The Future of Kashmir? "Seven" Possible Solutions!

[toppys]

i stand by my words, because that's how things really did transpire

i have no sympathy at all for those poor ''oppressed'' 'pundits'






people with honour and pride never abandon their ancestral homelands while their neigbhours, friends & families suffer......they fled for purely economic reasons and are now integrated into hindustany society. More power to them; but they dare not call themselves ''Kashmiris'' anymore since they pledged allegiance to hindustan, the very entity that is oppressing Kashmiris today.

we can see what this oppression is leading to; a lot of anger and resentment


for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction

It will be dark when you have shut your eyes yourself.

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

negligible....i wear Aviators -especially in the summer

 

[RamGorur]

i supposed '47 comes after '35.

But then it is useless to argue with you. '35 and '47 both make connection to the States, but we were discussing the latter and there was no need to bring in '35. It was just an attempt by you to confuse the issue as you couldnt get something better to chew on.

Congratulations. You have cracked the biggest mystery of the world - 47 comes after 35. Now buy yourself some candy.

Except in so far as other provision is made by or in accordance with a law made by the Constituent Assembly of the Dominion under subsection (i) of this section, each of the new Dominions and all Provinces and other parts thereof shall be governed as nearly as may be in accordance with the Government of India Act, 1935 ; and the provisions of that Act, and of the Orders in Council, rules and other instruments made thereunder, shall, so far as applicable, and subject to any express provisions of this Act, and with such, omissions, additions, adaptations and modifications as may be specified in orders of the Governor-General under the next succeeding section, have effect accordingly [Sec 8(2) of Indian Independence Act 1947]

Accordingly, necessary amendments were made in India Act 1935. This kind of embarrassing mistakes happen when one's primary source is Google chacha.

My only concern have been the following fact; the ruler decides, but if it is disputed by the population it needs to go by the will of the people.

Are you effing bull$hitting me. That was precisely India's stand and it was conveyed by Mountbatten to Jinnah, which Jinnah had rejected out of hand. It was to prove this point I posted that report by Mountbatten which you dismissed as 'an excellent attempt to mislead' and then pulled from your rectal orifice your own explanation that the States were supposed to accede 'on the basis of Muslim/Hindu majority/population'. You then went on to explain to another poster that Hari Singh couldn't 'automatically' accede to India.

Now that you have dug yourself in an effing hole, you are shamelessly eating your own words and taking an exact opposite stand. At least delete your posts before bull$hitting.

The same thing that happened in case of Junagadh but which india failed to implement in Kashmir. And yes, stop the BS of withdrawing of forces from Kashmir for a referendum to take place, india is equally responsible for the unfulfillment of the requirement.

The word 'equally' is an acknowledgment that on the other side of the equation Pakistan is also 'responsible for the fulfillment of the requirement', which obviously Pakistan has failed to this day.

Thank you for your inadvertent acknowledgment.

The issue of bringing in the truth that the ruler had the right to decide was only needed as you brought in Junagadh as if Jinnah committed a sin by accepting Nawab of Junagadh's IoA!!

You do realize that your posts still exist and everybody can read those posts from pg 103, post#1542?

That's what you have been miserably failing over and again to prove. Better luck next time!

Actually you have proved me right and you are not even aware of it.

Eat that spit!

Must be tasty.

So you know how spit might taste. I can only guess how.

 

[RamGorur]

i have no sympathy at all for those poor ''oppressed'' 'pundits'

What a terrible loss for the pundits.

 

[Xeric]

Congratulations. You have cracked the biggest mystery of the world - 47 comes after 35. Now buy yourself some candy.

Except in so far as other provision is made by or in accordance with a law made by the Constituent Assembly of the Dominion under subsection (i) of this section, each of the new Dominions and all Provinces and other parts thereof shall be governed as nearly as may be in accordance with the Government of India Act, 1935 ; and the provisions of that Act, and of the Orders in Council, rules and other instruments made thereunder, shall, so far as applicable, and subject to any express provisions of this Act, and with such, omissions, additions, adaptations and modifications as may be specified in orders of the Governor-General under the next succeeding section, have effect accordingly [Sec 8(2) of Indian Independence Act 1947]

Accordingly, necessary amendments were made in India Act 1935. This kind of embarrassing mistakes happen when one's primary source is Google chacha.


Are you effing bull$hitting me. That was precisely India's stand and it was conveyed by Mountbatten to Jinnah, which Jinnah had rejected out of hand. It was to prove this point I posted that report by Mountbatten which you dismissed as 'an excellent attempt to mislead' and then pulled from your rectal orifice your own explanation that the States were supposed to accede 'on the basis of Muslim/Hindu majority/population'. You then went on to explain to another poster that Hari Singh couldn't 'automatically' accede to India.

Now that you have dug yourself in an effing hole, you are shamelessly eating your own words and taking an exact opposite stand. At least delete your posts before bull$hitting.

The word 'equally' is an acknowledgment that on the other side of the equation Pakistan is also 'responsible for the fulfillment of the requirement', which obviously Pakistan has failed to this day.

Thank you for your inadvertent acknowledgment.


You do realize that your posts still exist and everybody can read those posts from pg 103, post#1542?


Actually you have proved me right and you are not even aware of it.


So you know how spit might taste. I can only guess how.

As they say; "There's nothing more dangerous than a resourceful idiot."



Game over!

 

[Jackdaws]

i stand by my words, because that's how things really did transpire

i have no sympathy at all for those poor ''oppressed'' 'pundits'






people with honour and pride never abandon their ancestral homelands while their neigbhours, friends & families suffer......they fled for purely economic reasons and are now integrated into hindustany society. More power to them; but they dare not call themselves ''Kashmiris'' anymore since they pledged allegiance to hindustan, the very entity that is oppressing Kashmiris today.

we can see what this oppression is leading to; a lot of anger and resentment


for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction

They will call themselves Kashmiris all the time and there is pretty much nothing Pakistan can do about it.

 

[Xeric]

Bangkok Post : New death sparks protests in Indian Kashmir

New death sparks protests in Kashmir

* Published: 26/08/2010 at 12:56 AM

Kashmiri women mourn at the funeral of Umar Qayoom, 13, in Srinagar. Thousands of people poured on to the streets of Indian Kashmir summer capital Srinagar on Wednesday after another protester died, taking the toll in two months of violence to 64, police said.

Thousands of people poured on to the streets of Indian Kashmir summer capital Srinagar on Wednesday after another protester died, taking the toll in two months of violence to 64, police said.

The teenager who died in hospital on Wednesday had been admitted on Monday. Witnesses said he had been beaten by federal paramilitary forces during a protest against Indian rule.

His family said he had also been tortured by police in custody.

Police said they were investigating the death, which brought thousands of locals out on the streets of Srinagar's Soura district chanting slogans.

Later some of the protesters, chanting "blood for blood" and "Go India, go back", set fire to a police vehicle and a private vehicle parked near a police station, witnesses said.

Police fired live ammunition, teargas and swung batons to disperse the protesters and in the ensuing clashes 12 demonstrators were hurt, police said.

The scenic Kashmir region has been under rolling curfews to contain deadly protests that began with the killing on June 11 of a teenage student in Srinagar by a police tear-gas shell.

India's home minister P. Chidambaram regretted Wednesday that New Delhi was not able to stop the unrest.

"We are concerned that we have not been able to stop the vicious cycle in which that state is caught," he said in an address to police chiefs of all the Indian states in New Delhi, according to Press Trust of India.

"However, it is my hope that, in the next few days, we would be able to find that elusive starting point from where we could reach out to the protestors, reassure them of their rights and dignity."

He said the peace and order would be restored and "the process of dialogue restarted that will lead to a solution."

Separatists opposed to Indian rule have declined to enter into fresh talks until India withdraws troops from civilian areas, repeals tough security laws and releases all the political prisoners.

Immediately after Chidambaram's statement, authorities released senior separatist Yasin Malik who had been detained in early June, police said.

Most parts of Srinagar were under strict curfew on Wednesday after Muslim separatists opposed to Indian rule in the region called on residents to hold protests.

In other Muslim-majority towns where the curfew was not in force, a strike called by separatists to at protests the deaths brought daily life to a standstill, witnesses said.

In Pampore town, 15 kilometres (nine miles), south of Srinagar, a young protester was wounded on Wednesday when security forces opened fire to quell a demonstration, police said.

Anti-India sentiments run deep in Kashmir, where Muslim militants have fought a 20-year insurgency in Indian Kashmir against rule from New Delhi.

The mountainous region, held in part by Pakistan and India but claimed in full by both, has been the cause of two of the three wars the countries have fought since independence from Britain more than half a century ago.

 

[indiaworldpower]

The Future Of Kashmir?

Scenario 1

The status quo

Kashmir has been a flashpoint between India and Pakistan for more than 60 years. Currently a boundary - the Line of Control - divides the region in two, with one part administered by India and one by Pakistan. India would like to formalise this status quo and make it the accepted international boundary. But Pakistan and Kashmiri activists reject this plan because they both want greater control over the region.


Scenario 2

Kashmir joins Pakistan

Pakistan has consistently favoured this as the best solution to the dispute. In view of the state's majority Muslim population, it believes that it would vote to become part of Pakistan. However a single plebiscite held in a region which comprises peoples that are culturally, religiously and ethnically diverse, would create disaffected minorities. The Hindus of Jammu, and the Buddhists of Ladakh have never shown any desire to join Pakistan and would protest at the outcome.


Scenario 3

Kashmir joins India

Such a solution would be unlikely to bring stability to the region as the Muslim inhabitants of Pakistani-administered Jammu and Kashmir, including the Northern Areas, have never shown any desire to become part of India.

Scenario 4

Independent Kashmir

The difficulty of adopting this as a potential solution is that it requires India and Pakistan to give up territory, which they are not willing to do. Any plebiscite or referendum likely to result in a majority vote for independence would therefore probably be opposed by both India and Pakistan. It would also be rejected by the inhabitants of the state who are content with their status as part of the countries to which they already owe allegiance.


Scenario 5

A smaller independent Kashmir

An independent Kashmir could be created from the Kashmir Valley - currently under Indian administration - and the narrow strip of land which Pakistan calls Azad Jammu and Kashmir. This would leave the strategically important regions of the Northern Areas and Ladakh, bordering China, under the control of Pakistan and India respectively. However both India and Pakistan would be unlikely to enter into discussions which would have this scenario as a possible outcome.


Scenario 6

Independent Kashmir Valley

An independent Kashmir Valley has been considered by some as the best solution because it would address the grievances of those who have been fighting against the Indian Government since the insurgency began in 1989. But critics say that, without external assistance, the region would not be economically viable.

Scenario 7

The Chenab formula

This plan, first suggested in the 1960s, would see Kashmir divided along the line of the River Chenab. This would give the vast majority of land to Pakistan and, as such, a clear victory in its longstanding dispute with India. The entire valley with its Muslim majority population would be brought within Pakistan's borders, as well as the majority Muslim areas of Jammu.

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How do YOU see the future of Kashmir?

So far we have discussed on these 7 options, what do u think which one is winning?

In my view, one more option should also be added here which Parvez Musharraf and Manmohan Singh were discussing, that is autonomy to whole Kashmir (parts currently being governed by both India and Pakistan) and will be governed together by both countries.

 

[indiaworldpower]

May be pakistan can declare azad kashmir really azad for a start. Then we will be in pressure to reciprocate.

What if that azad kashmir joins India?

 

[Jackdaws]

What if that azad kashmir joins India?

There is more likelihood of Bush and Osama being twin brothers lost at the Kumbh Mela than that happening.

 

[indiaworldpower]

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/14/world/asia/14kashmir.html?_r=1&partner=rss&emc=rss

Deadly Clashes Continue in Kashmir

By LYDIA POLGREEN
Published: August 13, 2010

Kashmiri protesters run for cover as Indian paramilitary soldiers chase them during a protest in Srinagar, India on Friday.


NEW DELHI — Kashmiris demanding independence from India flooded the streets in protests across the troubled region Friday[Rolling, your 'suggestion' just went down that drain which empties in Gulf of Mexico], clashing repeatedly with the police and Indian security forces, the

Four people were killed, bringing the total number of dead to at least 55 since the unrest began in June. Kashmiris have been marching in increasing numbers, and in increasingly bold defiance of strictly enforced curfews, in an effort to force India to withdraw its troops from the disputed region, which is claimed by India and Pakistan. It was the first Friday of the Ramadan fasting month, and many people in the mostly Muslim region tried to visit mosques to offer prayers.

The clashes dampened hopes that Ramadan, during which Muslims neither drink nor eat from sunrise to sunset, would cool the simmering anger here. The protests, which began when a teenager was killed by a tear gas shell in June, have spiraled into a broad, unarmed popular revolt that Indian authorities have struggled to control.

Poorly trained and equipped security forces use live ammunition to fend off angry, stone-throwing crowds. The resulting deaths have fed still more protests, and the state government has resorted to calling in still more troops to try to wrest control of the streets.

On Friday police officers fired on a crowd of protesters in the town of Pattan, and a 58-year-old man died of injuries sustained there. In the separatist stronghold of Sopore a large crowd gathered after Friday Prayers and threw stones at a camp occupied by Indian paramilitaries, who opened fire, killing two people, the police said. In Kupwara, a local official ordered the police to open fire on a crowd of 2,000 people who had gathered in defiance of curfew, police officials said. A 23-year-old man died of a gunshot wound.

In Srinagar, the regional capital, officials did not impose curfew, and Friday Prayers were held at the historic, pagoda-shaped mosque for the first time in six weeks. Officials had feared violence if they tried to prevent worshipers from visiting the mosque.

Many Indian paramilitary forces were deployed in Kashmir to fight a brutal, Pakistan-backed insurgency that swept across the Kashmir Valley in the 1990s. They operate under special laws that shield them from prosecution, and many Kashmiris say that this has led to many human rights violations in the region.

Hari Kumar contributed reporting.

Oh so these handful of people are protesting. What about the normal public. These people can be on the pay of ISI or seperatists who get support from ISI.

 

[Bhairava]

Bangkok Post : New death sparks protests in Indian Kashmir

New death sparks protests in Kashmir

* Published: 26/08/2010 at 12:56 AM

Kashmiri women mourn at the funeral of Umar Qayoom, 13, in Srinagar. Thousands of people poured on to the streets of Indian Kashmir summer capital Srinagar on Wednesday after another protester died, taking the toll in two months of violence to 64, police said.

Thousands of people poured on to the streets of Indian Kashmir summer capital Srinagar on Wednesday after another protester died, taking the toll in two months of violence to 64, police said.

The teenager who died in hospital on Wednesday had been admitted on Monday. Witnesses said he had been beaten by federal paramilitary forces during a protest against Indian rule.

His family said he had also been tortured by police in custody.

Police said they were investigating the death, which brought thousands of locals out on the streets of Srinagar's Soura district chanting slogans.

Later some of the protesters, chanting "blood for blood" and "Go India, go back", set fire to a police vehicle and a private vehicle parked near a police station, witnesses said.

Police fired live ammunition, teargas and swung batons to disperse the protesters and in the ensuing clashes 12 demonstrators were hurt, police said.

The scenic Kashmir region has been under rolling curfews to contain deadly protests that began with the killing on June 11 of a teenage student in Srinagar by a police tear-gas shell.

India's home minister P. Chidambaram regretted Wednesday that New Delhi was not able to stop the unrest.

"We are concerned that we have not been able to stop the vicious cycle in which that state is caught," he said in an address to police chiefs of all the Indian states in New Delhi, according to Press Trust of India.

"However, it is my hope that, in the next few days, we would be able to find that elusive starting point from where we could reach out to the protestors, reassure them of their rights and dignity."

He said the peace and order would be restored and "the process of dialogue restarted that will lead to a solution."

Separatists opposed to Indian rule have declined to enter into fresh talks until India withdraws troops from civilian areas, repeals tough security laws and releases all the political prisoners.

Immediately after Chidambaram's statement, authorities released senior separatist Yasin Malik who had been detained in early June, police said.

Most parts of Srinagar were under strict curfew on Wednesday after Muslim separatists opposed to Indian rule in the region called on residents to hold protests.

In other Muslim-majority towns where the curfew was not in force, a strike called by separatists to at protests the deaths brought daily life to a standstill, witnesses said.

In Pampore town, 15 kilometres (nine miles), south of Srinagar, a young protester was wounded on Wednesday when security forces opened fire to quell a demonstration, police said.

Anti-India sentiments run deep in Kashmir, where Muslim militants have fought a 20-year insurgency in Indian Kashmir against rule from New Delhi.

The mountainous region, held in part by Pakistan and India but claimed in full by both, has been the cause of two of the three wars the countries have fought since independence from Britain more than half a century ago.

Ok where were these "protestors" when two days back a mother daughter were killed in cold blood by the terrorists..?

Oh yes I got it.. only if the sec forces do anything protests will happen because they know the security forces dont shoot back.

But these freedom fighters,they will jus pump two bullets in the forehead of those who dare protest against them.

Like Abu sab when he said He has no sympathy for the Hindu Pundits, my feelings are reciprocated for these separatists.

 

[ejaz007]

New death sparks protests in Held Kashmir

SRINAGAR: Thousands of people poured on to the streets of Indian-held Kashmir on Wednesday after another protester died, taking the toll of two months’ violence to 64, said the police. The teenager wounded had been admitted in a Srinagar hospital on Monday and passed away on Wednesday. The witnesses said that the boy had taken a sound beating by the federal paramilitary forces during a protest against the Indian occupation. afp

Daily Times - Leading News Resource of Pakistan

 

[karan.1970]

Ok where were these "protestors" when two days back a mother daughter were killed in cold blood by the terrorists..?

Dont you know they were killed by the Indian Army as per the Moderators of this forum.

 

[Pride]

i stand by my words, because that's how things really did transpire

i have no sympathy at all for those poor ''oppressed'' 'pundits'






people with honour and pride never abandon their ancestral homelands while their neigbhours, friends & families suffer......they fled for purely economic reasons and are now integrated into hindustany society. More power to them; but they dare not call themselves ''Kashmiris'' anymore since they pledged allegiance to hindustan, the very entity that is oppressing Kashmiris today.

we can see what this oppression is leading to; a lot of anger and resentment


for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction

Thanks for showing your true colour... I wish IA has same feelings for "Separatists" and show them the door for Hell or some Azad Nation (same as hell).. down to your statement