Turkish Naval Programs

[-SINAN-]

ANKARA - CHP Genel Başkan Yardımcısı Sezgin Tanrıkulu, LPD Havuzlu Çıkarma Gemisi ile ilgili ihale sürecinin kamu menfaatleri açısından araştırılması amacıyla Meclis Araştırması açılmasını istedi.

Gerekçe bölümünde Tanrıkulu, Savunma Sanayii Müsteşarlığı, Havuzlu Çıkarma Gemisi (LPD-Landing Platform Dock) projesi için bilgi istek dokümanı yayınlayarak, projede ilk adımın atıldığını ifade etti. Savunma Sanayii Müsteşarlığı'nın proje hakkında Bilgi İstek Dokümanları ile ilgili (BİD) son başvuru ve bilgi edinme tarihini de 4 Mayıs 2007 olarak belirlediğini dile getiren Tanrıkulu, "Anadolu Deniz İnşaat Kızakları A.Ş, Çelik Tekne Sanayi ve Ticaret A.Ş, DEARSAN Gemi İnşaat Sanayi A.Ş, DESAN Deniz İnşaat Sanayi A.Ş, İstanbul Denizcilik Gemi İnşa San ve Tic. A.Ş, RMK Marine Gemi Yapım Sanayi Deniz Taşımacılığı İşletmesi A.Ş., SEDEF Gemi İnşaatı A.Ş. ünvanlı şirketler teklife çağrı dosyası almışlardır. Mayıs 2011´de Sedef Gemi İnşaatı A.Ş, RMK Marine Gemi Yapım Sanayi Deniz Taşımacılığı İşletmesi A.Ş ve DESAN Deniz İnşaatı San. A.Ş ünvanlı şirketler proje için tekliflerini sunmuşlardır. RMK Marine Gemi Yapım Sanayi Deniz Taşımacılığı İşletmesi A.Ş´nin teklifte bulunduğu LPD Havuzlu Çıkarma Gemisi, büyük kısmı MİLGEM (Milli Gemi) projesinde çalışmış olan emekli deniz subaylarından oluşan Türk mühendisler tarafından dizayn edilmiştir. İhaleyi kazanan Sedef Tersanesi projeye İspanyol Navantia Şirketi ile ortak girmiş ayrıca teklif ettiği İspanyol Juan Carlos sınıfı LPD´nin mühendislik hizmetlerinin İspanyollar tarafından verileceği açıklanmıştır. İhale öncesinde İspanyol Navantia Tersanesi´nin büyük mali sıkıntı çektiğini ve kapanmak üzere olduğu, mali verilerinin çok kötüleştiği ve adeta bu proje ile hayat bulduğu da İspanya basınında yer alan haberlerde belirtilmektedir. İhaleyi kazanan Sedef Tersanesi´nin mali sıkıntı içinde olduğu, 400 milyon Avro borcu olduğu ve personel maaşlarını 4-5 aydır ödeyemediği, sektörden alınan bilgiler olarak ülke basınında yayınlanmış, projenin 200 milyon Avro'yu aşan teminat yükümlülüğünü de Sedef Tersanesi´nin karşılama gücünün olmadığı iddiası yankı bulmuştur. Ayrıca, Sedef Tersanesi´nin sahibi gözüken Metin Kalkavan´ın hisselerinin yüzde 90´ını Recep Tayyip Erdoğan´ın içlerinde petrolcü ve altıncı yakınları olmak üzere avenesinden müteşekkil bir konsorsiyuma sattığı iddiaları da mevcuttur." diye konuştu.

İhale sürecinde önemli ayrıntılardan birisinin ihale sırasında en düşük teklifin İngiliz BAE System ile ortak tasarladığı proje ile ihaleye katılan RMK Marine Gemi Yapım Sanayi, Deniz Taşımacılığı İşletmesi A.Ş tarafından verilmiş olmasına rağmen fiyat teklifleri verildikten sonra firmalardan iki defa indirim istenmesi olduğunu belirten Tanrıkulu, RMK Marine Gemi Yapım Sanayi, Deniz Taşımacılığı İşletmesi A.Ş fiyat teklifini değiştirmediğini kaydetti.

Tüm bunlarla birlikte ayrıca, LPD-Havuzlu Çıkarma Projesi işinin Sedef Tersanesi´ne (SEDEF Gemi İnşaatı A.Ş) verildiğinin açıklanması sonrası projede yapılan bazı değişikliklerle maliyetin kasıtlı olarak artırıldığı, ihale bedelinin 800 milyon Euro´dan 1.2 milyar dolara çıkartıldığı ve kamu aleyhine 400 milyon Euro tutarında bir zarar oluşturulduğu iddiasının mevcut olduğunu anlatan Tanrıkulu, "200 milyon Euro tutarında bir paranın TÜRGEV adlı vakfa aktarıldığı iddiası ise dikkat çekicidir. 27 Aralık 2013 tarihinde sedef tersanesi ile sözleşme imzalanacağının açıklanmasından önce nisan 2013 ve 27 eylül 2013 tarihlerinde Recep Tayyip Erdoğan'ın sedef gemi inşaatı A.Ş şirketi sahibi Metin Kalkavan ile yaptığı iddia edilen ve Recep Tayyip Erdoğan'ın daha sonra doğruladığı telefon görüşmeleri sonucu her ne kadar Milgem Projesi ile ilgili telefon görüşmeleri olsa da havuzlu çıkarma gemisi- lpd projesi ihalesinde de ihalenin en az teklifte bulunan koç grubuna değil de Metin Kalkavan'ın sahibi olduğu Sedef Gemi İnşaatı A.Ş'ye verilmesinin tesadüf olamayacağı, ihale sonucunun tamamıyla Recep Tayyip Erdoğan'ın kararı ile belirlendiği, RMK Marine Gemi Yapım Sanayi Deniz Taşımacılığı İşletmesi A.Ş şirketinin ihale sürecinde bezdirilerek elenmiş olduğuna dair güçlü kuşkular mevcuttur." diye konuştu.

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Google translate

ANKARA - CHP Deputy Chairman Sezgin Tanrikulu, LPD Amphibious Ships pool of public interests relating to the procurement process in terms of the opening of the Parliamentary Research asked to investigate.

Rationale section Tanrikulu, Defense Industry Undersecretariat, Pool Landing Ship (LPD-Landing Platform Dock) for the project by issuing a request for information document, taken the first step in the project, he said. Defense Industry Undersecretariat about the project Request for Information Documents related (RFI) deadline and learn the history of the May 4, 2007 set the voicing Tanrikulu, "Anatolia Marine Construction Guides Inc., Steel Craft Industry and Trade Co., DEARSAN Shipbuilding Industry Co, DES Inc. Marine Construction Industry, Istanbul Maritime Shipbuilding Industry and Trade. Inc., RMK Marine, Shipbuilding Industry, Maritime Transport Enterprise Co., PEARL Shipbuilding Inc. to offer the above mentioned companies call files were extracted. in May 2011 Pearl Ship Building Co., RMK Marine, Shipbuilding Industry, Maritime Transport Enterprise Inc. and DES Marine Construction sec. Inc. names companies for project proposals submitted. RMK Marine, Shipbuilding Industry, Maritime Transport Enterprise Inc. 's bid the LPD pool Landing Ship, the majority MİLGEM (National Ship) worked for a project, a retired naval officer consisting of Turkish engineers was designed by. winning bidder Sedef Shipyard project Spanish Navantia Company and joint ventures have also offered the Spanish Juan Carlos class LPD will be given by the Spanish engineering services are explained. Before bidding on the Spanish Navantia Shipyard to close the huge financial trouble and that the financial data is very poor and almost come to life with this project which is reported in the news media in Spain. The winning bidder, Sedef Shipyard's in financial distress, which is 400 million euros owed and staff salaries for 4-5 months could not pay, industry information received from the country's media published on the project's 200 million exceeding the guarantee liabilities also Sedef Shipyard meet, the power is not the claim was echoed. In addition, the text appears Sedef Shipyard owns 90 per cent of the shares of Kalkavan Recep Tayyip Erdogan oilman and sixth in the interior, including relatives allegedly sold to a consortium consisting of aveneu are also available. "He said.

In the bidding process important details one during the tender the lowest bid British BAE System partners with design with the project involved in the tender RMK Marine, Shipbuilding, Marine Transport Enterprise Inc. given by despite quotations after giving from companies twice a discount is requested, indicating that the Tanrikulu, RMK Marine Shipbuilding Industry, Maritime Transport Enterprise Inc. to change the offer price, he said.

All therewith also the LPD-pool Removing Project job Sedef Shipyard to (PEARL Shipbuilding Corporation) provided that the disclosure after the project made some changes cost intentionally be increased, the tender price of EUR 800 million from 1.2 billion is removed and the public against 400 million Euro damage that created the claim was available describing the Tanrikulu, "200 million euros a money TÜRGEV's foundation is transferred claim is striking. Dec. 27, 2013 on psoriasis shipyard signed with the announcement prior to April 2013 and 27 September 2013 the Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan s psoriasis shipbuilding Inc. company owner Text Kalkavan with his alleged and Recep Tayyip Erdogan later confirmed that the phone calls as a result, although Milgem Project related phone calls, though the pool removing gemisi- lpd project tender, the tender at least offer ram groups rather than text Kalkavan owned psoriasis Shipbuilding Inc. to be given to the coincidence can not be the tender outcome completely Recep Tayyip Erdogan's decision as determined by RMK Marine Shipbuilding Industry Marine Transport Enterprise Inc company in the bidding process bezdirilerek there is a strong suspicion that it is eliminated. "he said.

 

[ANMDT]

net bir bilgi verilemez zaten surekli olarak donanma yenilenecek planda olan bu , tf 100 belki 2020 lere dogru goruruz aktif olarak , tf-2000 icinde 2023 lerde celik tekne isi bitmis olur diye ongoruyorum, 2025-27 arasinda aktif olarak donanmaya katilir
Gabyalara da o vakite kadar kapsamli bir tamirden gecer, yapisal ,celik olarakta yenilenme yapilir diye dusunuyorum

***
Replied upon a question of a possible delivery time,

There is nothing can be told clearly about possible delivery of ships , TF 100 can be seen in 2020 i expect so , and for TF 2000 , its steel works will be done in 2023 and launched , or earlier.
Until that moment, Gabya class may receive a complete repair to make them safe while sailing ..

ANKARA - CHP Genel Başkan Yardımcısı Sezgin Tanrıkulu, LPD Havuzlu Çıkarma Gemisi ile ilgili ihale sürecinin kamu menfaatleri açısından araştırılması amacıyla Meclis Araştırması açılmasını istedi.

Gerekçe bölümünde Tanrıkulu, Savunma Sanayii Müsteşarlığı, Havuzlu Çıkarma Gemisi (LPD-Landing Platform Dock) projesi için bilgi istek dokümanı yayınlayarak, projede ilk adımın atıldığını ifade etti. Savunma Sanayii Müsteşarlığı'nın proje hakkında Bilgi İstek Dokümanları ile ilgili (BİD) son başvuru ve bilgi edinme tarihini de 4 Mayıs 2007 olarak belirlediğini dile getiren Tanrıkulu, "Anadolu Deniz İnşaat Kızakları A.Ş, Çelik Tekne Sanayi ve Ticaret A.Ş, DEARSAN Gemi İnşaat Sanayi A.Ş, DESAN Deniz İnşaat Sanayi A.Ş, İstanbul Denizcilik Gemi İnşa San ve Tic. A.Ş, RMK Marine Gemi Yapım Sanayi Deniz Taşımacılığı İşletmesi A.Ş., SEDEF Gemi İnşaatı A.Ş. ünvanlı şirketler teklife çağrı dosyası almışlardır. Mayıs 2011´de Sedef Gemi İnşaatı A.Ş, RMK Marine Gemi Yapım Sanayi Deniz Taşımacılığı İşletmesi A.Ş ve DESAN Deniz İnşaatı San. A.Ş ünvanlı şirketler proje için tekliflerini sunmuşlardır. RMK Marine Gemi Yapım Sanayi Deniz Taşımacılığı İşletmesi A.Ş´nin teklifte bulunduğu LPD Havuzlu Çıkarma Gemisi, büyük kısmı MİLGEM (Milli Gemi) projesinde çalışmış olan emekli deniz subaylarından oluşan Türk mühendisler tarafından dizayn edilmiştir. İhaleyi kazanan Sedef Tersanesi projeye İspanyol Navantia Şirketi ile ortak girmiş ayrıca teklif ettiği İspanyol Juan Carlos sınıfı LPD´nin mühendislik hizmetlerinin İspanyollar tarafından verileceği açıklanmıştır. İhale öncesinde İspanyol Navantia Tersanesi´nin büyük mali sıkıntı çektiğini ve kapanmak üzere olduğu, mali verilerinin çok kötüleştiği ve adeta bu proje ile hayat bulduğu da İspanya basınında yer alan haberlerde belirtilmektedir. İhaleyi kazanan Sedef Tersanesi´nin mali sıkıntı içinde olduğu, 400 milyon Avro borcu olduğu ve personel maaşlarını 4-5 aydır ödeyemediği, sektörden alınan bilgiler olarak ülke basınında yayınlanmış, projenin 200 milyon Avro'yu aşan teminat yükümlülüğünü de Sedef Tersanesi´nin karşılama gücünün olmadığı iddiası yankı bulmuştur. Ayrıca, Sedef Tersanesi´nin sahibi gözüken Metin Kalkavan´ın hisselerinin yüzde 90´ını Recep Tayyip Erdoğan´ın içlerinde petrolcü ve altıncı yakınları olmak üzere avenesinden müteşekkil bir konsorsiyuma sattığı iddiaları da mevcuttur." diye konuştu.

İhale sürecinde önemli ayrıntılardan birisinin ihale sırasında en düşük teklifin İngiliz BAE System ile ortak tasarladığı proje ile ihaleye katılan RMK Marine Gemi Yapım Sanayi, Deniz Taşımacılığı İşletmesi A.Ş tarafından verilmiş olmasına rağmen fiyat teklifleri verildikten sonra firmalardan iki defa indirim istenmesi olduğunu belirten Tanrıkulu, RMK Marine Gemi Yapım Sanayi, Deniz Taşımacılığı İşletmesi A.Ş fiyat teklifini değiştirmediğini kaydetti.

Tüm bunlarla birlikte ayrıca, LPD-Havuzlu Çıkarma Projesi işinin Sedef Tersanesi´ne (SEDEF Gemi İnşaatı A.Ş) verildiğinin açıklanması sonrası projede yapılan bazı değişikliklerle maliyetin kasıtlı olarak artırıldığı, ihale bedelinin 800 milyon Euro´dan 1.2 milyar dolara çıkartıldığı ve kamu aleyhine 400 milyon Euro tutarında bir zarar oluşturulduğu iddiasının mevcut olduğunu anlatan Tanrıkulu, "200 milyon Euro tutarında bir paranın TÜRGEV adlı vakfa aktarıldığı iddiası ise dikkat çekicidir. 27 Aralık 2013 tarihinde sedef tersanesi ile sözleşme imzalanacağının açıklanmasından önce nisan 2013 ve 27 eylül 2013 tarihlerinde Recep Tayyip Erdoğan'ın sedef gemi inşaatı A.Ş şirketi sahibi Metin Kalkavan ile yaptığı iddia edilen ve Recep Tayyip Erdoğan'ın daha sonra doğruladığı telefon görüşmeleri sonucu her ne kadar Milgem Projesi ile ilgili telefon görüşmeleri olsa da havuzlu çıkarma gemisi- lpd projesi ihalesinde de ihalenin en az teklifte bulunan koç grubuna değil de Metin Kalkavan'ın sahibi olduğu Sedef Gemi İnşaatı A.Ş'ye verilmesinin tesadüf olamayacağı, ihale sonucunun tamamıyla Recep Tayyip Erdoğan'ın kararı ile belirlendiği, RMK Marine Gemi Yapım Sanayi Deniz Taşımacılığı İşletmesi A.Ş şirketinin ihale sürecinde bezdirilerek elenmiş olduğuna dair güçlü kuşkular mevcuttur." diye konuştu.

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Google translate

I keep telling since first time , Sedef is the worst choise ever , not because of navantia but because of themselves .Navantia recently had troubles with their Submarine project for spain, in trials the submarine submerged , but couldnt surface . The reason wasnt issue about pumps of systems, just the ship was too HEAVY . so the whole design done wrong and production wasnt followed well.

On the other hand , i have seen how much of design knowledge delivered to RMK marine just with a little collaboration for LPD project , to their engineers, consider how much of knowledge will be gained if they were achieved tender. But it wont be same for Sedef , because they dont have ANY of engineers qualified on design.

S-80-class submarine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Navantia Gets US Help To Fix Overweight Sub | Defense News | defensenews.com

 

[ANMDT]

ozel tershaneler son 5 yilda askeri edinim kazanmaya basladi ( muharebe gemisi hususunda ) , ki ozel tershaneler teknolojik acidan cok dusuk durumdaydi , son zamanlarda gelismeye basladilar.
Askeri tershanede yapilmasi onemli,cunku oradaki personel ve muhendis yeterince o konularda tecrubeli .
Gemi , tank veya helikopter gibi seri uretebilecegin bisey olmadigi icin, ilk seferde prototip uretiyormus gibi davranamiyorsun, o yuzden ilk gemilerdede cok dikkatli olunmasi gerekiyor.
Ayrica tf-2000 hatlari cok yillardan beri belli, sadece alt teknolojilerin gelismesi bekleniyor, CAFRAD , ve geminin diger ana unsurlari yerli uretilmeden, gemininde uretilmesi manasiz.
Gemi dizaynindan ,spiralle ilerlenir . Spiralin en disindan en icine gittikce detay artar, yan projelerde ilerleme kaydedildikce, gemininde uretimine yaklasilmis olur.
Ozel tershanelerde son zamanlardaki ortak uretim, dizayn ,ve bilge transferi ile tecrubeler kazanmaya basladilar, zaten milgem icin ihale cikildi, ancak yenilecenek . Diger milgemlerde ihale cikar zamanla.

*** replied on reply about private shipyard cooperation of state.
Private companies in turkey gained Warship production capability in last 5 years . Even they had very low techs in production, they had to improve all to have a compete in tenders.
Its important to build 1st ship in Navy shipyard since its not something like a prototype as if seen in Tanks or Helos , its a direct product will be delivered. Thats why a focus and care needed in 1st ship even in 2nd and 3rd .
Curves of TF 2000 had been already decided since years ago , just sub systems developments are being awaited like CAFRAD and other critic parts in electronics, optics , IR and etc. without those systems handled in indigenous way ,its useless to build our own air defence frigate.
Ship production proceeds within a spiral, as you reach to center, details are increased and with outputs from outher projects and subsystems , the production is getting closer.
For milgem a tender has done, cancelled and will be renewed.

 

[ANMDT]

Askeri tershanenin uzerinde dusundugun gibi buyuk bi yuk zaten yok, ki milgemde zaten dedigin yapilacak, ihalede ilk gemi ortak yapilip , sonraki gemiler ozel tershaneye yaptirtilacak.
Mesele sadece muhendiste bitmiyor, boru ustasindan elektrik ustasina, kaynakcisina, CNC cisinde herkesin egitim almasi gerekiyor.
Bizzat sahid oldugum,sahil guvenlik gemileri yapilirken ( ki milgem kadar kritik gemi degiller ) , tershanede her geminin kontrolunde sonra yuzlerce duzeltme cikiyordu , insaatin her asamasini donanma gelip kendi bizzat takip ediyor .
Tershanelerimiz ticari gemi insaasinda bile 10-20 senelik teknolojileri kullaniyorken, birdenbier askeri gemi yapacak teknolojileri istememiz mantiksiz, bizim alacagimiz gemi 5-10 olsun , o kadar yatirim degersiz olur, ne zaman disariya gemi yapmaya baslariz, veya o tershaneler baska islere yaptiklari isler sayesinde dahil olur, o zaman dedigin gibi tam koordinasyon baslar.
Askeri gemi ureten 5 tershane var , bunlardan sadece 2 si dizayn ofise sahip, ve son 5 yilda askeri gemi ile ilgili tecrube kazandilar ( 1-2 tanesi onceden de destek gemileri ile ilgili tecrubeye sahip )
ihaleyi almamis bi tershaneye de , durduk yere egitim vermek mantiksiz, ki zaten Savunma sanayi m. Devamli olarak tershaneler ile koordinasyonlu ilerliyor, onlarinda gelismesini desterkliyor, koordinasyon donanma bazinda olacak bisey degil.
Projelere ise zaten ozel sirketler ve enstituler destek veriyor, ozel sektorden destege ihtiyac oldugunu dusunmuyor, onlarin sadece uretime dahil olmasi yeterli.
Isin acikcasi, bizde AUSTAL , Bath iron works, gibi gemi dizayn edip uretbilcek, ve bunu yapmasi ihtimal dahilinde olacak bir tershane bile yok .

***
Replied on reply about Overload on Navy shipyard.

There is no overload on Navy shipyards, they are handling civilian works also beside military works , and handling all in once. Already collaboration is being done with private shipyard , there are tenders about it . Its not only about engineer to train , but also all employers in welding, CNC ,electrician , technician etc should be trained .Military production is so far different with Commercial ship production.
As i seen by myself, while SAR ships being build , Navy was following all small steps and deliver hundreds of re-marks ( correction ) in every check , even those ships not seen critical as Milgem.
Its not affordable to ask shipyards those are installed with 10-20 years old 3rd generation shipyard subsystems to increase 4th generation while there is no guaranteed production . number of ships turkey would buy will be 10 at most, and not profitable to improve all at once. when ships received some tenders intentionally, these shipyards may go through impovements.
There are 5 main shipyard builds up Military ships 2 of them had a seriously working design office within themselves with R&D , and its not usefull to train all shipyards by saying " just in case ".
To clear it out, there is no shipyard we had like AUSTAL or Bath Iron works to collaborate on design , development and even one shipyard with possibililty of being such. ( 5th generation shipyard, with production line, R&D and design by themselves )

** all translations are done @Bismarck

 

[atatwolf]

Why does companies like dearsan, rocketsan, aselsan all have san at the end?

 

[-SINAN-]

Why does companies like dearsan, rocketsan, aselsan all have san at the end?

San is the abbreviation of "Sanayi"

 

[xxxKULxxx]

@ Çay Bahçesi

 

[Kamil_baku]

***
Replied on a request about Official chairs not answering upon answers sent online by mert can and why ships are not complated yet .

Its not possible to achieve one information about neither from Undersecratariat of Defence Industry or From Turkish Navy sources before than security clearance level is dropped to restricted ,or unclassified. During its in phase of "Secret" thats not possible . To illustrate situation, Torpedo development programme began about 5 years ago , 4 years ago torpedo's concept was cleared out , size, speed and weight was decided , tests were done regardly to these values both in acoustics and hydrodaynamic drag . but we heard of it this project about 1 year ago or 2 when security clearance reached down to restricted.

The main issue is Milgem called as corvette class, isnt about its armanement or size, even size is reached to frigate , instruments on vessel can be seen to be advanced corvette, but ship has capability of handling more armanement than it has currently. This ship called to be corvette because 1st steps of project decided to develop a 70-80 meters of corvette , upon researchs done by professional people on this subject ,it was also seen world has a tendency to smaller , handy ships like corvettes. Later ship's sizes expanded with more requests and new installations needed with changes in region.
As example to this armanement issue, Recently built SAR ships can be showed, they are looking like just SAR, but in fact they are built in way to be warships in case of emergency . they are installed with adequate systems , and chracteristics to handle this. thats why its delivery delayed.

they are called corvettes in case turkey sell it to other countries(middle eastern or Azerbaijan or other central Asian countries, not to get complains from other players like USA, Russia ..

 

[ANMDT]

they are called corvettes in case turkey sell it to other countries(middle eastern or Azerbaijan or other central Asian countries, not to get complains from other players like USA, Russia ..

İts highly related to history of project on the sizes of vessel ,once i could drop in library of university i will share picture of that design . Also in a free time,i will share the mentioned research on world's trend in military ships, that is done before milgem started.
There are further projects to be called frigate, and still will be sold to other countries .

here is the speech given by Yücel Odabaşı who is considered to be father of milgem, also the mentioned research done by him .

İlk hedef: Korvetler


However, some allegedly lost share of the cake in Israel, as a result of German and European companies lobbying persuaded the Navy MİLGEM project has been suspended.

his extensive research on the subject for months without completing Naval Forces had received shortly before a sudden decision to remove from the agenda again took over the project.

Thus, the coordination of all private sector university consortium between the Navy and the signing of the outer found in the middle of the road was happening.

Taşkızak and puddles built in large ?? small landing craft and 80 class coast guard boats in the growing design and workmanship success, especially last generated coast guard boats 100% Turkish design to be $ 1.5 million, labor savings and nearly half of domestic material ratio Turkish engineers were excited and şevklendir. That form had the courage to start MİLGEM project.

Professor Yucel Odabaş'ı: 12 corvettes will produce

Handing on the subject at the beginning of the project the most authoritative party, Prof. Dr. Yucel talked with Odabaş. Professor Odabaşı says: 'Environmental conditions, technology, the environment needs and cyclical changes in parallel with the Turkish navy in preparation for some input as to balance it. MİLGEM project was born. Enabling a remote point may seem like there is an issue. Duration of the project is the main reason behind the disruption. Is Turkey can do it, whether or not we thought for a long time? Elapsed time it has passed the evaluation. Supply industry has been the evaluation phase. To encourage a number of areas had to be uncovered. Then it was entered on financing some preparations. These are very serious matters and require large amounts. This is the case anywhere in the world. Finance costs should not be confused with the ship costs. System integration that takes certain amount of money for it. MİLGEM project and billions of dollars will be prevented from escaping to the outside. Therefore, this project is one of the biggest projects in Turkey. "

Yucel Odabaş'ı currently Turkey's ship purchases on the choice of whether, in which the ship if they get him had said: "But MİLGEM project design we will make the situation will come. Therefore preferred the right will increase. MİLGEM project currently 4 + 4 + 4 in the form of a total of 12 corvettes produce have started. single ship cost $ 160 million. Financing extent of the problem can evaluate. every ship until 2006 navy gain is planned. corvettes alone who can move, fight and manoeuvrable vessels are. these are the ideal ship for Turkey in the Aegean. Larger states outside the corvette almost all states have moved toward. Turkey on this issue is not too late. takes into consideration everything we have, "he says.


"Gölcük and Taşkızak shipyards activities started very successful results gave. Especially the German boat design and design technology, benefiting from guided missile frigate, frigates and submarines in the construction to advanced levels reached. Taşkızak our shipyards activities started very successful results gave. Taşkızak shipyards lurs the Verft in cooperation with the Harpoon missile capacity gunboats from Doğan class 4 ships, wind class 4 ships, Star class 2 ship is made of ongoing projects under the Star class ships' construction is underway. submarine production under the German Hovaldswerk shipyard with a thousand ton class submarine production began, six submarines were produced. second stage thousand 400 ton class Preveza and Sakarya submarine produced and very special technologies, this ship two of the construction still continues. German Meko Concept of the Turkish reviews can call Yavuz class of ships started with the construction frigates in the program Blohm und Voss and Hovaldtswerk shipyard in cooperation with four ships and Barbaros class 2 vessels are manufactured. This program will be equipped with the vertical launch system the last two ship TCG TCG Salih Reis Kemal Reis F with F 246 ,F 247, the construction is ongoing.

Reached the boat should point design and design capabilities, as well as of the size of the Turkish Navy is one of the biggest navy in the Mediterranean. Our country is a peninsula at the same time, however, the Black Sea and the Mediterranean and the Aegean have to float the ship. Greece against Turkey tensions policy must be conducted in a controlled effort on the arms of Greece is the power, the Greek air force and navy have been working almost constantly on the alert level. Greece in the Aegean using the advantages of the lobby on the United States naval forces in terms of the balance is willing to turn in their favor. In previous years, the ship took over Greece needs. Monitor these developments closely to promote Turkey, where the technological level, to eliminate foreign dependence in order to prepare for the future and the navy has produced two important projects. These projects are TF 2000 and MİLGEM project. Turkey has achieved technological know-how at the same time assessing their own needs in the design, engineering, systems integration technologies like the 21st century, this project hopes to practice with. MİLGEM project having historical significance in this respect is a project for Turkey. "

What is the situation in the world fleet?

Professor Dr. Based on the information we received from Yucel Odabaşı what kind of corvette vessels that were investigated. Currently, a total of 600 working in the world's oceans close to 200 frigate under the age of 10. In addition, 100 more are being built frigates. Among them, 5 thousand 400 tons of boats, so many varieties to 200 thousand ton vessel type and tonnage of the ship's.

Two thousand - four thousand tons, on the high seas can function, four thousand nautical miles more than the cruise capable, 40 -60-day self-contained ,submarine, air defense and surface warfare used in the strong arms equipped with a large surface vessels to the "frigate" it said .

In recent years, the world fleet in order to eliminate the weakness of the gunboats on the very rinse and frigates will replace the alleged another platform Prof.Odabaşı well as the exalted; corvettes.

The world fleet in the "corvette" vessel working under the name 275 and 70 units under construction ... Corvettes of the first frigate in the background is smaller than the tonnage stands out. Therefore, some differences in weapons and equipment available. However, to be effective in each of the three main naval battles as well as the ability to move the helicopter.

New trend: Corvettes are

We met some sailors "could sink a frigate with missile salvos when you can get a large number of gunboats, frigates buy big and expensive one is meaningless," they say.

"About ten years ago, some countries, small and fast gunboats are great warships predilection began. Israel's Eilat named destroyers in 1967, two Egyptian gunboats beats with missiles after the sinking of the world's smaller countries' naval forces many of the various types of assault boats have purchased . "

Small and fast gunboats, which are very popular and the demand for this type of warship increased during the years in an extraordinary way, the makers of warships, frigates began to think of the market disappear.

Gunboats on the orientation of the corvette

Israeli gunboats philosophy attaches great importance to the war on closer examination, it seems that turning to classic corvettes of gunboats. For example, a frigate design with excellent Saar, left in place in case the Saar 5 corvettes and this new ship type. The same trend is seen in some other naval forces. But not without different ideas about it.

For example, in the Navy for many years, who served a retired colonel in this regard says: "A great ship money to be spent on instead of six small warships, the idea apparently is attractive. However, modern missiles and weapon systems equipped with small vessels, is quite complex and in a variety of systems and sub-systems for the Navy a huge financial burden brings. small and fast gunboats limited size as a result of these ships more staff can not be. Hence these vessels for teaching purposes can not be used. frequent opening to the sea, this small ship large ship than they wear out quickly and the old. "

The Soviet Union in the 1960s, its allies and Third World countries located between the friendly countries, a large number of "Komar" type missile gunboats, with subsequent and more complex "Os" type gunboats from the gave. "Osa 1" and "Os 2" types, some countries in the Navy, the former "Shershun the" type was used in conjunction with torpedo boats. These small vessels, the place slowly "Pauker" and "Tarantule" type corvettes and "Matka" class hovercraft to the left.

A wide range of vessels from the Soviet navy gunboats averse, there were weapons systems. Upgrading of the size of gunboats, is seen as an inevitable trend, but at this time, and the advantages of a small assault boat had disappeared. In addition, the exact location of the missiles did not take the ball because the ball and heavy machine guns "soft" targets of attack and defense against air attack missions were important weapons system. Small gunboats, protection against air attack force consisted targets. Missiles, rockets and bombs against the air strikes, gunboats were unable to approach their target, they must be equipped with some air defense weapons had become. So it had to be enlarged to the size of gunboats.

This view also of the way the world navy "corvette" type began to turn to. For example, Israel is equipped with CIWS and lightweight helicopter carrying three LAHAV class (SAAR 5) had bought a corvette. France and Germany, a new ship from a thousand to two thousand tons of family entered into a collaboration to develop and BREE called Car 20 Corvette was offered to the world's oceans.

India made 400 thousand ton corvette, but Pauker and Tarantule class 56 m from Russia. missile corvettes bought in the neck. Italian firm Fincantieri 660 tons 62 m. Wader class corvette made in the neck; six in Iraq, six had sold to the Ecuadorian Navy.

Swedish Navy, the first class of 50 m ago in Stockholm. two in length, then the 57 m long Gothenburg class corvettes built 4.

Peterson Builders company, Saudi Arabia Al Siddiq Navy 9 58 m of class A, 4 x 75 m long by Badr class corvettes were sold in that country.

What should Turkey do?

Until recently, quite old, used US consisting of the Turkish navy ship recently made some purchases began to change with the shell. However, many of the economic life of existing platforms has been completed, performances and strike force is very low and difficult to maintain.

Given the nature of this force air defense of Turkey in particular has some shortcomings. However, the United States, although sometimes we want to pay money to remove the difficulty in making ships, Turkey's defense industry has necessitated the review of the policy. Here in this context, the Turkish Navy laid the foundations of the MİLGEM project. On the other hand the current threat by many naval officers, tasks, considering the theater is not in the Turkish navy frigates and corvettes type ships in Turkey to meet the needs of the most suitable vessels that are being expressed.

Who coordinated the project, According to Yucel Odabaşı today's frigates equipped with highly sophisticated systems, large-diameter ball, with low-frequency sonar boats and helicopters. However, not too expensive, too costly supply and maintenance. Corvettes and almost joined a frigate to effectively perform all kinds of operations, the tonnages ranging from about 700 -- 1,400 tons platforms. relatively affordable cost compared to frigates are built with. So the money will be divided into two frigates and 5 corvettes can be made. 1 corvette cost of $ 160 million. To produce approximately 12 Corvettes will cost $ 2 billion to Turkey. Experts in this case Turkey will be in the billions of dollars of profit are specified. The economic and political turmoil in our country, this type of projects could adversely affect. However, with strategic insight and prescient Navy Commander Admiral Salim Dervişoğlu closely involved with the project is known.

Navy pupil of the Turkish Armed Forces for a moment before realizing this project will proud up our people.

 

[mert can]

iso kardeş gerçekten çok sağlam bilgi verdin yani tam sonuna kadar okudum çeviriyle yani tam olarak anlamasamda anladıgım kadarıyla verdiğin bilgiler gerçekten harika zaman gerekli herzaman problemler çözülür elbet ama siyasal çıkarlar için bu Tür büyük projelerin kaderini kötüye oynamasak daha iyi olucağından yanayım yani donanmanın bir an önce isteklerine cevap verilmeliki bizlerinde gözlerimize cevap verilmeliki hem biz hemde donanmamız sevinsin her modern gemisiyle

 

[ANMDT]

iso kardeş gerçekten çok sağlam bilgi verdin yani tam sonuna kadar okudum çeviriyle yani tam olarak anlamasamda anladıgım kadarıyla verdiğin bilgiler gerçekten harika zaman gerekli herzaman problemler çözülür elbet ama siyasal çıkarlar için bu Tür büyük projelerin kaderini kötüye oynamasak daha iyi olucağından yanayım yani donanmanın bir an önce isteklerine cevap verilmeliki bizlerinde gözlerimize cevap verilmeliki hem biz hemde donanmamız sevinsin her modern gemisiyle

Bilgiyi ben vermedim , ITU de profesor olan,merhum Yucel Odabasi vermis zamaninda, " ilk hedef korvetler " yazan yerde , linkin turkcesi de var, linke tiklarsan ulasabilirsin.

***
i didnt give the information, its a speech given by professor in Istanbul tech. Un. deceased , Yucel Odabasi, if you click on the link " ilk hedef korvetler" you will get the orginal turkish document.

 

[Neptune]

iso kardeş gerçekten çok sağlam bilgi verdin yani tam sonuna kadar okudum çeviriyle yani tam olarak anlamasamda anladıgım kadarıyla verdiğin bilgiler gerçekten harika zaman gerekli herzaman problemler çözülür elbet ama siyasal çıkarlar için bu Tür büyük projelerin kaderini kötüye oynamasak daha iyi olucağından yanayım yani donanmanın bir an önce isteklerine cevap verilmeliki bizlerinde gözlerimize cevap verilmeliki hem biz hemde donanmamız sevinsin her modern gemisiyle

99 depremi yuzunden DZKK'nin neredeyse butun projeleri gunumuze kadar ertelendi. Normal şartlar altinda bizim MILGEM, TF-2000 ve Levent sınıfı LHD'yi bir kac yil oncesinden denize indirmis olmamamiz planlanmisti. Ustune bi de davalarla butun seçkin subaylar tasfiye edilince su an bile halen yapilmaya çalışılan, DZKK'nin yetki ve sorumlulukları icerisinde bulunan, ülkenin karşı istihbarat ve dış istihbarat faaliyetlerinin devamini sağlamak. Yeni yeni bu ertelenmis projelere baslaniyo.

 

[xxxKULxxx]

Ok, at last S&H(162, Pg. 91) there is Logistic Support Ship's design and some infos...

Length : 102,29 m
Width : 16,00 m
Propulsion : 2x1380 kW
Living quarters : 53 personel
Fuel Capacity : 4.012 F-76 MDO & JP5 Helicopter Fuel
Mission : Fuel, Food, Clothing, Equipment, Building Materials, Personnel Transport & Medical Assistance, Ship Maintenance Repair Assistance...

Damn, i was expecting capability of munition supply also but there is not !!!...

Anyways, here is the design...

And now i add this design and update the list...

Current Status...

 

[mehmet75]

What does "equipment" stand for ?
Guns. Ammo etc . İ think.

kafanı duvarlara vurmana gerek yok bence

 

[xxxKULxxx]

What does "equipment" stand for ?
Guns. Ammo etc . İ think.

kafanı duvarlara vurmana gerek yok bence

It's my bad translation... it stands for 'ekipman'...

So i can keep hitting my head to wall...