'The System'-by WAJsal

[Arsalan]

@WAJsal has alluded to the obstacles in the way of Pakistan's system meeting the standards set by the western world, but he doesn't seem to give any suggestions on as to how we should go about doing that. Military intervention is merely one of the many facets of those obstacles and one that is increasingly used by the corrupt political dynasties as a scapegoat to blame for their own corruption incompetencies. In Pakistan's case, It merely slows down the process of political reforms but unfortunately no decisive attempts are being made to that end.

Let's talk about political reforms. Here I would suggest to readers the study of the working of the Parliment, its history and also the contrast between the nomination of prospective parliamentary candidates in Pakistan and the western world. Britan would be a good place to start. The problem, as you have pointed out, is the complete domination of dynastic politics headed by business tycoons and landowners, you can call the second estate, though second to none in rank, or Pakistan's very own Lord Temporals If you will. The only difference is that they sit in both the upper and the lower houses. There is the clergy, of course, but comparatively of little consequence in the politics. These Lord Spiritual equivalents tend to claw at the political systems from the outside of the Parliment. Our political lairds run their political parties by nominating smaller landowners, sons of landgrabbers and the like, in exchange for inducements that cannot possibly be afforded by the honest-to-god people we would like to be governed by. Another unfortunate reality, one that cannot be helped (not right away in any case) is that the electorate, no more sane than a crowd from the middle ages cheering for the executioner, which decides to vote based on unqualified intuition and the charm of his laird.

The way to initiate these political reforms would be to set up a political party headed by well-known intellectuals of one mind, with a clearly defined party politics, charter and manifesto. Not a conservative party, not a liberal party but a labour party. But this time, it would not be headed by the landowner Bhutto but by the people. This party will nominate its candidates with selection committees composed of upstanding citizens and will nominate candidates based on merit and merit alone. Only this sort of representation will get you the political reforms at the pace they're needed. As for the Judicial reforms, they're trickled down from the legislative assembly.

@Oscar @Joe Shearer @Arsalan @hellfire

You talk about reforms and you will soon be labeled as a PTI supporter.

I am not sure what good ANY system can be for such public/people!

 

[RAMPAGE]

You talk about reforms and you will soon be labeled as a PTI supporter.

I am not sure what good ANY system can be for such public/people!

A valid point and one that I hinted at. You'll have to read it slowly. I doubt anyone can read this fast.

 

[Arsalan]

A valid point and one that I hinted at. You'll have to read it slowly. I doubt anyone can read this fast.

Lolz,,
bahi i read it completely, are you saying that i just saw it is you posting it so decided to reply
It took me a minute to go through what you posted. Super powers?

Anyway, will go through it AGAIN and see if there is anything else i can reply on in detail.

 

[anant_s]

One thing the general public is quite wrong to do is to confuse democracy with the politicians who are associated with the system.

Gem of an observation and thought.
I'm yet to read the full write up, but i'm going back to this line again and again

 

[hassan zohaib]

no doubt democracy needs time to flourish in Pakisatn but i have a question,irrespective of the fact that i am among the people who agree with the thought of the article, that is "any system should be given a chance to do experiments in the environment where transition from one phase to another is being observed and the very existence of a country is at its stake?"

IMO, Pakistan is not observing democracy or dictatorship but we have a system in place which i call "demmartialacy"- a system where democracy has space to flourish but all the stakeholders are dictators.

 

[WAJsal]

Thank you all for the kind words, really means a lot. And thanks a lot for detailed replies. @Joe Shearer , you will like the discussion taking place.
One more thing to add in simpler words:
Currently we cannot be labelled as a perfect democracy, or a democracy at all in my opinion. Too many flaws, too many lee-ways. One thing we need to realize as a nation is that the system is flawed, surely; One needs to realize that it can be made better. Currently we have a civilian dictatorship in power, this gang is nothing less than dictators. Breed and grown by dictators, this class has been hurting this region for centuries. This class has now gone to the topic, this is our failure. People need to forget their castes and personal gains and look to reform the country.
Every wondered why no one looks to improve policy, politicized police, justice system, the 'Jagerdars' 'patwaris'. Everyone is affected by them, while a few think about reforms.
We need to make the basic links, who gains from all these flaws? A corrupt politicized police serves who exactly? We have mafias, from the parking mafia, sugar mafia, sugar cane mafia, medicine mafia, if one can connect the dots it's not too tough to link it all to one certain class of people. A group of families destroying this country from it roots. And this group is looking to grow room for their children to do the same. And this facade will continue till we as a naiton as people start doing something about it.

One thing the general public is quite wrong to do is to confuse democracy with the politicians who are associated with the system.

This is a major problem. Plus the politicians also play their part, they want to be presented as 'the system'. While they are only there to run the system.

It will take time but the system needs time to improve as you have mentioned.

The educated class in this country is quite capable and it can bring a change. You don't need to poor masses to get educated first to bring a change.

This will not happen far from it. See above

It wont. That is why i have blamed the general public too, a lot responsibility lies on them.
"We get the ruler we deserve."
Makes a lot of sense when you think about it.

@WAJsal has alluded to the obstacles in the way of Pakistan's system meeting the standards set by the western world, but he doesn't seem to give any suggestions on as to how we should go about doing that.

Jumped all the needed details, i agree. First we need to point these flaws, actually first the people need to put the right people in the right place. Simply saying 'use your votes properly'. We have kept our votes for sales to the highest bidder. Look it's the people who need to stand up and bring the change.

Let's talk about political reforms. Here I would suggest to readers the study of the working of the Parliment, its history and also the contrast between the nomination of prospective parliamentary candidates in Pakistan and the western world. Britan would be a good place to start. The problem, as you have pointed out, is the complete domination of dynastic politics headed by business tycoons and landowners, you can call them the second estate, though second to none in rank, or Pakistan's very own Lord Temporals If you will. The only difference is that they sit in both the upper and the lower houses. There is the clergy, of course, but comparatively of little consequence in the politics. These Lord Spiritual equivalents tend to claw at the political systems from the outside of the Parliment. Our political lairds run their political parties by nominating smaller landowners, sons of landgrabbers and the like, in exchange for inducements that cannot possibly be afforded by the honest-to-god people we would like to be governed by. Another unfortunate reality, one that cannot be helped (not right away in any case) is the electorate, no more sane than a crowd from the middle ages cheering for the executioner, which decides to vote based on unqualified intuition and the charm of his laird.

The way to initiate these political reforms would be to set up a political party headed by well-known intellectuals of one mind, with a clearly defined party politics, charter and manifesto. Not a conservative party, not a liberal party but a labour party. But this time, it would not be headed by the landowner Bhutto but by the people. This party will nominate its candidates with selection committees composed of upstanding citizens and will nominate candidates based on merit and merit alone. Only this sort of representation will get you the political reforms at the pace they're needed. As for the Judicial reforms, they're trickled down from the legislative assembly. So political reforms should be the primary concern here.

Good stuff. Happy to read good posts...

Gem of an observation and thought.
I'm yet to read the full write up, but i'm going back to this line again and again

3 members have pointed it out now.

is being observed and the very existence of a country is at its stake?"

Who will save the country? who is the big savior, certainly not the dictators.

@niaz , forgot to tag you here. Thought would be welcome.

 

[Joe Shearer]

One thing the general public is quite wrong to do is to confuse democracy with the politicians who are associated with the system.

Source: https://defence.pk/threads/the-system-by-wajsal.455694/page-2#ixzz4N4HrEtwy
That sentence is grammatically very wrong and could have been written like this

One more thing about general Public who confuse politicians with the democratic system itself which is wrong.

Grammatically wrong? Why? The substitution is wrong, IMHO. It amounts to "One more thing about xyz....which is wrong." I'm sorry, it doesn't make sense.

@WAJsal

I'm LOVING it! It's interesting that several people have mentioned one of your best observations, about confusing the system with the politicians who operate the system.

Great going. I'm back in lurk-space.

 

[hassan zohaib]

Who will save the country? who is the big savior, certainly not the dictators.

I think all the dictators whether politicians or millitary can put their contribution together.
One thing we should keep in mind that when one player is playing bad and other player has to take the responsibility then things appear which definitely harm the fabrication of a very understood alliance. IMO, the more the situations like after-the -surgical-strike are going to develop the more the above-mentioned things are going to appear. Your enemy knows you well and he is playing with your weaknesses. he is exploiting your mistrust.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Check the both sentences and make some sense.

First, I don't write sentences like,"Check the both sentences and make some sense."

It should be, "Check the two sentences, and try to make sense of each of them."

 

[RAMPAGE]

Check the both sentences and make some sense.

You should change your name to Meera.

 

[RAMPAGE]

Now kill the waves
Ja jakey mojaan maar.

Salaa aik tu ghalti sudharo oper se batyen b sunoo.

From now I stop selling mirror in blind city.

You're funny!

 

[Joe Shearer]

Now kill the waves
Ja jakey mojaan maar.

Salaa aik tu ghalti sudharo oper se batyen b sunoo.
,
From now I stop selling mirror in blind city.


Kindly correct me in this

I own a dog who barks more and bites less; his name is Joe, and he is very sharear naughty.

I own a dog who barks more and bites less; his name is Joe, and he is very sharear naughty.

There you are.

 

[hassan zohaib]

question is why should not people confuse them in a scenario where all the victory credit is taken by the politicians themselves and all the failure are credited to THE SYSTEM?

confusing the system with the politicians who operate the system.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Thanks

You're welcome.

Now, with your permission, we will return to the meat of the article. Please be assured, there are no spelling mistakes, and there are no grammatical errors. Just a budding intellect showing its first flowering.

Back to the topic.

question is why should not people confuse them in a scenario where all the victory credit is taken by the politicians themselves and all the failure are credited to THE SYSTEM?

He is urging people to see through this rather flimsy deception.

 

[Shah01]

Mods: Please clean up the thread.

The educated class in this country is quite capable and it can bring a change. You don't need to poor masses to get educated first to bring a change.

Sir they are the problem not the cure of the problem..... All the civil servants are highly educated who run the day to day administration of the country. These are the same guys who are in power despite a dictator rule or democratic rule.
Edit: Their attitude towards life and work ethic is very poor.

Every wondered why no one looks to improve policy, politicized police, justice system, the 'Jagerdars' 'patwaris'

These feudals need to learn about the new age and art of collaboration/distribution of wealth in a trickle mood so that they are still in power with everyone happy with their lives.... Look to west this is what happens. Vast majority of people are busy with their lives/jobs/routines and the ruling elite still the same people but rules in shadows.....