Swach Bharat closing in on 80%, doubling coverage from start

[GodToons]

I wonder how @Nilgiri can be so delusional. It's a common sense. It is such a big project and will take many years especially in a country like India which is rife with bureaucracy, red-tape and inertia.

Does he even live in India to pass judgements?

#nilgiri still have hope with India. Indian civilization had too many change management and still growing. No need to pull down the optimism

 

[Kamikaze Pilot]

#nilgiri still have hope with India. Indian civilization had too many change management and still growing. No need to pull down the optimism

Did you read his posts? He believes 90% of India is ALREADY clean like Western countries! Maybe in future. But already it's clean now? So fast?

 

[Novice09]

Window dressing. Abracadebra. Claims. Claims. Problem solved. Turn the equation upside down. Hey look at Pakistan ---> "Open Pooping Capital".

What is raw fact is Modijee came to power. Waved his magic cadra-abra and 1.4 billion people country with nearly 50% shatting in the open suddenly changed habits. Listen sunshine you might believe your own hype but rest of us don't need to.

Until external bodies like World Bank or UN start matching up their data with these 'claims' I am apt to believe that the smell emanating from the east is from the Ganga open pooping army in India.

All this is poor attempt to change perception without even touching the reality. Even if India managed to make a serious attempt it would at least take a decade for the effects to work out on the ground. Not wave a finger and utter "Swatch" and suddenly half a billion Indians become civilized and learn toilet manners.

Dream on. Good evening.

Let me to inform you the changes I faced first hand post "Clean India" mission

1. Daily garbage collection from our door step. My two year old son really love Kailash Kher's voice...

2. Daily cleaning of drains in our street

3. Daily cleaning of main road by automated machine

4. Distribution of dustbin

5. One of my property... a corner plot... in a posh colony was rented to rickshaw pullers because no family was ready to live in it due to the mountain of garbage on the green belt which was parallel to my property...
Now, the green belt is really green and I earn hefty rent for this PRIME location...

6. Cleanliness in trains is way better than 5 years back... although I mostly travel by plane as their is negligible difference in air and train fares...

7. My village... in 2017...
Open defection free.
Every household has electricity.
Conneted with rest of the world with Fiber network.
Every household has LPG Gas connection...

AND I DON'T NEED U.N. OR WORLD BANK REPORT TO CERTIFY IT...

you want to believe it or not, is upto you...

 

[GodToons]

Did you read his posts? He believes 90% of India is ALREADY clean like Western countries! Maybe in future. But already it's clean now? So fast?

My counter question is... who says western countries are clean (except for EU), they manage cleanliness effectively. If you have to experience EU level cleanliness, I invite you to Indore and Bhopal, you can sit on road in the morning. They are clean because government and civil society are working together.

for @Nilgiri post, he is mentioning govt targets of providing amenities and services. If people dump trash whole day without their responsibilities, will it remain clean? Govt is on target, Modi is running world largest change management program in India. I have optimism in Indan peoples.

 

[jamahir]

@jamahir https://yourstory.com/2018/06/rani-mistris-swachh-bharat/

I am unable to open this link property. My Firefox browser hangs the machine and Chrome doesn't show the page.

https://www.firstpost.com/india/swa...-sanitation-revolution-in-odisha-4481119.html

"Our gram sabha had passed a resolution that anyone found defecating in the open will have to pay Rs 500 and a whistleblower will be paid Rs 250 per case. Those found flouting norms will also be publicly shamed. The oversight panel was roped in for vigilance. There isn't a single case of open defecation in our village now," said Jadumani Sahoo, a member of the oversight committee at Kirtanpali.

Good !!

And the wall-painting on the toilet walls is also a good idea.

I wonder how @Nilgiri can be so delusional. It's a common sense. It is such a big project and will take many years especially in a country like India which is rife with bureaucracy, red-tape and inertia.

Does he even live in India to pass judgements?

4. Distribution of dustbin

Problems are still there.

In my town, near my locality and in my locality, there are two bins, one marked "Dry waste" and the other marked "Wet waste". The trouble is that people throw plastic bags filled with garbage from a distance instead of putting the bags into the bins.

@Kaptaan , I am interested how is this issue solved in Pakistan. Sincere question.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

I am interested how is this issue solved in Pakistan. Sincere question.

Okay I can tell you only about my ancestral village not far from Attock/Hazro and Islamabad.

• Village. On my first visit to Pakistan in mid eighties nearly 30 years ago majority of people had toilets in their houses. Of course these were not to what I was used to but after bit of a shock they did what they needed to do. Essentially it was a small brick built cubicle with a door and air outlets at top. It was just a hole and cemented around. And I understand a pit had been dug first. It had not water supply but you filled the bucket from a tap in the garden wall that was fed from a tube well.
• 
  
• As a interesting tit bit the village was recieving some funding from some entity that I forget [it was not government] for the those who could not afford to build their own toilets. This would mean by about 1990 everybody had access to their own toilet. Izzat and modesty drove familes because non wanted their females to 'go out'.
• 
  
• The village had recieved electrecity by about 1976 soon after the Tarbela Dam came online. A communal water supply for the village was organized with my late dear grandad being the push for the whole project. Government agreed to fund to the capital cost. Because our village is on hilly area a large tube well was constructed at a lower point which then was pumped to a large water tank slightly higher then the village level on a mounted concrete structure which itself was constructed on a crest of a hill. From there everybody could enjoy piped water. However this is Pakistan we are talking about. Because our village is divided along tribal/biraderi groups the underlying rivalry began to eat away at what was a cooperative project. Everybody had to pay for the running costs - electrity bills and maintenance for the pump. By the time I was went there this communal water supply had fallen to disuse as nobody paid the bill and government cut off the supply to the tube well. Soon the pump was stolen or sold. All that was let was the concrete water tanks and some of the piping which was fast being stolen for scrap metal. Sad.

Today everybody has their own tube well but because of the elevation these wells have to be bored very deep to strike water. As my grandad told me the tragedy was everybody could not be bothered to work together and pay together. Now everybody was paying out of their backsides as each tube well cost a fortune.

There were good examples though of communal effort. I saw everybody agree to provide 25% of the cost of having a open drain and block paving of the village streets. The other 75% of the cost was provided by some government project. Again there was lot of petty politics as one side said that one of the villagers who was acting as chair of the project was pocketing some money but the matter was resoved in a huge 'jirga' in my grandads garden where all the men of the area came. Tea was served and not a women was in sight. It was grand show of male dominated society. This project was completed about 1988.

As regards rubbish this was recycled. We had people [from Afghanistan] coming every week who took the rubbish away which I presume was sorted and sold.

I must add here that our district is on the old GT belt - the corridor along the GT road from Peshawar - Mardan- Attock - Islamabad/Rawalpindi - Jhelum - Gujranwallah - Lahore was and probably still is the most developed part of Pakistan. Significant number of people room this 'belt' migrated abroad, are ex-pats etc. Today for instance in our village almost everybody has a car let alone basic sanitation.

In Islamabad rubbish was collected by the CDA although here we also still had 'scrap dealers' coming to collect anything that migt be recycled. We had a large open air market near our neighbourhood in Islamabad that just began to take shape but now is a permanent fixture. Every monday traders from all over - Afghans/Tajiks/Baloch/Chinese Uigurs/Kashmiri/Gilgiti/Sindhi and locals would pitch stalls. From delicious nuts, fruits to knives could be bought. It was a sight to behold. Central Asia in a one camp. However the place would have rotting food and rubbish the next day giving of stench. But eventually after locals protested CDA left these huge commercial bins. Even then rotting rubbish was left. This was resolved by CDA sending cleaners the day after. On my last visit to Pakistan the site was crisp and clean the next day after CDA workers cleaned up. However the neighbourhood was prosperous with many residents having pull so not sure if this can be used as benchmark.

Finally my feeling is Pakistan is cleaner and has better sanitation then India. It still is South Asia but I think it does better although cities like Karachi are probably as dirty as any Indian city. Possibly having lower population density also helps.

I hope this helps to answer your request ....

 

[jamahir]

Okay I can tell you only about my ancestral village not far from Attock/Hazro and Islamabad.

• Village. On my first visit to Pakistan in mid eighties nearly 30 years ago majority of people had toilets in their houses. Of course these were not to what I was used to but after bit of a shock they did what they needed to do. Essentially it was a small brick built cubicle with a door and air outlets at top. It was just a hole and cemented around. And I understand a pit had been dug first. It had not water supply but you filled the bucket from a tap in the garden wall that was fed from a tube well.
• 
  
• As a interesting tit bit the village was recieving some funding from some entity that I forget [it was not government] for the those who could not afford to build their own toilets. This would mean by about 1990 everybody had access to their own toilet. Izzat and modesty drove familes because non wanted their females to 'go out'.
• 
  
• The village had recieved electrecity by about 1976 soon after the Tarbela Dam came online. A communal water supply for the village was organized with my late dear grandad being the push for the whole project. Government agreed to fund to the capital cost. Because our village is on hilly area a large tube well was constructed at a lower point which then was pumped to a large water tank slightly higher then the village level on a mounted concrete structure which itself was constructed on a crest of a hill. From there everybody could enjoy piped water. However this is Pakistan we are talking about. Because our village is divided along tribal/biraderi groups the underlying rivalry began to eat away at what was a cooperative project. Everybody had to pay for the running costs - electrity bills and maintenance for the pump. By the time I was went there this communal water supply had fallen to disuse as nobody paid the bill and government cut off the supply to the tube well. Soon the pump was stolen or sold. All that was let was the concrete water tanks and some of the piping which was fast being stolen for scrap metal. Sad.

Today everybody has their own tube well but because of the elevation these wells have to be bored very deep to strike water. As my grandad told me the tragedy was everybody could not be bothered to work together and pay together. Now everybody was paying out of their backsides as each tube well cost a fortune.

There were good examples though of communal effort. I saw everybody agree to provide 25% of the cost of having a open drain and block paving of the village streets. The other 75% of the cost was provided by some government project. Again there was lot of petty politics as one side said that one of the villagers who was acting as chair of the project was pocketing some money but the matter was resoved in a huge 'jirga' in my grandads garden where all the men of the area came. Tea was served and not a women was in sight. It was grand show of male dominated society. This project was completed about 1988.

As regards rubbish this was recycled. We had people [from Afghanistan] coming every week who took the rubbish away which I presume was sorted and sold.

I must add here that our district is on the old GT belt - the corridor along the GT road from Peshawar - Mardan- Attock - Islamabad/Rawalpindi - Jhelum - Gujranwallah - Lahore was and probably still is the most developed part of Pakistan. Significant number of people room this 'belt' migrated abroad, are ex-pats etc. Today for instance in our village almost everybody has a car let alone basic sanitation.

In Islamabad rubbish was collected by the CDA although here we also still had 'scrap dealers' coming to collect anything that migt be recycled. We had a large open air market near our neighbourhood in Islamabad that just began to take shape but now is a permanent fixture. Every monday traders from all over - Afghans/Tajiks/Baloch/Chinese Uigurs/Kashmiri/Gilgiti/Sindhi and locals would pitch stalls. From delicious nuts, fruits to knives could be bought. It was a sight to behold. Central Asia in a one camp. However the place would have rotting food and rubbish the next day giving of stench. But eventually after locals protested CDA left these huge commercial bins. Even then rotting rubbish was left. This was resolved by CDA sending cleaners the day after. On my last visit to Pakistan the site was crisp and clean the next day after CDA workers cleaned up. However the neighbourhood was prosperous with many residents having pull so not sure if this can be used as benchmark.

Finally my feeling is Pakistan is cleaner and has better sanitation then India. It still is South Asia but I think it does better although cities like Karachi are probably as dirty as any Indian city. Possibly having lower population density also helps.

I hope this helps to answer your request ....

A nice read. You are a good narrator. If only you didn't mention from time to time about "Gangadesh".

So by 1990 Pakistan villages generally had the basic toilets that India is getting now.

Also, going by pictures of Pakistani cities ( in threads like about burger shops ), I too feel that Pakistani cities are a bit more cleaner than Indian ones. Especially no stray dogs in sight, though you say that Karachi might be as dirty as the equally populated Bombay in India.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

So by 1990 Pakistan villages generally had the basic toilets that India is getting now.

Yes and no. I think that statement would apply to large parts of Pakistan but there are 'pockets' in Sind and near the Thar Parker Indian border that lag behind. You might also include parts of Balochistan/FATA but these regions have very low populations spread over huge areas ths sanitation/garbage is not a big issue. The 'pockets' I mentioned on the periphery I think, even today are struggling. This issue often is lot about the local practices and socio-economic development which hinder basic development.

I too feel that Pakistani cities are a bit more cleaner than Indian ones.

Yes, I agree. I have often read outsiders who have visited both countries mention this as conspiciously evident that Pakistan tends to be less cluttered and tidier - as I said before lower population density must also be a factor.

Karachi might be as dirty as the equally populated Bombay in India.

Indeed. I don't see much differance between Bombay and Karachi. Only differance make Mumbai drier, get rid of the Bolly glitz, induce dollop of Islamic religious soup and your done. Although I think Karachi still is not as densely packed as Mumbai.

If only you didn't mention from time to time about "Gangadesh".

I am sure you know what 'beer hall politics' is? Well this is PDF not Oxford Union debating Society .....

Ps. In real life I engage in impeccable mannes and fine living. Cyberspace is place where you can let it rip!

 

[Nilgiri]

Did you read his posts? He believes 90% of India is ALREADY clean like Western countries! Maybe in future. But already it's clean now? So fast?

Where did I say that you stupid moron? ....and don't you worry, seeing what type of threads you open and proliferate in (past your sham fake avatar to disguise), it is pretty clear to me what agenda and likely origin you really have....suffice to say you are a fake.

I specifically said the crucial improvements are basic level stuff for rural areas to prevent esp post-pregnancy women and infants/children from dieing from. That sound like a final 10% western aesthetic standard or something to your retard brain? Get flushed you piece of crap.

My counter question is... who says western countries are clean (except for EU), they manage cleanliness effectively. If you have to experience EU level cleanliness, I invite you to Indore and Bhopal, you can sit on road in the morning. They are clean because government and civil society are working together.

for @Nilgiri post, he is mentioning govt targets of providing amenities and services. If people dump trash whole day without their responsibilities, will it remain clean? Govt is on target, Modi is running world largest change management program in India. I have optimism in Indan peoples.

Exactly. I base my opinion on:

a) what I see when I visit rural parts of India when I visit. There were definite improvements when I last visited. Of course not near top developed country standards on average...but definitely it wasn't like before either.

b) The twitter feeds regarding the project...which similarly take pictures of the rural programs and engagements. The real crux of the issue basically. This capability did not exist to apply reverse pressure on the bureaucrats before (i.e prevalence of social media and networking to give real evidence)

c) Video logs etc etc and people discussing actual project implementation issues and how to keep improving (and their credible proven experience....like the guy Mr. P. Iyer who runs the program for example)

There is a long way to go...but I leave it to people (voters) to decide if there has been improvement along with things like the gas connection program, housing program + DBT that have been instrumental in improving living standards but at same time cutting down on govt spending wastage.

I am unable to open this link property. My Firefox browser hangs the machine and Chrome doesn't show the page.





Good !!

And the wall-painting on the toilet walls is also a good idea.





Problems are still there.

In my town, near my locality and in my locality, there are two bins, one marked "Dry waste" and the other marked "Wet waste". The trouble is that people throw plastic bags filled with garbage from a distance instead of putting the bags into the bins.

@Kaptaan , I am interested how is this issue solved in Pakistan. Sincere question.

Bro, maybe these links will work for you (original one I posted is about these Rani mistris too):

https://sbmgramin.wordpress.com/201...raining-paving-the-way-for-women-empowerment/

https://sbmgramin.wordpress.com/2018/03/13/rani-mistris-pave-the-wave-for-a-swachh-jharkhand/

http://www.dailypioneer.com/state-e...-felicitated-on-international-womens-day.html

 

[baajey]

Hey lets meet sometime in Gurgaon, I am at sector10 (old gurgaon).
Things were bad, now improving. With new trash pick up vans from MCG coming twice in a day and sweeper doing daily activities. Having said that, Gurgaon 'elites' are worst case in having civil mentality. They do not bother to come to trash van to dump trash but love to throw a packet on the road while going by car. This is change management

yeah good idea.
@ranjeet also lives in gurgaon sonewhere.
lets plan out of usual life n meet up. i am advised by docs to avoid alcohol.
regarding trash van,yes, absolutely. same in kirti nagar, where i stay.
after municipal elections we got our roads repitched. no potholes as of now.mostly.

 

[indianfighter1999]

India has done something remarkable now over 80% sanitation coverage in few years Modi took this as one of his priorities... the day is not far when almost full coverage will be achieved...

 

[GodToons]

yeah good idea.
@ranjeet also lives in gurgaon sonewhere.
lets plan out of usual life n meet up. i am advised by docs to avoid alcohol.
regarding trash van,yes, absolutely. same in kirti nagar, where i stay.
after municipal elections we got our roads repitched. no potholes as of now.mostly.

10-4

my sector road converted to RCC and now we are free for atleast 5Y regarding potholes and other stuff. Dust pollution reduced significantly which was pain for person living around hero honda chowk. Gadkari did a wonderful work here.

I will be in gurgaon next week end, lets catch up (mine is traveling profile, so visit lots of cities in India and others)