Thoughts on going back to your homelands (for non-European diaspora in the West)?

[313ghazi]

If by being born in a stable u do not become a horse...then what criteria makes u(u in particular) European(or British for that matter)?
...u r a Homo Sapien...before the arrival of Homo Sapiens...Neanderthals were thriving in regions of Europe. Homo Sapiens that came out of Africa at some point in distant history drove Neanderthals to extinction.
...so depending on how far back u draw the line...r u going to take that £50,000 and move back to Africa u homo sapien?

Or perhaps u r gonna protest that the above is not realistic...it's too far back in time. Let's move up a little then...how about all non Celts leave Britain?
No? Still unfair somehow? How about we try it at a small scale? In a great demonstration of "practice what u preach"...the British citizens leave northern Ireland(part of UK)...give that back to the Irish ppl...so they can live there as they had been for a long time.

Where does one draw the line for a person to be of a certain nationality? How many generations does it take for it to "reflect their ppl's history"? One? Two? Three? My guess is that ur answer will be something that will conveniently suit u(and others like u).
That answer wouldn't at all be objective no matter how u look at it...it will be completely subjective.

Objectively a "citizen" of a certain nationality...pays his/her taxes, votes, abides by law, gets represented by his/her government, etc. These ppl that u see as "outsiders" do all that...and yet somehow they don't belong.

The shooting at Christschurch and other such racist incidents...are just that...racist. Racism is just a mental construct...that one uses to justify all that is "wrong" with the society. So an "us vs them" can be created...and whichever group ends up on the receiving end...is somehow responsible for the [problem]...
...insert whatever that problem is...and this excuse can be recycled time and again for whenever a scapegoat is needed for a certain problem.

Dave Chappelle is a famous comedian here in the US...and he is also a genius when it comes to highlighting issues like racism. In one of his famous comedic bits...he showed a blind African American man(himself)...who grew up in the South(southern US states). He was enrolled in white dominant school with other blind kids...and was the only African American kid there...so no one ever told him or the other students...that way there wouldn't ever be any trouble. He grew up with those kids...learning the "white supremacist" concept and started looking down on African Americans...
...the whole thing is shown as light-hearted comedy...but the point is that racism is all in our heads...a completely made up construct.

@waz @masterchief_mirza tag other PDF Brits...I would like to know ur feedback to the OP.

Mashallah - you tore his argument to bits.

 

[JackFell]

Then why countries like Canada have Express Entry immigration program that attracts around 300K immigrants every year.....And Australia and New Zealand have similar programs? Maybe their governments know something you don't?

Also you know little about condition of Japan.

Because of demographic problems Japan:
1) has a stagnating economy with GDP growing only 0,75% a year over the last 20 years. Because of this stagnation, level of income in Japan is only 70% of USA's level

2) Japan is forced to raise taxes to support retirees--this decreases the level of income even further

3) because of high taxes and lack of labor force factories are moving away from Japan to places like Philippines and Mexico----i/e deindustrialization of Japan

4) taxes are not enough to balance the budget so Japanese government borrows---today government debt of Japan stands at 260% of GDP---the highest in the world (but this is tolerable in unique Japanese conditions of deflation, because in deflation Central Bank can partially print money and buy gov. bond to fund budget deficit)

5) this is what Japan thinks about immigration

Japan is in a much better state than most of the multicultural European countries, it's streets are safe and clean, it has good infrastructure and it has high levels of social trust.

Did you know Poland actually rejected the asylum application of the Chechen teenager who beheaded that French teacher recently? Poland and other Central/Eastern Europeans nations are doing the right thing and keeping their countries White.

Western immigration policy is insane, what will happen when the immigrants get old? What will happen when the world population itself starts to decline? Are we going to give work visas to aliens?

Mashallah - you tore his argument to bits.

Not really, this is just a form of deconstruction which pro-multiculturalists use to claim the certain European nations are actually a mixed population and so it doesn't matter if we let in infinity Africans and Asians.

I am not that familiar with other European nations but for Britain, I know that it is a fairly homogenous country genetically speaking and the last great invasion was in 410, before Islam itself came into being, this was the invasion by the genetically related Anglo-Saxons.

I am pretty sure most immigrants do not see themselves as British anyway, in many ways it is very sad what has happened to the children of these immigrants as they are neither here nor there, this is why most terror attacks are done by second+ generation immigrants, because these types are prone to radicalisation due to their identity crisis.

 

[GWXP]

White people more or less created modernity. I think others could also learn just as Europeans learned from others like the Middle East peoples. My initial assertion is that colonisation was a net benefit for the colonised nations. Countries that were colonised for the longest are now the richest and have better living conditions. Look at South Africa for example.

Peoples are different not only because of their races, but also because of their geographic environment that well explains differences in development levels

It is impossible that industrialization of 19th century could happen (lets say) in the deserts of Arabia or mountains of Tibet....Probably development of capitalism and industrialization requires a place with a lot of arable land, temperate climate, navigable rivers and good ports--Europe

Differences in development level are explained by: 1)geography 2)institutional environment

In order to be successful, a country must have several geographical characteristics:

1) temperate climate which is good for agriculture and prevents spread of diseases

2) navigable rivers, which were used as natural transport highways in 19th century and stimulated trade, specialization and capital accumulation

3) access to ocean and good ports in order to trade with the rest of the world

4) a lot of arable land

Europe and US has all of this...Africa (for example) has few

Africa has tropical climate that faciliate spread of diseases, lacks large amount of arable land, lacks navigable rivers and has few places to build a port.

This is arable land map---as you can see US has a lot of land and Africa has very little

This is climatic map---as you can see places with temperate climate are very developed

And this is USA map that shows all geographic features needed for success

 

[halupridol]

Lol whatta thread,,,,,answer is obvious.
If asking about South Asian diaspora thn,, We even have a saying apt for it.
Bhayya 2 rupaye jyada ke liye kuch bhi karega.
Add this to it-- aur internet pe izzat, ghairat, patriotism, religion pe waddi waddi fekega.

 

[GWXP]

Poland and other Central/Eastern Europeans nations are doing the right thing and keeping their countries White.

With the exception that no brown man wants to migrate to a country like Poland----poles themselves are leaving their country and move to Britain or France--so why brown people need to migrate to such a relatively poor country like Poland?

Poland will be aging rapidly and this will have terrible socio-economic consequences for this country

This is demographic pyramid of Poland

 

[JackFell]

With the exception that no brown man wants to migrate to a country like Poland----poles themselves are leaving their country and move to Britain or France--so why brown people need to migrate to such a relatively poor country like Poland?

Poland will be aging rapidly and this will have terrible socio-economic consequences for this country

This is demographic pyramid of Poland
View attachment 682497
View attachment 682498

Poland is relatively poor compared to Western Europe, but if we compare it to the world it is fairly rich and many would want to go there.

The ageing population thing is over-hyped. Only Capitalists care about it, society itself wouldn't collapse without immigrants.

The right way to have done immigration would be like the Gulf States do with their guest worker programme, although Arabs are pretty lazy so we wouldn't have needed that many immigrants. Giving immigrants citizenship is just prolonging the inevitable.

 

[GWXP]

The ageing population thing is over-hyped. Only Capitalists care about it, society itself wouldn't collapse without immigrants.

But capitalists are part of economy---from money they earn they pay taxes and make investments creating jobs for Europeans....

And now...

This is a HEALTHY demographic pyramid

People aged 40-60 are usually at the height of their carrier and they earn a lot of money and tend to make savings and keep them in banks---they lower credit interest rates---there are a lot of them

People aged 18-40 are people who tend to consume---they borrow money from banks and buy new goods thus keeping economy going---they are the most numerious

People aged 63 and over are retirees----there are few of them

And now what happens when demographic pyramid inverts like this?

There are A LOT of retirees and government has to raise taxes and borrow money to support them

At the same time there are few people who make savings--government tax them to support retirees, so the level of income of this group falls

And there are VERY FEW young consumers---so companies produce new goods--and there is nobody who can buy them, so economy stalls

At the same time factories in such countries move to places where taxes are lower and labor force is available so deindustrialisation happens


Every migrant is a NEW WORKER, TAXPAYER AND CONSUMER (even if we assume he is low skilled)

Without migration economies of the developed world will experience economic stagnation and constant recessions

You can explore future demographic pyramids of countries on this site

UK and France are relatively well off because of migration

Population Pyramids of the World from 1950 to 2100

United Kingdom - 2050

www.populationpyramid.net

 

[JackFell]

But capitalists are part of economy---from money they earn they pay taxes and make investments creating jobs for Europeans....

And now...

This is a HEALTHY demographic pyramid
View attachment 682500

People aged 40-60 are usually at the height of their carrier and they earn a lot of money and tend to make savings and keep them in banks---they lower credit interest rates---there are a lot of them

People aged 18-40 are people who tend to consume---they borrow money from banks and buy new goods thus keeping economy going---they are the most numerious

People aged 63 and over are retirees----there are few of them

And now what happens when demographic pyramid inverts like this?
View attachment 682501

There are A LOT of retirees and government has to raise taxes and borrow money to support them

At the same time there are few people who make savings--government tax them to support retirees so their level of income falls

And there are VERY FEW young consumers---so your companies produce new goods--and there is nobosy who can buy, so economy stalls

At the same time factories in such countries move to places where taxes are lower and labor force is available so eindustrialisation happens


Every migrant is a NEW WORKER, TAXPAYER AND CONSUMER (even if we assume he is low skilled)

Without migration economies of the developed world will experience economic stagnation and constant recessions

You can explore future demographic profiles of countries on this site

UK and France are relatively well off because of migration

Population Pyramids of the World from 1950 to 2100

United Kingdom - 2050

www.populationpyramid.net

Most Europeans would rather be poorer than have their countries transformed in such a way, anyway one day Iraq will also have to go through this problem.

 

[GWXP]

Most Europeans would rather be poorer than have their countries transformed in such a way, anyway one day Iraq will also have to go through this problem.

seems like the governments of the European countries think the other way

 

[Green disc]

If there was a good standard of living in Pakistan then yes I would. I am a 3rd gen immigrant.

The whites are also immigrants

 

[JackFell]

The whites are also immigrants

Not really, unless you mean Eastern European ones. Immigration means coming into an established society and ingraining yourself within that society to one degree or another, the people you talk if we're settlers and/or invaders.

 

[Green disc]

Not really, unless you mean Eastern European ones. Immigration means coming into an established society and ingraining yourself within that society to one degree or another, the people you talk if we're settlers and/or invaders.

'There were Africans in Britain before the English came here': how Staying Power shook British history

When it was published in 1984 Staying Power vividly captured the struggle for black British identity. Nearly 35 years on it still has lessons to teach

www.theguardian.com

And then post war Britain the immigrants help rebuild Britain

 

[Baybars Han]

Most Turks move back after making a good living abroad especially after 50. If Turkey was a richer country nobody would move. Turkey is heaven, the coastal cities, the historical cities, the green cities, every region is beatiful. Take away the wealth most western countries(not all) are dump to live imo.

 

[JackFell]

'There were Africans in Britain before the English came here': how Staying Power shook British history

When it was published in 1984 Staying Power vividly captured the struggle for black British identity. Nearly 35 years on it still has lessons to teach

www.theguardian.com

And then post war Britain the immigrants help rebuild Britain

This is just another piece of Afrocentric nonsense by a black advocate, these types always claim that so and so nations had Africans in them before the current inhabitants were there (they never seem to be able to explain why blacks were basically not present in the UK in any significant numbers before 1948, despite being here before the English) and so these countries should in fact allow for mass immigration of Africans and generous benefits programmes to subsidise the incompetence of these people and their inability to create a Western style civilisation.

It is a lie that Britain needed immigrants to rebuild after the war, most people were shocked when the first Carribbean migrants arrived and didn't know why they were here.

 

[Baybars Han]

The west looted for centuries now their getting immigrants that benefit their society, many doctors and professionals immigrants in western countries. So it's not really payback, but I have no doubt most Europeon countries are going to be dump holes in 15-20 years. Many Asian countries are rising and will be more developed. I went to many parts of Paris and its a dump hole. The good thing west does is marketing.