The Folly of The German Air Force

[CHI RULES]

Hi,

I am not talking about over the land strikes---I am talking about over the sea---. The ' reverse dog leg ' to indian coastline---the aircraft can easily fly farther out from the envelope of the S400's---and can dash in---launch its ALCM's and be gone---.

What about missile interception as India already inducting Barack SAM new version with 100 KM+ range SAM.

 

[MastanKhan]

What about missile interception as India already inducting Barack SAM new version with 100 KM+ range SAM.

Hi,

Very difficult to beat the low flying alcm's---but still---. So you are looking at 63 miles range---they would need a lots of batteries up and down the coastline to protect their coastal assets.

They will have air cover as well---but then nothing is bullet proof---some aircraft will slip thru and do the damage on the ground---.

The thing is---once mumbai gets a strike---it will create panic and chaos in the city.

You have to understand the psychology of the attack---. Mumbai is a very well off city---means people are soft---no water shortage---no electric shortage---no fear at all---.

So---for a city like that---which has no preparation---the panic would be like a 1000 times more than if it was Karachi---where we have no water---no electricity---death mayhem and crime---filth and trash everywhere---and this is all in times of peace.

You bring mumbai under heavy strike---you will make the foreign capital run away from the country like if there is no tomorrow.

 

[Sloth 22]

F16 Block 52 with CFT can carry upto 8 tons of munitions.

F16 is good enough. Plus its proven and PAF already use it.

I don't see why a platform like JH7 be procured , it would be mere duplication.

What about missile interception as India already inducting Barack SAM new version with 100 KM+ range SAM.

The range is 90 km currently.

The ER is still under development. And with S400 on cards, it can be cancelled to avoid duplication.

 

[MastanKhan]

F16 Block 52 with CFT can carry upto 8 tons of munitions.

F16 is good enough. Plus its proven and PAF already use it.

I don't see why a platform like JH7 be procured , it would be mere duplication.



The range is 90 km currently.

The ER is still under development. And with S400 on cards, it can be cancelled to avoid duplication.

Hi,

You cannot launch a CM400AKG or a Hatf8 from the F16---basically Paf F16's have no alcm's---secondly---it may only carry one alcm---thirdly---it is a single engine aircraft not suitable for long distances over water----.

With cft---its extended range is less than that of the JH7B.

 

[Readerdefence]

Hi

Hi,

You cannot launch a CM400AKG or a Hatf8 from the F16---basically Paf F16's have no alcm's---secondly---it may only carry one alcm---thirdly---it is a single engine aircraft not suitable for long distances over water----.

With cft---its extended range is less than that of the JH7B.

Hi MK can we envelope this long range role with j11 or j16 instead of jh7 why I'm
asking this is if we can get more advance twin engine then the one you are mentioning
Why we are not going for j series beside this some members have argument about third party
E.g. Russia won't allow for j series will they not indulge in not to supply jh7 to Pakistan
Thx

 

[ghazi768]

Hi,

Your base comment is agreeable---. When I talk about the JH7B---I am talking not of WISHFUL thinking but what is available.

It is still a donkey.. and frankly, thinking about using using donkeys to a horse's job is more of a WISHFUL thinking..

Pakistan air force has been using donkeys for ages----the Fantan ( worst than a donkey---maybe a sloth )---the F7's---the outdated mirage 3's---.

Fanta was never thought of being used for long range strike the way you are hoping. F7s never, they were always for interceptor duty. Mirages only issue is age and its impact on airframe and parts etc.

1000 miles away is the heart of the enemy---never been struck before---. The strikes would devastate the enemy---make the foreign assets run away from the country---never to come back---.

Plus---that would force the enemy to spread its defense assets far and wide to protect ' that ' assets.

Which means---that crucial gaps would be created in the frontline as well.

Their "heart" in terms of political power is not a 1000 miles away, it is much nearer. The "heart" in terms of their air capability to strike, if you have the relevant information and can connect the dots is also not out of range.. even their financial/economic heart is not that much away and "may be" open to raids.

Pakistan is not US of A, we do not have the resources either to produce or purchase a sizeable strategic bombing fleet with likes of B-52s and or F-111s and nor the capacity to have them in numbers to overwhelm the Indian capacity to not be able to defend against such a force and be able deplete it heavily. But trying to run behind such fanciful dreams may seriously effect our war fighting capabilities to defend against and destroy IAF capabilities.

My apologies for mentioning it but it looks that it is you who is building CASTLES IN THE AIR.. a few bombing raids 1000s of miles away may bring some psychological benefit and that is all.. it will not have any significant, frankly speaking not even marginal, effect on over all strategic and tactical picture during the war.

 

[Kompromat]

We don't need them. Currently we only need dedicated strike air craft like J-16 or Su-34.

 

[MastanKhan]

Hi

Hi MK can we envelope this long range role with j11 or j16 instead of jh7 why I'm
asking this is if we can get more advance twin engine then the one you are mentioning
Why we are not going for j series beside this some members have argument about third party
E.g. Russia won't allow for j series will they not indulge in not to supply jh7 to Pakistan
Thx

Hi,

Because you need another 5-8 years to integrate the J16. Why do you think the chinese are buying the SU35---because they have a severe shortage of potent aircraft in the crisis that they are finding themselves in.

Russia has no say in the JH7B----it is all chinese.

Fanta was never thought of being used for long range strike the way you are hoping. F7s never, they were always for interceptor duty. Mirages only issue is age and its impact on airframe and parts etc.

Hi,

Fantan---what do you mean thought of----that thing had a range of 150 miles---.

For mirage3's and F7's my comments were for being obsolete aircraft than for long range.

If pakistan cannot afford aircraft---then why not wrap it up---sign up for peace on the dotted line.

Everytime---the issue of heavy strike aircraft comes up---it becomes fashionable to state that " pakistan is not america "---what is it Morocco or Algeria that ordered the SU34's recently---.

You ASSUME---.

I never mentioned ' heart of political power '----I mentioned capital---money---cash---financial---and mumbai is the financial capital on india---it is its achilles heal.

Collapse of mumbai would damage the stock markets world over---and severely damage indian economy.

It is a SHAME for pakistan that smart and intelligent men like you don not have fantasies and build castles and have vision out of the norm.

Here are some daring missions of air raids that many thought were impossible---.

And most of these raids were done by " donkeys ".

http://listverse.com/2016/06/30/10-insanely-daring-historical-air-raids/

We don't need them. Currently we only need dedicated strike air craft like J-16 or Su-34.

Hi,

And when would you need them---?

 

[fitpOsitive]

Such anomalies exited on all the sides of WW 1 and 2, be it any country or any force. However in my humble opinion Hitlers biggest blunder was the way he invaded Britain: bombing only, no serious land invasion on Britain(Of course through sea).
But in the end, as Hitler said:
The victor will never be asked if he told the truth.

 

[ghazi768]

Hi,

Because you need another 5-8 years to integrate the J16. Why do you think the chinese are buying the SU35---because they have a severe shortage of potent aircraft in the crisis that they are finding themselves in.

Russia has no say in the JH7B----it is all chinese.




Hi,

Fantan---what do you mean thought of----that thing had a range of 150 miles---.

For mirage3's and F7's my comments were for being obsolete aircraft than for long range.

If pakistan cannot afford aircraft---then why not wrap it up---sign up for peace on the dotted line.

Everytime---the issue of heavy strike aircraft comes up---it becomes fashionable to state that " pakistan is not america "---what is it Morocco or Algeria that ordered the SU34's recently---.

You ASSUME---.

I never mentioned ' heart of political power '----I mentioned capital---money---cash---financial---and mumbai is the financial capital on india---it is its achilles heal.

Collapse of mumbai would damage the stock markets world over---and severely damage indian economy.

It is a SHAME for pakistan that smart and intelligent men like you don not have fantasies and build castles and have vision out of the norm.

Here are some daring missions of air raids that many thought were impossible---.

And most of these raids were done by " donkeys ".

http://listverse.com/2016/06/30/10-insanely-daring-historical-air-raids/



Hi,

And when would you need them---?

There's lot of difference between having vision and day dreaming..

stocks will already be in a dive and tail spin with start of war, in both countries, no raids needed..

In terms of war, production will not matter much for both countries, both are heavily dependant upon imports to just keep running the war machine..

Even with Su-34s, algerian air force will not dare to bomb even the tiniest speck of land in Mediterranean, it is for internal use.. all their assets are on the coast in the north with a big desert to the south and border away a 2000 kms.

 

[CHI RULES]

Hi,

You cannot launch a CM400AKG or a Hatf8 from the F16---basically Paf F16's have no alcm's---secondly---it may only carry one alcm---thirdly---it is a single engine aircraft not suitable for long distances over water----.

With cft---its extended range is less than that of the JH7B.

Crux of discussion is Pak will never ever get required permission/source codes to integrate any capable offensive A2G weapon on F16s by USA. The are good for limited A to A defensive role and also to for limited ground bombings.

 

[MastanKhan]

Crux of discussion is Pak will never ever get required permission/source codes to integrate any capable offensive A2G weapon on F16s by USA. The are good for limited A to A defensive role and also to for limited ground bombings.

Hi,

You hit the nail right on the head---.

 

[MastanKhan]

There's lot of difference between having vision and day dreaming..

stocks will already be in a dive and tail spin with start of war, in both countries, no raids needed..

In terms of war, production will not matter much for both countries, both are heavily dependant upon imports to just keep running the war machine..

Even with Su-34s, algerian air force will not dare to bomb even the tiniest speck of land in Mediterranean, it is for internal use.. all their assets are on the coast in the north with a big desert to the south and border away a 2000 kms.

Hi,

I would agree with your assessments 110% if the past of the Paf was clear and honest---. I would say yes---this is coming from a very knowledgeable person who knows what he is talking---.

But the past of the Paf is murky----very murky deceitful and dark---. Basically what I am saying is that the Paf are liars cheaters and thieves. Their doctrine cannot be trusted.

And tragically---those honest working hard working Paf personal get hurt and get upset at these comments because as always---the corrupt and the criminal always put forward the honest ones upfront to save their hides.

Like here in Los Angeles---LAPD---whenever they kill innocent people---a female of that race would be the spoke person for the LAPD that day.

During the 65 war---an officer proposed strike at Agra air base---. The base commander rejected it outright---calling it STUPID---giving the same example as you gave to me.

When Noor Khan learnt of it after the war---he said " if he had known before---he would have given the okay ".

" Those who dare to fail miserably can achieve greatly ". John F Kennedy

 

[MastanKhan]

http://www.sinaimg.cn/dy/slidenews/8_img/2017_15/203_251105_563993.gif

http://www.sinaimg.cn/dy/slidenews/8_img/2017_15/203_251104_196068.gif

 

[Readerdefence]

Because you need another 5-8 years to integrate the J16. Why do you think the chinese are buying the SU35---because they have a severe shortage of potent aircraft in the crisis that they are finding themselves in.

Russia has no say in the JH7B----it is all chinese.




Hi,

Fantan---what do you mean thought of----that thing had a range of 150 miles---.

For mirage3's and F7's my comments were for being obsolete aircraft than for long range.

If pakistan cannot afford aircraft---then why not wrap it up---sign up for peace on the dotted line.

Everytime---the issue of heavy strike aircraft comes up---it becomes fashionable to state that " pakistan is not america "---what is it Morocco or Algeria that ordered the SU34's recently---.

You ASSUME---.

I never mentioned ' heart of political power '----I mentioned capital---money---cash---financial---and mumbai is the financial capital on india---it is its achilles heal.

Collapse of mumbai would damage the stock markets world over---and severely damage indian economy.

It is a SHAME for pakistan that smart and intelligent men like you don not have fantasies and build castles and have vision out of the norm.

Here are some daring missions of air raids that many thought were impossible---.

And most of these raids were done by " donkeys ".

http://listverse.com/2016/06/30/10-insanely-daring-historical-air-raids/



Hi,

And when would you need them---?[/QUOTE]

JH7 A training in the night