the link.
i cheked his age and his avatr and they r same on both forums so i can,t be wrong.

SORRY IF I SAID SOMETHING WRONG

:lol: well even if you are wrong about this person.

Just look at the content that is the only idea Jewish Zionists and and Hindu Zionists are working for these days.

The joining of hands by these two zionisms is aimed at snatching Pakistani nukes.

Look at other Islamic countries. No one has nuclear power even if they are developing they are not in a stage where it could become a danger for Anti-Muslim world so the zionists have a plenty of time at their hands to take care of other Muslim countries.

If you look at the Muslim block it comes down to Pakistan and ends at Pakistan, futher is Bangladesh. Hence it is rightly said Pakistan is the fort of Islam.
So they are eyeing Pakistan first.
 
Exactly my point, that we will not do anything because there is no political will to do it and this time i doubt Kyani will go beyond the decision making of the political forces. But under any circumstances, a direct US assualt on Pakistan with both the democratic setup and the PA doing nothing about it will raise some serious feelings into the minds of oridinary emotional Pakistanis and they will be forced to think how secure they actually are specially since the nation literally cuts its stomach to feed the military and yet no one is there to defend them when the need arises.

A very near future assesment by icecold sir, & the correct 1 , i guss.
The problum isnt comming from the pakistani militry leadership , its HAMID KARAZAI & his opponent's (khalil zad) strugle for the leadership of the afgan drug mafia, a business which has producing trilions of dollors , with out any taxes.
Bush and his admintration, dont have any way out, they cant do any thing about it because they are the 1s who were indirect benifishries.
Gen. Kiyani feeling the danger now, after dumping his boss (musharaf) who was not good enough at that time for GEN.kiyani and for USA.
As ASIF (GHADARI) became the president of pakistan, CIA is about to unleashed! its next step of the game plan, which can make USAs basic intersts come in to reality.
1. dismentlling pakarmy and its ability to act against any kind of enemy's attack on pakistan.
2. once this target been achived, then there is a 1000% chance that, USA+EROUPE can ask pakistan's pupet goverment to hand over all the nukes and to dump all the nuclear technology forever.
if the above mentioned aims can be reached, then USA willbe willing to stationed its troops in side pakistan, so they can lanch any future insurgncy against, IRAN & CHINA???


GEN.kiyani's survival depends on how he tackle's the crunt situation. if he is just doing the lip sync, then its a very dangerous virus,& surly it will prvoke a backlash inside from army itself, & it can be bloody too. it all depends now on COAS , he doesnt have many choices now!
1. secure the power, secure the country, secure the nukes, put all these thugs back into jail, where they belong.
2.Bring back musharaf as C.EC, anounce ISLAMIC SOCIALIST REVOLUTION.
3.Tell USA of conditional support on WOT.
4. Start makig better ties with IRAN , to counter enrgy criss, increase co- oppreation with CHINA.
5. Tell all the diplomates, that they cant interfere in pakistan'S INTERNAL AFFAIRS specialy SAUDI ARABIAN prince! plz stay away.

Or, simply wait for ASIF(GHADARI) to take out the badges from his(COAS) shoulders???:angry:
 
:) Well umer did you find another statment by NATO too wherein it said that NATO had not taken part in any air or ground attack on Pakistani areas.


They are more than shamless creatures
 
Armed Forces capable to defend country’s frontiers: COAS
Updated : Thursday September 11 , 2008 9:41:43 PM


RAWALPINDI: Chief of Army Staff (COAS) Gen. Ashfaq Pervez Kayani has said that the Armed Forces were capable enough to defend the territorial frontiers of the country and would defend it at all costs.

The COAS was addressing the Corps Commanders Conference at GHQ here on Thursday. He said that Pakistan was capable of defending its frontiers and it would not bear any external aggression at into the country’s territorial frontiers as well as internal matters.

Kayani said that since 9/11, Pakistan was playing a vital role in the war on terror and conducted a number of successful military operations against terrorists throughout the country especially in the tribal region along Pak-Afghan border.

The military commanders discussed the security situation in the country in depth. All corps commanders and principal staff officers attend the conference.

The conference was held at a time when the US has commissioned "a new, more comprehensive military strategy for the region that covers both sides of that border."

Military sources say that the unilateral approach by the coalition forces would not bode well, nor the Pakistani people and their leadership would support such thinking.

The meeting also took up host of issues, including lingering situation in Fata and Swat areas where the operation is going on against the terrorists and those taking refuge in their hideouts.

The conference also discussed the issue of NATO forces’ attacks inside Pakistan, internal security situation of the country and violation of border rules by the US forces.

The COAS expressed his satisfaction over the assurance of the government to facilitate Pak Army with all facilities.

Kayani said that strong and impregnable defense was the need of the country to safeguard it from the external aggression therefore Pak army was committed to attain the invincible defense.

The two days Core-commander conference would continue today (Friday).:bounce:

http://www.aryoneworld.net/
 
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Afghan president supports change in US strategy
Updated at: 1825 PST, Thursday, September 11, 2008
Afghan president supports change in US strategy KABUL: President Afghanistan Hamid Karzai has welcomed the new strategy for military operation in the areas of Afghanistan-Pakistan border in America’s war against terror.

Addressing a press conference in Kabul, president Hamid Karzai said that his government has been asking for many years to take this step.

The US general, Michael Mullen had said on Wednesday that he approved a new and more comprehensive military strategy for the region including border areas between Afghanistan and Pakistan.

The United States said that these areas are safe shelters for extremists who are attacking the allied forces engaged in operation against Talibans.

President Hamid Karzai said that change in the strategy is enevitable and we should demolish hideouts and training centres of militants through joint operation in these areas.

this guy come out of his bunker and spell out only bullshit :sick::sick:

Afghan president supports change in US strategy - GEO.tv
 

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