UAE ISRAEL Peace Agreement

[Lincoln]

We are one of the most poorest nations on earth. We are not in a position to even help ourselves let alone other Muslims or anyone else for that matter.

We should help how we can. I am a progressive liberal, but honestly, that doesn't mean I forsake Pakistan's identity and its founder's vision. That's my nationalist point of view.

Secondly, from a realistic point of view as well. Having relations with Israel won't make us rich. The position we're in isn't because we refused to have relations with Israel. It is because of our own direct incompetence in statesmanship. Sure having relations with Israel might help us here and there, but it's nothing we can't get from any other nation in the world.

I do think we should develop relations, but not, and never, at the compromise of Palestine. But it's not because I think it will make us rich or better. There are other reasons, reasons which saved Egypt from an invasion by Israel in the 50's.

 

[LeGenD]

I agree with all you said....constraints and limitations in the eyes of the world is what stops bullies from doing unimaginable things. Yet America deployed MOABs in afghanistan and israel white phosphorus in built up areas.

Bro,

100% agreed with highlight part. You lost traction in the next statement.

Any WAR will turn UGLY for a while; white phosphorus and depleted uranium rounds are small issues. Big bombs were dropped in the Tora Bora mountain region where militants seek shelter in custom-built/natural hideouts; these bombs were not dropped on towns and cities at any point in time in Afghanistan. Both countries never went utterly ballistic on their respective subjects in Lebanon and Afghanistan - extermination of the subject nation was not desired in either case (selective targets and political objectives instead). Humanity and international factors come into play in some way or form.

It is not wise to 'escalate' enmity with a nuclear-armed military juggernaut nevertheless - you never know when one would loose its cool and say ENOUGH (recall World War II). Iran did not manage to achieve anything for Palestine, and ended up harming itself instead. Once again, I will stress that it is much better to choose your battles wisely.

 

[PakSword]

@PakSword
just see the google map to see how Palestinians and Jews are living together, All of the Palestinians are pushed out of their land dear.they are living in other countries. Just see at least once the google map to see the reality which is far worse for Palestinians. then be neutral Sir.

That's why I am saying, the ones who are living on the remaining land should get some form of relief..

Or if we have strength, lets attack Israel.. I have no problem with that..

Whatever land Palestinians are left with, they should be allowed to live freely there.. grow their food and be able to export that too.

You know how much it's difficult to export even olive oil for them? Here I know many locals and Pakistanis who buy Palestinian olive oil that's 3-4 times more expensive just to support them.

Either agree to absorb them in Muslim countries (which they will not agree of course), or do something..

 

[Iltutmish]

I don't like the fact that people are belittling the Ummah concept in Islam.

What happened to "Tera Mera Rishta Kya?"

What I like about Pakistanis is that they have so much sympathy for other Muslims. A Pakistani village boy without having access to water or education will tell you that he is ready to fight everywhere on earth where a fellow Muslim is opressed. Pakistans strong Islamic identity made us like that. And this is beautiful.

BUT

Please tell me what did we get from our slavish like attitude towards the Arabs? They treat our expats badly and don't support us diplomatically regarding our foreign issues. And many Arabs think that they are superior to other races (LOL IKR) and they are more "muslimish" than others due to their ancestry (if they knew something about Islam they wouldn't bring up ancestry, skin color and so forth as prove for being a Super-Muslim but this is a story for another time).

The Arab-Israeli conflict is a NATIONALIST one, not an Islamic one. Why should we suffer or fight in wars for some desert people? What did we get in 1967? Pakistans army is not the private property of a dictatorial royal family.

My suggestion:
You don't have to necessarily recognize Israel as state, but stop making this a Muslim-Vs-Non-Muslim-Conflict. It's an Arab-Nationalist-vs-God-Knows-Conflict. Just make sure that Muslims have access to their holy sites in Israel/Palestine and be done with it. Palestinians are not our friends either. They can dream their NATIONALIST dream on their own. No need to drag Pakistan into it.

Poor Palestinian President Mahmud Abbas hugging Modi:

Do you know what the Ummah needs? The mindset of our founding fathers! But for this we need a strong Pakistan with a big economy, a big military and strong diplomatic relationsships (you get only relationsships if you are an economic and military power).

Think global (save the Ummah) but for gods sake act LOCAL. Pakistan should be our main concern, you first check your own house, after you cleaned the mess at your space you can go abroad and help others to handle their problems.

 

[ZAC1]

Even the suffering Palestinians are richer than Pakistanis and have a higher standard of living than we do

Where? Go check the ground reality first.
People talk about economy life style bullshit.this is not for what we are sent.how can a Muslim live in peace if their bro sis mother Muslim is in pain.? Just answer this simple question

 

[Trango Towers]

And us Pakistanis are in a far worst state than that. We are so poor that we have to go in our millions to the UAE and other GCC nations. The same nations that are now allies with Israel.

Actually bro I do not agree.
Us pakistani speakw with two tongues.
We spend many many lakh to go there yet same money could be used to make good business in pakistan..
But mind set is

Nokri Karni hai

 

[AZ1]

Political opinions are banned in the UAE and Saudi Arabia, unless they're in favor of the Government. If someone protests, they're jailed. There are no surveys on it. Right now, literally no one knows what is the representative political opinion of their populations. They're given a good life by their states, that is all they care about, a good and easy life.

This is not political issue but muslim issue. In saudia there are ulema specially i think in abqaiq or taif area where they do protest and I think will emrge from those area as well but in order to have impact they must gather huge crowd.

 

[Lincoln]

That's why I am saying, the ones who are living in the remaining land should get some form of relief..

Or if we have strength, lets attack Israel.. I have no problem with that..

Whatever land Palestinians are left with, they should be allowed to live freely there.. grow their food and be able to export that too.

You know how much it's difficult to export even olive oil for them? Here I know many locals and Pakistanis who buy Palestinian olive oil that's 3-4 times more expensive just to support them.

Either agree to absorb them in Muslim countries (which they will not agree of course), or do something..

Israel knows what they're doing. They keep it this way so Palestine is never able to build up enough resources to threaten them. I won't be surprised if the condition in any future deal will be that Palestine cannot have an army, only a police force.

 

[Lincoln]

This is not political issue but muslim issue. In saudia there are ulema specially i think in abqaiq or taif area where they do protest and I think will emrge from those area as well but in order to have impact they must gather huge crowd.

It is a political issue in essence. Not religious. Those scholars who protest in Saudi Arabia, even if they express disapproval of some policy, even if it is the Imam-e-Kabah, the scholar is removed.

In these two countries, the Friday sermon is drafted by the Government. Not the imams of the mosques. They monitor everything.

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

We should help how we can. I am a progressive liberal, but honestly, that doesn't mean I forsake Pakistan's identity and its founder's vision. That's my nationalist point of view.

Secondly, from a realistic point of view as well. Having relations with Israel won't make us rich. The position we're in isn't because we refused to have relations with Israel. It is because of our own direct incompetence in statesmanship. Sure having relations with Israel might help us here and there, but it's nothing we can't get from any other nation in the world.

I do think we should develop relations, but not, and never, at the compromise of Palestine. But it's not because I think it will make us rich or better. There are other reasons, reasons which saved Egypt from an invasion by Israel in the 50's.

How can we help ANYONE when we ourselves are one of the most impoverished nations on earth who can't even help ourselves? In fact the Palestinians are more richer and have a far greater standard of living than Pakistanis do. What help can we EXACTLY give them? Can you explain and be specific? So in reality, Pakistanis are suffering more at the hands of fellow Pakistanis than the Palestinians are under Israeli rule.

 

[Lincoln]

That's why I am saying, the ones who are living on the remaining land should get some form of relief..

Or if we have strength, lets attack Israel.. I have no problem with that..

Whatever land Palestinians are left with, they should be allowed to live freely there.. grow their food and be able to export that too.

You know how much it's difficult to export even olive oil for them? Here I know many locals and Pakistanis who buy Palestinian olive oil that's 3-4 times more expensive just to support them.

Either agree to absorb them in Muslim countries (which they will not agree of course), or do something..

That's true, something immediately needs to be done about it. But the conditions would be no less than the dismantling of Palestinian militant forces, which quite frankly don't give much resistance anyways.

 

[PakSword]

Israel knows what they're doing. They keep it this way so Palestine is never able to build up enough resources to threaten them. I won't be surprised if the condition in any future deal will be that Palestine cannot have an army, only a police force.

One step at a time.. For now, the priority is to save Palestinians from immense suffering.
A person living in a far away land can't understand. Even I couldn't understand their suffering until I met some Palestians in UAE who have been divided and they can't meet their loved ones back home.

I believe that their will be a war eventually, but until then, all the Muslim countries should forget their differences and come on the table to just save the palestinians now..

 

[Lincoln]

How can we help ANYONE when we ourselves are one of the most impoverished nations on earth who can't even help ourselves? In fact the Palestinians are more richer and have a far greater standard of living than Pakistanis do. What help can we EXACTLY give them? Can you explain and be specific? So in reality, Pakistanis are suffering more at the hands of fellow Pakistanis than the
Palestinians are under Israeli rule.

Well it certainly depends on which part of Pakistan, and which sub-group you're talking about.
In terms of help; diplomatic help.

 

[AZ1]

It is a political issue in essence. Not religious. Those scholars who protest in Saudi Arabia, even if they express disapproval of some policy, even if it is the Imam-e-Kabah, the scholar is removed.

In these two countries, the Friday sermon is drafted by the Government. Not the imams of the mosques. They monitor everything.

I know about saudia and their removal of imam. I also know they don't say anything against kingdom but then there were in past who did protest and no where to be seen. But this thing will hurt public sentiments for sure and if any cousin of royal family emerge in these time public along with scholars will support them and refuse MBS. With funds, public and scholar things can be done.

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

Where? Go check the ground reality first.
People talk about economy life style bullshit.this is not for what we are sent.how can a Muslim live in peace if their bro sis mother Muslim is in pain.? Just answer this simple question

What help can poor, impoverished Pakistanis give when they can't even help themselves?