UK handovers Sea King helicopters to Pakistan Navy

[Cornered Tiger]

we have 12 we should have 12 more . there is order as i remember

Sir don't we have 6 only for Zulfiqar class? & Is there any order of this nature?

 

[niaz]

Why are my compatriot members always ready to “pooh- pooh” when it comes to US or UK built machines?

Before we start calling Sea King ‘Junk’ and praise Z-9, one must understand that these are two totally different helicopters and assigned to different roles in Pakistan Navy.

Firstly, a rotary wing aircraft even though an old design is not necessarily old. After its rotor blades and avionics & engines have been upgraded, an old design is as good as modern machine. For example Chinook helicopter first flew in 1962 or 65 years ago, it is still in front line service in the US and about the best heavy lift helicopter in the world. In 2015 India ordered 15 Chinook worth $3-billion.

Both the Harbin Z-9 as well as Sea King is based on 40 /50 year old design. Sea King based on Sikorsky SH3 (first flew in 1960) and Harbin Z-9 evolved from French AS365 Dauphin which first flew in 1975.

In Pakistan Navy, Z-9 is primarily carried on F22 Frigates and used in ASW as well anti-ship role armed with torpedoes. It is a relatively light helicopter with maximum take-off weight of 4,100 Kg or 9,000 lbs.

Sea King is a medium lift helicopter with maximum take-off weight at 9,550 Kg or 21,400 lbs. PN Sea King Mk45’s are shore based and fitted with Exocet anti-ship missiles in addition to the ASW warfare package.

Understand the 7 Mk4 Sea Kings in question have been refurbished and would be assigned to Search & Rescue duties.

Sea King is certainly not ‘Junk’ as some members have flippantly called it. We got them for a 'Song' and expect these Sea Kings will continue to provide sterling service to Pak Navy for quite a few years.

 

[khanasifm]

The new pn tanker can accommodate a single sea king size heli plus a z9 size heli in the hanger

 

[Liquidmetal]

I have been in a PK Navy Sea King (and allouette) and it is a very solid and reliable machine and will be a great edition to the navy esp since we got these very cheap and have refurbed them to give many years of great service. Kudos for a great choice.

 

[Aamir Hussain]

INMHO I have seen Seaking MK 45 doing transport/commando duties whereas they are best sutied for a more specialised role of ASW and Antiship roles. With the addition of the MK4's, the transport/Commando/SAR duties will taken over by these birds and leave the more expensive MK 45's to be used in the specialised roles that they were bought for.

They can also form a backbone for the helo support for the PN Marines.

 

[jamal18]

Why are my compatriot members always ready to “pooh- pooh” when it comes to US or UK built machines?

Before we start calling Sea King ‘Junk’ and praise Z-9, one must understand that these are two totally different helicopters and assign to different roles in Pakistan Navy.

Firstly, a rotary wing aircraft even though an old design is not necessarily old. After its rotor blades and avionics & engines have been upgraded, an old design is as good as modern machine. For example Chinook helicopter first flew in 1962 or 65 years ago, it is still in front line service in the US and about the best heavy lift helicopter in the world. In 2015 India ordered 15 Chinook worth $3-billion.

Both the Harbin Z-9 as well as Sea King is based on 40 /50 year old design. Sea King based on Sikorsky SH3 (first flew in 1960) and Harbin Z-9 evolved from French AS365 Dauphin which first flew in 1975.

In Pakistan Navy, Z-9 is primarily carried on F22 Frigates and used in ASW as well anti-ship role armed with torpedoes. It is a relatively light helicopter with maximum take-off weight of 4,100 Kg or 9,000 lbs.

Sea King is a medium lift helicopter with maximum take-off weight at 9,550 Kg or 21,400 lbs. PN Sea King Mk45’s are shore based and fitted with Exocet anti-ship missiles in addition to the ASW warfare package.

Understand the 7 Mk4 Sea Kings in question have been refurbished and would be assigned to Search & Rescue duties.

Sea King is certainly not ‘Junk’ as some members have flippantly called it. We got them for a 'Song' and expect these Sea Kings will continue to provide sterling service to Pak Navy for quite a few years.

Absolutely spot on. Many military items on service now are based on designs that are very old. Technically, I would argue that a refurbished machine is not as good as a new one, there is after all metal fatigue, you can only refurbish machines for so long. Also these machines take the pressure off newer, more expensive machines, making them last longer.
It is also about bang per buck, for a small outlay you get a massive increase in capacity.

 

[airmarshal]

RN Sea King HC4 are formidable platform. They are newer models of Sea King family than what we have in PN. The Sea King fleet Pakistan has was bought in mid 70s. Even after 40 years, its still is a modern platform.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westland_Sea_King

Commando and further developments
One of the most extensively modified variants was the Westland Commando, operated by the Royal Navy as the HC4.[11][12] The Commando had capacity for up to 28 fully equipped troops and had originally been developed to meet an Egyptian Air Force requirement.[13] Due to the deletion of the amphibious capability, not required in the Egyptian desert, the most noticeable change from the Sea King was the deletion of the side floats, the main undercarriage being carried on stub sponsons. An improved variant of the Egyptian Commando, with changes including the fitting of folding blades common to the ASW variants, was designated as the Sea King HC4 by the Royal Navy and all the aircraft were new build. First flying on 26 September 1979, due to its operational range of up to 600 nautical miles without refuelling, the HC4 'Commando' became an important asset for amphibious warfare and troop transport duties, in particular.[13][14] Several Royal Naval Air Squadrons have operated the Commando variant, such as 845 Naval Air Squadron, 846 Naval Air Squadron and 848 Naval Air Squadron. In British service, the Sea King HC4 was deployed on operations in the Falklands, the Balkans, both Gulf Wars, Sierra Leone, Lebanon and Afghanistan.

 

[Cornered Tiger]

In Pakistan Navy, Z-9 is primarily carried on F22 Frigates and used in ASW as well anti-ship role armed with torpedoes. It is a relatively light helicopter with maximum take-off weight of 4,100 Kg or 9,000 lbs.

Sir, are we operating Z-9EC in anti-ship role? I haven't seen yet any... Please clarify me.

 

[khanasifm]

I think 3 are used in sar/ transport role while remaining 3 have dipping sonar so long range anti sub role for short /medium range ship has its own anti sub torpedo and multi barrel dept charged

Heli can fly out to 100-150 mile out to find and fire torpedos at sub if detected by mother ship and guide heli in the vicinity where heli can search using dipping sonar to locate and deploy on board two mk46 type light torpedos

This can also be true for the new pn tanker ( room for sea king plus one z9 type ) if it has own board radar / sonar plus its sea king can also engage surface targets with Exocet type weapon

 

[khansaheeb]

Welcomed move between two nations that have similar interest

Not really welcome , these helicopters have a poor safety record:-
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_accidents_and_incidents_involving_the_Westland_Sea_King

That'
s why the sea helicopters were retired after 36 years of age.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

This is old junk UK is dumping on Pakistan, because scrapping these dinosaurs will cost them money

So they (UK) sent in Royal Marines who grabbed Pak Navy officers and then with guns on their heads "dumped" the helicopters on them. Then they forced them to fly to Pakistan with this "dumped junk".

 

[echo 1]

All the Helo's Pak Navy using,

View attachment 399342 View attachment 399343 View attachment 399344 View attachment 399345

Are the Lynx still operational?

 

[khanasifm]

If its good for the president its good for me https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marine_One

 

[tarrar]

Why can't PN go for better helicopters for its navy? The Z-9 Chinese helicopter was a good selection made by PN & they should explore for better option options.

 

[Arsalan]

Are the Lynx still operational?

no they were retired back in 2012