Taiwan Conducts Live Fire Drills on Spratlys, Angering Vietnam

[Reashot Xigwin]

talking to you is useless.

Why bother you won't even remember this ever happen? A benefit from having an addled mind I reckon.

: ignore this Hua mixed people are living in Indonesia.

& what does that have to with anything?

 

[Huaren]

@Viet : ignore this Hua mixed people are living in Indonesia.



Hua and Yue people existed from ancient time, kid.

That proves nothing, we have all taken territories from countless animals and other "ancient people", in the end you can only hold as much as you are capable of, if only looking at the "historical" maps china would possess right to claim all of viet territories in existence, more importantly china would have more to back up our side of claim than viets could ever be.
One last thing, Chinese people in China are the heir of the ancient people of historical and cultural center of yue, your ancestors were mostly native people from further south who were once taught by the chinese way of civilization by the hua people, there is no greater insult for my yue brother to place viets and them in the same group.

 

[Rechoice]

Why bother you won't even remember this ever happen? A benefit from having an addled mind I reckon.



& what does that have to with anything?

you are bias for china.

 

[Rechoice]

That proves nothing, we have all taken territories from countless animals and other "ancient people", in the end ou can only hold as much as you are capable of, if only looking at the "historical" maps china would possess right to claim all of viet territories in existence, more importantly china would have more to back up our side of claim than viets could ever be.
One last thing, Chinese people in China are the heir of the ancient people of historical and cultural center of yue, your ancestors were mostly native people from further south who were once taught by the chinese way of civilization by the hua people, there is no greater insult for my yue brother to place viets and them in the same group.

chinese invaders were kicked back to China, don't lying with big mouth. Other Bai Yue are still enslaving by Han Chinese, who came from North China, until now.

It is very funny that almost aggressive PDF chinese member is come from Sothern China. Slaves try to play role of their master.

 

[Reashot Xigwin]

you are bias for china.

First time seeing a neutral, eh?

 

[BoQ77]

Ba Binh is known for its cemetery for dead whales (Nam Hải Tombs) and shrines in their honor. Whale are known to help residents. From Lê dynasty to Nguyễn Dynasty the island was populated by about 1000 vietnamese residents. Old temples were erected by villagers.

@BoQ77. Is there still tours to go out there or has it been forbidden because of the dispute?

Taiwanese troops station there, and all the visitors are fishermen.
Sometimes PH, VN fishermen visits and have some exchange with stationed troops there.

 

[Huaren]

chinese invaders were kicked back to China, don't lying with big mouth. Other Bai Yue are still enslaving by Han Chinese, who came from North China, until now.

It is very funny that almost aggressive PDF chinese member is come from Sothern China. Slaves try to play role of their master.

Obviously according to you chinese "invaders" are "not" kicked back to China or you would not be constantly crying for US, Japan, india or whoeverelse to save your *** and back your claim for you. In which regard it would be totaly fine for China to return to our "historical" territories at any time, the only difference is that we would do it ourselves.

First time seeing a neutral, eh?

look at whos talking about bias, apprarantly at least some viets have lost their shame

 

[Rechoice]

Obviously according to you chinese "invaders" are "not" kicked back to China or you would not be constantly crying for US, Japan, india or whoeverelse to save your *** and back your claim for you. In which regard it would be totaly fine for China to return to our "historical" territories at any time, the only difference is that we would do it ourselves.



look at whos talking about bias, apprarantly at least some viets have lost their shame

don't telling hilarious story here, why China is still crying when US protect Taiwan and Japan control Senkaku ?

 

[BoQ77]

Thanks. So I see that the historical claim of ROC's (later, PRC) over the Spratly's , and actual occupation goes back to Japan's seizure of Itu Aba , and its administration via the Formosa Colonial Government.

Appreciate the clarification.

ROC occupation over Itu Aba is few years after WW2.

Do you have any other information regarding actual Vietnamese occupation of these islands prior to the 19th century? I'd appreciate some other source. Thanks.

There're some records by Vietnam Nguyen Dynasty about that.
The records was kept under UNESCO's Memory of the World program
with title "Chau Ban trieu Nguyen" something like "Nguyen Dynasty Royal Records"

Translation later

Song giá trị nổi bật của Châu bản Triều Nguyễn còn ở chỗ nó là cơ sở pháp lý về chủ quyền của Việt Nam đối với hai quần đảo Hoàng Sa và Trường Sa. Trong số 85 nghìn đơn vị Châu bản còn lưu giữ được, có gần 20 tờ Châu bản liên quan đến Hoàng Sa, Trường Sa mà nội dung của nó cho thấy Nhà nước phong kiến Việt Nam đã xác lập và thực thi chủ quyền tại hai quần đảo này một cách liên tục, thông qua các hoạt động quản lý Nhà nước với sự chỉ đạo trực tiếp của các triều vua. Có thể dẫn ra đây, Châu bản đề ngày 12-2 năm Minh Mệnh thứ 17 (1836) phản ánh sau khi nhận công văn của Nội các có Châu phê của nhà vua "Các thuyền được phái đi Hoàng Sa, mỗi thuyền được mang theo 10 cọc gỗ (mỗi cọc dài bốn đến năm thước, dày một tấc) khắc sâu dòng chữ to: "Minh Mệnh thập thất niên". Năm Bính Thân, các viên cai đội thủy quân vâng mệnh đi Hoàng Sa khảo sát, đến đó thì cắm mốc đánh dấu. Hãy tuân mệnh". Bộ Công đã chuẩn bị đủ cọc gỗ và gửi cho tỉnh Quảng Ngãi chuyển cho Chánh đội trưởng thủy quân Phạm Hữu Nhật đem ra cắm mốc ở quần đảo Hoàng Sa.

Tờ Châu bản đề ngày 21-6 năm Minh Mệnh thứ 19 (năm 1838) có nội dung: Bộ Công tâu trình đoàn đi khảo sát Hoàng Sa đợt này có Ðỗ Mậu Thưởng, Thị vệ Lê Trọng Bá là người của Bộ. Ðoàn khảo sát được 25 đảo thuộc vùng thứ ba, đồng thời vẽ được bốn bản đồ mang về (trong đó một bức vẽ chung, ba bức vẽ riêng từng vùng). Bộ Công tâu xin cho họ chỉnh sửa hoàn thiện để dâng trình lên triều đình... Khối tài liệu Châu bản Triều Nguyễn cũng thể hiện, xác định hai quần đảo Hoàng Sa và Trường Sa thuộc lãnh thổ Việt Nam nên có chính sách cứu hộ, cứu nạn đối với các thương thuyền nước ngoài đi qua vùng biển nước ta gặp nạn.

Bản tâu ngày 27-6 năm Minh Mệnh thứ 11 (1830) của Thủ ngự cửa biển Ðà Nẵng cho biết ngày 21-6 vừa qua có một chiếc thuyền của Pháp từ Ðà Nẵng đi Lữ Tống (tên gọi Phi-li-pin lúc bấy giờ), khi đến phía Tây quần đảo Hoàng Sa không may bị mắc cạn. Khi được tin báo, Thủ ngự Ðà Nẵng là Nguyễn Văn Ngữ liền huy động thuyền của ta mang lương thực, nước uống đi tìm và đã cứu được những người bị nạn về cửa biển Ðà Nẵng. Vua Minh Mệnh sau khi tiếp nhận bản tâu trình đã châu phê một chữ "lãm" (đã xem) vào tờ Châu bản này... Dưới thời Bảo Ðại, tuy nước Việt bị chìm trong vòng nô lệ của thực dân Pháp nhưng triều đình Huế không quên trách nhiệm đối với Hoàng Sa. Hai tờ Châu bản do Bảo Ðại bút phê, một là truy tặng Huy chương Long tinh của triều đình nhà Nguyễn cho La-ri Phông-ten, Chánh cai đội hạng nhất của đội lính Khố xanh đóng tại Hoàng Sa, vừa qua đời ở Huế đầu tháng 2-1939. Hai là, chuẩn y của Bảo Ðại về việc ban thưởng Huy chương "ngũ hạng Long tinh" cho ngạch lính Khố xanh ở Trung Kỳ vì họ đã có nhiều công lao trong việc lập đồn phòng thủ bảo vệ Hoàng Sa...

A set of administrative documents from the Nguyen Dynasty (1802-1945) has been named a world documentary heritage by UNESCO, the fourth such recognition Vietnam has won so far.
The records, known as “Chau ban trieu Nguyen” in Vietnamese, are now listed in the Asia – Pacific Register of UNESCO’s Memory of the World Program, Tuoi Tre (Youth) newspaper reported Friday.
The recognition was announced at a meeting of the Asia – Pacific Regional Committee for the program in Guangzhou, China, on Wednesday.


According to the National Archives in Hanoi, the records amount to nearly 200,000 pages, including notices, circulars, and decrees issued during the reign of the 11 Nguyen emperors.
It is the sole set of surviving administrative documents maintained by a Vietnamese dynasty, a spokesman for the archives was quoted as saying.
The records are printed on handmade paper and bear the original seals of the kings and their agencies.
Prof. Phan Huy Le, chairman of the Vietnamese Association of Historical Sciences, told Thanh Nien that 19 documents reflect how the Nguyen kings applied their sovereign rights over the Hoang Sa (Paracel) and Truong Sa (Spratly) Archipelagos.
Every year, the kings sent naval forces to the archipelagos to collaborate with on-site military forces in conducting a variety of activities like mapping islands, surveying and exploring seaways, and exploiting resources, he said.
A series of documents issued in 1838 during the reign of Emperor Minh Mang, for instance, mentioned surveying trips to the Hoang Sa islands, said Dr. Phan Thanh Hai, director of Hue Monuments Conservation Center and a member of the panel that submitted the documents for the UNESCO recognition.

 

[Huaren]

don't telling hilarious story here, why China is still crying when US protect Taiwan and Japan control Senkaku ?

lol look at whos hilarious here, see china is backing up in any of those cases and you need to check your brain, and if considering all the actions which were taken or incoming as "crying" you should try to do the same (like for example setting up zone of control and tighting it). First of all use struggling incident between major powers as argument will only make you look even more pathetic. You are licking the boots of those who are neither capable of holding down china nor care enough for you to try and pay the price.

 

[dichoi]

Are you sure of this? There was little to no activity by the IJN near the waters of Indochina prior to 1940 before Operation Ten Goh. To my understanding, hostilities between the French Indochina and the Japanese Empire were initiated in 1940 when the Imperial Japanese Army's 5th Division under Lt. General Nishimura spearheaded the invasion at Lan Song. Eventually, the Imperial Japanese Army mounted a full blown invasion of Indochina with 140,000 soldiers. The Imperial Navy didn't really commit naval forces because what little the French Indochinese Government had were wiped out by IJN's destroyer squadrons. I've never heard or read any reports of IJN destroying any temples there.

Perhaps you can clarify with me. I'd love to know more.

. In colonial time France established the Meteo and radio station there. before 1938, only Vietnamese controlled Itu Aba. I think Vietnamese didn't destroyed the temple,

Japan navy build the sea port for submarines there, it could been the temple was destroyed.

For more information for you, here is the history book of us printed in 1836, It stating clearly that Spratly Islandes, (included Itu Aba) is important part of territory of Vietnam .

 

[mike2000]

I totally agree with you mate, and at the same time, different people will react in different ways; rather than insulting back and get into a back and forth tirade like many people here do, I responded with a funny comment (as you also said) meant to remind her that her choice of words was totally out of place and by the way, you might not be aware of this, calling Vietnamese people "gooks" (which she did repeatedly) is considered quite strong by Vietnamese people. By the way, why don't you lecture her for a change?

Bceause she looks sooo beautiful.

 

[Carlosa]

Bceause she looks sooo beautiful.

I can relate to that, but watch out, she carries a big gun and she always has 1 or 2 Leopard ll tanks near her.

 

[SamDNguyen]

It is useless to argue in here. Let's wait to see more updates.

As long as no civilians (fishermen) are hurt in the process, regardless of their nationality. I don't think anyone fish there anymore.

 

[Aepsilons]

. In colonial time France established the Meteo and radio station there. before 1938, only Vietnamese controlled Itu Aba. I think Vietnamese didn't destroyed the temple,

Japan navy build the sea port for submarines there, it could been the temple was destroyed.

For more information for you, here is the history book of us printed in 1836, It stating clearly that Spratly Islandes, (included Itu Aba) is important part of territory of Vietnam .

View attachment 146639

Thanks. I did some objective research on this last night. It appears that the Imperial Navy did conduct limited action in the Paracels in April 4 of 1939 under the pretext that the Paracels were historically "Chinese territory". The justification of the invasion was because during that time, the Empire of Japan was at war with China and had then effectively placed the Paracels under Japanese Protectorate-ship, then later in 1941, the whole Paracels were placed under jurisdictional control of Japan's Imperial Crown Colony of Taihoku (present day Taiwan), and thus the Paracels were administered by both Japanese and Chinese (Taihokujin) from the seat at Takao (Taiwan).

After Japan ceded control over the entire South China Sea after her surrender in 1945, the administrative control of the Spratly's was open. However, politically and historically speaking, the ROC's claim over the Spratly's and the Paracels stems back to the legacy that they had administered the Paracels when Taiwan was still part of the Japanese Empire. After Taiwan's independence from Japan in 1945, Taiwan retained, officially that is, its administrative rights in the Parcels by historical basis.

Plus, since the Japanese Empire seized the Paracels in 1939 to preserve Chinese territory, in essence recognizing China's historical claims of the region, this can be used as historical basis for China's claim in present status.

Basically, the Chinese (ROC and PLA) base their claim on Japanese Imperial Administration of these so called islands.