The Uyghur issue

[xenon54 out]

First step : Denial

There are tons of such stupid wanna be historians talking in biased challels such as ülke tv, talking as if they was sitting in village ''kahve''.
Nothing academic in these people, putting Pro.Dr. before his name doesnt change anything as long as they spread such BS.

''Treaty of Lausanne is the confirmation of Treaty of Sevres'', yeah sure but it doesnt appear to me like that when i look at the maps above.

Try to be a little bit more grateful instead of screaming ''we lost this, we lost that'' yeah sure we lost much but who lost it and who tried and got at least Anatolia back?

 

[Nefer]

There are tons of such stupid wanna be historians talking in biased challels such as ülke tv, talking as if they was sitting in village ''kahve''.
Nothing academic in these people, putting Pro.Dr. before his name doesnt change anything as long as they spread such BS.

''Treaty of Lausanne is the confirmation of Treaty of Sevres'', yeah sure but it doesnt appear to me like that when i look at the maps above.

Try to be a little bit more grateful instead of screaming ''we lost this, we lost that'' yeah sure we lost much but who lost it and who tried and got at least Anatolia back?

A member of the same group which got is in the mess the first time, thank you very much. Mustafa Kemal Pasha, was member of
İttihat ve Terakki.

 

[xenon54 out]

A member of the same group which got is in the mess the first time, thank you very much. Mustafa Kemal Pasha, was member of
İttihat ve Terakki.

All of this is the result of corruption and the inability of later Ottoman Sultans.

 

[Nefer]

All of this is the result of corruption and the inability of later Ottoman Sultans.

At least they weren't rash like Ittihat ve Terakki to join a war so sudden in order to reclaim lost lands. Abdulhamit atleast was trying to fix the entire system, but heej thank you Ittihat ve Terakki, because of you we had 5 million casualities under which half were civillians, have killed an entire generation of potential "Bilim adamlari", made us dependent on foreigners to teach us.

And I know the Ottoman structure caused this, because it was easily infiltrated by ill intentioned people, but that ain't a justiciable excuse for what they have done.

 

[xenon54 out]

At least they weren't rash like Ittihat ve Terakki to join a war so sudden in order to reclaim lost lands. Abdulhamit atleast was trying to fix the entire system, but heej thank you Ittihat ve Terakki, because of you we had 5 million casualities under which half were civillians, have killed an entire generation of potential "Bilim adamlari", made us dependent on foreigners to teach us.

The war didnt started from our side why are you producing history?

 

[Nefer]

The war didnt started from our side why are you producing history?

We got into War because of Enver Pasha's incompetence

 

[xenon54 out]

We got into War because of Enver Pasha's incompetence

No Because British Empire wanted to get Istanbul which they occupied later in 1918 according to Treaty of Sevres.

 

[Nefer]

No Because British Empire wanted to get Istanbul which they occupied later in 1918 according to Treaty of Sevres.

And I am telling you, If Enver Pasha never acted rash and idealistic, we would have stayed Neutral. I mean You Whats left of the Ottoman empire think that in the comming war germany will be victorious and you join him in order to reclaim lost lands. And since you are in war WHY Shouldn't the British wan't Istanbul since we technically have lost the war. If there wasn't a war than something like Sevres wouldn't have happened now would it, and the British could have wanted alot but than it had to be the agressor nation.

Also funny fact, Germans actually did win the war. Untill they got the Americans involved and started flooding western europe with american troops

 

[xenon54 out]

And I am telling you, If Enver Pasha never acted rash and idealistic, we would have stayed Neutral. I mean You Whats left of the Ottoman empire think that in the comming war germany will be victorious and you join him in order to reclaim lost lands. And since you are in war WHY Shouldn't the British wan't Istanbul since we technically have lost the war. If there wasn't a war than something like Sevres wouldn't have happened now would it, and the British could have wanted alot but than it had to be the agressor nation.

Also funny fact, Germans actually did win the war. Untill they got the Americans involved and started flooding western europe with american troops

You think a empire thats declining since centurys, having wars in all fronts and Europeans calling it the ''sick man of Europe'' could stay neutral?
Russians were gaining land in East, Europeans were gaining land in Balkan, Arabs revolting and you say we should have do nothing?

 

[Nefer]

You think a empire thats declining since centurys, having wars in all fronts and Europeans calling it the ''sick man of Europe'' could stay neutral?
Russians were gaining land in East, Europeans were gaining land in Balkan, Arabs revolting and you say we should have do nothing?

I hope you are aware that Abdulhamit was planning on giving all locations outside of Syria, Iraq and Bati Trakya , Independence. Because that is what the Ottoman Meclis before it was closed, was yelling about, and Abdulhamit accepted that fate and was working on that.

And do you know why we lost lands in the balkans, Because when Enver Pasha did a coup, the commanders in the army refused to serve him and didn't fought the russians, we lost because of Pasha meddling with politics

 

[xenon54 out]

I hope you are aware that Abdulhamit was planning on giving all locations outside of Syria, Iraq and Bati Trakya , Independence. Because that is what the Ottoman Meclis before it was closed, was yelling about, and Abdulhamit accepted that fate and was working on that.

And do you know why we lost lands in the balkans, Because when Enver Pasha did a coup, the commanders in the army refused to serve him and didn't fought the russians, we lost because of Pasha meddling with politics

Do you have source for these claims?

But even if it was as you say, British empire was driven by trade at that time, they needed two strategic strait, namely Bosporus and Suez, a war with British empire was inevitable.

 

[xenon54 out]

@Nefer
And let me add this one too, you said Atatürk was memeber of Ittihat ve Terraki which doesnt reclect the truth, he attendet one congress of them where he critisized them, after that he avoided politics and continued his military career, in 1923 he banned the organization.

 

[Nefer]

But even if it was as you say, British empire was driven by trade at that time, they needed two strategic strait, namely Bosporus and Suez, a war with British empire was inevitable.

sources are from books which link to archives. Not available on the Internet.
Also that same guy, which you just called out for BS was telling the same thing in a other video but,
Sen cizdin onu artik <_<.

The only reason they needed Bosporus was to restock the Tsar to prevent the bolshevik uprising.
Suez, Egypt was already occupied by the British since 1882, we could have gotten a diplomatic solution.

And when Kemal Pasha was head of state, why did you think he said to the generals, those who want to meddle with politics drop your rank and be part of the government or else go to your barracks and wait for further orders.

 

[xenon54 out]

sources are from books which link to archives. Not available on the Internet.
The only reason they needed Bosporus was to restock the Tsar to prevent the bolshevik uprising.
Suez, Egypt was already occupied by the British since 1882, we could have gotten a diplomatic solution.

And these are exactly the reason for British empire to attack Ottoman Empire

And when Kemal Pasha was head of state, why did you think he said to the generals, those who want to meddle with politics drop your rank and be part of the government or else go to your barracks and wait for further orders.

Are you referring to this?

Cemiyet 22 Eylül 1909’da Selanik’te bir gizli kongre daha düzenledi. Mustafa Kemal bu kongreye Trablus delegesi olarak katıldı. Bu kongrede yaptığı konuşmasında partiyi tenkit etti. Cemiyet içinde zabitlerin (subayların) bulunmaması gerektiğini, siyasetle uğraşanların ise askerlik görevini bırakması gerektiğini söyledi. Aksi halde askerî emir-komuta zincirinin, cemiyetin hiyerarşisi ile karışacağını ve askerî disiplinin sekteye uğrayacağını öne sürdü. Ona göre cemiyet, komita hüviyetinden çıkmalı ve partileşmeliydi. [12] Birçok parti yöneticisi Mustafa Kemal'in görüşlerine katılmadı. Sadece daha önceki kongrede aynı fikri savunmuş olan Kâzım Karabekir destekledi. Bu tarihten sonra Mustafa Kemal siyaseti 1923'e dek bırakmış, sadece askerlikle ilgilenmeye başlamıştır.

 

[Nefer]

And these are exactly the reason for British empire to attack Ottoman Empire

But, they didn't attack while they could, we did instead

Are you referring to this?

yes

edit: last thing to add, I would recommend on youtube " Mehmet Celik : Balkan faciasi", but.... you were quick to judge

ps: going to bed