U.S. Military Taught Officers ‘Hiroshima’ Tactics for ‘Total War’ on Islam

[VCheng]

Then you might wish to check my arguments with pakdefender - they were based on well-established logical facts as well.

However "well-established" they may seem to you, it is true that you presumed that in this particular case, the Officer was running a contingency scenario and not based on blind hatred for Islam/muslims. Although such a "presumption" cannot yet be proved by "well-established" facts.

Wrong again. What I said was that his course was part of such an educational process. I already have stated that the final investigation report will establish it to be the case or not as to his motive, avoiding that presumption on my part.

 

[pakdefender]

Both of the above are merely personal opinions about hypothetical situations, proving nothing, and therefore rather pointless for discussion.

Ok may I ask , how to do think America can win 'Total War' against Islam as the topic says so ? same question for S-19 as he seems to think that he has proven that America can win a War against Islam

Sure America can hit the Holy sites but can they really win a War against Islam ? there is no way they can but lets hear it from all the american cheer leaders , with all their logic , on HOW america can win a war against Islam

 

[gambit]

Why the outrage in America when Iranian govt wants to encourage discussion and invites people to talk about the holocaust and Jews

Outrage is not the same as censorship. Can you show me where in America does the academic institutions forbid the discussions of the Holocaust?

 

[pakdefender]

Outrage is not the same as censorship. Can you show me where in America does the academic institutions forbid the discussions of the Holocaust?

In America and in Europe no one is allowed to question the narrative of the Holocaust , debate on the number of Jews killed by the Nazis will never be allowed

 

[gambit]

Once again, we are not talking about idle chatter in the mess hall, but an official course whose whole purpose is to explore viable options. I am fairly certain the US military doesn't waste their soldiers' time on nonviable options.

Are you telling me that military academies in Pakistan have nothing similar?

You spoke of 'extreme' views and the ones in this course qualify.

So how does defending academic freedom turn to associating Al-Qaeda's ideology to that of 'mainstream' muslims'?

You are simply restating the premise, not providing any new arguments.

No need to present any new arguments when the current criticism about Dooley is proving to be problematic for you.

I am taking this one silly hypothetical (for Muslims) and applying it to other groups to show the absurdity of the extrapolation.

Not too long ago, it was absurd for dedicated muslims to attack Americans on US soil, even after the WTC towers had a failed underground parking garage bomb, it was still absurd and quite hypothetical.

Yawn. Shifting topics so soon?

Do not like it when the table is turned?

What is alien is the application of common sense. As I wrote, Dooley can do anything he wants in his private capacity, but, when he is speaking on behalf of the US military in an official course, then his 'freedom of speech' is very much limited. He must abide by certain guidelines which, one would hope, would be conformant with official pronouncements of the US govt.

Did he? The removal of his 'course', if we are to be generous and call it that, was not because of its intellectual absurdity but because of its social and political sensitivity, as in we are bending over backwards to accommodate overly sensitive muslims sensibilities. No one in the muslim world give a damn about Christian and Jewish sensitivities.

 

[anonymus]

Ok may I ask , how to do think America can win 'Total War' against Islam as the topic says so ? same question for S-19 as he seems to think that he has proven that America can win a War against Islam

Sure America can hit the Holy sites but can they really win a War against Islam ? there is no way they can but lets hear it from all the american cheer leaders , with all their logic , on HOW america can win a war against Islam

Your argument is fallacious.It violates the very definition of total war.

In total war,Enemy civilians and industrial and social facilities are targeted.It is easier for USA to win a total war compared to a limited war.

 

[gambit]

In America and in Europe no one is allowed to question the narrative of the Holocaust , debate on the number of Jews killed by the Nazis will never be allowed

Am interested in the US. Can you show me any federal and/or state laws that forbid discussions about the Holocaust. Remember, give only US laws.

Don't you think you are going some what off topic. Just think about it if there was a course for genocide of Jews what would happen to the guys who started the course. I mean even an inadvertent remark ends peoples careers with charges of anti anti semitism

Is Dooley presenting his discussion in Mecca? Or is he presenting it in the US in an academic setting? So what is preventing a bunch of imams creating a course on how the wipe Israel off the map in Mecca or in Abbottabad? Not a damn thing. Nice try on misleading.

Let them try.
Wars are won with mighty hearts and belief. Turn pages of islamic history and you'll see. No matter how divided muslim world is right now, attack on the Holy Land will clear all divisions. Besides power will shift from USA in next 20 years and then what?

Dooley's model does not based upon the current division in the House of Islam but upon the premise that this House is united and is waging an all out war upon the West.

Lt Col Dooley contradictions himself in his presentation , at one poin in his presentation he has listed AQ stratergy to make America do things that will discredit the US in Muslim countrires than like a moron he goes on to say they they should do Hiroshima on Makkah and Madina , as if that will give a boost to America's credibility in Muslim countires

Sound like US military officers have lost the plot .. these are signs of defeat

I doubt that you actually read Dooley's presentation and am willing to bet my next year's salary that if you ever meet the colonel and engage him in a genuine intellectual debate about the subject, he would wipe the floor with you.

 

[pakdefender]

Your argument is fallacious.It violates the very definition of total war.

In total war,Enemy civilians and industrial and social facilities are targeted.It is easier for USA to win a total war compared to a limited war.

No it cannot win , american military requires a lot of life support to function whcih at the moment it gets from pro-western implants in muslim countries , 'Total War' will mean a break down of this life support system the US military will be very in-effective

 

[anonymus]

No it cannot win , american military requires a lot of life support to function whcih at the moment it gets from pro-western implants in muslim countries , 'Total War' will mean a break down of this life support system the US military will be very in-effective

Dear total war means that America would simply Carpet Bomb it's enemies leaving no one alive to cause trouble afterward.Leave aside nukes even a fuel-air bomb has a destructive power of 0.5 Kt nuke.

Again,you should make your mind clear as to whether you are seeking clarification about "total war","war" or "limited conflict".

 

[gambit]

There is no such contingency for nuking Bogota and Sao Paolo to fight the war on drugs (which has gone upwards of $15 trillion and several decades).

There is no such contingency for nuking Kinshasa and Capetown to retaliate for Somali pirates.

Do you know why?

Because it is UNTHINKABLE to apply collective blame and punishment for those actions to an entire group of people. The US administration has repeatedly stated that the US applies the same logic to terrorism and does NOT view it as a collective Islamic issue. This course runs completely counter to the official statements of the US administration and makes liars out of them.

That argument failed a long time ago. The 'war on drugs' is about the conflict within everyone who may or may not chose to destroy him/herself in self interest. No state or ideology is involved. However, if the drug cartels managed to unite under one banner, take over any Central and/or South America country, and begins to act like a state, then that is a different course of discussion. Your attempt to mislead failed. Again.

The issue here is not Lt. Dooley's private thoughts. He is free to speculate and write books on them. The issue is the promotion of this attitude to military personnel in an official capacity at a US military academy.

Of course it is. This is about freedom of speech in an academic setting. Must be difficult to grasp.

 

[pakdefender]

Am interested in the US. Can you show me any federal and/or state laws that forbid discussions about the Holocaust. Remember, give only US laws.


Is Dooley presenting his discussion in Mecca? Or is he presenting it in the US in an academic setting? So what is preventing a bunch of imams creating a course on how the wipe Israel off the map in Mecca or in Abbottabad? Not a damn thing. Nice try on misleading.


Dooley's model does not based upon the current division in the House of Islam but upon the premise that this House is united and is waging an all out war upon the West.


I doubt that you actually read Dooley's presentation and am willing to bet my next year's salary that if you ever meet the colonel and engage him in a genuine intellectual debate about the subject, he would wipe the floor with you.

yeah I read the duffer's presentation , its available online here

http://www.wired.com/images_blogs/dangerroom/2012/05/dooley_counter_jihad_op_design_v11.pdf

Go to slide 11 and read the heading he has made under 'AQ Military Strategy' which states :

'Provoke America into actions across the Muslim world that will destroy its credibility and that of the "apostate" regimes that it supports'

stupid idiot also used the cover of a time magazine story on slide 21 .. lol

 

[gambit]

No it cannot win , american military requires a lot of life support to function whcih at the moment it gets from pro-western implants in muslim countries , 'Total War' will mean a break down of this life support system the US military will be very in-effective

This nonsensical whatever it is indicate you have no arguments left and must resort to vague generalities.

 

[King Solomon]

No it cannot win , american military requires a lot of life support to function whcih at the moment it gets from pro-western implants in muslim countries , 'Total War' will mean a break down of this life support system the US military will be very in-effective

I already, clearly explained to you that US can nuke Mecca/Medina and get away with a total war on Islam. ALL of your arguments were proven false. Maybe you need to refer to our previous discussion in this topic?

 

[gambit]

yeah I read the duffer's presentation , its available online here

http://www.wired.com/images_blogs/da...design_v11.pdf

Go to slide 11 and read the heading he has made under 'AQ Military Strategy' which states :

'Provoke America into actions across the Muslim world that will destroy its credibility and that of the "apostate" regimes that it supports'

stupid idiot also used the cover of a time magazine story on slide 21 .. lol

Good...Then what does slide one say?

 

[pakdefender]

Its interesting to note that the presentation starts with 'So what can we do?' which seems to indicate that they have run out of options and all the weapons that they have been using till now have not got them the result they wanted!

This is is implicit acceptance of defeat!