Stable gov and huge saving are the key for rapid economy growth

[313ghazi]

Read my post #51 copy pasted below. Who does the red part apply to?

"The Chinese model will not work in Pakistan because religious fanaticism and primitive social structures prevent this model from working in Pakistan. These regressive forces are way to entrenched. Only a full scale PLA invasion and five years of "cultural revolution" would prepare Pakistan for stage to move to being a first world developed country.

Until then there is only two solution for Pakistani's to do well ~

• gain access to the power elite, military, religious, administrative, judicial, industry or economy with positions being very limited.
• jump on a boat and become a illegal migrant to land of sin and no religion. The west. Once there indulge in a comfortable life and then start lecturing others about Islam."

You realise there is no less irony in you lecturing about... what is it you lecture about? It's ranting mostly. Do you think democracy is working in Britain? We're in a one party system run by Dominic Cummings. Ever since the closing of the Grammar school the power has slipped entirely into the hands of the Eton Elite. Corona has exposed just how ineffective the system of goverance in Britain is and how under resourced vital national services are. We live in a crumbling empire.

I didn't go anywhere, I was born in Britain, I've experienced this political system and it's failing a large part of the population. Unfortuinately you and me are going to live to see it get much much worse. Wait till no deal Brexit hits, the Corona related job losses will seem like a drop in the ocean.

Pakistans legal system and political system is inept. It's failing Pakistani's every single day. We need to go back to a form of governance that respects strength and works in a tribal society. Democracy weakens Pakistani society - it leads to ineffective governance. We need leaders who are in power, until they fail. We need a structure that judges success or failure and can only change leadership based on gross failure - not on popularity contests such as elections.

The Shariah aspect of it is the legal system - shariah is not a form of governance. You can come out from behind the sofa, nobody is putting an Ayatollah in charge or a Khadim Rizvi.

 

[Naofumi]

Is there any model can be exported?

Liberal democracy? Barring Muslim world, it has been successful more or less, countries like Singapore, South Korea, Taiwan transitioned after a period of China-like "benevolent" (used as an operative term here) dictatorships to liberal democracies. Is not China destined to be same eventually? Where do you see China in 2150, still with CCP?

We all know Japan and south Korea are US puppets and need to do US biddings , don't we?

That's an entirely different aspect.

 

[beijingwalker]

That's an entirely different aspect.

In many cases they have to do what US tells them to do, so they don't represent independent free will nations. Comparing them with China is pointless.

 

[vi-va]

Liberal democracy? Barring Muslim world, it has been successful more or less, countries like Singapore, South Korea, Taiwan transitioned after a period of China-like "benevolent" (used as an operative term here) dictatorships to liberal democracies. Is not China destined to be same eventually? Where do you see China in 2150, still with CCP?


That's an entirely different aspect.

1. The consensus among Chinese elites and intellectuals is that, western one man one vote is not suitable for China. Western ideology and value is the last thing we need from them.
2. China will never go for one man one vote system unless we screwed ourselves up.
3. The flaws of western system is too big to be ignored. China is too large to adopt such a self-destructive system, it will destroy us and dismember us. Western world has already been messed up by the system, we don't want to follow a failed system.
4. South Korea is the only successful case of major economy. But it has nothing to do with western value and system. The western value and system is the blockage of their success.
5. Singapore is not western system. Singapore and China are both meritocracy. We are damn the same in the core.
6. Taiwan is failure and laughing stock among mainland Chinese. You don't understand Taiwan. As a Chinese politics observer, as I can speak/read Chinese, I knew maybe 10x more than you do. Sorry to say so.

 

[Naofumi]

1. The consensus among Chinese elites and intellectuals is that, western one man one vote is not suitable for China. Western ideology and value is the last thing we need from them.
2. China will never go for one man one vote system unless we screwed ourselves up.
3. The flaws of western system is too big to be ignored. China is too large to adopt such a self-destructive system, it will destroy us and dismember us. Western world has already been messed up by the system, we don't want to follow a failed system.
4. South Korea is the only successful case of major economy. But it has nothing to do with western value and system. The western value and system is the blockage of their success.
5. Singapore is not western system. Singapore and China are both meritocracy. We are damn the same in the core.
6. Taiwan is failure and laughing stock among mainland Chinese. You don't understand Taiwan. As a Chinese politics observer, as I can speak/read Chinese, I knew maybe 10x more than you do. Sorry to say so.

In a nutshell, CCP is eternal?

 

[vi-va]

In a nutshell, CCP is eternal?

Nothing eternal. CCP call themselves 水能载舟亦能覆舟。which means if CCP don't deliver, CCP will game over.

 

[Naofumi]

Nothing eternal. CCP call themselves 水能载舟亦能覆舟。which means if CCP don't deliver, CCP will game over.

Hypothetically speaking, what will happen then? A new party? Would not be somewhat same as democracy? A guided/illiberal democracy perhaps.

1. Taiwan is failure and laughing stock among mainland Chinese. You don't understand Taiwan. As a Chinese politics observer, as I can speak/read Chinese, I knew maybe 10x more than you do. Sorry to say so.

What's the reason in particular?

 

[Indus Pakistan]

Shariah aspect of it is the legal system

Good luck convincing the British nation on adopting Sharia Law. And it has holes big enough for Titanic to sink inbetween. The practice and manifestation of something is test of a idea. You can build as many castle in the air. Britain with all it's failures is what it is on account of the historical forces it has developed on. Please tell me beyond the utopian "sharia law" you have in your head a country, a territory where we can see this example. So we can measure it against failed UK, France, China, Russia etc? Ehh Saudia perhaps? Pakistan maybe? Iran? Or does this sharia of yours only exist in your wet dreams?

Unfortuinately you and me are going to live to see it get much much worse.

No it won't. This country has seen far, far, worse. I lived through 1970s, 80s and they were worse. As long as this country caps immigration it will be fine.

 

[Yankee-stani]

The Chinese model will not work in Pakistan because religious fanaticism and primitive social structures prevent this model from working in Pakistan. These regressive forces are way to entrenched. Only a full scale PLA invasion and five years of "cultural revolution" would prepare Pakistan for stage to move to being a first world developed country.

Until then there is only two solution for Pakistani's to do well ~

• gain access to the power elite, military, religious, administrative, judicial, industry or economy with positions being very limited.
• jump on a boat and become a illegal migrant to land of sin and no religion. The west. Once there indulge in a comfortable life and then start lecturing others about Islam.

I agree but disagree with your premise that Mao was a good governor. He was never stable, he was very unstable, precisely because all he knew was revolution. His governance was a complete disaster.

Its sad that our country has been held hostage by clique of desidom and been stagnant for the last 70 years I dont see anything improving fast it will be slow and stagnant this country should thank the Army and China being a good patron for us as for the Chinese members who might view Mao more negative without Mao China would not be strong world power but a tool for the American world order granted he was not a economic manager but a revolutionary which lead to pragmatic Deng to handle the economy.Its not just in China Lenin with USSR gave way to pragmatic yet dictatorial Stalin Che in Cuba to Fidal the pragmatic Khomeni the fiery cleric to moderate Khamanei

 

[Indus Pakistan]

Its sad that our country has been held hostage by clique of desidom and been stagnant for the last 70 years

I don't think most people understand what is quite obvious. The thing that has held Pakistan back is as you put it "desidom". It is all those things that are native to our people. That is what has arrested our development. Indeed this is what the Chinese, Japanese, Turks, Singaporans, Malays, Taiwanese, Vietnam etc figured out and addressed. By copying those who had succeeeded. The west. They blindly copied them. And you see the results in Istanbul, Tokyo, Beijing, Kaula Lumpur etc.

The problem with our people is they instead adapting the success model from west decide to go back to the failed desidom. What is that I believe Einstien said. The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different result.

Then when failed we jump a boat to the very west we disparage. Once we get there we begin again to issue forth our miracle recipes. As you saw with @313ghazi He of course tries to wiggle out of what I said ~ by saying "he was born in UK" ignoring the fact that he dad or his dad did "jump on the boat" as we are not indigenous to these isles.

• jump on a boat and become a illegal migrant to land of sin and no religion. The west. Once there indulge in a comfortable life and then start lecturing others about Islam.

 

[Yankee-stani]

I don't think most people don't understand what is quite obvious. The thing that has help Pakistan is as you put it "desidom". It is all those things that are native to our people. That is what has arrested our development. Indeed this is what the Chinese, Japanese, Turks, Singaporans, Malays, Taiwanese, Vietnam etc figured out and addressed. By copying those who had succeeeded. The west. They blindly copied them. And you see the results in Istanbul, Tokyo, Beijing, Kaula Lumpur etc.

The problem with our people is they instead adapting the success model from west decide to go back to the failed desidom. What is that I believe Einstien said. The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different result.

Then when failed we jump a boat to the very west we disparage. Once we get there we begin again to issue forth our miracle recipes. As you saw with @313ghazi He of course tries to wiggle out of what I said ~ by saying "he was born in UK" ignoring the fact that he dad or his dad did "jump on the boat" as we are not indigenous to these isles.

I want Yankee and the Anglo Saxons to fall apart and us leading it but we gotta play the game "they" have imposed on us China you are correct ape them a lot but mixed it with good characteristics of their culture

 

[Indus Pakistan]

China you are correct ape them

They Chinese did not adapt. They just simply 'stole' the blueprint from the west and reverse engineered it on the Chinese people with CCP being a clone of of the CPSU of Soviet Union.

The prophet of CCP was the German exile Karl Marx who wrote their 'bible' in London or Communist Manifesto. Chinese today are just a bastardized version of the west. Ditto Japs. In fact ditto even most Turks.

 

[Yankee-stani]

They Chinese did not adapt. They just simply 'stole' the blueprint from the west and reverse engineered it on the Chinese people with CCP being a clone of of the CPSU of Soviet Union.

View attachment 646125

The prophet of CCP was the German exile Karl Marx who wrote their 'bible' in London or Communist Manifesto. Chinese today are just a bastardized version of the west. Ditto Japs. In fact ditto even most Turks.

and the Russians stole it from the Germans as usual

 

[Indus Pakistan]

Interesting warning sign in Malaysia. Starting with bottom. Punjabi, Tamil, Chinese, English. Can you guess what language the top one is?

I want Yankee and the Anglo Saxons to fall apart

Not me. I live here.

 

[Yankee-stani]

Interesting warning sign in Malaysia. Starting with bottom. Punjabi, Tamil, Chinese, English. Can you guess what language the top one is?

Bahasa Indonesian Indonesia is a mix bag bud they been getting f..cked by exported Wahabbism from the Gulf since the 80s