Taliban lashing woman for listening music !

[jamahir]

jamahir the cuck

What does that mean ?

Don't u have work to do or something else, ignorant piece of shi*

Work ? Who are you compared to me ? I have been a few things including writing the first operating system, though simple, in all of South Asia 20 years ago and co-founded a company with soon. I almost established the first workers union in the Indian IT / ITES industry in a company I worked in for less than a year till 2014 and in time would have been the leader of the federation of all workers unions in this industry. You can't talk back to your mother or your office manager and you think you should do it with me ? I have discussed at length with national-level progressive movements in my city since 2014 including in 2016 when at a time Communists being verbally lynched on news channels after the incidents in JNU university campus and one of them, Umar Khalid, escaped assassination in the campus, and I met the state secretary of one such group and discussed multiple topics over multiple days including the unfortunate happening of the Iraqi Baath party suppressing the Iraqi Communists despite both being progressives. And I attending that year a gathering at the town hall in remembrance and protest about the suicide of the Dalit student Rohith Vemula. Progressives gathered there and spoke and were direct. I was present there to join that particular group but missed meeting the group's district committee secretary. That was then. I have recently spoken with them again, had a long discussion over tea. And then I will be starting company with transnational scope and with computing products to start with. Such things. Since you ask don't I have something to do, this is what I do. Working to progress humanity. How about you ? In some finance company that your parents pushed you into ? A life of "paying the bills" even for water and basic food that you don't want to abolish to escape its oppression ? How about you ?

Why everything is about women, when it comes to u, sicko can't get 'em so he likes to see 'em, pathetic cuck!!

The OP has vids of Taliban filth flogging women for listening to music and casually lashing a woman just crossing the road and you instead of condemning the Taliban call me a sicko ? You are the sicko here in not being disgusted with the Taliban's acts. You claim to have gone around with many women and that they respect you so show them what you wrote here and see if they continue respecting you.

@jamahir

1. Islam is a sensitive theme. You look at Islam through the lens of modern-age controversial philosophies such as Feminism and Communism. You need to study Islam in its pure light. I can give you pointers in relation.

Bhai, sensitive theme in what way ? In another thread yesterday I quoted names of Muslim philosophers beginning 1200 years ago ( this post ) who found the teachings of Buddha similar to the teachings of Islam and they included Buddha as one of the 124,000 prophets of Islam. If they, existing 200 years on after the founding of Islam, discussed then what makes Islam Islam and the commonalities with other progressive and humanist philosophies why should some on PDF in 2022 think they are the experts on Islam when they are just ritualists like a Brahman priest praying 40 times a day and feeding idols ? In May this year I wrote this post about the simplicity of Islam including why Muslim women are prohibited from having any sign of marriage. What I wrote seven months ago can never be written by the Areeshs and the Sayfullahs ever, and they being ritualists, literalists and non-thinkers can only gather in lynch mobs whether against me or Mashal Khan in AWK University in Pakistan in 2017. Who were part of the Islamic Golden Age - ritualists like al-Ghazali, Areesh, Sayfullah or is it people like me and Ismail al-Jazari and those earlier mentioned philosophers ? 800 years ago an oppressed peasant in Punjab or Dagestan or Mauritania adopted Islam not because there were Areesh and Sayfullah going to him or her and ordering them to start praying 10 times a day. That wouldn't change their oppressed life one bit. The peasant adopted Islam because I went there and told the woman that the idea of Islam enables her to choose her own man with or without the consent of her parents and village head and marry with a contract that can be broken and I told the male peasant that he will construct a mosque where the idea is not to make it a "house of god" and assign an agent of god called priest but the mosque will be a place of community congregation and where during prayer no person is superior or inferior, with the village head standing beside the peasant, and I told the female and male peasants that the local money lender who had been oppressing them for years by taking more than what he gave to them even by force and even at the point of rendering them homeless or driving them to suicide all by charging interest, Islam has abolished interest. Thus, the oppressed female and male peasants would have told Areesh and Sayfullah to be on their way for delivering nonsense that doesn't improve anybody's life and the peasants would listen to me.

Secondly, below is from my thread from 2016 whose OP is an article written by Pakistani journalist Nadeem Paracha and is about Communist and Socialist activism among Muslims since the early 1900s, because it is automatic. The Islamic scholars in India from a 100 years ago found similarities between Islam and modern Communism ( "Modern" because Communism has always been there in various streams ) :

During the same period (1920s-30s), another (though lesser known) Islamic scholar in undivided India got smitten by the 1917 Russian revolution and Marxism.

Hafiz Rahman Sihwarwl saw Islam and Marxism sharing five elements in common: (1) prohibition of the accumulation of wealth in the hands of the privileged classes (2) organisation of the economic structure of the state to ensure social welfare (3) equality of opportunity for all human beings (4) priority of collective social interest over individual privilege and (5) prevention of the permanentising of class structure through social revolution.

The motivations for many of these themes he drew from the Qur’an, which he understood as seeking to create an economic order in which the rich pay excessive, though voluntary taxes (Zakat) to minimise differences in living standards.

In the areas that Sihwarwl saw Islam and communism diverge were Islam’s sanction of private ownership within certain limits, and in its refusal to recognise an absolutely classless basis of society.

He suggested that Islam, with its prohibition of the accumulation of wealth, is able to control the class structure through equality of opportunity.

Basically, both Sindhi and Sihwarwl had stumbled upon an Islamic concept of the social democratic welfare state.

Building upon the initial thoughts of Sindhi and Sihwarwl were perhaps South Asia’s two most ardent and articulate supporters and theoreticians of Islamic Socilaism: Ghulam Ahmed Parvez and Dr. Khalifa Abdul Hakim.

Parvez was a prominent ‘Quranist’, or an Islamic scholar who insisted that for the Muslims to make progress in the modern world, Islamic thought and laws should be entirely based on the modern interpretations of the Qu’ran and on the complete rejection of the hadith (sayings of the Prophet and his companions based on hearsay and compiled over a 100 years after the Prophet’s demise).

After studying traditional Muslim texts, as well as Sufism, Parvez claimed that almost all hadiths were fabrications by those who wanted Islam to seem like an intolerant faith and by ancient Muslim kings who used these hadiths to give divine legitimacy to their tyrannical rules.

Parvez also insisted that Muslims should spend more time studying the modern sciences instead of wasting their energies on fighting out ancient sectarian conflicts or ignoring the true egalitarian and enlightening spirit of the Qu’ran by indulging in multiple rituals handed down to them by ancient ulema, clerics and compilers of the hadith.

Understandably, Parvez was right away attacked by conservative Islamic scholars and political outfits.

But this didn’t stop famous Muslim philosopher and poet, Muhammad Iqbal, to befriend the young scholar and then introduce him to the future founder of Pakistan, Muhammad Ali Jinnah.

Jinnah appointed Parvez to edit a magazine, Talu-e-Islam. It was set-up to propagate the creation of a separate Muslim country and to also answer the attacks that Jinnah’s All India Muslim League had begun to face from conservative Islamic parties and ulema who accused the League of being a pseudo-Muslim organisation and Jinnah for being too westernised and ‘lacking correct Islamic behavior.’

Apart from continuing to author books and commentaries on the Qu’ran, Parvez wrote a series of articles in Talu-e-Islam that propagated a more socialistic view of the holy book.

In a series of essays for the magazine he used verses from the Qu’ran, incidents from the faith’s history and insights from the writings of Muhammad Iqbal to claim:

The clergy and conservative ulema have hijacked Islam.

They are agents of the rich people and promoters of uncontrolled Capitalism.

Socialism best enforces Qur’anic dictums on property, justice and distribution of wealth.

Islam’s main mission was the eradication of all injustices and cruelties from society. It was a socio-economic movement, and the Prophet was a leader seeking to put an end to the capitalist exploitation of the Quraysh merchants and the corrupt bureaucracy of Byzantium and Persia.

According to the Qur’an, Muslims have three main responsibilities: seeing, hearing and sensing through the agency of the mind. Consequently, real knowledge is based on empirically verifiable observation, or through the role of science.

Poverty is the punishment of God and deserved by those who ignore science.

In Muslim/Islamic societies, science, as well as agrarian reform should play leading roles in developing an industrialised economy.

A socialist path is a correction of the medieval distortion of Islam through Shari’a.

Parvez joined the government after the creation of Pakistan in 1947, but after Jinnah’s death in 1948, he was sidelined until he resigned from his post in 1956.

One of the other scholars and activists mentioned in the article is Ubaidullah Sindhi and there is a wonderful thread started by @R2D2 some days ago about Ubaidullah. You should read the OP but I posted my response from which is below a part :

I am breaking my self-exile from PDF to thank you much for posting this great article which is of much use to me. I did not login to find your thread but happened to see it in the side list on the pages. Although I am a full Communist I see here that I share a lot with Ubaidullah Sindhi including nationalizing of industry; the workers to run the industries and share profits from the income ( IMO for the interim until money itself is abolished ); abolition of interest-based economics; abolition of feudalism and Capitalism; free housing and healthcare for the workers; internationalism.

I also like that he proposed three important things : (a). Although India the conferation would consist of republics where a religion might be dominant because of population that republic should not use that religion to drown out the collective principles of the confedaration which are about socio-economic and social justice as understood by any human, (b). In future the pan-Asiatic confedaration will include the USSR too, (c). His Swarajya Party would include members of any caste, creed, colour or gender.

I will tag @Umair Nawaz because he had posted about Ubaidullah in another thread some months ago. He will find much more info about the man and his philosophy and movement just like

And what is Feminism ? Is it to enable the female to be a human being in her own right, to liberate her and emancipate her, enable rights for her, things that were deprived from her by oppressive family and community structures ? If so then Islam did that 1400 years ago. Below is from a thread of mine from 2015 whose OP is written by a Indian Christian lady marrying an Indian Muslim but under Islamic marriage law because she found it better for securing her socio-economic rights in case of divorce ( the idea of divorce being codified first under Islam ) :

Maneka Gandhi, minister of women and child development, recently gave a call for prenuptial agreements to be recognised in India. According to her, if the terms for division of property, guardianship of children and spousal support are settled prior to marriage, divorces will be less acrimonious and disputes could be resolved expeditiously.

In the discussions that followed, as to whether such a step will, in fact, safeguard the rights of women, there was no mention that this concept is already rooted in Islamic law of marriage since the 7th century. The nikahnama, an Islamic marriage contract is, in fact, a prenuptial agreement that outlines the rights and responsibilities of the parties and provides for conditions to be included for safeguarding a woman’s rights upon marriage.

One wonders why a reference to the Islamic law was not made either by the minister or other experts. Married Muslim women, we find, are often on a higher and more secure footing than their counterparts from other religions. In fact, as a Christian marrying a Muslim, I chose to marry under the Muslim personal law, even over the seemingly modern Special Marriage Act, 1954, to better secure my economic rights. My mehr was a house in my name and my nikahnama includes necessary clauses to safeguard my and my children’s rights. My husband’s family members were witness to this document, which is registered and enforceable by law.

When we examine marriage laws in their historic context, it is interesting to note that the universally accepted notion that marriages are contractual rather than sacramental originates in Muslim law, which was accepted by the French law only in the 1800s and incorporated into the English law in the 1850s and became part of codified Hindu law as late as 1955. Today it appears to be the most practical way of dealing with the institution of marriage. Treating marriage as a sacrament which binds the parties for life has resulted in some of the most discriminatory practices against women such as sati and denial of right to divorce and remarriage, even in the most adverse conditions.

The cornerstone of a Muslim marriage is consent, ejab-o-qubul (proposal and acceptance) and requires the bride to accept the marriage proposal on her own free will. This freedom to consent (or refuse), which was given to Muslim women 1,400 years ago, is still not available under Hindu law since sacramental rituals such as saptapadi and kanya dan (seven steps round the nuptial fire and gifting of the bride to the groom) still form essential ceremonies of a Hindu marriage. Even after the codification of Hindu law, the notion of consent is not built into the marriage ceremonies.

The contract of marriage (nikahnama) allows for negotiated terms and conditions, it can also include the right to a delegated divorce (talaq-e-tafweez) where the woman is delegated the right to divorce her husband if any of the negotiated terms and conditions are violated.

Mehr is another unique concept of Muslim law meant to safeguard the financial future of the wife. It is an obligation, not a choice, and can be in the form of cash, valuables or securities. While there is no ceiling, a minimum amount to provide her security after marriage must be stipulated. This is a more beneficial concept than streedhan which is given by choice and usually by the natal family. In addition to Mehr, at the time of divorce, a Muslim woman has the right to fair and reasonable settlement, and this is statutorily recognised under the Muslim Women (Protection of Rights on Divorce) Act, 1986 as per the 2001 ruling of the Supreme Court in the Daniel Latifi case.

It is also important to address polygamy and triple talaq, two aspects of Muslim law which are generally used to discredit the community and argue in favour of a uniform civil code. While sharia law permits a man to have four wives (before 1956 Hindu law permitted unrestrained polygamy), it mandates equal treatment of all wives. If a man is not able to meet these conditions, he is not permitted to marry more than one woman. (Quran 4:3; Yusuf Ali’s translation)

On the other hand, though codification introduced monogamy for Hindus, the ground reality has not changed and Hindu men continue to be bigamous or polygamous. The most disturbing aspect is that while men in bigamous/adulterous relationships are allowed to go scot-free, it is the women who are made to pay the price. Women in invalid relationships with Hindu men are denied maintenance and protection and are referred to as “mistresses” and “concubines”, concepts specific to the uncodified Hindu law. Any attempt to codify Muslim law to bring in legal monogamy should not end up subjecting Muslim women to a plight similar to that of a Hindu second wife. This is an important concern which needs to be taken into account while reforming the Muslim law.

And lastly, the much maligned triple talaq or talaq-ul-biddat, which the Prophet himself considered as the most inappropriate form of divorce. Fortunately, in 2002, in Shamim Ara vs State of Uttar Pradesh & others, the Supreme Court laid down strict Quranic injunctions which must be followed at the time of pronouncing talaq, hence now fraudulent practices adopted by errant husbands (including email and SMS talaq) can no longer constitute valid talaq. Yet, after a decade and a half, very few know challenge the validity of such divorces in court as they are unaware about this ruling.

Though Muslim law stipulates many different ways to end a marriage, including a woman’s right to dissolve her marriage (khula), divorce by mutual consent (mubarra), delegated divorce (talaq-e-tafweez), judicial divorce (fasq) and dissolution under Muslim Marriage Act

Is this Feminism ? Is it not ? What is it ? Who enabled it ? So 1400 years ago Hazrat Muhammad codified these progressive, rational and just ideas for the female and then in the 1800s the French and the English adopted the Islamic marriage law, at least some of it, and it was being discussed by Hindutvadis who never gave rights to the female since the last 3000 years of the existence of the political, social and socio-economic for Hinduism written in the Manusmriti, and the Hindutvadis didn't acknowledge the Islamic origin of the law they wanted to bring in. Is this Feminism ? Is it not ? But just today a mullah posted some pictorials about how divorce is a sin and a wife who wants a divorce will not smell the aroma of paradise, or something like that. Who taught these people all this rot when the real Islam is opposite to their beliefs and the Indian Christian lady used Islamic law because they gave her rights in case of divorce ?

2. You can talk about merits of communism but you are overselling it which is irritating. The world bear witness to failure of Soviet communism. Libya has a very small population base in comparison.

This is my very honest assessment.

@revol is allowed to make thread upon thread about Quranic texts and each thread is many many pages. There is no philosophical discussion there. I am not saying all those posts are wrong but nobody visits those pages. Is he not overselling ? And below is the simple description of Communism :

Communism (from Latin communis, 'common, universal') sociopolitical, philosophical, and economic ideology and current within the socialist movement[1] whose goal is the establishment of a communist society, a socioeconomic order centered around common ownership of the means of production, distribution, and exchange which allocates products to everyone in the society. Communist society also involves the absence of private property, social classes, money, and the state.

Can you or any other rational person reject these above simple and life-simplifying desires of Communism ? For example, money has been the bane of humanity for thousands of years, perpetuating injustice, oppression and inequality whether at family level or national level or world level. Communism says since money is an artificial construct with no human born with a bank account or his or her money status for life ordained in the sky every night by stars forming the list lettering, why not abolish money once and for all and remove the source of most of the problems of humanity ? Can anyone reject this idea's simplicity ? Here is what Muammar Gaddafi said in part 2 of his Green Book - "Solution of the economic problem : Socialism" :

The recognition of profit is an acknowledgment of exploitation, for profit has no limit. Attempts so far to limit profit by various means have been reformative, not radical, intending to prohibit exploitation of man by man. The final solution lies in eradicating profit, but because profit is the dynamic force behind the economic process, eliminating profit is not a matter of decree but, rather, an outcome of the evolving socialist process. This solution can be attained when the material satisfaction of the needs of society and its members is achieved. Work to increase profit will itself lead to its final eradication.

This section cannot be called anything but brilliant.

About "failure of Soviet Communism", how was it a failure ? And what about the Libyan Jamahiriya ? I made a reply on that only some hours ago, please read here. And I will quote the remembrance of the Hindi films actor Parikshat Sahni who recounted his father, actor Balraj Sahni, who witnessed a money-induced fight between two poor pony owners in Kashmir and tried to stop them :

remember the days I spent with Dad in Gulmarg with a nostalgic ache, in particular the long walks and climb to Khilan. The serenity of the hills, the mesmerizing vistas, the heavenly meadows and the meandering streams, they all gave us an overwhelming sense of peace and harmony, with each other and with nature. It was truly a deeply spiritual experience, which I have never been able to replicate anywhere or with anyone other than Dad.

Being an avid photographer, Dad carried his camera with him wherever he went and photographed any and everything that caught his eye—the deep coniferous forests, the wild flowers growing in the glades, the streams flowing down the mountainsides. And he discussed every topic that came to his mind with me. One day, we came across an unpleasant sight while on our evening walk.

Two pony owners, for some unknown reason, were fighting, lashing out at one another with their whips. I was unnerved at this sight. It looked like these two were hell bent on killing one another. Their faces and arms were lacerated and were bleeding profusely. There was no one around; Dad walked up to them and tried to pacify them, but they paid no heed to him. He implored them to stop and listen to him, but they were in a towering rage and kept whipping one another mercilessly.

In their frenzy, one whiplash accidentally landed on Dad and tore his shirt sleeve, leaving an ugly mark on his forearm. Finding that the two were implacable, Dad backed off. He looked very sad as he stared at them for a while, oblivious of his own pain. ‘Come,’ Dad said to me and we walked off. He was quiet for a while, paying little attention to the whiplash he had received on his forearm. He was pensive and sounded dismal when he finally spoke, ‘I am sure the cause of this fight must be quite trivial. This is what poverty does to people. The sad part is that they are ignorant of the root cause of their troubles—exploitation! They have not yet guessed the reason for their poverty and understood who is responsible for it. That is capitalism for you! The poverty-stricken working classes in India are blissfully unaware of the reason why they are starving. The Hindus blame it on karma and their actions in their past lives. These poor fellows are illiterate and have never given a thought to who is exploiting them. They are not aware that just across those mountains lies the Soviet Union, where poverty and exploitation have ceased to exist; where there is equality and justice. When will there be a revolution in India?’

Whatever happened, sooner or later Dad would return to the philosophy of Marx and Engels and the example of the Soviet Union. That was his answer to every social ill. He walked on, cogitating on what he had seen for a while, but his dark mood soon lifted as he pronounced the final conclusion, ‘There will be a revolution in India one day for sure. It is the law of dialectics!’ I don’t think Dad’s love of the working class and the poorer sections of society was only because of the Marxist philosophy. I think his empathy was the natural outcome of his innate compassion and ‘love of mankind’ as he called it.

How will you describe the fight and then thoughts of Balraj ?

So what is the problem in discussing all this and making PDF a platform to bring peace, progression and removal of wrongs in the world ?

all irrelevant ... their country their rules.

Please read my post# 39 on that.

Learn what daesh means

If we were standing near the sad 25 Syrian soldiers in the ruins of the Roman amphitheater in the ancient abandoned city of Palmyra aka Tadmur in July 2015 as they were about to be executed by a NATO-created mullah bunch ( as always ), they would tell you that it means this :

We all know you support DAESH aka "I"SIS, don't deny it.

LeGenD, action on this member please. I am sure "I"SIS is on ban list in Pakistan.

 

[CLUMSY]

Didnt know a thread about a woman being lashed for listening to music would get so hot.. Y'all need to chill

 

[Falcon34]

What does that mean ?

Use google

Work ? Who are you compared to me ? I have been a few things including writing the first operating system, though simple, in all of South Asia 20 years ago and co-founded a company with it 17 years ago. I almost established the first workers union in the Indian IT / ITES industry in a company I worked in for less than a year till 2014 and in time would have been the leader of the federation of all workers union in this industry. You can't talk back to your mother or your office manager and you think you should do it with me ? I have discussed at length with national-level progressive movements in my city since 2014 including in 2016 when at a time Communists being verbally lynched on news channels after the incidents in JNU university campus and one of them, Umar Khalid, escaped assassination in the campus, and I met the state secretary of one such group and discussed multiple topics over multiple days including the unfortunate happening of the Iraqi Baath party suppressing the Iraqi Communists despite both being progressives. And I attending that year a gathering at the town hall in remembrance and protest about the suicide of the Dalit student Rohith Vemula. Progressives gathered there and spoke and were direct. I was present there to join that particular group but missed meeting the group's district committee secretary. That was then. I have recently spoken with them again, had a long discussion over tea. And then I will be starting company with transnational scope and with computing products to start with. Such things. Since you ask don't I have something to do, this is what I do. Working to progress humanity. How about you ? In some finance company that your parents pushed you into ? A life of "paying the bills" even for water and basic food that you don't want to abolish to escape its oppression ? How about you ?

All right princess i am a structural engineer, Did my Bachelors from NUST and Masters from Ireland. nobody forced me into anything, got all this far by myself. In a nutshell i am rich and thin, and i don't waste my time talking about communism or working for progress of humanity. its already in the form of Islam. I travel and boss around thats it.

The OP has vids of Taliban filth flogging women for listening to music and casually lashing a woman just crossing the road and you instead of condemning the Taliban call me a sicko ? You are the sicko here in not being disgusted with the Taliban's acts.



Bhai, sensitive theme in what way ? In another thread yesterday I quoted names of Muslim philosophers beginning 1200 years ago ( this post ) who found the teachings of Buddha similar to the teachings of Islam and they included Buddha as one of the 124,000 prophets of Islam. If they, existing 200 years on after the founding of Islam, discussed then what makes Islam Islam and the commonalities with other progressive and humanist philosophies why should some on PDF in 2022 think they are the experts on Islam when they are just ritualists like a Brahman priest praying 40 times a day and feeding idols ? In this post from May this year I wrote this post about the simplicity of Islam including why Muslim women are prohibited from having any sign of marriage. What I wrote seven months ago can never be written by the Areeshs and the Sayfullahs ever, and they being ritualists, literalists and non-thinkers can only gather in lynch mobs whether against me or Mashal Khan in AWK University in 2017. Who were part of the Islamic Golden Age - ritualists like al-Ghazali, Areesh, Sayfullah or is it people like me and Ismail al-Jazari and those earlier mentioned philosophers ?

Secondly, below is from my thread from 2016 whose OP is an article written by Pakistani journalist Nadeem Paracha and is about Communist and Socialist activism among Muslims since the early 1900s, because it is automatic. The Islamic scholars in India from a 100 years ago found similarities between Islam and modern Communism ( "Modern" because Communism has always been there in various streams ) :

One of the other scholars and activists mentioned in the article is Ubaidullah Sindhi and there is a wonderful thread started by @R2D2 some days ago about Ubaidullah. You should read the OP but I posted my response from which is below a part :


And what is Feminism ? Is it to enable the female to be a human being in her own right, to liberate her and emancipate her, enable rights for her, things that were deprived from her by oppressive family and community structures ? If so then Islam did that 1400 years ago. Below is from a thread of mine from 2015 whose OP is written by a Indian Christian lady marrying an Indian Muslim but under Islamic marriage law because she found it better for securing her socio-economic rights in case of divorce ( the idea of divorce being codified first under Islam ) :

Is this Feminism ? Is it not ? What is it ? Who enabled it ? So 1400 years ago Hazrat Muhammad codified these progressive, rational and just ideas for the female and then in the 1800s the French and the English adopted the Islamic marriage law, at least some of it, and it was being discussed by Hindutvadis who never gave rights to the female since the last 3000 years of the existence of the political, social and socio-economic for Hinduism written in the Manusmriti, and the Hindutvadis didn't acknowledge the Islamic origin of the law they wanted to bring in. Is this Feminism ? Is it not ? But just today a mullah posted some pictorials about how divorce is a sin and a wife who wants a divorce will not smell the aroma of paradise, or something like that. Who taught these people all this rot when the real Islam is opposite to their beliefs and the Indian Christian lady used Islamic law because they gave her rights in case of divorce ?



@revol is allowed to make thread upon thread about Quranic texts and each thread is many many pages. There is no philosophical discussion there. Nobody visits those pages even. Is he not overselling ? And below is the simple description of Communism :

Can you or any other rational person reject these above simple and life-simplifying desires of Communism ? For example, money has been the bane of humanity for thousands of years, perpetuating injustice, oppression and inequality whether at family level or national level or world level. Communism says since money is an artificial construct with no human born with a bank account or his or her money status for life ordained in the sky every night by stars forming the list lettering, why not abolish money once and for all and remove the source of most of the problems of humanity ? Can anyone reject this idea's simplicity ? Here is what Muammar Gaddafi said in part 2 of his Green Book - "Solution of the economic problem : Socialism" :

This section cannot be called anything but brilliant.

About "failure of Soviet Communism", how was it a failure ? And what about the Libyan Jamahiriya ? I made a reply on that only some hours ago, please read here. And I will quote the remembrance of the Hindi films actor Parikshat Sahni who recounted his father, actor Balraj Sahni, who witnessed a money-induced fight between two poor pony owners in Kashmir and tried to stop them :

How will you describe the fight and then thoughts of Balraj ?

So what is the problem in discussing all this and making PDF a platform to bring peace, progression and removal of wrongs in the world ?



Please read my post# 39 on that.



If we were standing near the sad 25 Syrian soldiers in the ruins of the Roman amphitheater in the ancient abandoned city of Palmyra aka Tadmur in July 2015 as they were about to be executed by a NATO-created mullah bunch ( as always ), they would tell you that it means this :

We all know you support DAESH aka "I"SIS, don't deny it.

LeGenD, action on this person please. I am sure "I"SIS is on ban list in Pakistan and in USA where the servers must be located.

 

[Ghazwa-e-Hind]

After what happened to Azam Swati and his family, do we Pakistanis have moral authority to comment on this?

 

[tower9]

This is society run by insane people.

How does one country become so backward?

 

[Ghazwa-e-Hind]

This is society run by insane people.

How does one country become so backward?

Every society is backward, just methods are different.

Look at the family system in west and compare it with east.

 

[tower9]

Every society is backward, just methods are different.

Look at the family system in west and compare it with east.

This is another level of backwardness

 

[Sayfullah]

What does that mean ?



Work ? Who are you compared to me ? I have been a few things including writing the first operating system, though simple, in all of South Asia 20 years ago and co-founded a company with it 17 years ago. I almost established the first workers union in the Indian IT / ITES industry in a company I worked in for less than a year till 2014 and in time would have been the leader of the federation of all workers union in this industry. You can't talk back to your mother or your office manager and you think you should do it with me ? I have discussed at length with national-level progressive movements in my city since 2014 including in 2016 when at a time Communists being verbally lynched on news channels after the incidents in JNU university campus and one of them, Umar Khalid, escaped assassination in the campus, and I met the state secretary of one such group and discussed multiple topics over multiple days including the unfortunate happening of the Iraqi Baath party suppressing the Iraqi Communists despite both being progressives. And I attending that year a gathering at the town hall in remembrance and protest about the suicide of the Dalit student Rohith Vemula. Progressives gathered there and spoke and were direct. I was present there to join that particular group but missed meeting the group's district committee secretary. That was then. I have recently spoken with them again, had a long discussion over tea. And then I will be starting company with transnational scope and with computing products to start with. Such things. Since you ask don't I have something to do, this is what I do. Working to progress humanity. How about you ? In some finance company that your parents pushed you into ? A life of "paying the bills" even for water and basic food that you don't want to abolish to escape its oppression ? How about you ?



The OP has vids of Taliban filth flogging women for listening to music and casually lashing a woman just crossing the road and you instead of condemning the Taliban call me a sicko ? You are the sicko here in not being disgusted with the Taliban's acts.



Bhai, sensitive theme in what way ? In another thread yesterday I quoted names of Muslim philosophers beginning 1200 years ago ( this post ) who found the teachings of Buddha similar to the teachings of Islam and they included Buddha as one of the 124,000 prophets of Islam. If they, existing 200 years on after the founding of Islam, discussed then what makes Islam Islam and the commonalities with other progressive and humanist philosophies why should some on PDF in 2022 think they are the experts on Islam when they are just ritualists like a Brahman priest praying 40 times a day and feeding idols ? In this post from May this year I wrote this post about the simplicity of Islam including why Muslim women are prohibited from having any sign of marriage. What I wrote seven months ago can never be written by the Areeshs and the Sayfullahs ever, and they being ritualists, literalists and non-thinkers can only gather in lynch mobs whether against me or Mashal Khan in AWK University in 2017. Who were part of the Islamic Golden Age - ritualists like al-Ghazali, Areesh, Sayfullah or is it people like me and Ismail al-Jazari and those earlier mentioned philosophers ?

Secondly, below is from my thread from 2016 whose OP is an article written by Pakistani journalist Nadeem Paracha and is about Communist and Socialist activism among Muslims since the early 1900s, because it is automatic. The Islamic scholars in India from a 100 years ago found similarities between Islam and modern Communism ( "Modern" because Communism has always been there in various streams ) :

One of the other scholars and activists mentioned in the article is Ubaidullah Sindhi and there is a wonderful thread started by @R2D2 some days ago about Ubaidullah. You should read the OP but I posted my response from which is below a part :


And what is Feminism ? Is it to enable the female to be a human being in her own right, to liberate her and emancipate her, enable rights for her, things that were deprived from her by oppressive family and community structures ? If so then Islam did that 1400 years ago. Below is from a thread of mine from 2015 whose OP is written by a Indian Christian lady marrying an Indian Muslim but under Islamic marriage law because she found it better for securing her socio-economic rights in case of divorce ( the idea of divorce being codified first under Islam ) :

Is this Feminism ? Is it not ? What is it ? Who enabled it ? So 1400 years ago Hazrat Muhammad codified these progressive, rational and just ideas for the female and then in the 1800s the French and the English adopted the Islamic marriage law, at least some of it, and it was being discussed by Hindutvadis who never gave rights to the female since the last 3000 years of the existence of the political, social and socio-economic for Hinduism written in the Manusmriti, and the Hindutvadis didn't acknowledge the Islamic origin of the law they wanted to bring in. Is this Feminism ? Is it not ? But just today a mullah posted some pictorials about how divorce is a sin and a wife who wants a divorce will not smell the aroma of paradise, or something like that. Who taught these people all this rot when the real Islam is opposite to their beliefs and the Indian Christian lady used Islamic law because they gave her rights in case of divorce ?



@revol is allowed to make thread upon thread about Quranic texts and each thread is many many pages. There is no philosophical discussion there. Nobody visits those pages even. Is he not overselling ? And below is the simple description of Communism :

Can you or any other rational person reject these above simple and life-simplifying desires of Communism ? For example, money has been the bane of humanity for thousands of years, perpetuating injustice, oppression and inequality whether at family level or national level or world level. Communism says since money is an artificial construct with no human born with a bank account or his or her money status for life ordained in the sky every night by stars forming the list lettering, why not abolish money once and for all and remove the source of most of the problems of humanity ? Can anyone reject this idea's simplicity ? Here is what Muammar Gaddafi said in part 2 of his Green Book - "Solution of the economic problem : Socialism" :

This section cannot be called anything but brilliant.

About "failure of Soviet Communism", how was it a failure ? And what about the Libyan Jamahiriya ? I made a reply on that only some hours ago, please read here. And I will quote the remembrance of the Hindi films actor Parikshat Sahni who recounted his father, actor Balraj Sahni, who witnessed a money-induced fight between two poor pony owners in Kashmir and tried to stop them :

How will you describe the fight and then thoughts of Balraj ?

So what is the problem in discussing all this and making PDF a platform to bring peace, progression and removal of wrongs in the world ?



Please read my post# 39 on that.



If we were standing near the sad 25 Syrian soldiers in the ruins of the Roman amphitheater in the ancient abandoned city of Palmyra aka Tadmur in July 2015 as they were about to be executed by a NATO-created mullah bunch ( as always ), they would tell you that it means this :

We all know you support DAESH aka "I"SIS, don't deny it.

LeGenD, action on this person please. I am sure "I"SIS is on ban list in Pakistan and in USA where the servers must be located.

Shut up pervert

 

[jamahir]

Every society is backward, just methods are different.

Look at the family system in west and compare it with east.

Yes, even the Western family system is based on money-based anti-democracy but at least that family system doesn't do honor killing and force its children to suicide in the cause of stupid marks in stupid exams like happens in desi lands or in Indonesia where pre-marital sex has been made severely punishable recently.

Shut up pervert

Silence, NATO-created mullah ghey boi murtad. Go serve your imams, Obomba and B'liar.

 

[Pak_Sher]

Afghanistan looks like it has a bright future ahead.

Afghanistan is a 5hit hole

 

[jamahir]

Use google

I am not an internet lout to know such things. I talk simple and straight and don't use such snarky tone. So you must explain here why you used it against me.

All right princess i am a structural engineer, Did my Bachelors from NUST and Masters from Ireland. nobody forced me into anything, got all this far by myself. In a nutshell i am rich and thin, and i don't waste my time talking about communism or working for progress of humanity. its already in the form of Islam. I travel and boss around thats it.

1. Why do you boss around ? Don't you believe in equality, humbleness, gentleness, respect for the other and democracy ? Yet you claim you believe in Islam. Is bossing around and making 20 visits to the mosque every day where you get a sore on the forehead from banging it on the floor and going on hajj thrice in five years what you think Islam is ? If so then it doesn't make you different from a believer in Hinduism.

2. You call working for progress of humanity as waste of time ? If so you should be called a parasite. Do you want to be called so ? And I have already mentioned a simple description of "Communism" to LeGenD in post# 49 - please read that post. Communism is something every human must put his or her life to bring about. I also informed LeGenD the automaticness of believers in true Islam in preaching modern Communism and I quoted Islamic scholars from before the Indian partition of 1947 finding great similarity between Islam and modern Communism. Every Muslim-majority society, even Saudia, has had Communist activism but this shouldn't be said by me as example because examples are created later and first comes adoption of the ideas because they are understood as good by Nature-given reasoning before 40,000 others adopt them.

3. So you are a "Masters". Well, I am a 12th class dropout yet I have been a teacher and other things including those already described. Your family and neighbors may be impressed with your "Masters" but I am not. There are millions who have done "Masters" so you are no different. Come back here when you have convinced someone to invest in a company with your technological idea and the company has to be a co-operative type where every worker whether the security person or the receptionist or the engineer - and you too will be a worker - will be equal in respect, equality in the right to participate in decision-making and then equality in income. All being equal. You will have a board of directors to comply with the current corporate law since you live in a Capitalist country ( Pakistan ? ) but internally there is no boss in the company because it is a co-operative type where all workers are equal. Have a look at this Wikipedia page for the Indian cafe chain Indian Coffee House. A progressive, democratic company. And parallely join a progressive movement in your city and if there one you see in the country but no unit in the city write to them and say that you want to bring their movement to your city by founding it's unit there. Through this movement you will also know how to employ your company for the good of the world, whether of human society or for the natural ecosystem humans must live in. After these things you do come back here and we will discuss harmoniously because you will be a changed person.

 

[pak-marine]

what any one expected from these backward Barbarians .. Pakistanis love afghan taliban a lot they want same system in our country we are not following proper Islam

 

[Falcon34]

I am not an internet lout to know such things. I talk simple and straight and don't use such snarky tone. So you must explain here why you used it against me.



1. Why do you boss around ? Don't you believe in equality, humbleness, gentleness, respect for the other and democracy ? Yet you claim you believe in Islam. Is bossing around and making 20 visits to the mosque every day where you get a sore on the forehead from banging it on the floor and going on hajj thrice in five years what you think Islam is ? If so then it doesn't make you different from a believer in Hinduism.

2. You call working for progress of humanity as waste of time ? If so you should be called a parasite. Do you want to be called so ? And I have already mentioned a simple description of "Communism" to LeGenD in post# 49 - please read that post. Communism is something every human must put his or her life to bring about. I also informed LeGenD the automaticness of believers in true Islam in preaching modern Communism and I quoted Islamic scholars from before the Indian partition of 1947 finding great similarity between Islam and modern Communism. Every Muslim-majority society, even Saudia, has had Communist activism but this shouldn't be said by me as example because examples are created later and first comes adoption of the ideas because they are understood as good by Nature-given reasoning before 40,000 others adopt them.

3. So you are a "Masters". Well, I am a 12th class dropout yet I have been a teacher and other things including those already described. Your family and neighbors may be impressed with your "Masters" but I am not. There are millions who have done "Masters" so you are no different. Come back here when you have convinced someone to invest in a company with your technological idea and the company has to be a co-operative type where every worker whether the security person or the receptionist or the engineer - and you too will be a worker - will be equal in respect, equality in the right to participate in decision-making and then equality in income. All being equal. You will have a board of directors to comply with the current corporate law since you live in a Capitalist country ( Pakistan ? ) but internally there is no boss in the company because it is a co-operative type where all workers are equal. Have a look at this Wikipedia page for the Indian cafe chain Indian Coffee House. A progressive, democratic company. And parallely join a progressive movement in your city and if there one you see in the country but no unit in the city write to them and say that you want to bring their movement to your city by founding it's unit there. Through this movement you will also know how to employ your company for the good of the world, whether of human society or for the natural ecosystem humans must live in. After these things you do come back here and we will discuss harmoniously because you will be a changed person.

Dude the f*uck is wrong with u.
I don't need to impress anyone i am content with my life and thats all.
I don't believe in equality, u can't compare a man and woman, but in the eyes of allah everyone is equal, if that's the equality ur talking about yes i believe in that, but the modern concept, i don't believe in it.
u can't follow a certain thing based on similarity.
And again if u don't know about a profession don't poke ur nose in it.
democracy is flawed concept, u can't have two kings.
And boi learn to analyze things from the lense of thers. u can't sell something if u don't put urself in someone else's shoes, thats what education teaches, u learn to analyze things in different ways. And that's what ur missing sometimes we are wrong and we should listen to other people and think what if they are right, No one's perfect and humbleness dude read ur posts and tell me where is humbleness in that u attack peoples belief, say stuff about them and when someone gets back at u, u say ur encouraging exploitation. ur a hypocrite.

 

[jamahir]

Dude the f*uck is wrong with u.
I don't need to impress anyone i am content with my life and thats all.

You don't need to impress me but just bring your life and daily time to contribute to humanity in your way.

I don't believe in equality, u can't compare a man and woman

What about man and man ? You said earlier you are "rich and thin" so does that mean you don't respect the male security person in your office because he's on a lesser socio-economic situation than you in the Capitalist system you live in despite he doing a riskier work than you just like the male sewer cleaners in India and Pakistan who live oppressed and money-poor despite they cleaning the excrement of some Goldman Sachs fellow and the sewer cleaners at daily risk of losing life ?

If you are dismissive and scornful of the socio-economically lesser positioned security person in your company then your company owner will also be scornful and dismissive about you since you are socio-economically lesser than him.

u can't compare a man and woman, but in the eyes of allah everyone is equal

What does that mean ?

And again if u don't know about a profession don't poke ur nose in it.

You can describe in simple words. Besides I am a jack of all trades.

democracy is flawed concept, u can't have two kings.

How can you call flawed the act of giving equal place in society to every person so that they are not oppressed by someone who artificially places himself or herself superior and so that every person can contribute his or her Nature-given talents and ideas and experiences to the development of society because also that that person himself or herself will live in a harmonious society at personal day-to-day level ?

The concept of Demokratia ( Democracy in English ) was formed in the Greek cities 2500 years ago and they decided that let alone the two kings you speak of, not even one king should rule the people and the people of the Greek cities should manage their cities by themselves by direct participation in the decision making. A wonderful thing that overthrew the ideas of the past of monarchy. However, the idea was flawed because it didn't include the females and continued the slave system who were also not included in the decision making. And when Alexander's people came to India they even set up a region in the Himalayan current state of Himachal Pradesh to be governed by Demokratia. But much of the world remained unknowing of this.

And then the French Revolution of the late 1700s came and overthrew feudalism and monarchy and their leader became Napoleon Bonaparte but there were many streams in that revolution. The slogan of the French Revolution was "Liberty, Equality, Fraternity". How can any person not accept this ? Tipu Sultan in India was much inspired by this revolution and established a Jacobin Club in India and collaborated with Napoleon to get a large contingent of French troops to work with Tipu's own and counter the British and this would have expanded Tipu's presence more and French presence in India more and in a few years would have driven the British out of India. However, the British allied with traitors in India and Tipu was killed. Later, Napoleon was captured by the British and kept exiled on the island Saint Helena. It is said the British had him poisoned on the island let he return to France and in a people's revolution overthrow the monarchy which had then come back to power.

And then the Communist activism of the mid-1800s brought back the idea of people's rule and abolishing the State and the Nation. The Russian Revolution of 1917 laid work for the USSR to be established in 1922 whose goals included enabling the people of the world to live without a State, through people governing themselves. The "Union" in the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics didn't have a fixed number of republics within it and the goal was forment world revolution and make the entire Earth Communist. However, the USSR itself retained the party system ( the Communist party ) as the governor so the system wasn't really democratic.

However, in the modern world it was the Libyan Jamahiriya that existed until the massive invasion by NATO+GCC+Al Qaeda+"Muslim" Brotherhood in 2011, that had true democracy called the Jamahiriya ( my member name in my imagination meaning someone who forwards the Jamahiriya system ) which was a Communist-Socialist system of participatory democracy where every citizen participated in the running of society without any party, elections and ballot and the social structure of Libya was changed to discard oppressive cultural traditions and made for example the females liberated where no one told them they couldn't marry someone or be with someone, and the socio-economic system was made a welfare system where things like water was provided to citizens without the citizens giving money in return to the system and the system built for the citizens the largest irrigation project in the world called The Great Manmade River. Hugo Chavez, the late revolutionary leader of Venezuela adapted the Jamahiriya system for Venezuelan conditons.

You should read this thread of mine on how to achieve Jamahiriya :

jamahir Musings - Actual Democracy

Inspired by following thread: https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/pakistan-develops-electronic-voting-machine.702447/ Step in the right direction. Actually not. What Pakistan ( and rest of South Asia ) should be doing is establish actual democracy, not this multi-party confusion and the show-sha...

defence.pk

And boi learn to analyze things from the lense of thers. u can't sell something if u don't put urself in someone else's shoes, thats what education teaches, u learn to analyze things in different ways. And that's what ur missing sometimes we are wrong and we should listen to other people and think what if they are right,

You do not believe in equality, you do not believe in democracy but I do yet you want me to put myself in others' shoes and listen to them ? That is automatically within me. It is for you to learn those. You have learnt nothing from your "Masters" so-called education.

No one's perfect and humbleness dude read ur posts and tell me where is humbleness in that u attack peoples belief, say stuff about them and when someone gets back at u, u say ur encouraging exploitation. ur a hypocrite.

I am neither a hypocrite nor arrogant. I say what I am, what my ideas are, what I have done and what my goals are. And I simply ask what have others done to throw arrogance at me.

 

[Falcon34]

You don't need to impress me but just bring your life and daily time to contribute to humanity in your way.



What about man and man ? You said earlier you are "rich and thin" so does that mean you don't respect the male security person in your office because he's on a lesser socio-economic situation than you in the Capitalist system you live in despite he doing a riskier work than you just like the male sewer cleaners in India and Pakistan who live oppressed and money-poor despite they cleaning the excrement of some Goldman Sachs fellow and the sewer cleaners at daily risk of losing life ?

If you are dismissive and scornful of the socio-economically lesser positioned security person in your company then your company owner will also be scornful and dismissive about you since you are socio-economically lesser than him.

Look i just gave an example, i never said i consider my self better or superior. i didn't indulged either they are poor or rich, but you can't compare a security guard with a engineer both are not on same level in many different ways but they contributing to the society in their own way, earlier u said (will be equal in respect, equality in the right to participate in decision-making and then equality in income) about all workers being in equal in all respect, yet how can they be equals one of them worked hard to become an engineer the other went about his way when he should have worked hard. There will always be differences among humans. We all get a chance yet very few grasp it.

What does that mean ?

That means being rich, poor, colour, tall, small, handsome, ugly does not matters, what matters are ur deeds. What u are doing is comparision between two different classes and saying these two should have same status. Equality in simple terms is all of humanity is equal but keeping way the comparsions like, some are weak and some are physical strong, they are equals but u can't compare their physiques. just like that men and women, a doctor and a security guard, rich and poor, they are equal but u can't compare them.
And dude don't write damn essays.

You can describe in simple words. Besides I am a jack of all trades.



How can you call flawed the act of giving equal place in society to every person so that they are not oppressed by someone who artificially places himself or herself superior and so that every person can contribute his or her Nature-given talents and ideas and experiences to the development of society because also that that person himself or herself will live in a harmonious society at personal day-to-day level ?

The concept of Demokratia ( Democracy in English ) was formed in the Greek cities 2500 years ago and they decided that let alone the two kings you speak of, not even one king should rule the people and the people of the Greek cities should manage their cities by themselves by direct participation in the decision making. A wonderful thing that overthrew the ideas of the past of monarchy. However, the idea was flawed because it didn't include the females and continued the slave system who were also not included in the decision making. And when Alexander's people came to India they even set up a region in the Himalayan current state of Himachal Pradesh to be governed by Demokratia. But much of the world remained unknowing of this.

And then the French Revolution of the late 1700s came and overthrew feudalism and monarchy and their leader became Napoleon Bonaparte but there were many streams in that revolution. The slogan of the French Revolution was "Liberty, Equality, Fraternity". How can any person not accept this ? Tipu Sultan in India was much inspired by this revolution and established a Jacobin Club in India and collaborated with Napoleon to get a large contingent of French troops to work with Tipu's own and counter the British and this would have expanded Tipu's presence more and French presence in India more and in a few years would have driven the British out of India. However, the British allied with traitors in India and Tipu was killed. Later, Napoleon was captured by the British and kept exiled on the island Saint Helena. It is said the British had him poisoned on the island let he return to France and in a people's revolution overthrow the monarchy which had then come back to power.

And then the Communist activism of the mid-1800s brought back the idea of people's rule and abolishing the State and the Nation. The Russian Revolution of 1917 laid work for the USSR to be established in 1922 whose goals included enabling the people of the world to live without a State, through people governing themselves. The "Union" in the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics didn't have a fixed number of republics within it and the goal was forment world revolution and make the entire Earth Communist. However, the USSR itself retained the party system ( the Communist party ) as the governor so the system wasn't really democratic.

However, in the modern world it was the Libyan Jamahiriya that existed until the massive invasion by NATO+GCC+Al Qaeda+"Muslim" Brotherhood in 2011, that had true democracy called the Jamahiriya ( my member name in my imagination meaning someone who forwards the Jamahiriya system ) which was a Communist-Socialist system of participatory democracy where every citizen participated in the running of society without any party, elections and ballot and the social structure of Libya was changed to discard oppressive cultural traditions and made for example the females liberated where no one told them they couldn't marry someone or be with someone, and the socio-economic system was made a welfare system where things like water was provided to citizens without the citizens giving money in return to the system and the system built for the citizens the largest irrigation project in the world called The Great Manmade River. Hugo Chavez, the late revolutionary leader of Venezuela adapted the Jamahiriya system for Venezuelan conditons.

You should read this thread of mine on how to achieve Jamahiriya :

jamahir Musings - Actual Democracy

Inspired by following thread: https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/pakistan-develops-electronic-voting-machine.702447/ Step in the right direction. Actually not. What Pakistan ( and rest of South Asia ) should be doing is establish actual democracy, not this multi-party confusion and the show-sha...

defence.pk

You do not believe in equality, you do not believe in democracy but I do yet you want me to put myself in others' shoes and listen to them ? That is automatically within me. It is for you to learn those. You have learnt nothing from your "Masters" so-called education.



I am neither a hypocrite nor arrogant. I say what I am, what my ideas are, what I have done and what my goals are. And I simply ask what have others done to throw arrogance at me.