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The General's son- To all members educate yourselves about Israel and Pales

We can slap each other with numerous videos and articles but it would hardly end the mess started since 1947.
"The mess" didn't start in 1947 but in 1899 when the Mufti of Jerusalem proposed to his Ottoman masters that terror be used to uproot the Jews from Palestine. The Turkish gov't rejected this but the proposed policy was implemented by his successor after Palestine was conquered by the British. Hence the cry of the Arab mob, "Al Yahub Kalabna" - "the Jews are our dogs" - which has been the inspiration of the Arab war upon Jews from 1920 to the present day.
 
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"The mess" didn't start in 1947 but in 1899 when the Mufti of Jerusalem proposed to his Ottoman masters that terror be used to uproot the Jews from Palestine. The Turkish gov't rejected this but the proposed policy was implemented by his successor after Palestine was conquered by the British. Hence the cry of the Arab mob, "Al Yahub Kalabna" - "the Jews are our dogs" - which has been the inspiration of the Arab war upon Jews from 1920 to the present day.

Here is an article which portray the Britishers as supporters of Jews in their early days.



Formation of Modern Day Israeli Illegitimate State



For centuries, the Jews have had their presence all over the world, but were mostly concentrated in North Africa, Arab states and in Europe (mostly Germany, Austria, and the UK), USA and some parts of Latin America (South America) ; but they didn’t have their own state with a Jewish majority and were desperate to have one they could call their own.
Following the world wars, most of the Muslim Ottoman Empire was broken up and captured by allies that implemented their own rules in these territories. After the 2nd world war ended, the Jewish population was mostly exiled from Europe and was sent to Palestinian territories to occupy and live there. All this happened under the British support. The British first kept the Jews in refugee camps as the Muslims were not ready to accept this. Later on, they were given armed support and were set free to occupy by force. Seeing the gradually weakening British control on Palestine, the Jewish militant and terrorist groups started a revolt against the British Rule in a desperate attempt to gain an area for themselves under cover of statements from their Holy Book, that that part of earth had been promised to them in their Holy Book. There were soon mob attacks on Muslim populations and this started a series of fights ultimately leading to a situation that could be called a civil war.
In 1947, the British announced that they would soon be ending their Palestinian mandate as the things were going out of control and no agreement could be made between the Jews and the Arabs. The newly formed United Nations presented a partition plan for this region, on 29 November 1947, which was named as Partition Plan for Palestine (United Nations General Assembly Resolution 181). According to this plan, there were two states to be formed; Palestine and Israel. Israel was to be formed on the Palestinian territories occupied by the Jewish minority of the region and Jerusalem was to be made a city under the control of United Nations. As could be expected, the Arab League and Palestinians refused to accept this plan as it was compromising nearly all the rights and major part of Palestinian land. The Jews were delighted and accepted the plan as it was favoring them completely.
The British mandate was to end on 15th of May, 1948. On 14th of May, 1948, the Jewish Agency declared independence and vowed to start an armed struggle and snatch the lands from the locals. As a result, Egypt, Syria, Iraq, Lebanon and Yemen launched a joint Arab League war to defend the Palestinian territories. The Israelis were armed and supported by the allies and so were well equipped as compared to Arab League Force. After a very fierce fighting, for over a year, a cease fire was reached. Temporary borders were setup and given the name Green Line. According to this cease fire treaty, West Bank and Jerusalem (East) were given in control of Jordan and Gaza Strip was taken over by the Egyptian Authorities. Both the Palestinians and Jews suffered heavy losses of life and major economic crises. Millions of Palestinians were displaced. However the leaders of Jewish Population declared the occupied territories as their “Holy land” and made it clear to the Muslim neighbors that they would say there and Israel is a reality. None of the Arab world countries accepted Israel, as it was a country without any legitimacy.

The War in 1967

The Green Line, the Israeli occupation and false propaganda against its neighboring countries led to worsening of ties with the neighboring states. In 1967, the Egyptian Army expelled United Nations forces from the Egyptian lands of Sinnai peninsula. Egypt, Jordan and Syria started to mobilize their forces as Israel continued to threat. On 5th of June, 1967, Israel launched an attack on Jordan, Egypt and Syria. Backed by the US, UK and other western powers, tiny Israeli army defeated the forces of Egypt, Syria and Jordan and after a fight of 6 days, the Arab armies surrendered. Israel captured Jerusalem and West Bank from Jordan, Gaza Strip from Egypt and also the Golan Heights.
In this way, most of the Palestinian land fell to the Jews who till now occupy and maintain a firm occupation in the region.

How The Occupation of Palestine is Illegal:

Bringing an end to the Israeli occupation of Palestinian land is as much a prerequisite for peace in the Middle East as is the Palestinian recognition of Israel. The Israeli occupation is not only inhuman and the cause of extreme suffering for the 3.5 million Palestinians living under its subjugation, but it is also illegal under international law. Attempts to claim otherwise have no legal validity and are morally bankrupt and politically dangerous since they basically preclude the achievement of peace.
While it is true that victorious powers can legally occupy hostile territories seized in the course of conflict - an example of which is the Allies' occupation of the territory of Nazi Germany during World War II, foreign occupation should nevertheless be a temporary situation, pending a political settlement or solution. During the interim, the occupying Power must comply with relevant instruments of international humanitarian law with regard to its conduct in the territory it has occupied.
International law is very clear on two basic principles: the inadmissibility of the acquisition of territory by war and the prohibition of the transfer of civilians of the occupying Power to the occupied territory. Both are intended to prevent expansionism and the colonization of occupied territories. Both complement another explicit principle of international law, namely the right of peoples to self-determination, a right that a colonial or occupying Power is obliged to respect.
The Israeli occupation has clearly violated all three of these principles of international law. In fact, throughout its prolonged occupation, Israel has persistently and aggressively breached international law.
Thus, what makes the Israeli occupation of Palestinian land illegal is not the fact that it occurred during the war of 1967 (regardless of the narrative concerning the causes of the war). What makes the Israeli occupation illegal is that it has existed for 35 years, during which time it transformed into a form of colonialism and suppressed and oppressed an entire people for decades, preventing them from the exercise of their right to self-determination and the establishment of their State, Palestine.
Israel, as an occupying Power, has undertaken countless measures attempting to change the legal status, demographic composition and character of the territory by confiscating land, exploiting natural resources, building more than 250 settlements, transferring more than 400,000 Israelis to the occupied territories, establishing a dual system of law and even annexing part of the territory.
These actions have been carried out in direct contravention of the Fourth Geneva Convention relative to the Protection of Civilian Persons in Time of War, which, among other things, defines the rules of conduct and the obligations of the occupying Power. Clearly then, the active intent of the Israeli occupation has been to negate Palestinian rights, to create new facts on the ground and to illegally expand Israel's borders.
Security Council resolution 242 (1967), which is the bedrock of the peace process and of any future peace settlement, is anchored in the principle of the inadmissibility of the acquisition of territory by war. The old and deceptive argument that the resolution calls for withdrawal from 'territories' and not 'the territories' not withstanding (in fact, the French text of the resolution does contain the article 'the'). The call in the resolution for the withdrawal of Israel can only be read within the context of the above-mentioned principle.
Since the onset of the Israeli occupation in 1967, and in response to established, illegal policies and practices of the occupying Power, the Security Council has adopted 26 resolutions that affirmed the applicability of the Fourth Geneva Convention to the territories occupied by Israel. Of those resolutions, several deal directly with the issue of Israeli settlements and several also specifically deal with Israeli violations in Occupied East Jerusalem.
The resolutions clearly address the illegality of Israel's policies and practices with regard to both issues. For example, some of the resolutions affirm that the Israeli settlements 'have no legal validity'; call upon the government and people of Israel 'to dismantle the existing settlements'; and call upon 'all States not to provide Israel with any assistance to be used specifically in connection with settlements in the occupied territories'.
As for Occupied East Jerusalem, which the Israeli government illegally annexed in 1980, the Security Council, in resolution 478 (1980), determined 'that all legislative and administrative measures and actions taken by Israel, the occupying Power, which have altered or purport to alter the character and status of the Holy City of Jerusalem, and, in particular, the recent "basic law" on Jerusalem are null and void and must be rescinded forthwith'.
Similar affirmations were made by the Council in several other resolutions. Moreover, the General Assembly and other UN organs have adopted scores of resolutions on the illegal policies and practices of the Israeli occupation and on the legitimacy of, and the necessity for, the exercise of the right to self-determination by the Palestinian people.
There has therefore been absolutely no impropriety on the part of the UN Secretary-General concerning his recent statements with regard to the Israeli occupation. Kofi Annan's call for an end to 'the illegal occupation' was not only legally correct but was also not a concept invented by the Secretary-General, as reflected in the numerous resolutions of the United Nations. It was, however, important for Mr. Kofi Annan to add his moral authority to the urgent need for an end to that illegal occupation, particularly during this late stage in the perilous deterioration of the situation.
In that statement on 12 March 2002, the Secretary-General addressed both the Palestinian and Israeli sides. The Palestinian side probably did not like everything it heard. But, taken in its entirety, the statement was widely viewed as a necessary and responsible call that intended to, and should, help the parties to move forward towards a peaceful settlement. For this to happen, the Israeli people and the Israeli government must indeed come to terms, for once and for all, with the illegality of their occupation and the need for its termination.


The first map is Israel as it was first created by UN declaration in 1947. The blue portion is Israel; the rest is all Arab lands. Note that Jerusalem was completely within Arab lands and Israel was much smaller than it is today. Note also that there is NO Israeli presence inside the area surrounding Jerusalem. No settlements, certainly no IDF.
The red square outlines the approximate region shown below.
The second map shows Israel as it is today. Note that the western border of Palestine has been pushed up to Jerusalem. Such a land grab is NOT the result of a defensive act, but of an invasion to bring Jerusalem under Israeli control, even though Jerusalem was not originally part of Israel. The maps clearly tell the story of an Israel conquering lands which do not belong to it. Since Sharon took office, Israel has built more illegal Jewish Settlements on Palestinian land. Note on the above map that the majority of the lands which were originally Arab lands when Israel was created, are now under complete (dark blue) or partial (green) Israeli control. Only the black areas remain to the Palestinians, and those are shrinking by the minute.




The Loss of Palestinian Lands from 1946-2000; The maps tell it all! :

How does a defensive action result in the total conquest of the lands of others? The answer is that it does not. Israel is the aggressor. The maps of Israel then and now prove it.
 
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^^^^
Some true objective facts are listed in the above account but many others are missing. Some important ones: the fact that Israel was legitimized internationally (though not declared a state) by the Mandate of Palestine with its proclaimed mission to encourage "close settlement" of Palestine by Jews with the intent of eventual statehood (Class A mandate), the fact that Arab violence against Jews started soon after the British conquest, and the misuse of the maps which fail to distinguish between state lands, lands owned by Jews, and lands owned by Arabs - especially lands which remained owned by Arabs after the state of Israel was established. Most interesting are modern maps of Israel showing the proportion of Arab ownership in areas like the Galilee to be steadily growing.

How does a defensive action result in the total conquest of the lands of others? The answer is that it does not.
That's not the whole answer. When the Arabs revolted and attacked Jewish settlements the Jews responded by pushing them back. When the Arab armies then invaded and advanced nearly to Tel Aviv the Jews pushed them back. When the Arabs unified their military commands in '67, expelled the U.N. from Sinai, and committed an act of war by blockading an Israeli port the Israel pushed them back further from its borders. When Egypt and Syria decided to attack in '73 they advanced and Israel pushed them back once more.

So what you're left with is that the ONLY party who you can condemn for crimes (given the objective facts) are the Arabs. But you're not going to do that. You're going to cover it up. You're going to lie. You're going to invoke warlike causes like "honor".

So how can you be surprised when some of your nationals decide they don't have to bother traveling to the Israeli front and wish to apply these twisted principles to improving their lot at home? To cure that condition you have to advocate Israel. You have to become (whether you like it or not!) a Zionist.
 
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No responses? What, are the Pakistanis here in shock or something?
 
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Im not well versed in Jewish history. But is King David someone like King Ram who the respective people believe existed and ruled and their reign documented only in holy books ?
 
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^^^^
Some true objective facts are listed in the above account but many others are missing. Some important ones: the fact that Israel was legitimized internationally (though not declared a state) by the Mandate of Palestine with its proclaimed mission to encourage "close settlement" of Palestine by Jews with the intent of eventual statehood (Class A mandate), the fact that Arab violence against Jews started soon after the British conquest, and the misuse of the maps which fail to distinguish between state lands, lands owned by Jews, and lands owned by Arabs - especially lands which remained owned by Arabs after the state of Israel was established. Most interesting are modern maps of Israel showing the proportion of Arab ownership in areas like the Galilee to be steadily growing.

That's not the whole answer. When the Arabs revolted and attacked Jewish settlements the Jews responded by pushing them back. When the Arab armies then invaded and advanced nearly to Tel Aviv the Jews pushed them back. When the Arabs unified their military commands in '67, expelled the U.N. from Sinai, and committed an act of war by blockading an Israeli port the Israel pushed them back further from its borders. When Egypt and Syria decided to attack in '73 they advanced and Israel pushed them back once more.

So what you're left with is that the ONLY party who you can condemn for crimes (given the objective facts) are the Arabs. But you're not going to do that. You're going to cover it up. You're going to lie. You're going to invoke warlike causes like "honor".

So how can you be surprised when some of your nationals decide they don't have to bother traveling to the Israeli front and wish to apply these twisted principles to improving their lot at home? To cure that condition you have to advocate Israel. You have to become (whether you like it or not!) a Zionist.

I think what is being said here is that there has been way too much Israel right-or-wrong. Any questioning of the persistent status quo line or generally criticizing the inhuman and disproportionate acts is rewarded with lambasting from zionists. Obama brought up the extremely salient points about stopping further settlement on the West Bank and establishing pre-1967 borders as a starting point for negotiations. Notice how he was slammed for “turning his back/cold shoulder to Israel” and how Benji tried to interfere in US election against Obama? Sure, Israel has the right to defend itself as you boastfully portray as pushing ABC Arabs on XYZ sides, which is then debatable and debunked by Mr. Miko though. But even your account to be accepted then you won’t need to defend if you get to the root of the problem, namely melting away the hatred that driven and drives those desperate people to do so-called hateful things. The only way one can see would be major, generous concessions given to Palestine after putting an end, maybe withdrawing offending settlements.

And there is nothing sort of shock or something. Some people have lot more things too to do except posting on PDF.
 
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Absolute rubbish.

"Kind david historically never existed" - Well then, there goes Christianity, Judaism and Islam.
Ignoring the fact that "Palestinians" never, ever, existed as a nation of people but rather as a a bunch of Arab nomad tribes residing in the land of modern Israel under Ottoman rule. Wait, this makes too much sense, so it will be hard to swallow by the likes of him.

PTex...
How much would it cost to visit Israel ?
Just, Jerusalem ... for 4-5 days ?
 
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Im not well versed in Jewish history. But is King David someone like King Ram who the respective people believe existed and ruled and their reign documented only in holy books ?

A lot of religious history is like that ....

So many egyptian shyt and no clear sign of Moses story !
 
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I think what is being said here is that there has been way too much Israel right-or-wrong. Any questioning of the persistent status quo line or generally criticizing the inhuman and disproportionate acts is rewarded with lambasting from zionists.
What could possibly be wrong with that when such "lambasting" is 100% justified?

Obama brought up the extremely salient points about stopping further settlement on the West Bank and establishing pre-1967 borders as a starting point for negotiations.
Note that there were no pre-1967 borders, only armistice lines. Nevertheless, that path was trodden a dozen years ago. The Arabs rejected it in favor of eliminating Israel entirely.

Sure, Israel has the right to defend itself as you boastfully portray as pushing ABC Arabs on XYZ sides, which is then debatable and debunked by Mr. Miko though.
Not successfully.

But even your account to be accepted then you won’t need to defend if you get to the root of the problem, namely melting away the hatred that driven and drives those desperate people to do so-called hateful things. The only way one can see would be major, generous concessions given to Palestine after putting an end, maybe withdrawing offending settlements.
No sir. "Generous concessions" don't cut it, they only whet the appetite for more. The truth is that the Arabs aren't entitled to anything from Israel, either legally or morally; what they receive is mercy and welfare. Without a culture change only killing Jews will satisfy them.

Yet imagine if they succeeded: you'd have an armed, angry, aggressive population fresh from "holy" genocide and conquest with no other job skills and no economy to sustain them. Do you think they would leave the rest of the world alone to live in peace?

And there is nothing sort of shock or something. Some people have lot more things too to do except posting on PDF.
At the point where Pakistanis acknowledge to themselves that I'm right - or at least they can't counter my arguments - most shut up and do turn away to other things. Yet most of Pakistan's problems relate to corruption of one form or the other. To publicly advocate Israel is to take a stand away from corruption. To lay out the arguments and evidences and freely discuss the deceptions is to set a new standard for public discourse and ultimately governance. That's why it isn't enough for Pakistanis to stay silent, or establish secret or cold Egypt-like relations with Israel, but to step forward themselves as Israel's champions in the mosque, marketplace, school, and home.
 
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By the terms of the Treaty of Sevres and its successor the Mandate of Palestine, "close settlement" of Palestine by Jews was to be encouraged but nevertheless both Jews and Arabs were supposed to respect the civil and property rights of minorities in the lands that came under their political domination, as they were under the Ottomans. This obligation the Israelis kept - Israel is over 20% Arab - but the Arabs did not fulfill it either in their own lands or in Palestine - the Jews were tossed or made to flee, save for a few in Tunisia and Morocco, and entire Arab villages in Palestine participated in attacking Jewish settlements, or fled expecting Arab armies to win the victory for them.

When these Arabs in the Mandate committed or supported collective violence against Jews they forfeited their civil and property rights under the laws and practice of the Ottomans. Neither they nor their descendants have any legal rights to return. If it wasn't for the politics of the vastly larger number of Arabs focusing their anger on the peace-seeking Jews of Israel and the frightened fashionistas of the West seeking to accommodate them the legal case would have dominated the discussion long ago.
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Hasbara I refuted this stupidity earlier as well. Treaty of sevres was annulled, ripped up and thrown back into the face of all parties concerned by Mustafa Kemal Ataturk. You cannot use a cancelled treaty as some kind of justification you fake propaganda machine.
 
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What could possibly be wrong with that when such "lambasting" is 100% justified?

Note that there were no pre-1967 borders, only armistice lines. Nevertheless, that path was trodden a dozen years ago. The Arabs rejected it in favor of eliminating Israel entirely.

Not successfully.

No sir. "Generous concessions" don't cut it, they only whet the appetite for more. The truth is that the Arabs aren't entitled to anything from Israel, either legally or morally; what they receive is mercy and welfare. Without a culture change only killing Jews will satisfy them.

Yet imagine if they succeeded: you'd have an armed, angry, aggressive population fresh from "holy" genocide and conquest with no other job skills and no economy to sustain them. Do you think they would leave the rest of the world alone to live in peace?

At the point where Pakistanis acknowledge to themselves that I'm right - or at least they can't counter my arguments - most shut up and do turn away to other things. Yet most of Pakistan's problems relate to corruption of one form or the other. To publicly advocate Israel is to take a stand away from corruption. To lay out the arguments and evidences and freely discuss the deceptions is to set a new standard for public discourse and ultimately governance. That's why it isn't enough for Pakistanis to stay silent, or establish secret or cold Egypt-like relations with Israel, but to step forward themselves as Israel's champions in the mosque, marketplace, school, and home.


When the oil goes all of a sudden America won’t care a damn about Israel or the Arabs, just wait. And with the demographic changes in the USA try telling your average Latino to send her son to die in whatever the neocon Israel lobby cooks up in say the year 2020. Good luck with that. I’ll bet Israel doesn’t exist by the time this century is over, and/or they will have nuked the entire Middle East, in which case same difference. So… if the Israelis were smart they’d make peace now, but then again they are not smart, just angry, scared and xenophobic.
 
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"The mess" didn't start in 1947 but in 1899 when the Mufti of Jerusalem proposed to his Ottoman masters that terror be used to uproot the Jews from Palestine. The Turkish gov't rejected this but the proposed policy was implemented by his successor after Palestine was conquered by the British. Hence the cry of the Arab mob, "Al Yahub Kalabna" - "the Jews are our dogs" - which has been the inspiration of the Arab war upon Jews from 1920 to the present day.

Once again another blatant lie by the Hasbara force lmao. The arabic pronunciation for the word Jew is Yahudi and the word for dog is pronounced Alkab or Ilkab.
 
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At the point where Pakistanis acknowledge to themselves that I'm right - or at least they can't counter my arguments - most shut up and do turn away to other things. Yet most of Pakistan's problems relate to corruption of one form or the other. To publicly advocate Israel is to take a stand away from corruption. To lay out the arguments and evidences and freely discuss the deceptions is to set a new standard for public discourse and ultimately governance. That's why it isn't enough for Pakistanis to stay silent, or establish secret or cold Egypt-like relations with Israel, but to step forward themselves as Israel's champions in the mosque, marketplace, school, and home.

Of course lieing is perpetually encouraged by Zionist so I will also indulge you. The other day me and my best friend Benjy Netanyahooooo were having coffee together and he started crying. I was like yo bro what is the problem and he admitted that you guys were occupying the land of poor people who you then subsequently oppress as well. I was like OK so do the right thing but then he said Mossad will kill him so he couldn't. :eek:

When the oil goes all of a sudden America won’t care a damn about Israel or the Arabs, just wait. And with the demographic changes in the USA try telling your average Latino to send her son to die in whatever the neocon Israel lobby cooks up in say the year 2020. Good luck with that. I’ll bet Israel doesn’t exist by the time this century is over, and/or they will have nuked the entire Middle East, in which case same difference. So… if the Israelis were smart they’d make peace now, but then again they are not smart, just angry, scared and xenophobic.

Do not listen to this guy every other day he has another different story where people suddenly agreed with him. He thinks Pakistanis can solve their problems only if they become Zionists lol he is a clown and a Hasbara.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_diplomacy_(Israel)
 
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Hasbara I refuted this stupidity earlier as well. Treaty of sevres was annulled, ripped up and thrown back into the face of all parties concerned by Mustafa Kemal Ataturk.
But not by the Caliph and its Palestine terms were incorporated into the Mandate. As the written testament of the Caliph's desires the Treaty of Sevres remains uncontested.
 
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Solomon2 would go running to the UN to try and justify expulsion of Palestinians by using the annulled treaty and they would laugh at him. That is why the zionists do not want Abbas to go through with the recognition of Palestine as a non-member observer state because they might have to actually pay up for the crimes they have committed.
 
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