Featured US blocks delivery of Turkish gunships to Pakistan

[Pakistan Space Agency]

Bro, things are not that simple.

Block 3 is a significant leap from older Blocks in the BVR engagement regime (AESA radar system; 11 hardpoints; PL-15 compatibility). Even then PAF need numbers, and F-16s will remain relevant due to very good reliability, speed, range, payload capacity, and sensor package.

If (or when) Americans are willing to give hardware to Pakistan, F-16 Bock 70/72 would be excellent choice because it is a major leap from Block 52+ and rock solid counter to Rafale.

I'm not denying Pakistan does not need the F-16s anymore just because we have Block-3s now, all I was trying to tell the brother is that the JF-17 Thunder in Pakistan Air Force today is a formiddable asset that shouldn't be taken lightly.

The Thunders in numbers of 200+ will make Pakistan Air Force one of the most powerful air forces in the world. After all, we are talking about a nearly 500 fighter aircraft armed air force.

 

[Pakistan Space Agency]

I thought you would have known better than to ask that question. Yes T-129s were tested exactly in the same method and terrains as the Z-10s. ...

No, I wasn't aware as I didn't follow the acquisition process of the T-129s in Pakistan as much as I did with the Z-10s.

... Second, why should have Pakistan cancelled the deal with the Turks in 2019? ... So cancelling the deal would have accomplished zilch, except to strain ties with a country that is one of handful to stand by you.

In my humble opinion, the T-129 decision is more political rather than ensuring Pakistan Army getting combat helicopters it needed last year.

From 2015 onwards, it's obvious that Pakistan had chosen China over the US in the Second Cold War so why on Earth would the US allow heavy duty military equipment to be supplied to Pakistan wherever it had influence?

No F-16s, Zulus or even training for Pakistan Army officers so why is anybody expecting the T-129s to land in Pakistan anytime soon?

 

[waz]

It was expected. Anyway it doesn't affect us. we should build better relations with Sweden, Ukraine and Russia.

Brother the Swedes are terrible with Pakistan. They went out of their way to humiliate Pakistan (Mush era) and openly leak to the press that they were rejecting Pakistan's request for the Grippen, due to it going to a 'sensitive' region. The hypocrites then bent over backwards to offer India with it's custom made Grippen. Yes the PAF got AWACS from them, but it's non-offensive.
The Russians are too tight with India.
Ukraine is a good bet. The UK and Italy are also nations to be worked with.

 

[GriffinsRule]

Brother the Swedes are terrible with Pakistan. They went out of their way to humiliate Pakistan (Mush era) and openly leak to the press that they were rejecting Pakistan's request for the Grippen, due to it going to a 'sensitive' region. The hypocrites then bent over backwards to offer India with it's custom made Grippen. Yes the PAF got AWACS from them, but it's non-offensive.
The Russians are too tight with India.
Ukraine is a good bet. The UK and Italy are also nations to be worked with.

They probably thought it would win them favor with India in the MMRCA tamasha

 

[Dalit]

Should Pakistan also end military to military relations with the US after so many debacles? The US was very desperate to reinstate military to military programs after Trump ended this hypocrisy. Only US is to gain with military to military exchanges. Influencing our top military leaders and reading their minds.

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

Should Pakistan also end military to military relations with the US after so many debacles? The US was very desperate to reinstate military to military programs after Trump ended this hypocrisy. Only US is to gain with military to military exchanges. Influencing our top military leaders and reading their minds.

Pak can always send their most “dumb” officer to the USA for the training.....

 

[HAIDER]

And 15 Cobras from RJAF

Who will buy RJAF Cobra ... These heli been retired Second time. There is no life left, may be for cannibalizations for parts. First served in Israeli airforce for decades, In 2013 Israel retired then RJAF adopted in 2015 and now they retired. These were surplus sitting in Israel.

 

[mingle]

Who will buy RJAF Cobra ... These heli been retired Second time. There is no life left, may be for cannibalizations for parts. First served in Israeli airforce for decades, In 2013 Israel retired then RJAF adopted in 2015 and now they retired. These were surplus sitting in Israel.

PAA should procure one Sqd of Z10ME along extra MI35 as stop gap meantime wait for turkish engine to mature we not in rush there are no military ops in country so we can wait

 

[abrar khan]

Who will buy RJAF Cobra ... These heli been retired Second time. There is no life left, may be for cannibalizations for parts. First served in Israeli airforce for decades, In 2013 Israel retired then RJAF adopted in 2015 and now they retired. These were surplus sitting in Israel.

Yes for spare parts, to utilise in existing cobra heli. As it seems difficult to get even parts from USA for existing fighters / heli. Our forces are in love to keep the vintage aircraft and heli from US, and these can be use to keep them alive for a certain period until we get Helis from other sources.

 

[Trango Towers]

Brother the Swedes are terrible with Pakistan. They went out of their way to humiliate Pakistan (Mush era) and openly leak to the press that they were rejecting Pakistan's request for the Grippen, due to it going to a 'sensitive' region. The hypocrites then bent over backwards to offer India with it's custom made Grippen. Yes the PAF got AWACS from them, but it's non-offensive.
The Russians are too tight with India.
Ukraine is a good bet. The UK and Italy are also nations to be worked with.

I am so glad these nations reject us. It forces us to develop our own. Long may embargoes continue. The day we get a leader the recognises that a cut in the defence spending of say 2% and give to R&D will have a huge impact on our future. We will have an amazing future

 

[abrar khan]

Should Pakistan also end military to military relations with the US after so many debacles? The US was very desperate to reinstate military to military programs after Trump ended this hypocrisy. Only US is to gain with military to military exchanges. Influencing our top military leaders and reading their minds.

Its already at its low, where neither the USA nor the Pak can squeeze more milk. China , Turkey and Italy will remain the suppliers cum partner in defence hardware. After BREXIT and COVID-19 UK is striving for more exports in every field as their economy is plunged , may be at this stage they can agree to supply us some defence products. Our top brass can look this as an opportunity and it seems right time to approach for high-tech defence products.

 

[SpaceMan18]

Who will buy RJAF Cobra ... These heli been retired Second time. There is no life left, may be for cannibalizations for parts. First served in Israeli airforce for decades, In 2013 Israel retired then RJAF adopted in 2015 and now they retired. These were surplus sitting in Israel.

I mean my nation of Bangladesh wanted T129s but then chose AH-64s which went no where , idk if they can get these Ah-1s but they seem like a good opportunity. But then again we don't have any dedicated attack helis, and I guess we can wait for the Turks

 

[Asian.Century]

Tragic to see what US has done not just Turkey and Pakistan as well:

 

[mudas777]

To be frank for the price we were paying (1.5 billion) we could have easily ordered 40 Super Cobras + Hell fire missiles and possibly gotten a lucrative upgrade package for the existing Cobras for free. That would have been 80+ deadly cobras able to launch hellfire missiles. but our generals wasted such opportunity.

I failed to understand you are missing the point here. US doesn't wants to sell us the Military equipment unless we full fill their requirements of joining their camp under their slave conditions. They refused to let us have the surplus Jordanian's F -16 sale to go through and if we try on now surplus Jordanian's cobras am sure outcome will be the same. So stop blaming generals or other personnel, things and time have moved on and so does Pakistan/US too. At the moment and for a foreseeable future the only thing from the Pakistan side on the table is trade and investments and from the US side is Afghanistan and some lolly pops and they don't count for much.
India is new darling for the US and they have got much bigger fish China on the agenda to fry and do you for a sec think India will let us to have Zulu's, cobras or block 70 etc? Indian/Jewish camp is holding the US establishment from their balls and they are loving it. Take a chill pill and don't waste your time on the boat we have missed instead count your blessing that traffic have delayed you to miss the boat in the first place.

 

[TigerOfMysore]

Policy makers need to understand - that US and PK interests are getting further and further apart.
This is a foregone conclusion.

Now the question is how long to run the facade of partnership, before things completely unravel. No one in the US is under any illusion that this PK/US alliance will fall apart. US is prepared and willing to stretch it as long as it can, giving it time to address the changing dynamics. PK is willing to stretch it because it is not a comfort zone for PK policy makers that they have a strongly adversarial US. Beside a few lingering questions around supplies and export also make it difficult for PK to split ties.

Likelihood will be that the US will work against PK interest, directly and indirectly. PK will pay this price for its shift towards China. PK needs to grow up fast, and adjust quickly. If PK is not able to convince the US that there is a high price to pay for PK directly opposing US interests in the region, the US will continue to weaken and unravel the State of PK. If PK can on the other hand convince that there is interest for the US for PK to stay on the sidelines, then there is some chance of coming out of this whole.

PK has to develop a working relationship with the US, where both sides understands each others red lines and stay within those.

Otherwise expect the following (US is not going to leave Afghanistan):

FATF Pressure
Institutional and Individual International Sanctions
Arms/Intel supplies to India
Sanctions and PR campaigns against PK on religious and minority rights
NGO based subterfuge
Attempt at UNSC sanctions
Afghan based attacks in FATA and Balouchistan
Balouch support for autonomy
Gilgit support for autonomy
Internal Political and Media 5th Column activation
Driving religious / ethno centric divisions
Law & Order challenges in order to drive/enable intellectual and intelligentsia exodus
High profile attacks to raises question on PK nuclear security