Tracing Arya Samaj in Karachi

[Jackdaws]

All hindus should return to INDIA. We have simplified citizenship rules for all non-Muslim of Pakistan .


Jawahar LAL nehru khan of Muslim congress league party brought Muslim rule again in INDIA with help of angrej and Muslims. Hindus kept fighting Muslim rule of Congress for the last 70 years. Finally we have started towards achieving Hindu rashtra .

WhatsApp forward nahin, book padha karo.

Cliftonite,
We are deviating, but I will answer your questions.
1. The word Muhajir should no longer be used. Pakistan has its share of immigrants just like the USA and Canada . A generation later the children of those who migrated proudly call themselves Americans or Canadians, not immigrants. Which is why I leave my own origins to guess work. We are all proud Pakistanis ( period).

2. We have already discussed Indian Muslims at length. They helped the establishment of Pakistan and paid a fearful price. They are fighting a grim battle for themselves and there is nothing Pakistan can do for them. We can sympathize but in silence as the enemy knows that to hurt Pakistan psychologically the easiest way is to torture, murder, and oppress Indian Muslims. We must not be seen to care even though we do. Indian Muslims can't fight for Pakistan because they do not control any geography other than the 70,000 fishermen living on the Laccative Islands . Even Kashmiris ( if we are to count them as IM ) are in a majority only in the valley. Other than that there are no cities, towns or regions where IMs are in a majority. For minority to fight in a majority environment is suicide. No minority population without a geographical footprint and access to an international border to a friendly state has ever won a conflict. Even Bangladesh though a Muslim Majority region is hemmed in and has no access to a friendly neighboring territory.
So to conclude:
1. Pakistan cannot help Indian Muslims.
2.Indian Muslims cannot help Pakistan.
Indian Muslims should not be reviled and cursed for not fighting for Pakistan.,

Now help me find Risala e Vartaman an Arya Samaj Urdu journal published from Lahore one hundred years back.,

Indian Muslims don't like BJP. They are hardly under siege.

 

[El Sidd]

WhatsApp forward nahin, book padha karo.

Jack is teaching Acchu again.....

 

[Jackdaws]

Jack is teaching Acchu again.....

Lol, did I teach him before?
The way BJP and its followers have demonized Nehru - it's absurd. That man is largely responsible for India having world class labs and techs despite being third world. If some Gowalkar / Godse had been in charge, they'd be injecting us with cow urine instead of vaccines.

 

[Surya 1]

Keywords: Arya Samaj, Aryaveers, Shuddhi Movement, Reconversion of Muslims, Arya Samaj activity in Pakistan (Punjab), Arya Samaj activity in Pakistan ( Sindh), Arya Samaj activity in India ( reconversion of Indian Muslims).
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Attention Mods: @krash @waz @The Eagle :
Only if you permit, I would like to revive this thread (or start a new thread), in response to our guests from India (below) and provide them a forum to voice their opinion on the key topics as above.
These guests repeatedly attempt to derail other threads with their assertions, and troll posts that Indian and Pakistani Muslims were earlier "Hindus" ( Sanatanis) and hence must convert back to "Hinduism" ( Sanatan Dharma) . Since the Arya Samaj movement in Pakistan and India espouses exactly such a theory this thread might be an appropriate place on this forum to discuss this topic, even though this thread discusses temples rather than the Arya Samaj reconversion movement.This was the closest thread I could find on the topic.
Would it be appropriate to rename this thread:

"Arya Samaj, the reconversion movement in Pakistan & India"

It is not intended to make this thread into a flame bait or troll dump but to restrict the discussion solely to the topic of the success (or otherwise ) of the Arya Samaj movement in Pakistan which was established in Lahore on 24 June 1877. The movement had started in India in Bombay in 1869 but it moved from a regional movement to a global effort after it was reformed and reorganized in Lahore. Given the fact that the Arya Samaj movement started in Pakistan and with the rise of Hindutva in India revisiting this trend is important since it has implications for Pakistan's security. The earlier attempts to reconvert Sindhi peasants and Rangar Muslims in Punjab were not very successful and reconversion activity declined after 1948. The current effort seems to be aimed at the secular or agnostic section of our urban educated society.

The thread is also intended to gather data provided by the Indian members here on how successful the movement has been in India and now that is joined with the Hindutva movement. The shuddhi movement started in Sindh and Punjab ( Pakistan) has now morphed into the gharwapasi movement in post-Independent India.

The discussions here may lead to ideological or religious topics which would be discussed without malice or insult solely on the basis of available knowledge with a strict adherence to forum rules.
As moderators would request you to closely monitor thus thread with the usual warnings and censures for forum rule violations. If the discussions get too volatile, the thread could be locked, though this is not likely because our Pakistani members would like to keep the tone of the discussion strictly academic.

_________________________________________________________________
@achhu @Surya 1 @Bambi @MilSpec @Juggernaut_Flat_Plane_V8
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The posts from different threads are copied below:









My next post on this thread will be on the resistance to the Arya Samaj movement in Pakistan by the Ahmediyya community and a brief history till partition.
Would like inputs from @masterchief_mirza , @Cliftonite and others on this topic.

Arya samaj was a great movement take people of this subcontinent back their route of Vedas. Swami ji's vision was"ved taraf pachhal valo" meanch return back to Vedas. It was interesting to make this society Aryas means people with best actions. Pakistan being a subcontinent country having great Hindu legacy will have to return back to Vedas We have seen that foreign relation has bring nothing good to Pakistan society. It has helped in regression of the country. Untill Pakistan goes back to its routes, happiness will not to Pakistan society.

 

[Baibars_1260]

Arya samaj was a great movement take people of this subcontinent back their route of Vedas. Swami ji's vision was"ved taraf pachhal valo" meanch return back to Vedas. It was interesting to make this society Aryas means people with best actions. Pakistan being a subcontinent country having great Hindu legacy will have to return back to Vedas We have seen that foreign relation has bring nothing good to Pakistan society. It has helped in regression of the country. Untill Pakistan goes back to its routes, happiness will not to Pakistan society.

Surya,
Thanks for a very insightful post. Always welcome your contribution to the discussions here.
Could you read my previous post #24 ( a portion is referenced below), and comment. I have a whole bunch of questions on the article.

Refer below please:

Ram Ratan Bhatnagar, in his book The Rise and Growth of Hindi Journalism, notes:

“The bane of this style was that it was too emotional and irrational. It did not decorate itself with literary ornaments. Nor did it care much for accuracy.”

Swami Dayanand, the founder of the Arya Samaj, was deeply influenced by his guru, Swami Virjanand, who believed in cleansing India of all contaminating elements – like any other religion apart from Hinduism – and bringing back her glory of the pre-Krukshetra war recorded in the Mahabharata. This vision entailed an attempt to wipe out all faiths from the face of India, also giving the movement its militant character. Swami Dyanand’s death was followed by schism within the Samaj with the wing led by the likes of Pandit Lekhram who acquired a militant and violent approach particularly towards Islam.

Question:
1. Is the Arya Samaj in India today following Swami Virjanand's legacy?
By what date does the Arya Samaj hope to achieve the goal of
cleansing India of "all contaminating elements"?

Swami Dyanand’s death was followed by schism within the Samaj with the wing led by the likes of Pandit Lekhram who acquired a militant and violent approach particularly towards Islam. This aggressive approach continued to grow out of all limits of reason, sensibility and decency. The obscene and vulgar language against the God and the founder of Islam used in their street lectures and publications ought not to be repeated here, but can be read in the judgments given by courts in lawsuits filed by Muslims against the Aryas.

2. Does the Arya Samaj in India still publicly abuse Islam, Muhammad and Allah in street corner meetings as directed by Pandit Lekhram?

3. In India was Swami Agnivesh a follower of Pandit Lekhram? Is there still a schism within the Arya Samaj in India?

4. The shuddhi movement started in the 1920s in Lahore what is now
Pakistan. There are 200+ million Muslims in Pakistan about 100 years later. How many Arya Samaj converts are there in Pakistan?

5. Asked @Bambi this question, but perhaps you can answer:
How many Muslims have converted to the Sanatan Dharma as Aryavirs?

6. There are 8 million Arya Samajis in India? What percentage are converted Muslims?

7.There are approximately 190 million Muslims in India.
The Arya Samaj started in 1877. By what date or year do the Arya Samajis expect to have 100% of the Muslims converted?

Looking forward to your inputs.

 

[achhu]

Jack is teaching Acchu again.....

Jinnah sahab jindabad
Two nation theory jindabad
Hindu rashtra ki JAI ho.

Lol, did I teach him before?
The way BJP and its followers have demonized Nehru - it's absurd. That man is largely responsible for India having world class labs and techs despite being third world. If some Gowalkar / Godse had been in charge, they'd be injecting us with cow urine instead of vaccines.

Congress Muslim league stopped creation of Hindu rashtra. Hindu historians have proved jawahar lal was Muslim he wed his daughter to feroz khan .this is why nehru family is still supporting Muslims and Pakistan .
INDIA will progress in Hindu rashtra only .

 

[achhu]

Religious conversions into new religions hardly find mainstream success in the subcontinent. They're like fringe groups. Ahmadiyya didn't fare well (did surprisingly well in Africa with around 8-10 million Ahmadis though).

Bahaism didn't. Brahmo Samaj didn't. Jainism didn't. Christianity didn't.

Sikhism did well because of the Sikh empire. But only in the areas of the erstwhile Sikh empire.

Islam didn't find much traction east of the Jamuna and Thar desert either.

Only exception I can name is Islam in Bengal.

Supposedly Islam also took centuries to gain majority in Punjab and Sindh. It was a gradual process. And till the 1800s, most of the people here were practising a syncretic mix of Islam and Hinduism.

We hindu aryavir stopped Islamic sword, that stopped spread of islam in INDIA .

For consistency in this discussion we may want to put @achhu ( is that a sneeze) on the ignore list. Because of a limited education and limited English language skills which forces the use of Hindi words ( "angrej", notice the "j" instead of "z" ) the posts from this member are not very interesting. I would highly recommend that you put @achhu on your ignore list.

you are welcome .
longlive two nation theory
aryavart zindabad .

 

[achhu]

Jack is teaching Acchu again.....

we are vishwaguru .

 

[achhu]

View attachment 706604
He who flyeth over the skies,
Spreading his holy red coat,
Over the fields of tapioca,
He weareth his underwear out,
And thus he projects his inner truths-
And thus he endorse you,
O worshippers of the mighty Dinkan , to be truthful and clear in your approach !
He hate no unbeliever, and he praises them for their honesty, As honest as his holy underwear!!!

JAI SRI ram .

Nope. The hidden truth is that there are too many pretend-secularists in this forum...the charming secular republic to our right seems to have suffered likewise in fact.

Very pointed statement. This is PRECISELY how the "look I'm secular, look I'm agnostic, look I'm atheist....look look look and love my enlightened moderation....but don't look when I cunningly rationalise gharwapsi and the hindutva driven violent conquest of Islamic India" Hindustanis think.

Long live two nation theory .
Job is incomplete thanks to Congress Muslim league .

 

[Baibars_1260]

We hindu aryavir stopped Islamic sword, that stopped spread of islam in INDIA .

Question:
1. Is the Arya Samaj in India today following Swami Virjanand's legacy?
By what date does the Arya Samaj hope to achieve the goal of
cleansing India of "all contaminating elements"?

Does the Arya Samaj in India still publicly abuse Islam, Muhammad and Allah in street corner meetings as directed by Pandit Lekhram?

3. In India was Swami Agnivesh a follower of Pandit Lekhram? Is there still a schism within the Arya Samaj in India?

4. The shuddhi movement started in the 1920s in Lahore what is now
Pakistan. There are 200+ million Muslims in Pakistan about 100 years later. How many Arya Samaj converts are there in Pakistan?

5. Asked @Bambi this question, but perhaps you can answer:
How many Muslims have converted to the Sanatan Dharma as Aryavirs?

6. There are 8 million Arya Samajis in India? What percentage are converted Muslims?

7.There are approximately 190 million Muslims in India.
The Arya Samaj started in 1877. By what date or year do the Arya Samajis expect to have 100% of the Muslims converted?

Looking forward to your inputs.

Arya samaj was a great movement take people of this subcontinent back their route of Vedas. Swami ji's vision was"ved taraf pachhal valo" meanch return back to Vedas. It was interesting to make this society Aryas means people with best actions. Pakistan being a subcontinent country having great Hindu legacy will have to return back to Vedas We have seen that foreign relation has bring nothing good to Pakistan society. It has helped in regression of the country. Untill Pakistan goes back to its routes, happiness will not to Pakistan society.

Hi Surya,

Waiting for your answers to the questions below:
Please do enlighten us

Surya,
Thanks for a very insightful post. Always welcome your contribution to the discussions here.
Could you read my previous post #24 ( a portion is referenced below), and comment. I have a whole bunch of questions on the article.

Refer below please:



Question:
1. Is the Arya Samaj in India today following Swami Virjanand's legacy?
By what date does the Arya Samaj hope to achieve the goal of
cleansing India of "all contaminating elements"?




2. Does the Arya Samaj in India still publicly abuse Islam, Muhammad and Allah in street corner meetings as directed by Pandit Lekhram?

3. In India was Swami Agnivesh a follower of Pandit Lekhram? Is there still a schism within the Arya Samaj in India?

4. The shuddhi movement started in the 1920s in Lahore what is now
Pakistan. There are 200+ million Muslims in Pakistan about 100 years later. How many Arya Samaj converts are there in Pakistan?

5. Asked @Bambi this question, but perhaps you can answer:
How many Muslims have converted to the Sanatan Dharma as Aryavirs?

6. There are 8 million Arya Samajis in India? What percentage are converted Muslims?

7.There are approximately 190 million Muslims in India.
The Arya Samaj started in 1877. By what date or year do the Arya Samajis expect to have 100% of the Muslims converted?

Looking forward to your inputs.

 

[Chhatrapati]

Lord Dinkan was eating a Cassava. When he let out a laugh out of boredom, that is what caused the formation of time, space and the entire galaxy systems. That laughter later came to be known as Big bang.

 

[Baibars_1260]

How is Arya Samaj different from Mainstream Hinduism?

How is Arya Samaj different from mainstream Hinduism?

Answer (1 of 9): There isn’t anything which is “MAINSTREAM HINDIUSM”. Its not like Bollywood which is divided into 2 i.e. Mainstream and Parallel Cinema. Arya Samaj followers stick to rituals, the Vedic rituals and not the Dhong that has been going around for many years now. Till the time Idol w...

www.quora.com

The Arya Samaj is a revolutionary movement whose main objective is a worldwide movement to overcome the superstition of various types of hypocrisy, vote-caste, caste-fauna, various types of saints,etc. spreading in the society, its creator Maharishi Dayananda Saraswati.

1. Aryasamaj is the purest form of Hinduism. The movement that runs against superstition is not a separate creed or sect.
2. The religious texts of Arya Samajis are just Vedas. Vedas are the highest. Satyarth Prakash, originally compiled by Maharishi Dayanandji, is a script which is essentially helpful in returning to the Vedas. We get guidance from this, but it is not in the category of religious texts.
3. Aryasamaj puts Lord Rama and Yogeshwar Krishna in the category of Maha Purusha admits its ideal. Your ancestor considers Walk on the path shown insists on but they believe in worshiping in some other places and insulting these great men. And these great men used to worship the supreme God as well!

1. Maharishi himself said that if I were in the time of the Sage Kanada or Rishi Jaimini , “I would not have considered myself as nothing”. That is, the heart of the sage had immense respect for all of his Vedic Rishis. Aryasamaj also respects all Vedic sages. There is also Adi Gurushankaracharya Ji, who restored Vedic religion and saved the society from the path of non-Vocal [i.e., hypocrisy].
2. Arya Samaj’s Guru is Veda.They get their guidance from the Vedas. Those who are Vedic, accept and renounce non-vidya. Rishi has respect for Dayanand in his heart, but never worshiping sage anywhere, they follow the true paths shown by him.
3. Arya Samaj respects other ideologies and is familiar with their usefulness. Aryasamaj thinkst hat is the only religion of man that is in the vedic world, but the ideology may differ because of lack of intelligence in society.

The Aryasamaj also calls Gautama Buddha the "Mahatma" who opposed the Vedas. Atheism also calls the originator of Jain religion as "God" Mahavira. But the falsehood is not said to be untrue ?The society should not be told that the right path (Vedic path is justified) is what ?

Truth is bitter to digest but it needs courage to tell the truth, in which Arya Samaj is always ahead.

1. The Arya Samaj does not want the political parties to keep Hindus in the caste on the basis of hollow democracy and continue to nurture a particular community, and behave in a Hindu community only by raising the flag and looking at the dream of Hindu Rashtra only, and this humiliating leader will trump the votes of Hindus Keep on taking and exploit.

Rather, it wants that by establishing democracy like democracy and establishing a monarchy on the basis of Manusmriti, and establishing the founding of the Vedic rule (True Hindutva) can be established, that our king should bring the complete transcendent Vedic republic into a single Vedic Republic, like the Yudhisthira, Vikramaditya, In place of the rule, establish a unified Vedic Chakraborty State and make Rajasuya Yagya.

1. Arya Samaj believes that only the texts that follow the principles of Vedas and Vedas (Darshan, Upanishad, Aranyak, Vedanga, Ramayan, Manusmriti, Mahabharata, Kautilya economics) are only authentic.
2. Arya Samaj believe that Lord Krishna was a Brahmachari from birth to 48 years, they married only one Rukmani, and with them, in the ashram of Upmanyu Rishi, on the Vishnu mountain, 12 years of Brahmacharya created their own equally bright son Pradyuman; God used to pray, pranayama, evening, agnihotra etc.,he was proficient in many types of martial arts, his first weapon was Sudarshan Chakra, great thinker, was a unique warrior, a great politician who brought together all republics of India in the struggle of the Yadavas.
3. On the basis of Ramcharitmanas, Arya Samaj do not believe that Hanuman ji was monkeys, nor do they believe that he used to comb through the tail.

Rather, on the basis of Valmiki Ramayana, it is believed that Hanuman ji was a Kshatriya branch of South India which resides in forest, from which the unbroken Brahmachari, Mahabali, the great scholar,knower of the Vedas.

 

[achhu]

Lord Dinkan was eating a Cassava. When he let out a laugh out of boredom, that is what caused the formation of time, space and the entire galaxy systems. That laughter later came to be known as Big bang.

Dharma ki JAI ho.

 

[Chhatrapati]

"Even if you believe in me or not, you shall not be sent to hell, I'm not a sadist to create hell in the first place"
Dinkan (Holy Balamangalam 90:53)

 

[jamahir]

Help me with this please.

I don't know about your particular views but most son of the soil "non gangu" Pakistanis here (barring Muhajirs like me) have very disparaging and disgusting views about Indian Muslims. A weird victim blaming kind of approach where they blame "cowardly Indian Muslims" for daring to be attacked by Hindus. Completely ignoring that a large part of their second class status has to do with 1947. It's like asking a rape victim how dare she be raped

Members here openly and routinely claim they don't care if Hindus kill Muslims in India. Why the faux concern for what Hindus do to Muslims in India then? It's not about the people but the land and glory I presume?

@Naofumi @jamahir @xeuss

The underlined parts are to the point.

Some Pakistani members routinely say "Thanks to Jinnah".

It was either @xeuss or @Naofumi who said once that it is easy for these particular Pakistanis to sit in a Muslim-majority country and propose that Indian Muslims should do civil war, take up arms etc.