Thunder on ADA scramble

[Dazzler]

How about in BVR engagements? Did the Flanker prevail?

PAF employed tactics to gain an upper hand as far as i know, both sides employed AWACS aircraft that helped achieved parity.

 

[Dazzler]

J11 with dummy sd-10s..

 

[mingle]

Jf17 is small and agile plane compare to flankers .I remember for PAF the toughest plane they faught was GNAT small agile hard to spot pilots called him makhi mean fruitfly .
We need bigger plane like flanker's for deep enemy strike not for Dog fight .For Dogfight F16 and JF17 combo is good for vegetable flankers of East.

 

[messiach]

@Dazzler @CriticalThought & Others. FC1 is precisely scripted for heavy fighters. PAF MEN should concentrate on professional fighting skills rather than wasting time on stupid media campaigns, hiring women fighter pilots for a males job & rubbish friendly public displays. Not a very re-assuring report.

I'm gonna assume PAF pilots are superior at WVR combat.

Is this a case of you cant win them all?

Or does it say something about pilot training between the two air forces? Or between the two platforms?

What would you say is the significance of these reports?

 

[Rafael]

@Dazzler @CriticalThought & Others. FC1 is precisely scripted for heavy fighters. PAF MEN should concentrate on professional fighting skills rather than wasting time on stupid media campaigns, hiring women fighter pilots for a males job & rubbish friendly public displays. Not a very re-assuring report.

Meaning JFTs were not that impressive?

 

[CriticalThought]

Meaning JFTs were not that impressive?

Meaning where J-11 managed a lock, it was because of pilot skills.

 

[Arsalan]

DAMNIT!!!!!! R-Darter and A-Darter on the Thunder along with new HMD/S?????????? Tell me I am dreaming?????

@Knuckles @Bilal Khan (Quwa)

Kya ho gya bahi?
Check R and A Darter fin positioning. The missile in the pic are our SD-10s and PL-5!!
R Darter and PL-5 look somewhat similar but still . . . .

Edit: Noticed that it is already clear.

I'd say Flankers in general. The Russians increase version numbers (SU-27, SU-30, SU-35) after certain modifications. The base platform remains the same. The J-11s are a highly customized Chinese evolution and I would at least equate them with SU-30. Against SU-35, if you retain the same radar, it will retain the BVR advantage at least. But the latest SU-35s are equipped with a beast of a radar/jammer, so I wouldn't fancy Thunders chances against it... just yet. Block 3 will be a different beast altogether...

People should understand that this was done in basic "clear" environment. EW was a weak point for us and that was not factored in, one it is, JFT would have been at the receiving end. However follow some news an rumors, BLK-III may be addressing at least SOME of these issues. I just hope that it continues on the right track and this short coming in addressed sooner rather than later. That will give us an EXCELLENT viable options against MAJORITY of our enemy's aircraft.

 

[CHI RULES]

The exercises are conducted to learn and get new expertise. One may guess same has been done in under discussion exercise. The signs show that PAF learned a lot and complete SWOT analysis has been done. The areas required to be addressed shall be done in block 3. Some people spreading negativity should learn that JF17 block 2 is at most 3.5 th to 4th gen meanwhile J11b is 4.5 th gen. More over it is discussed that J11b is using AESA radar which due to it's heavy power and mass should be in league of Su35 PESA radar if not better. Meanwhile in EW/ECM capabilities may be same as SU35. No one here knows 100% abt Chinese gadgets only assumptions so we should refrain from giving negative comments.

I require some clarity from well informed members why PAF still emphasis on WVR meanwhile world is going for BVR. The 4.5 to 5 th gen Jets are usually heavy and rely first on their stealth features and then on their BVR capabilities to engage enemy jets at long distances.

The SU30 with it's PESA radar should be able to locate JF17 at long distance despite low RCS and can engage from there with latest BVRs with longer no escape zones. The concept og F35 is also same as it shall not allow adversary jets to reach near it.

May be it's time to induct capable next generation BVRs and WVRs with longer ranges and accuracy.

 

[Windjammer]

Meaning JFTs were not that impressive?

Actually the PLAAF officials are of the opinion that, ''JF-17 would bite and never let go''. !!

 

[CriticalThought]

Kya ho gya bahi?
Check R and A Darter fin positioning. The missile in the pic are our SD-10s and PL-5!!
R Darter and PL-5 look somewhat similar but still . . . .

Edit: Noticed that it is already clear.


People should understand that this was done in basic "clear" environment. EW was a weak point for us and that was not factored in, one it is, JFT would have been at the receiving end. However follow some news an rumors, BLK-III may be addressing at least SOME of these issues. I just hope that it continues on the right track and this short coming in addressed sooner rather than later. That will give us an EXCELLENT viable options against MAJORITY of our enemy's aircraft.

Sir, EW needs a doctrine. Just like CAS led to ACE, we need to treat EW as a dedicated topic at ACE and evolve a doctrine based on knowledge of current and future developments, leading to strategies, leading to training in the force. EW is a multi-dimensional element which requires interaction between the tri-services.

 

[sparten]

PAF employed tactics to gain an upper hand as far as i know, both sides employed AWACS aircraft that helped achieved parity.

In past exersizes, the Flankers were superior at WVR and long BVR range. Which is why tactics called for medium range engagement envelopes.

If Thunders managed to win at BVR and WVR, then thats a really good thing.

Against the MKI, the presence of MAWs might be decisive.

 

[messiach]

Lets leave it at that. Nothing wrong with FC1. PAF was up against a real & truely professional airforce ( not our eastern neighbours). I hope this interaction will continue on a more frequent basis. & Thankyou.

>> PAF guys, Information gets leaked out very quickly thesedays.

Meaning JFTs were not that impressive?

 

[Trango Towers]

Partly correct.
FC1 did very well at low, mid and high altitudes against heavy fighters. Contrary to claims, heavy fighters were unable to get a fix on it. Our easterly neighbours should watch out.

Our easterly neighbour has monkeys flying the best coffins so it doesn't care

 

[messiach]

AESA were switched off in most medium to within-visual range scenarios.Used in BVR engagements. Updated: We did surprisingly well in beyond visual ranges.

More over it is discussed that J11b is using AESA radar which due to it's heavy power and mass should be in league of Su35 PESA radar if not better.

 

[Dazzler]

Actually the PLAAF officials are of the opinion that, ''JF-17 would bite and never let go''. !!

Did u know the guy I talked to? He said a smilar thing. As per him, Chinese pilots call thunder a weasel.

Damn!